Dealing with random player killing in an open-world PvP MMO.

For such an ambitious player-driven MMO as Ashes, the presence of random player killing (RPK) poses a challenge.
How do you allow for player agency while protecting new / weak players?

On one hand, giving players the agency to dish out justice in blood makes the world much more interactive and unpredictable, as your reputation and behavior may have dire consequences.

However, the challenge is that this level of PvP-interactivity, typically also gives rise to RPKs. Some of which intentionally grief, and others who just PvP indiscriminately.

The corruption system is already a great safety mechanism against this. However, with player-interaction at the heart of Ashes it would be great to see additional counter-RPK mechanisms that are driven by the players themselves.
Bounty hunters as planned, are a great first step.

However, bounty hunting only taps into monetary motivation. It'd be great to provide tools by which guilds and players may establish a reputation of benevolence and fairness. If Newbie Joe can report a RPK or griefer to the local guild, then it puts justice back into the hands of players. If the game tracks and incentivizes such player-driven justice, then guilds may want their territory to garner a reputation as a safe haven with just proceedings.

If Anti-PKing or peacekeeping is made worthwhile in this sense, we'll be encouraging the community to respond to griefing or bad behavior organically.

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Comments

Marcet

The corruption system is more than enough to limit PvP.

Bricktop

Marcet wrote: »

The corruption system is more than enough to limit PvP.

Corruption system won't limit PvP, it'll limit low level ganking though for sure.

Marcet

Bricktop wrote: »

Marcet wrote: »

The corruption system is more than enough to limit PvP.

Corruption system won't limit PvP, it'll limit low level ganking though for sure.

Yeah exactly, Im not refering to other PvP activities like caste siege etc...
Plus not everybody is gonna be an asshole for the sake of it, plenty of people will fight the griefers or corrupted, there's even incentives to hunt them.

Bricktop

Marcet wrote: »

Bricktop wrote: »

Marcet wrote: »

The corruption system is more than enough to limit PvP.

Corruption system won't limit PvP, it'll limit low level ganking though for sure.

Yeah exactly, Im not refering to other PvP activities like caste siege etc...
Plus not everybody is gonna be an asshole for the sake of it, plenty of people will fight the griefers or corrupted, there's even incentives to hunt them.

Yea, thankfully most people understand that. I love PvP but I have better things to do with my time then gank lowbies. It'll hardly ever happen to people. It's only true carebears who are making a big stink about "griefers".

AxelBlaze1

Bricktop wrote: »

It's only true carebears who are making a big stink about "griefers".

This is the only thing that a lot of you seem to have to counter any of @Noaani 's points. Some of you guys have either been, repeating the same things over and over again, or repeatedly misunderstanding another. Is it really hard to discuss an opinion that isn't different from yours? If it is, then maybe you shouldn't be here.

Why hate people over something we don't even know much about yet? Just be nice to each other. At the end of the day, its just another video game.

Dolyem

Miracle wrote: »

Dolyem wrote: »

If you log in to a game with open world pvp knowing that it has said pvp, its consensual. Nobody is forcing you to play the game, you are choosing to participate by playing it. If you want the feature to opt out, go play a game with that option. This game is not that game and wont ever be.

There's definitely some truth to this, but Intrepid would presumably want to avoid needlessly alienating players who aren't familiar with this genre, and perhaps ease them into it.

I mean, they are advertising it as such. They are adamant about an open world factionless pvp system that punishes people who gank, via corruption. It doesn't really need to ease people in because its relatively straight forward. You can potentially be ganked by anyone, but there are systems that act as a deterrent to griefing so it doesn't happen as often, and is punished effectively when it does.

Jubilum

Mojottv wrote: »

AxelBlaze wrote: »

Mojottv wrote: »

Noaani wrote: »

Mojottv wrote: »

If a guy is a dick, you can kill him, its nice...

You didn't just say that? (in shock) Really did you just say that? OMG, what have we come to. I guess if it is alright to kill some one for who they voted for, why not for being a dick.

Bricktop

AxelBlaze wrote: »

Bricktop wrote: »

It's only true carebears who are making a big stink about "griefers".

This is the only thing that a lot of you seem to have to counter any of @Noaani 's points. Some of you guys have either been, repeating the same things over and over again, or repeatedly misunderstanding another. Is it really hard to discuss an opinion that isn't different from yours? If it is, then maybe you shouldn't be here.

Why hate people over something we don't even know much about yet? Just be nice to each other. At the end of the day, its just another video game.

Thanks for your input chuckles. I find it hilarious that YOU are telling people to be nice considering what you got banned on your other account for. Looks like our friend "Axel" is banned now too. Most likely for ban evasion.

Warth

Bricktop wrote: »

AxelBlaze wrote: »

Bricktop wrote: »

It's only true carebears who are making a big stink about "griefers".

This is the only thing that a lot of you seem to have to counter any of @Noaani 's points. Some of you guys have either been, repeating the same things over and over again, or repeatedly misunderstanding another. Is it really hard to discuss an opinion that isn't different from yours? If it is, then maybe you shouldn't be here.

Why hate people over something we don't even know much about yet? Just be nice to each other. At the end of the day, its just another video game.

Thanks for your input chuckles. I find it hilarious that YOU are telling people to be nice considering what you got banned on your other account for. Looks like our friend "Axel" is banned now too. Most likely for ban evasion.

I was curious on who that was, his writing seemed awefully familiar. Interesting to read that my hunch turned out correctly. Its good that these Forums are properly moderated. That will prevent them from turning into a wow-like cesspool. Name calling can't have a place here.

Its quite interesting, that people keep shouting "you misunderstand my points" when people understand them completely. They merely disagree.

Also quite amusing that people conviniently ignore the points you make when they don't fit their agenda and don't have any answer for them.

Bricktop

Warth wrote: »

Bricktop wrote: »

AxelBlaze wrote: »

Bricktop wrote: »

It's only true carebears who are making a big stink about "griefers".

This is the only thing that a lot of you seem to have to counter any of @Noaani 's points. Some of you guys have either been, repeating the same things over and over again, or repeatedly misunderstanding another. Is it really hard to discuss an opinion that isn't different from yours? If it is, then maybe you shouldn't be here.

Why hate people over something we don't even know much about yet? Just be nice to each other. At the end of the day, its just another video game.

Thanks for your input chuckles. I find it hilarious that YOU are telling people to be nice considering what you got banned on your other account for. Looks like our friend "Axel" is banned now too. Most likely for ban evasion.

I was curious on who that was, his writing seemed awefully familiar. Interesting to read that my hunch turned out correctly. Its good that these Forums are properly moderated. That will prevent them from turning into a wow-like cesspool. Name calling can't have a place here.

Its quite interesting, that people keep shouting "you misunderstand my points" when people understand them completely. They merely disagree.

Also quite amusing that people conviniently ignore the points you make when they don't fit their agenda and don't have any answer for them.

The fact that a brand new account came to the forums and immediately accused me and @Tyrantor of misunderstanding everything was a major red flag lol.

The name chuckles really does suit him, he's constantly making me laugh.

Noaani

Warth wrote: »

I was curious on who that was, his writing seemed awefully familiar. Interesting to read that my hunch turned out correctly. Its good that these Forums are properly moderated. That will prevent them from turning into a wow-like cesspool. Name calling can't have a place here.

Indeed.

To be fair though, there are a few other people I strongly suspect are using two or more accounts - which is a part of the reason that the number of posters on each side in a discussion is not a good point to ever make.

Hurf Derfman

Noaani wrote: »

Warth wrote: »

I was curious on who that was, his writing seemed awefully familiar. Interesting to read that my hunch turned out correctly. Its good that these Forums are properly moderated. That will prevent them from turning into a wow-like cesspool. Name calling can't have a place here.

Indeed.

To be fair though, there are a few other people I strongly suspect are using two or more accounts - which is a part of the reason that the number of posters on each side in a discussion is not a good point to ever make.

Oh hush. Don't reveal your hand when it's already strong.

Noaani

Hurf Derfman wrote: »

Noaani wrote: »

Warth wrote: »

I was curious on who that was, his writing seemed awefully familiar. Interesting to read that my hunch turned out correctly. Its good that these Forums are properly moderated. That will prevent them from turning into a wow-like cesspool. Name calling can't have a place here.

Indeed.

To be fair though, there are a few other people I strongly suspect are using two or more accounts - which is a part of the reason that the number of posters on each side in a discussion is not a good point to ever make.

Oh hush. Don't reveal your hand when it's already strong.

If I were using two accounts, everyone would know it.

Hurf Derfman

Noaani wrote: »

Hurf Derfman wrote: »

Noaani wrote: »

Warth wrote: »

I was curious on who that was, his writing seemed awefully familiar. Interesting to read that my hunch turned out correctly. Its good that these Forums are properly moderated. That will prevent them from turning into a wow-like cesspool. Name calling can't have a place here.

Indeed.

To be fair though, there are a few other people I strongly suspect are using two or more accounts - which is a part of the reason that the number of posters on each side in a discussion is not a good point to ever make.

Oh hush. Don't reveal your hand when it's already strong.

If I were using two accounts, everyone would know it.

Exactly.

bigepeen

Noaani wrote: »

Warth wrote: »

I was curious on who that was, his writing seemed awefully familiar. Interesting to read that my hunch turned out correctly. Its good that these Forums are properly moderated. That will prevent them from turning into a wow-like cesspool. Name calling can't have a place here.

Indeed.

To be fair though, there are a few other people I strongly suspect are using two or more accounts - which is a part of the reason that the number of posters on each side in a discussion is not a good point to ever make.

The only people using multiple accounts so far have an agenda to change the game's design direction to make it more PvE focused. Why am I not surprised...

Noaani

bigepeen wrote: »

Noaani wrote: »

Warth wrote: »

I was curious on who that was, his writing seemed awefully familiar. Interesting to read that my hunch turned out correctly. Its good that these Forums are properly moderated. That will prevent them from turning into a wow-like cesspool. Name calling can't have a place here.

Indeed.

To be fair though, there are a few other people I strongly suspect are using two or more accounts - which is a part of the reason that the number of posters on each side in a discussion is not a good point to ever make.

The only people using multiple accounts so far have an agenda to change the game's design direction to make it more PvE focused. Why am I not surprised...

To be fair, that was that posters 3rd account that I am aware of.

There is a reason I barely interact with him.

I wouldn't start trying to tie multi-account usage to a particular side of a debate, to be honest. As I said, I am fairly sure there are a few others using multiple accounts - and attempting to tie such activity in to a particular side wouldn't go down so well if my assumptions were true.

Bricktop

Noaani wrote: »

bigepeen wrote: »

Noaani wrote: »

Warth wrote: »

I was curious on who that was, his writing seemed awefully familiar. Interesting to read that my hunch turned out correctly. Its good that these Forums are properly moderated. That will prevent them from turning into a wow-like cesspool. Name calling can't have a place here.

Indeed.

To be fair though, there are a few other people I strongly suspect are using two or more accounts - which is a part of the reason that the number of posters on each side in a discussion is not a good point to ever make.

The only people using multiple accounts so far have an agenda to change the game's design direction to make it more PvE focused. Why am I not surprised...

To be fair, that was that posters 3rd account that I am aware of.

There is a reason I barely interact with him.

I wouldn't start trying to tie multi-account usage to a particular side of a debate, to be honest. As I said, I am fairly sure there are a few others using multiple accounts - and attempting to tie such activity in to a particular side wouldn't go down so well if my assumptions were true.

Interesting because you and he go through a lot of the same motions like accusing everybody of misunderstanding you and ignoring massive portions of someones reply to cherry pick 1 little tiny part to write a dissertation about.

Yes, everybody has nothing better to do with their free time and they are making tons of accounts to make you look like you have nobody agreeing with you. It couldn't POSSIBLY be that everybody thinks your ideas are trash.

Tragnar

What do you think about "red cross" equivalent kinda intended for healers and higher corruption values for them. Or even some religions to have increased corruption when eligible.

Seems pretty immersive to me to have some corruption for killing regular people, but to have some extra when killing doctors(healing specs)/priests(religion representatives)/children(low lvl players)

Bricktop

Tragnar wrote: »

What do you think about "red cross" equivalent kinda intended for healers and higher corruption values for them. Or even some religions to have increased corruption when eligible.

Seems pretty immersive to me to have some corruption for killing regular people, but to have some extra when killing doctors(healing specs)/priests(religion representatives)/children(low lvl players)

Ehhhhh, I would say no to higher corruption on healers. They are usually targeted first in PvP, and if I get the jump on a groups healer before they flag back by healing someone who flagged then I shouldn't suffer even higher corruption. The corruption system is extremely punishing as is already IMO.

Tragnar

well there are supposed to be no oneshots so it is kinda unreasonable to think they cant react quickly enough to not do any PvP action that flags them (like healing themselves/others)

Edit:
Isn't the kill time aimed at 30+s?

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