Misc. Game Mechanics

This post covers ideas that are just to simple to warrant their own post.

Having the ability to click on the map and see what is going on in that region if friendly players are there like League of Legends would be pretty useful in 250 vs 250 brackets

As developers I see you guys are putting a lot of effort into making cool looking weapons be nice if we could look at them close up and have ability to rotate them same thing with armour sets.

There is an old spell from Dungeouns and dragons called Chromatic Orb with 12 different effects or could be a weapon like a spear with sweep dazzle and impale abilities or just a mage spell like fireball with different effects. Think if you push lets say But lets say Chromatic Orb had only 7 effects then pushing that button could bring up the effect choices and press whichever one you want then automatically goes back to previous page. Aslo if you just push the Chromatic Orb button ounce then effect in box one is selected. Be pretty cool if we could arrange the order of the spell effects . Works very similar to page up and page down. And similar to pressing modifiers like shift alt and control and similar to stances. But what this does is introduces a two button sequence for abilities kind like in Tekken. Increases the number of abilities you can use without actaully increasing the number of keybindings that you need.

Be cool if pets could do stuff like open doors and pull levers or capture a flag. Well maybe not capture flag. Things is I play huntesr and well realized that pets can be to powerful in pvp, but there are a lot of other things that pets could do like have dnager sense track monsters. Plus be pretty cool if we could see a picture in a cloud of what they might be thinking. Like food they want to eat and player that just killed their master and wants revenge, or some toy to play with. Since rangers would be metally linked to pet then this would make sense. Just things that would make them more like a life long campanion than just a pet that does x damage.

That is all for now gents good day to you.

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consultant

Think secondary communication system would be cool like pings point I was trying to make is voice chat is insufficient. Most people most like just pay attention not actually in vioce seriously doubt all the people are in voice chat So in this games that you are talking about are like 500 people actually in voice chat.

Warth

consultant wrote: »

Think secondary communication system would be cool like pings point I was trying to make is voice chat is insufficient. Most people most like just pay attention not actually in vioce seriously doubt all the people are in voice chat So in this games that you are talking about are like 500 people actually in voice chat.

Voice chat isn't insufficient lmao. Not much point having a discussion with someone who doesn't know what they are talking about though.
Everybody that played Eve for a while knows how easily 100s or even 1000+ players on a single voicecom can be managed.

Trying to use LoL as a reference point for large scale battles and voice coms is asinine at best.
In large scale battles either everybody but the group and raid leads are outright muted or Trolls, Drunk and Stoned People as well as those people that don't know how to stfu will be muted in no-time.

Its a pretty simple concept actually. With increasing amount of numbers participating in an operation, the amount each person says declines drastically. Which is enforced in one way or the other. With increasing amounts of participants, most of the communication gets consolidated under the wings of a few individuals. Soldiers STFU, Commanders lead. Simple as that.

Ramirez

consultant wrote: »

Think secondary communication system would be cool like pings point I was trying to make is voice chat is insufficient. Most people most like just pay attention not actually in vioce seriously doubt all the people are in voice chat So in this games that you are talking about are like 500 people actually in voice chat.

Playing albion online and voice chat is okay, in big scale fight just shoutcalllers speak, the rest is muted and i m talking about fights with more then 500 players... You can ping in the map to, but we need to ignore, imagine 500 people pinging the map... Pings is more usefull for small scale fights and pve, we use alot for Ganks

Noaani

consultant wrote: »

Ever heard of people playing drunk or high or young peprson But just to be perfectly clear you are saying that

I believe he addressed this.

Warth wrote: »

People don't sing, people don't joke around. People follow the orders of a handful of people or they will be muted/not participating the next time.

If someone in voice chat is causing an issue - they get universally muted.

If that happens, there are no issues any more.

In some situations I've been involved in, everyone present is muted, and then only a select few are unmuted.

I have also seen dozens of times where people not following orders in these large scale events get booted and not invited along next time.

consultant

So now its 1000 people in voice chat and for the most part orderly conduct...well if it works it works just not my personal experience . If you have like lets say a group of like 250 that is comprised of lets say 5 guilds that are 50 people per guild that will work because it is organized.

Really do not see this working in an evironment were the pvp is just who ever shows up. Matter of fact we are getting ready to do the who ever shows up uneven PvP 250vs250.

Is that part of your ecperience 100 to 1000 people just show up and it is mostly orderly with exceptions in voice chat.

To be clear it is whoever shows up no group or invitation neeeded or will not play with you next time type of thing. Have heard any structure to it so....

Noaani

consultant wrote: »

Is that part of your ecperience 100 to 1000 people just show up and it is mostly orderly with exceptions in voice chat.

Mute all.

Unmute those in leadership positions.

Where is your lack of understanding this coming from?

Warth

You are afraid that it won't work for large scale matchmade pvp game modes?

Well, then i'm happy to inform you that there won't be such a thing in Ashes

consultant

consultant wrote: »

Warth wrote: »

You are afraid that it won't work for large scale matchmade pvp game modes?

Noaani wrote: »

consultant wrote: »

Is that part of your ecperience 100 to 1000 people just show up and it is mostly orderly with exceptions in voice chat.

Mute all.

Unmute those in leadership positions.

Where is your lack of understanding this coming from?

As far as what Noaani said that is a great way to cut down chatter would have to agree and works great in a premade group.....

We do not have a premade group. Let me explain see you could be in a guild and ask people from that guild to do dungeouns with you and require them to be in voice chat to get ready for raiding. In this case voice chat would work even if the group is 250. Or let say you are playing an open world pvp game like lets say Eve online. Were lets say 10,000 people are logged in and you spam a server wide message and out of 10,000 you go through the selection process and get 250 in a group obviosly you could simply say hey if you are not in voice chat not going to invite or if they do not want to be in voice chat thye get removed from party. Point there is some there making sure people are in voice chat just keep going until you get to 250.

I guess I will just have to spell out for you guys......some people are under the impression well why not just use voice chat for 250 vs250 bracket. Well in a premade you get organized first .usually done by group leader which could include voice chat really no brainer. But what is being implied here is that 250 will show up for an event and most of them will decide to be in the same voice chat let say in game voice chat since every one will have access to to it.

In the open world battleground and in node vs node you have no control over who is goiing to show up.
I know what you guys are saying you can in fact get groups of 250 or more in voice chat in large scale open world PvP game. But in Ashes fo Creation is not going to be reaching out to lets say 10,000 people in getting 250 in voice chat then pvping. Really the number 250 does not matter to much. It is the random nature of the event. If 100 people show or 50 people show up some of them are not going to be inclined to be in voice and no one can force them to do so.

It is getting the 250 people that just happened to show up some which may use voice chat some which do not that is the problem. Just cause they do not use voice that does not barr them from the event. What you have in ashes of Creation for the most part is Open World Pvp Events.

In Ashes of Creation The premade PvP I see is guild wars and Caravans. So how ever many people participate in those events 50 or 100 or 150 voice chat would work cause of the non random nature of the premade event. Or you get to chose the people that go with you and only people that are in voice chat get to go. Really if only the people that are in voice chat can go with you then there is no chance for voice not to work.

But this is not the case in an Open World PvP Event.

Just to be clear you could in fact get 250 people in a group and lets say that is the upper limit for a battle ground. And let say all 250 are in voice chat and as you say it is all organized you could then you march over to a Battleground. If there are already 100 random people from your server there then guessing only 150 will be able to participate from your group and how are you going to get those 100 people that are already there in your voice chat. You could ask politely other than you cannot do much of anything. Now there are quite of number of things that Ashes of Creation could do to encourage using voice like automatically making a 250 people chat room for people using ingame voice chat per event. But some people will not use in voice game chat cause they like discord better so....and also there all kinds of game mechanics that could be implemented like a 250 group could reserve a battle ground but that isa different topic.

As far as muting people as a means to control chatter when already in a group that works.

Noaani

consultant wrote: »

If 100 people show or 50 people show up some of them are not going to be inclined to be in voice and no one can force them to do so.

So, your issue has gone from voice chat with many people being unwieldy, to not everyone in large scale combat will want to join voice chat.

Obviously not everyone will want to. The people that dont will just follow everyone else. This is all fairly basic stuff.

consultant wrote: »

Just to be clear you could in fact get 250 people in a group and lets say that is the upper limit for a battle ground. And let say all 250 are in voice chat and as you say it is all organized you could then you march over to a Battleground. If there are already 100 random people from your server there then guessing only 150 will be able to participate from your group and how are you going to get those 100 people that are already there in your voice chat.

This is not a situation that could happen. You have the system design wrong in your mind.

consultant

Really do not have an issue just saying more needs to be done as far as cummincation systems for non premade groups like we have in Ashes of Creation.

Yeah it is basic stuff, but is basic stuff that conflicts with the idea that well we could just use voice chat for large scale PvP in Ashes of Creation.. i do not why someone is posting about Eve online.

So basically I do not think that just voice chat is is acceptable as the primary form of cummuncation in large scale battles in Ashes of Creation. Some the posts indicate otherwise like making a comparison to what happens in Eve online.

I have ideas like a sign up sheet so people can sign up for roles in advance for node vs node or having a primary secondary and tertiary raid leaders (peopel that feel comfortable giving out orders and are good at it)
So that an event will likely have some some leader ship. Pre Assigned raid leaders.

To say well we could just use vocie is absurd for an Open Word PvP Event were people just show up.

That is what is being implied that voice Chat is appropriate for a 250 event like Node vs Node.}
Really do not see how any one could say that.

So will voice chat work for Node vs Node obviously the answer is NO. No brainer. Yeah it is a no brainer but we got people sayig well In Eve online it works. All those links to videos submitted as proof that it works all Irrevelent.

Yeah a no brainer but for some reason people think voice chat will work for 250 EVENT (not a premade)
250 people are not going to show up and just go into voice ready to take orders from a raider.

So just wanted to take the time to say it will not work in order to say that had to go through some really basic stuff as you said. Really do not know Why I have to say it in the first place. All the sudden we are in Eve Online ??

consultant

Just to be clear battlegrounds in Ashes are Open World like an Open world Boss. Not sure what the exact game mechanics are. Open world usually means who ever shows up. Now there are exceptions like guild castle sieges. So does voice chat workd for guilds....real basic stuff but yes. In this case it is which ever guild shows up see the differrence group vs no group.

Point is it does work for Open world PvP events were People just show up and you have not control who is in a group matter of fact lot people will not be in group per say and still participate in Events.

So Premade Yes (like in group)
Non Premade No (like an Open world PVP EVENT or Open world Raid boss)

Now all you have figure which PvP in Ashes of Creation is Premade and Non Premade and that answers the question if voice chat is appropriate or not.

Noaani

consultant wrote: »

Point is it does work for Open world PvP events were People just show up and you have not control who is in a group matter of fact lot people will not be in group per say and still participate in Events.

Again, you have the wrong idea in your head about the mechanics of how these things will work.

Whether a node war, a siege, or a guild war, there will be structure in place well before the day. These aren't things where everyone just shows up and you run with whoever you have. They are events where guilds would have communicated with each other about their intention to participate, and the events in question will be run using the existing structures of those guilds.

Random people that just show up and want to participate are likely welcome to do so, but no one is going to care if you are in voice chat and try to be useful, or if you just run around and do your own thing.

consultant

Noaani wrote: »

consultant wrote: »

Point is it does work for Open world PvP events were People just show up and you have not control who is in a group matter of fact lot people will not be in group per say and still participate in Events.

Again, you have the wrong idea in your head about the mechanics of how these things will work.

Whether a node war, a siege, or a guild war, there will be structure in place well before the day. These aren't things where everyone just shows up and you run with whoever you have. They are events where guilds would have communicated with each other about their intention to participate, and the events in question will be run using the existing structures of those guilds.

Random people that just show up and want to participate are likely welcome to do so, but no one is going to care if you are in voice chat and try to be useful, or if you just run around and do your own thing.

yep that is my whole point there has to be structure in place for events to work.

However the posts in this thread is more like well Just Use Voice Chat. Like that would work.

That is the implication that all the structure that is needed is Voice Chat and that idea is absurd.

So there needs to be structure in addition to just Voice chat. Like other forms of cumminication.

So all those people that say Well Just Use Voice are wrong. You may get 250 to sign up getting them in voice chat is another matter. You cannot even control which voice chat They are going to use.

So all of us would have to agree. That using Just voice chat is insufficient structure for 250 brackets in Ashes of Creation. That it is not going to work like in Eve Online.

Right??

That is like the person that said well just use Google as a mentoring program.????

So just to be clear agains Voice chat will only work for Premades not events Period,.

You agree with this right?

Noaani

consultant wrote: »

So just to be clear agains Voice chat will only work for Premades not events Period,.

You agree with this right?

I dont understand what you are saying, and I don't think you do either.

What do you mean by premade,and what do you mean by event?

As I said above,events like node wars, guild wars, sieges and such (which are the only things likely to get to 250 vs 250), the bulk of those present will be a part of an organized guild that organized the event. In terms of guild wars, 100% of participants will be.

If this isn't the very definition of a premade, than I dont know what is.

Essentially, these large scale events you are talking about - they will be almost exclusively premade.

It isn't like Ashes is going to have a 250 vs 250 arena or anything.

Again, as I said above, I think you have the wrong idea about the mechanics.

Hedgemon

wont military nodes have a minigame/petsystem arena style pvp for who gets mayor?!?!?!

Noaani

Hedgemon wrote: »

wont military nodes have a minigame/petsystem arena style pvp for who gets mayor?!?!?!

Yes. Not sure what relevance that has though.

FutureCultLeader

IF VC is in the game, it should be local, 30 meters or so. Possibly going up for specific party chat.

consultant

In a premade there is someone that says Hey if you are not in voice chat you are not going to play.
In a premade you have some one that chooses to lets say do node vs node and they decide to join a group and the group leader requires them to be voice chat. Very similar to a ten man raid group in WoW: Plus in a Premade group leader hand picks participants for thins like composition and strategy.

In a nutshell raid group. But notice the elements here. Group Leader Group is itself Have to be ine voice Chat to be in Group.

In an open world event Poeple choose to particpate in event but no one will be requiring them to be in voice chat No one will be sayin we have to many rnagers already. No one will be banning them from event if they do not cooperate and be in voice Chat. So no requirement for voice chat. There might not be a requirement to be in a group either.

In a premade a group leader is hand picking people.

In non premade like the Open world battle grounds it who so ever wants to participate same thing with node vs Node. Unless there is some there to banning people from event that are not in trade chat it will not work.

Voice Chat the software will work it just some people will not wnat to be in it and no one will be able to do anything about it.

Here is a question. How is anyone going to get the people that play MMOs that do not use Voice Chat into Voice Chat when they are doing lets say a Node vs Node event. Anser is you cannot. That why it will not work. You are going have a Pool of 1000 people and from that pool 250 people not of your choosing are going ot paritcipate in event. So you do not get to make the choice of well this guy does not have discord he cannot play with us Like what happens in Eve Online. Same thing goes for open world battle grounds.

Unless there is someone there saying if you are not in voice chat you cannot play then Vioce chat will not work cuase there lot so people that do not use voice chat.

So 250 that are not of your choosing will show up but they will not all use voice chat.

Bricktop

consultant wrote: »

Here is a question. How is anyone going to get the people that play MMOs that do not use Voice Chat into Voice Chat when they are doing lets say a Node vs Node event. Anser is you cannot. That why it will not work. You are going have a Pool of 1000 people and from that pool 250 people not of your choosing are going ot paritcipate in event. So you do not get to make the choice of well this guy does not have discord he cannot play with us Like what happens in Eve Online. Same thing goes for open world battle grounds.

People are creative. Somebody ambitious and charismatic can easily make a discord and start spamming the link in node chat and set up some structure and a process to verify who's a citizen and who's not and start facilitating organization between the mayor/guilds/citizens of the node. It happened in Guild Wars 2, people created server websites and server discords and got as many people as they could apart of the community to organize World vs World and whatever else more efficiently. Obviously some people will choose not to participate, but a lot more will.

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