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Alpha Two Phase II testing is currently taking place five days each week. More information about testing schedule can be found here
If you have Alpha Two, you can download the game launcher here, and we encourage you to join us on our Official Discord Server for the most up to date testing news.
Dev Discussion #75 - Node Siege System
Dev Discussions are an opportunity to join in on player discussions about topics that Intrepid Studios want to hear your thoughts on. This is less about asking us questions, and more about us asking YOU the questions! If you do have questions about Ashes of Creation, keep an eye our social media channels for our monthly livestreams, check out the Ashes of Creation community wiki, or try the #questions channel in Discord!
In this thread, we’ll be discussing:
Dev Discussion - Node Siege System
The Development Team wants your thoughts on the new Node Siege System! What are your first impressions of Node Sieges? Do you have any thoughts or concerns regarding Node Sieges? What are your favorite and least favorite aspects of Node Sieges so far?
More specifically, we're looking for feedback on the following:
In this thread, we’ll be discussing:
Dev Discussion - Node Siege System
The Development Team wants your thoughts on the new Node Siege System! What are your first impressions of Node Sieges? Do you have any thoughts or concerns regarding Node Sieges? What are your favorite and least favorite aspects of Node Sieges so far?
More specifically, we're looking for feedback on the following:
- Control Point Respawns - What did you think about the location of the control point respawns? Did you have any thoughts regarding wave respawns?
- Final Objective Location - What did you think about the final cap objective locations?
- Gate Destruction Time-To-Kill (TTK) - What did you think about the gate TTK?
- Impact of Archetypes - Did any archetype stand out as having too much or too little impact? Why do you feel specific archetypes had more of an impact?
0
Comments
- Meele is a nightmare...kinda zero impact - you just die in a sec without even pressing a key.
- Game performance is not in the stage as it needs to have to for a reactive pvp gameplay on a decent rig.
- attackers basically just camped the marketplace thats all - gg
- time to get respawned was good
- lean set up via discord was good
- only lvl 25 should be a requirement to sign up at the moment
Actually this is a issue, the locations currently are unbalanced imo just comparing miralyth to winstead one is surrounded by buildings, the other is on top of a rock exposed from above and below. Granted the imbalance is to the defense of both in different ways but the building way is farther and more manageable for the attackers more so then the winstead layout is faster rally to point.... small thing but i see it.
I am hesitant to say as game mechanics are incoming that change these? so take what i or any one says as a grain of salt. I think its just a boring Time sink? we had people attacking them and with no repair or regen for the gates its just a forgone conclusion that they come down within 5 minutes max. I think its a bit silly as they are currently ingame, and you can just hop walls if you want so "MEH" i think its kinda pointless in current iteration
cleric & bard As the only way to win cleric has the biggest impact for maintaining those moments when a attackers is able to touch the channeler on the god spike. You can only heal a player to full, clerics & bards can shield. (essentially over-healing for a time). Offensive wise, Ranger and rouge stand out with aoe's for crowd slow's & disable movements drastically
PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE FIX the vision, render issue. IDK if you the devs see it.... but 100% there is a render range issue some times youll see spell lighting go off and know some one is there, you wont see people but the lighting effects but they must see you if they are casting at you...
Vision some times is like 15-20 yards... ITS BAD. PLEASE FIX THIS nothing worse then game bugs affecting fight when you dont see some charging at you w 50+ people that all spawn in right in front of you.
ALSO
Quality of life issue for Roster, you cant see online/offline. You can not drag and drop TO AND FROM waitlist. The guild tags are not updated or accurate. These are all PAINFUL Frustrations that need a GOOD CLEAN PASSOVER. AT A MINIMUM, you should see online/offline and be able to drag and drop with out having to KICK some one, and guild tags are DEFINITELY needing to be accurate (they are not)
Bug/Issues:
- for people like me that have a weaker (but still up to spec) internet connection, it was unfortunately *unplayable*... when pushing the market, lag slowed fps to 2 frames per second, or less... a slide show, and I was of course completely useless to my team as a result. Have to work on either server horsepower, or packet efficiency for those without a T1 into their homes.
- Rezzed inside some structure I could not identify, no option to "unstuck" or the like
- Enemy team members went red IMMEDIATELY after the Siege flag was planted... NOT when the Siege actually started... you are able to attack opposite team members, but guards kill you immediately, and you take full death penalties.
Thoughts:
- Time was WAY too short... it felt like we ran the siege in mere minutes, and not too many either... it was basically big push at gate for only a minute or two, then killed/rez, then push to deal with attackers inside town, killed/rez, then try to stop the capture... felt like about 5 mins.
- Can't comment on any of the other things you are looking for, as noted above - it was unplayable... couldn't tell who was attacking whom, much less archetypes.
- Gate came down way too fast, and there didn't appear to be any way to attack the attackers while the gate way still up.. i.e. archer towers, ballistae, or the like.
-
- Need a better way of selecting players for the siege. first come first served, then it rotates through people in a queue is not a good way at all to get the siege lead to formulate a proper comp.
- The obvious. Render distance being about 10m. This makes it very difficult to play
- The server tick rate. being alive at 100% health one second and then being teleported back 20m back in time and finding yourself dead. Tick rate effects being able to combat properly.
- Gate TTK I think is still too low. we cleared a gate in like less than 1 minute and the defenders didn't have time to formulate a proper defence.
- Respawns were very fast! fastest respawn I've had in the game was whilst in the siege, if this was available throughout the rest of the game it would be huge.
As a Bard on the Lotharia Winstead Defender team, I felt like I had very little to contribute. Players were dying so fast that I couldn't even cast an ability in time to try to prevent that. There was no real "time to kill", and people were just dropping instantly.
The fight was over too quickly to make use of control point respawn camps.
On a positive note, having the final capture point at the marketplace instead of the hill is a good improvement for this node layout.
However, the Gate fell so quickly it felt like it was made of wet paper.
Overall, I felt like my actions had minimal impact on the siege's outcome.
2nd of April Siege - Lotharia EU Miraleth Attacker
The recent Siege highlighted how critical active and experienced shot-callers are for successful coordination. Without them, things can quickly fall apart. Relying solely on voice chat isn't always practical or reliable in large-scale battles, so players need better communication tools.
A potential solution is a map-drawing feature for players in charge, similar to what was implemented in Savage: The Battle for Newerth. In that game, commanders could freely draw on the map, and those markings would appear on other players' maps, providing visual cues for key locations, such as:
This system not only made it possible to quickly and simply communicate with a large number of players in real time, but it was also extremely easy to understand and an effective form of communication without needing voice chat at all. However, if combined with voice communication, this would greatly enhance the experience for everyone involved. Getting an audio-visual explanation is much better than just having half of it, or if you're not even in a voice chat, since you wouldn't know what's going on.
While it was technically possible to misuse those free-draw features to draw inappropriate things, in practice, players who abused it were quickly dealt with by effective and active moderation and the community.
I think that adding such, or very similar, tools is absolutely essential for Sieges and other large-scale content to provide a positive long-term experience. It would allow for greatly improved coordination, and as a huge bonus, it would also make it easier to communicate with people who may have difficulty hearing or speaking in voice chat.
Control Point Respawns - What did you think about the location of the control point respawns? Did you have any thoughts regarding wave respawns?
Respawn timer seems to be OK. Defender respawn point is not too far nor too close so we can regroup. Didnt test outside respawn
Final Objective Location - What did you think about the final cap objective locations?
Market is like a turtle. it was the first so cant say about strat but its a pain to get in
Gate Destruction Time-To-Kill (TTK) - What did you think about the gate TTK?
feels fast, did not even see if we could hit them outside from inside the gate
Impact of Archetypes - Did any archetype stand out as having too much or too little impact? Why do you feel specific archetypes had more of an impact?
Think it was hard for a fighter ! as a mage it was full distant AE and trying to execute low hp but....
The render distance is a thing to work on. its a pain to have a large overview of the field, was just following shot callers but you run on ennemies nearly without see them. made a blink in a relative "safe" zone with 3/4 reds -> oh noes in fact 20 reds people are here
nevertheless that was a good test, thanks for those opportunities. theres some work to do but sieges will surely be good
I ask because it's a Dev Discussion in the General and not, like, a Feedback Request in the A2 forums, so it's a little ambiguous on that given the secondary, specific prompts. I can see how the 'main prompts' could be engaged with from just videos tho, so...
"For what...?"
"Just about everything, really."
Control Point Respawns - What did you think about the location of the control point respawns? Did you have any thoughts regarding wave respawns?
What control points? Is that something for the attackers? - I know from the tests on PTR that there are respawn camps, but this time the defenders died so hard, they didn't even had the time to try to (re)capture them.
I don't know about wave respawn, the only waves I noticed where the ones that the raid leaders formed.
Final Objective Location - What did you think about the final cap objective locations?
Compared with the PTR test where the final cap objective was on the hill, I think the marked place is better. But I miss a bit the possibility to place defenders on strategic points (like barikards) to defend the point.
Gate Destruction Time-To-Kill (TTK) - What did you think about the gate TTK?
What gate? - The gate was destroyed so fast, that it already was missing when the raid I was in reached it.
Impact of Archetypes - Did any archetype stand out as having too much or too little impact? Why do you feel specific archetypes had more of an impact?
I think rouges have too much of an impact. You can't see them -> can't attack them, but they just onehit one player after another.
On the other Hand I as a Cleric felt completely useless, the players were dieing too fast for me to heal, if I even where able to target them before they die. Even to heal myself I died too fast (mostly in CC and without seeing from what).
Additional notes
2nd of April Siege - Lotharia EU Miraleth Attacker
Control Point Respawns - What did you think about the location of the control point respawns? Did you have any thoughts regarding wave respawns?
I find it difficult to see which Respawn Point is where, I always had to check on the map.
Final Objective Location - What did you think about the final cap objective locations?
Miraleth has an easier time to defend the final cap objective than Winstead. While in Winstead the defenders come down an unguarded hill and reach the capture point from the side with less buildings, where the attackers can just mow them down. In Miraleth the defenders have first the high advantage from the cliff (with their walls that they can pass with ease) and than can recapture the final cap objective from the side with the buildings where they have cover.
Gate Destruction Time-To-Kill (TTK) - What did you think about the gate TTK?
It shows with less rouges and a split group it is more difficult to destroy the gates. Also it seemed like Miraleth has (on the gates that got attacked) a more easy time to attack the attackes from cover and high ground. Maybe the problem in Winstead was more, that the defenders didn't have a real way to prevent the attackers from hitting the gate and could only wait for them to destroy it.
Additional notes
I think the biggest problem is the coordination. While defenders basicly just need to sit on the final cap objective the attackers need a good way to coordinate. In the real game I assume that someone only attacks a node when they have a plan and a group that helps them, but what about the players that are not part of the group?
Attackers can just climb over the cliff at the south west gate to ignore the gate itself.
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- Control points are pretty much insignificant, and there is no reason for defenders to fight for them.
- Node walls present no real advantage to defenders (especially after they become destructible), and having the gates closed only means the defenders have to leave the node to fight or wait for the gates to fall.
- On that subject, it's very easy to bypass node gates/walls completely. Abilities like the bard's anti-gravity and other terrain placements make it pretty easy to jump over the walls. The gate's HP is irrelevant if all you do before the node gate is destroyed is wait for it to be destroyed.
- Players can easily destroy node structures (walls and gates), and with the current implementation, I don't see siege vehicles and weapons being important.
- The village node is pretty small, and the playing space is very limited for a siege.
- The channeling point requires one person to stop playing completely while channeling.
- Identifying the channeler is very difficult, with the number of players and size of nameplates and all VFX.
- With all that said above, I think we are very far from the defensive advantage we should have. Sieging a node should be a feat. Right now, I'd say the odds are 50/50 or at best 60/40 for defenders. We need this to be AT LEAST 80/20 for defenders.
- The performance was unbearable. from FPS to lag, to weird bugs like guy channeling doesn't trigger animation, to god awful TTK, it's all very difficult to even gauge what the system looks like ideally.
.Suggestions
Let me preface with something here. We know some of this stuff is planned, but we don't know to what extent. So I might suggest something that is already planned. No need to tell me, I'm just giving feedback on the current implementation
For example, each control point gives 25% of the total speed for the banner channel. When control points are taken, speed increases/decreases. If attackers control 1 point throughout the whole channel, it takes 20 minutes for the total channel. If they have 100% of control points, its 5 minutes, and it can take anything between that when control points keep changing hands. If defenders control all 4 points, they freeze the channeling
In this example, attackers would have to spread out to control the points while channeling. Defenders would have to choose between turtling up and allowing a possible quick channeling if they lose, or spreading out and fighting for the control points. As long as it's properly balanced, this could create a cool scenario of players alternating between decentralized battles with big 100v100 (for now) battles.
- Control Point Respawns outside of town can be capped WAY too fast with WAY too few people
- Control Point Respawns WAY too close to towns --> YOU said defenders have the advantage...no they dont the time to run from closest respawn outside is basically the same
- Final Objective Location can be capped too fast and also have the advantage for attackers cuz once they settled there defenders have to go through VERY NARROW choke points to get back there
- Gate Destruction TTK way too low, was like 500k on one gate?!?! Make it 20 million maybe.
- also to give a real defenders advantage players should not deal lots of damage to gates with ranged attacks
- TTK too low in general, therefore it is IMPOSSIBLE to say what archetypes had too much or too little impact (this makes PVP very unfun in general and this is most peoples opinion)
Other Feedback:
- too laggy to be a funny event
- rendering distance too low too be a funny event
- defenders need to have a huge advantage -> node destructions should not occur regularly and should need a HUGE effort and incredible tactics to pull off
- Slots for Node Sieges should be determined and adjusted as war groups by the Node Siege Leader and his assistants (just copy the New World System for Wars, at least this system worked perfect there)
Conclusion:
- Node Sieges as they are right now are unplayable shitshows and node destruction should NOT be enabled any time soon or people will spam Node Siegs until every single building is destroyed and server is basically done
- to really get an idea how to fix Node Sieges the TTK issue has to be fixed first (wiping servers could potentially delay this issue by a few month)
Everyone is free to participate in this thread! Whether you played in the Node Siege events or watched them
This system should be a node defense by the citizens of the node. The people who have all the risk in the system are the citizens of the node. They will have the most storage that is as risk. While outside citizens may have storage they will have half as much as a citizen will. Also, when owning a freehold requires you to be a citizen of the node those players will also have more risk in the system. Allowing rosters to be filled with other nodes citizens or those w/out any citizenship will give the content to the same group of people constantly, I heard this concern voiced about the system like this in New World. Give ownership to those who are citizens of a node.
1) Gates were too squishy. Add a way to hold them. There is nothing to do there right now except to wait for them to break it down.
2) Performance was really bad. I was rubberbanding constantly especially after reviving at a base camp
3) Zombie revives occurred multiple times when performance was bad. I would revive right where I died at.
4) Could we get a way for gear to be repaired or not break during a siege.
Performance was poor unfortunately, but that can be worked on (this was the biggest factor here).
"Control Point Respawns - What did you think about the location of the control point respawns? Did you have any thoughts regarding wave respawns?"
-> Respawn points were fine for the Defender's side, not sure about attackers here
-> Respawn times felt a bit short
-> Respawn timer should be either:
a) Longer every time you die
b) Group-respawn with a longer time (around 30s-1min, maybe more as the siege continues).
"Final Objective Location - What did you think about the final cap objective locations?"
-> Location should be choosen by the defender leader. The marketplace wasn't optimal in my opinion, in winstead it is very easy to just siege the node from 2 sides (2 closest entrances) and camp the market.
"Gate Destruction Time-To-Kill (TTK) - What did you think about the gate TTK?"
-> TTK on gate was extremely low, 100x the HP would be fine on this setting, or make it more durable. It also doesn't help if AOE skills like mage's ball of lightning and ranger's charged scattershot can just go through the walls (hence making melee caracters impossible to attack it)
"Impact of Archetypes - Did any archetype stand out as having too much or too little impact? Why do you feel specific archetypes had more of an impact?"
-> Melee classes need more love in these scenarios.
-> Wall on Tanks was good, grapple is still broken (wish we could pull somebody in-or-out with a grapple reliably).
-> Playing a Fighter feels underwhelming, the only way to "not die" is to use your longbow to poke targets to death, which kinda defeats the fighter's point in large-scale pvp.
-> Bard feels disgustingly overpowered, as it can shield/nimble your whole raid & incap (mesmerize) the whole enemy raid. Applying a maximum amount of players who can have the buffs/CC's would be a good option here.
-> Rangers feel balanced at the moment
-> Mages feel good in large-scale
-> Rogue (not sure here, stealth was kinda useless in a large-scale battle, but it's understandable: go in -> kill 2-3 people -> die -> repeat
-> Cleric is cleric, heals and resurrects people, feels okay at the moment
Additional notes:
-> Allow the siege participants more time to prepare. Attackers and defenders should be able to form few hours before the siege starts at least.
-> Level requirement needed. At the current TTK, there's no point for a player lvl under 25 (maybe under 20) to participate in this event.
-> Instead of individual sign-ups, people should be able to sign-up for this event as teams (teams of 4 min, 8 max), this will encourage solo players to form teams, and will make sure, that most of the people who sign up are serious about the event. After the sign-ups, the attacker/defender lead can admit/reject teams instead of individual players (this will make the sorting faster and I think more fair as well).
-> Ability to prepare and re-inforce your node for the siege, like mayoral comissions, but in a larger scale (kinda similar with building requirements, like deliver 1000 wood & 1000 iron to a gate to make it barbed or more reinforced, upgrade the walls to make it higher, etc.)
Instead, you could have it be an accrual system for the channeling team, percentage or point-base for the channel, which is essentially the same as capture points for standing in an area, but the attackers have to give up a few attackers to get enough points to win. That's relevant due to the simple fact that attackers are generally going to have the initiative in combat in any game and especially here. Defenders should have a time limit to survive to for the win and or need to kill X attackers total.
Example: The attackers capture the point that was in the market today and out of 100 attackers have 5 ppl channeling, each get's a ticking % or points that accrue toward a total amount, eventually netting enough that you complete the channel and win.
This would also make some classes that might not normally be desirable for an attacking team, such as tank, more relevant. Tanks channeling on the point would be harder to kill, etc.
Let's say channeling is 1 point per second and you need 3600 to win as the attacking team. The attacking team could try to win in an aggressive manner if they're dominating the PvP, giving up 10 of their attacking force to channel, 600 points per minute-6 minutes of 10 attackers doing so, you win. However, you pay for this aggressive tactic by losing the numerical advantage in combat, it's now theoretically 90 v 100.
This makes it extra important for each team to be full, and nodes that can't maintain a population are more vulnerable to attack; real in game consequences for being a bad node no one wants to be a citizen of. Defenders can perhaps take back spawn points or repair gates by channeling, slowing down attackers and gaining them back time to eventually win, but again, if you give up defenders to repair a gate, you lose your numerical advantage in combat temporarily since they're busy, which makes sense. The point is, in a system like this, the defenders now have an advantage and real incentive to defend vs. an attacking force and extend the siege (as they should) that would be inherently built in, and attackers are incentivized to be aggressive (as they should). Otherwise, the defenders could simply push a sortie out and fight in the field vs. the attackers to get a kill total, which is not necessarily ideal for "defenders" or "attackers" in a siege. Simply sitting in a capture point in a town also shouldn't win the Siege, if you're taking a node over, you would need to capture multiple points and or channel the Godspike for a large amount of time. This would fit thematically in the AoC world while making tactics, coordination, and skill relevant, on top of respective roles for players.
Another way to make the terrain and different points in the defending node relevant would be to have multiple points for channeling, which makes the system I'm proposing a hybrid capture/channel point. This would incentivize coordinated groups to split off and defend in different areas at different times, and make 8-man group tactics more relevant; perhaps the attackers get a higher point return for channeling based on how many of the areas they are channeling in. If there are 3-4 spikes and the attackers manage to hold a channel at each one, the points per second could get a bonus for each point held. Lends credence to the notion that controlling or losing key areas matters, makes numerical advantages a thing, and helps with immersion in your roles.
I know this post was long, thanks for reading my two cents.
Issue: Lower-level players (e.g., Level 10 or 14) were able to join the battle, creating a major imbalance. Teams with higher-level players had a significant advantage, whether attacking or defending.
Proposed Solution: Only max-level players should be allowed to participate or be invited. This ensures fair and competitive battles.
2. Strengthen the Gate with a Temporary Damage Reduction Buff
Issue: The gate to the inner area was destroyed too fast, giving defenders little time to organize. A key strategic structure should not be breached in mere minutes.
Proposed Solution: Implement a Damage Reduction Buff for the first 15 to 30 minutes to prevent a rush and allow defenders time to establish their positions.
3. Defenders Need a Stronger Starting Position to Withstand Early Attacks
Issue: Attackers had an overwhelming advantage, while defenders lacked effective ways to counter them outside the walls.
Proposed Solution: Adjust the starting numbers for both sides to create a more realistic siege scenario:
- Defenders start with 100 players, attackers start with 75.
- After 30 minutes, attackers receive 25 reinforcements.
This system would:
- Give defenders a slight early advantage, encouraging strategic defense.
- Simulate a real siege where attackers call for reinforcements after an initial struggle.
- Make battles feel more dynamic and engaging.
For recommendations, like many, id say removing mounts would likely make a big difference with spawn and view distance. Also I'd love to see the game prioritize rendering party members if its possible, I try to stick with my group during a raid like this, but it feels near impossible when selecting them from the raid list doesnt meaningfully highlight them in your vicinity, i know rendering so many bodies is hard, but i feel the system should prioritize party members, then raid, then guildies for instance.
One bug id love to see fixed are the invisible walls/rocks that we seemingly get stuck on and rubberband on, happens rather regularly!
It's good for attacker however you should be able to channel as a attacker after a defender has slightly recaptured and died. "Should be an easy fix and I think it just may be a glitch currently?" Also, the time to come back as a defender was crazy. I would kill a defender and would be back in the same location 14 seconds later. Add some death stock or maybe accumulative timer on how many times someone dies. It was crazy.
Final Objective Location - What did you think about the final cap objective locations?
This is an issue. Strategically hard in some locations and there really should be a checkpoint on the node as the capturing currently is really finicky. Maybe 2 check points or even one at 50%. It is almost impossible to capture with a competent defending group because a "Kamikaze" dive bomb will just reset the channel. Maybe just move the channel up near the mayoral vendor and have the defenders respawn market, would maybe eliminate some strategical advantage.
Gate Destruction Time-To-Kill (TTK) - What did you think about the gate TTK?
TTK is fine but the gates currently feel lacking in some way. Maybe siege equipment would change that and adding more hp with siege equipment. Not sure how to fix this one.
Impact of Archetypes - Did any archetype stand out as having too much or too little impact? Why do you feel specific archetypes had more of an impact?
I play rogue and fighter, the fighter is lacking in any large scale pvp as I am a glorified ranger. Ive played heavily into the game and have around 620 attack power and can say for certain that Healer and Bard are required in any group, Mages are great for large scale, rangers are ok but great for large scale cc. But, whoever made the rogue and bards archetypes need to redesign all the other classes because as it is a Single target class, they gave them utility for large scale as well and has good class feel. Tanks are in the same boat as fighter with slightly more utility for shielding but still bad in large scale IMO.
Right now for archetype it's heavily favored for ranged. As a fighter/tank you bring very minimal impact sitting back and poking with a ranged weapon, and even less so going into melee range as you're immediately targeted and die within seconds (even with Blood Fusion and Whirlwind going). I feel this will deter certain archetypes from wanting to join and give defending teams a much larger advantage if they can stack ranged archetypes.
I did not realize the node siege was going on and I had logged into my character for the day only to be instantly killed as soon as I logged in. There was no warning, no countdown...nada. And then insta robbed by a node siege participant (didn't have much on me fortunately).
Once I was dead I did rez at the Winstead Embershrine and then got the notice and timer warning to 'get out of dodge' or be slain. With this warning, I was able to move out of range and go on my way while the madness occurred in and around Windstead.
Devs: For the future, please warn us at login/character select if possible, or at least insta teleport us out of node if we are not a participant.
Thank you
Control point respawns:
I had no issue with the placement of the spawn points, I just don't see a reason for them to exist. There is no clear reason to take them outside of slightly delaying the push of the attackers. Mounts being enabled allow for traversal to happen fairly rapidly no matter where you spawned in. Early on during the siege the defenders took all the points, we proceeded to hold most of the points with very little difficulty for most of the siege. They weren't contested often, but neither were they used often. They didn't seem to play a large role in the event at all. They should be more important to the siege. As they stand they were a minor objective at best, with little to no effort being made to take or contest them. Maybe make them have mechanical benefits for the team that controls them?
I liked the wave spawns, as they gave us some breathing space a few times. the did end up being part of the reason we lost, but that was our fault.
Final Objective location:
The final objective is in a awful place. It positioning combined with the primary defender spawn's location made it near impossible to push the attackers off the point after they got inside the city. the buildings are clustered too tightly around the objective giving the people on the point a large amount of cover. In addition to that one of the larger buildings actively makes it harder for those coming off the defender spawn, as it funnels them into tight clusters. The other passages are hardly much better as they are thin and easy to guard from the point. On top this certain abilities seem to ignore collision from walls and can be cast through them. Basically attacking the objective from the defender's side is really difficult. It was made even more difficult when mounts were added into the mix making picking specific targets even more difficult than the design of the point made it already.
Gate Destruction Time-To-Kill (TTK):
this was largely irrelevant for this siege, which was a bit dissapointing. The gates were largely ignored in favor of just jumping the walls in certain areas of Halc. Once they starting doing this our gate defense was pulled back to defend the point, at which point the gates were basically erased. We should have ignored the gates and just put everyone on defending the point, as that is what the siege devolved into at the end. There should be some mechanism that makes the gates more integral to the siege itself. Either by making the walls harder to cross, or requiring at least one gate to fall before the point become contestable.
Impact of Archetypes:
Mages and Hunters seemed most oppressive. the ground was covered in thorns and I spent a lot of time dyeing to abilities and attacks that were hitting me from outside my line of sight. There was also a ton of lag that ate a ton of my ability casts and caused me to just randomly die (and respawn where I died instead of the defense spawn).
some more notes:
-Control points don't feel impactful. They need something there worth having and or denying.
-Only 1 objective once inside the gates (Which go down WAY to fast) feels a bit shortsighted. There should be multiple points once inside a town that have to be held before the Godspike is even spawned.
-Being able to see enemies is imperative and right now you can die and never see the person that killed you.
A siege of a town should be a very difficult thing to accomplish and actually feel like a SIEGE. There should be no way its over quickly.
Rubber banding, player render distance, player pop-in, abilities not rendering at all, rezing at the spot of your death plus the instant respawn bug (so I hear) and continued channel after death all make the sieges none-competitive.
It's not possible to properly gauge the balance of classes, respawn mechanics, or objectives in this environment.
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The Controlpoints had not a lot of impact to the gameplay imo. Even if u managed to get one it wouldnt matter the moment the Gate broke and the Attacker managed to get onto the marketplace.
Maybe consider that u need to hold all CPs and the marketplace to fill the gauge to win ? So the defender are allowed to counterstrat and the players would split among the whole area of the node.
The rubberbanding and renderdistance is not yet there to allow for suge big battles in crowded areas like cities.
Even on a good rig it was more or less a serverside slideshow, which as a meele in particular is bad.
Sometimes abilitys wouldnt activate, or render.
I think that dynamic server meshing and griding is more or less necessary to handle this amount of players on that little space.
The Gate TTK was barerly noticable imo. One moment it was closed with only 4 people visible outside the Gate, the next it was Gone with attackers flooding in, invisible until u dropped dead of the AOE.
It should hold at least 10 minutes that the defender are able to manage a counter attack or get out and start taking CPs to force the attacker to react (especially if u would need all of them to proceed the siege)
The Respawntimer was good, but maybe to fast for the attackers, even though the render distance didnt allow me to see most of the attackers, it never felt as if our kills had any impact bc the respawned as fast as we did and could get back in fight as fast as the defender, which neglevts the defenders advantage of fighting on "home ground"
And for Archetype impact, well meeles are basically useless sadly, even the rogue thats meant to pick off striders u wouldnt get a proper chance to attack anything if the oponent just keeps spamming AOE and with no means to properly see and dodge them, u always get hit by something.
I dont want to imagine how a fighter must feel...
The good thing is, if and thats a big IF u manage to get long enough in range to burst someone, i think u would kill him, bc of the meele burst. Meeles will never life long in this kind of MMO but they should be able to kill u, if the get in range
So the advantage is big numbers, the disadvantage : get in range.
To sum up:
Most important issue: Render distance and Imput delay
Checkpoints should be more important imo
Gate TTK minimum of 5 min with itempower 500-600
Respawntimer based on team and/or amount of CP in own teams hand
Meeles wont get picked if they dont get a reason to be there if they just drop dead, and people will consider this in their class choice (so way more mages and rangers)
PS: thank u for ur hard work! I know its not easy to deliver a game like this if u consider the typical MMO player
But ur doing a great job and i hope u keep doing it!
Trakoon
from
Guild Obscuritas
Respawns seemed fine, the only issue that came with a wave respawn were some people pushing and trying to get aoe kills and not caring about dying because they knew respawn timer and when they could die/when to play safe.
Final Objective Location - What did you think about the final cap objective locations?
Location was fine, there was a spot inside one of the rooms where a ranger was able to roll behind a door that was propped open and camo up while capping.
Gate Destruction Time-To-Kill (TTK) - What did you think about the gate TTK?
I didnt feel like the gates mattered a whole lot to a big push but were effective against small groups. I can see attackers wanting to drop every gate as a group before they continue into the Node.
Impact of Archetypes - Did any archetype stand out as having too much or too little impact? Why do you feel specific archetypes had more of an impact?
I played a Tank for this Node War, most of my abilities didn't seem effective besides absorption field and wall. The chain didn't like to pull moving enemies, I could only get those who had decided to stand still for a moment. The wall was able to temporarily block a gate. I can see this having too much of an impact as well as the Rangers Vine Field in a war of attrition. The absorption field was absolutely insane, affecting everyone on defense and allowing for big pushes and big saves from the Vine Field. The tanks trip abilities played a nice roll in cc'ing those who overextended at an odd angle but were useless in the big pushes.