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Phase I of Alpha Two testing will occur on weekends. Each weekend is scheduled to start on Fridays at 10 AM PT and end on Sundays at 10 PM PT. Find out more here.
Check out Alpha Two Announcements here to see the latest Alpha Two news and update notes.
Our quickest Alpha Two updates are in Discord. Testers with Alpha Two access can chat in Alpha Two channels by connecting your Discord and Intrepid accounts here.
Comments
Thanks, @Vaknar - good additional questions. Based on the responses on the 'immersion' thread, I imagine it's going to be a split vote on immersion.
It's immersive because I realistically can't carry everything, it's important to have constraints that force me to prioritize what benefits me the most near / long term, also I'm at high risk when standing still in the wilds with my attention focused in my bags, not on @Vhaeyne who has a bow trained on me.
It's immersion breaking because I don't want to spend my time micromanaging stacks of items so I can make room in a random grid to carry something more. Just let me carry everything and take a hit to movement speed..
I'm curious to see how folks respond.
Inventory management would enhance the game in my opinion. I'm never immersed through inventories but I am often cautious about what I carry. Therefore, I'm more engaged through the caution.
2. would you feel that no weight would hurt your immersion?
A lack of weight wouldn't hurt my immersion, but, a lack of weight often implies items are all the same, thus, item prioritisation doesn't have the same function.
3. Do you find inventory management fun or tedious or necessary?
I find inventory management a pleasure when the scope is perfect, it is also a risk/reward when weight applies and you go slow because you are over the limit. I would also prefer the risk/reward in terms of weight management because a toon can't run around with numerous sets of armour - only the most succinct sets at one time.
Cheers Vaknar.
Inventory management is a task that needs to be performed in order to keep the game balanced (unlimited inventory would break many things). The management system of that inventory should be based on the fact that managing said inventory is indeed just a task that needs to be performed.
I think this ties back to the immersion question. Even if it's a negative effect that adds to immersion, then it's a good thing. Taking falling damage is a negative effect of an immersive believable world.
Q: Would you feel that inventory management being a large part of the game would break your immersion or add to the game?
A: Being a "large" part of the game, yes, it would not only break immersion for a lot of people, but it would also possibly take players focus/attention away from other more important parts of the game.
Q: On the other hand, would you feel that no weight would hurt your immersion?
A: I believe weight to be a very important aspect of inventory management as weight gives more depth to it and adds the possibility to balance maximum amount of carryable items without being completely bound only to inventory slots and limit of items stacks while maintaining a stackable aspect to items.
Q: Do you find inventory management fun or tedious or necessary?
A: Necessary? Depends on the type of game, but in MMORPGs, Yes, certainly.
Fun or tedious? Depends on the implementation.
But for a game like Ashes, the general idea is that it is better for the player having to worry less about your inventory limits/restrictiviness, and having to worry more about how much you could lose by being too greedy and having too much stuff in it, basically playing into the Risk vs Reward aspect of the game.
Aren't we all sinners?
I tend not to care either way about weight. Of course, I would prefer no weight, but it's a very minor annoyance.
It's not much different than armor degradation. Easier without the restriction(s), but not too much of a hassle.
In Ashes, seems like inventory management could be tons of fun if other people can see, from the outside, how we packed our bags.
I don't mind space or weight limitations if they are reasonable. What's reasonable?
These things add the element of immersion from a tiny bit of realism without being smacked in the face every five minutes by unfun mechanics. That's the key, I think. add complexity and depth without adding tedium or pain.
me stupid.
What system do you prefer?
For a MMORPG I do prefer a slot/stack system.
Why?
The weight system is great in "realistic" games such as Arma 3 but doesn't make much sense in MMORPGS... I mean, my skinny Bard will be able to have an actual ship inside his backpack right ? Plus a bunch of stones and some armors sets. How many tons is he supposed to carry ?
I like the Diablo "size" inventory system too, but it would end up with the same flaws... trying to bring some "realistic" size/weight limitation doesn't really fit the MMORPG genre in my opinion.
So I'd say slot/stack > "size" > weight.
Would you feel that inventory management being a large part of the game would break your immersion or add to the game?
A "large" part of the game would definitely be more a burden than a plus to me.
On the other hand, would you feel that no weight would hurt your immersion?
No, I'm not comfortable with weight in MMORPG as discussed above.
Do you find inventory management fun or tedious or necessary?
It's necessary... to some extent. And it becomes tedious if it goes too far.
The basic of inventory is to find a decent compromise between "Being able to carry enough for the inventory management not being a nuisance in the game" and "not to carry half of the world in a mere backpack".
On that regard I think the Mules system is quite an elegant solution. It allows the players to be able to carry a decent amount of goods, without having a too highly unrealistic backpack content. Plus it adds a cool immersion feature... no need to bother with weight here.
New World implemented a slots with categories so your bag was already sorted and your items could be transferred from that subslot by individual item or by category. that was a tremendous plus for inventory management. The same management followed through into your chest. Probably the best system I have come across.
If there was no such thing in game as "weight" in regards to inventory or equipment I would be perfectly fine with this. It is absolutely tedious in most games and in some it breaks the game and ruins the fun. Immersion is not something I usually care about but things that just stand out as dumb actually bug me. For example, the phone number "555" thing from movies. It's just dumb. In games it's things like a weight system where gold coins have no weight to them haha. Like wtf. It's GOLD.
Unlimited slots with a weight system = You can have a bag with 500,000 feathers because they are light or you could be bogged down with a couple pieces of armor. This sucks (especially when it comes to looting corrupted players or leaving a raid). Positively, with this system you can have the capability to spec into convenience perks like adding weight capacity.
Bag system with no weight limitations may be tedious to organize between bags but it does give us (or me anyway) a better sense of organization. It can provide more depth to the crafting system (skinning, leatherworking, processing the leather, and enchanting to make the bags bigger or hold more of certain items). It can be add another sense of improvement as you obtain larger bags. I also prefer the risk more when the bags are full vs the weight is at capacity. There is no need for your character to slow down and be penalized for playing the game.
At the end of the day, I honestly don't care what Steven decides to do. Split body melee combat is their focus moving forward and I am BEYOND excited all over again for this game. : )
Unlimited inventory would definitely not break the game! (I would NOT have a bank alt hold everything I ever farmed and only log in to dump loot)
I agree that inventory management is a task that simply needs to be expected. I hated the size of inventory in Rust at first. I learned how to loot quickly, loot the high value items, and do this all while knowing my surroundings. Too many times I loaded up on loot only to get blasted in the back of the head right after. Point is, the system was satisfying and balanced and we should hope to see something that brings the same feeling as this in AoC.
Yes, it's a necessary part of the game. Without it, the entire caravan system would be meaningless.
As a system, it should be easy to see what we have, how much of it we have, and what condition it is in (where condition is a factor). That way, we can quickly make what ever decisions are necessary without taking too much time away from the actual game.
If I need to scroll up or down (or sideways, I guess), or if I need to mouse over an item or stack in order to make a decision, then the system is not as efficient as I would want it to be.
To me, weight or slot/stack doesn't really concern me, as long as the system itself is designed well.
As they say - if you can be one thing, be efficient.
Bags/inventory with limited weight or item size feels BAD.
My immersion is not ruined if it doesn't exist weight limit. This is a fantasy game which is far beyond realistic to begin with. If you want it to feel believable that you can carry a ton of things in small bags just play with the thought that some wizard have casted some spell on the bags which makes them magical like Santa claus's present bag!
It would be cool if crafters could create bags in a similar vein to DnD's bag of holding/portable hole, letting players push the weight limits.
give the bags a durability modifier similar to weapons, so you don't end up flooding the market with bags.
Yet i do not know what mobs will drop cause in alpha 1 (from what i saw) they droped just 1 sellable item.
I don't mind which approach AoC takes regarding inventory space/weight limitations as long as it's enjoyable and not (too) tiresome. For example, I hope it won't force you to go to a city after 20 minutes of grinding to bank stuff to free up space/weight.
I also really hope the UI for inventory and storage is top notch. I want to be able to organize my bank thoroughly to satisfy my OCD without being extremely click intensive.
It would greatly add to immersion to have inventory management.
It helps a ton with immersion because:
Its something strongly tied to your character, your avatar in the mmo-rpg world.
And it also makes the game more challenging, thus the adventure more real, which is the goal of any mmo-rpg game.
You could go both ways
1. World of Warcraft-like system with very limited inventory which you can improve by finding/buying better bags, with items which you would expect to be heavier requiring more bagspace than items you would expect to be lighter.
or
2. Weight system with a large inventory. I would however avoid making weight influence character combat performance. It should be restricted to item-carrying only, as a limitation.
hell, you can even combine the systems and I think it would work out great.
At the end of the day, you need to give people a good reason to use the caravan system anyway.
The problem is, your definition of a fun inventory isn't the same as mine.
I find a game which forces you to be smart and take good decissions when it comes to inventory space, sacrificing some items to bring others home, as fun.
I loved what the Darkest Dungeon did with its loot systems.
I for one would love if the rarest and most valuable resources would be deep in dangerous jungles, far away from cities, and people would have to be smart and take good risks and be sociable, to achieve stuff with the profession system & economy.
Initially I wanted to write ''who knows, maybe a balance would be found to make both of us happy'' but neah.
At the end of the day, convenience is a main factor which ruined modern mmo-rpgs and I really hope they will take as few ''here, let me hold your hand baby'' approaches as possible.
You will pretty much want to do that anyway since you might get ganked and your stuff looted.
Even if they make the corruption system very harsh, you will have people in decent profession made (very available) gear zerging gatherers to loot their resources and to grief.
I never argued fun isn't subjective or that tiresome/bad isn't also.
Someone (IS first and then the player base, most likely) has to decide what is fun and what isn't.
So I hope they make it good/fun/enjoyable and that it also fits my taste.
Wrong. It's always risk vs reward and it's always about choice.
If I feel like it's a good idea to farm for 2 hours straight before banking because I'm somewhere remote or because I have a party or because I think I'm a PvP god, I want to be able to choose taking those risks.
Forcing players to go back to town every 20 minutes because of weight/space limitations is especially bad in a game with basically no fast travel. Having enough inventory capability for 1 hour long trips is a good number I'd say.
This is why mules should be meta and be able to carry a lot.
Didn't say you said fun isn't subjective.
I don't know what 2 hours straight of farming means for you. Can do that with a very smalli inventory if resources are rare.
My point is, making the game to force players to take smart decissions (what to keep when out there in the world and what to scrap) is good.
Thats what games should do, challenge people at an intelectual level.
Also, I think having too big of an inventory would actually diminuish the risk since if you have to go back to town every now and then and then back to the farming/questing areas, its an extra traveling risk (risk of being ganked on the way and back).
Having a small inventory would also make the people making bags (inventory improvement items) worth more (their time I mean) so it would also be better for the economy.
You have that already.
If you are out harvesting, you can opt to use a mule to store materials. It has a capacity 10 times larger than yours.
It makes you a more obvious PvP target, but that is a decision that you get to make.
I'm not a fan of the Burden system based off of Str because it leaves every class that isn't based off of Str at a disadvantage. And we all love phat lewt, and I don't see any reason to restrict any particular class from enjoying that.
Personally I prefer the Limited Slots route opposed to the Weight Only or Limited Slots & Weight.
Reason being as it moves me to pay more attention to the items I'm picking up and make strategic decisions. Am I looking for tinkering mats in the form of low value iron swords, or am I looking for highest coin per item?
One could say the same about Weight Only, but with Limited Slots my greed never renders my character Encumbered. Its more of a pain to find that last .25lb to ditch so I lose Encumberment as opposed to clearly seeing all more slots are full.
Man, I sure need that Enchanted Bag that has 10 more slots /drool