Dedicated RP servers

Hello everyone,

As known so far we will get multiple servers with different prime time and locations. This is to optimize connectivity and ensure that many of the core system activities are happening in your prime time.

However next to this data there is a feature that i would love to have a few of the servers designated as. As you know, people have mixed feelings about RP in an mmo. Some love it, some hate it. And while rp should persist on every server, I think that it would be nice, if some servers get a RP server tag before you create a character. This will ensure that more like minded players will choose for those That server, and that people who do not like RP, will choose a different one. In the end i think this will improve the experiance for most people.

What do you think about this?

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Kesthely

Noaani wrote: »

Kesthely wrote: »

I think a monthly increas of the subscription is a little bit absurd. Because we dont'even know if griefing will be a problem Bu if it does become a problemi think that a low entry fee of that server might solve the problem.

A low entry won't solve anything.

Griefing will be a thing. History bears this out. An increased fee for playing on this server will potentially solve the griefing issue - and if the server is going to require more effort from Intrepid (censuring player names, higher frequency of players reporting each other etc), then it is perfectly valid for them to ask for more to play on that server.

I mean, almost any company that has two products where one just outright costs them more than the other will charge more for the one that costs them more. Why should this be any different?

First of all we don't know if the amount of "griefers" will be different on the rp server then on any other server. (perceived) griefing will take place on any server. So grief management is something that any game has to account for. Be it manually or automatic.

I think that ultimately if all the griefers do end up going to the same server, that might actually mean less resources spend for the company. But if you want to protect a certain player group, i think a low entry fee (Say one month subscription) to create character on a heavy griefer server will prevent that.
The majority of griefers will not pay extra to be able to grief a certain group, if there are free other places to go to.

Noaani

Kesthely wrote: »

First of all we don't know if the amount of "griefers" will be different on the rp server then on any other server. (perceived) griefing will take place on any server.

As I said, history bears this out.

Unless there is heavy CS presence on RP servers, people will roll on RP servers to grief RP'ers.

The majority of griefers will not pay extra to be able to grief a certain group, if there are free other places to go to.

Most would happily pay a one off $15 addition.
I mean, most griefers pay $15 a month just to grief others, so why wouldn't they pay that one more time?

Some griefers (perhaps most, but absolutely not all) would not pay $30 a month, every month, when there is the option to pay $15 and grief on a non-RP server.

Again, some still would, but some (perhaps most) would not.

Taleof2Cities

Personally, I don’t have any problem with servers being tagged as a specific playstyle (i.e. RP).

Players do need to be aware that Ashes is an open world PvX game at its core.

As such, they have plenty of time to make a decision on whether risking PvP is OK for them or not (regardless of the server tag) … before they even subscribe, download, and click “play”.

Kesthely

@Noaani I think our perception of grievers is different. This could be due the games we've played, or the communities we played them with.

I think everyone griefs someone from time to time, if he or she is aware of it or not. I also think that most griefers in there hearth are true MMORPG fans, otherwise they would do their griefing in some other game..

Do i think some people will roll on ashes just to grief? ofcourse. Will they deliberately choose an Rp server if they feel like griefing them Yes. But heres the thing. Ashes world is vast. its system is designed by froming groups. Individual grievers will only be able to grief lowbies, and the'll won't be able to grief them for long, because the sysems in place prevent that. I think that on an RP server, the amount of bounty hunting will be quite high. I know that eventually that will probably be the most time spend online for me. I like group pvp 10-30 size, and a bunch of corrupt griefers really sounds like something i wanna kill. Especially because they have a chance to drop their gear as corrupt players.

Being a full time griefer, will take a lot of time and extra effort. And while your grieving might ruin someones day, It might make more people happy because they have a corrupt player to kill.

Also i don't think that rp servers or any other server will cause more time for the GM's to sort things out. I'm assuming that the servers will be regionally linked, at least for the GM's So you can have a group of GM's that all work on their own pc, and solve tickets by the time they come in. If they need to investigate for more then what their out of server logs can tell them, they could hop onto that server if their linked, or at the worst hop into one of he GM account of that server to investigate. Regardless you'd still have X Gm's in charge of Y servers.

Just because Ashes is emulating an old school mmo, isn't going tomean that their going to use old fashioned stand alone servers on a seperate entity that has no interaction with the other servers. That would be unwise to do. Servers (the physical ones) will be able to handle multiple serves (the world in game) The'll be linked so they can swap hosting them to different (physical) servers when they need to do maintenance or patch things.. Day 1 server A will need most of the GM attention, day 2 Seerver B. It doesn't matter if Server B has a rp tag, it will just be how that day goes.

Noaani

Kesthely wrote: »

Noaani I think our perception of grievers is different.
...
Individual grievers will only be able to grief lowbies

Totally agree on your first point.

To the second point here, I am talking about guilds, not individual players. Perhaps not large guilds, but a few dozen players per.

Kesthely

@nooani i don't think a group of players will be griefing. That is to boring. Sure the'll gank someone, or maybe even a group. But my gaming experiance has tought me that they then go keep on finding the next group,.

A political game where you control resources as Ashes is going to be, the defenders will always bring asbig of a number they can muster to defend those resources. Individual players of that area might get ganked by groups. and they might even return on a daily basis to target that specific area. But thats not griefing. Thats intrensic gameplay native to political games.

In eve online we have no allies only frenemies. Meaning that whenever they show up, we fight. Often they contact us before hand to give us time to get a fleet together. Often with certain criteria like X amount of people or X amount of healers often both. Those fights are fun and engaging. If they can't handle content that they come across they invite us in and vice versa. If there under siege, we help them and vice versa.

Sure an individual player might feel griefed if its the 5th time that week he loses an expensive ship. But you know what that often means? that
1) he wasn't paying enough attention or
2) he wasn't making use of all the ingame assets.

Noaani

Kesthely wrote: »

nooani i don't think a group of players will be griefing. That is to boring. Sure the'll gank someone, or maybe even a group. But my gaming experiance has tought me that they then go keep on finding the next group,.

And mine says they may well stay in a game griefing others for literal years.

I knew three guilds in Archeage that were nothing but griefers, that were in the game longer than I was.

Your EVE example isn't taking in to account the notion of people that get their enjoyment as a direct result of your loss of enjoyment. It is basically just a description of regular play.

Also, Ashes isn't going to play out nearly the same as EVE.

Niran_Felmorne

I am an Avid RPer, only one of my friends is also an RPer in most games the RP scene is scarce and diluting the RPers over many servers can cause coelution making it difficult to find that RP. Once players are situated in a server they wont like leaving that sever to start RPing on the 'unofficial RP Server' and with ashes case that server will likely be filled with normal players making it so that eventually there will come a time where that 'server' is no longer an option to join in and the risk of reopening a server to more players filling in can cause a situation where a bunch of players come back or a streamer gets popular on said server will kill the original player base.

This is a sticky situation that has no clear cut answer that is cost effective.

The fact ashes is not planning to do any merges and the server pops are going to be kept together without any transfers (Understandably) makes it so once the silt of players has settled we wont be seeing much divergence since you are investing in a character that takes 200+ hours of gameplay to get to the perceived 'max level'

In my humble opinion RP scene is going to be dead on arrival unless we have the option to re-enter the gateway to a RP hub world between servers where you start 'fresh' and none of the progress you make there carries over to your actual server.

This is asking a lot for the RP scene and I can see this more or less being used for something more important than just a hub universe for the RPers to go to. If I could make a perfect world I'd suggest making a tick box where you can select RP server and it puts you in the same servers with other 'rp' aligned players randomly. This however will likely be trolled and have the same 'issue' as having a RP server in the first place.

There will always be people that want to destroy others for enjoyment and the RP scene is just not full of PVP or PVE experts. Then again ashes is not going to be balanced for 1v1s and will instead focus on group balancing. So either way the griefers will find the best PVP 1v1 class and roll that to specifically hunt RPers since they are easy marks since I am kind of worried that 4 RPers will not be able to stand up to 2 PVPers that are hellbent on focusing them.

I do not think it will be as common once the servers filter out since griefers will have to contend with killing a server and just play the game without anyone around them since all the RPers scattered. This has happened in 5 MMO's that I've played that had RP communities in a PVP game all of those servers now are either dead, shut down/merged or have 12 players (looking at you Radalia)

You also have to mind that each griefer will need to put a good month/s worth of game time (assuming they work for a living) to grief established RPers.

Overall, I want RP servers but at this point I'm going to likely not play the game until an unofficial server pops up and I can join it. That is the sad truth for RPers since there looks to be many RP mechanics they want to add to the game, but they don't want to help RPers find and collect together.

Dygz

If there is a $30 charge for RP servers, there had better be GM enforcement which punishes people for disrupting RP.

daveywavey

What if that RP'ers "RP'ing" involves an activity that supposedly 'disrupts' another player's RP? You find it disruptive to have a player yelling "EEEEEEEEEEE" in chat, but that player is RP'ing as a character that converses solely through the use of differently-lengthed "EEEE" sounds, as they've chosen to play as a mouse-like character and they don't feel that speaking English is particularly mousey. Which RP'er gets punished? How do you decide - how do you enforce? Why is one player's RP greater/more acceptable/better than others?

Kalv1441

@DrGray there’s an established unofficial RP Discord already. Should join. https://forums.ashesofcreation.com/discussion/49229/ashes-of-creation-roleplay-community-all-are-welcome#latest

Also, I’m an RP’er and I’m also a PvP’er and will be defending/Bounty Hunting to protect the RP community in game with the guild Im in. There is a myth that RP’ers are not strong at pvp and I hope to one day dispel that myth.

Kalv1441

daveywavey wrote: »

What if that RP'ers "RP'ing" involves an activity that supposedly 'disrupts' another player's RP? You find it disruptive to have a player yelling "EEEEEEEEEEE" in chat, but that player is RP'ing as a character that converses solely through the use of differently-lengthed "EEEE" sounds, as they've chosen to play as a mouse-like character and they don't feel that speaking English is particularly mousey. Which RP'er gets punished? How do you decide - how do you enforce? Why is one player's RP greater/more acceptable/better than others?

I think the RP’er you’re referring to are the one’s that try to force others to bend to their standards of gameplay. Those people should behave their ego put in place.

If you place a set of rules on yourself for how you want to experience the game, the ideal approach is to find others who do the same and not spend energy on the ones that don’t.

In this scenario the GMs should be trained on how to handle this kind of thing. The old days of Vanilla WoW had really good GMs and they were able to cut through the BS of the people who needed to calm the heck down.

Kesthely

Noaani wrote: »

Also, Ashes isn't going to play out nearly the same as EVE.

Ofcourse not, its a different game, and eve has been continuesly evolving for nearly 2 decades. Even Stephen has mentioned Eve multiple times, i'm certain they are looking at it from some standpoint. From the games i played though the political system / node system resembles that of Eve the most. And while there most definatly will be differences, There will be some things that will be the same. I've played eve since 2007. In that time i've seen many enemies, often fighting the same people for years. Truelly making them frenemies. I'm hoping that Ashes will give me a mix of Wow Classic and Eve in its own unique coating.

Fighting the same people day in day out isn't griefing, thats a campaign or a war. To me griefing is singling out a single player and harrassing them till they quit. With no other reason than making them quit. Attacking a group because you want to control their resources / dungeons / raids does not fall under griefing

Like eve there is a distinct player pool that loves to fight day in day out for the things they've worked for. To protect their own things. Eve has had a steady player pool for years now. Its player dropoff is extremely low for a game. Its player count small but fanatical. But its a space game, the target audiance for such a game is niche compared to the mmo market. So i'm hoping that after the initial surge and dropoff, there will be a steady and slow incline of players

I'm looking forwards to beeing immersed in the world of ashes and that immersion to me is seeing a lot of rp, no "leet speak" names and a community that is decent and selfregulating. and for me, an rp tag will most likely create that enviroment.

Kesthely

daveywavey wrote: »

What if that RP'ers "RP'ing" involves an activity that supposedly 'disrupts' another player's RP? You find it disruptive to have a player yelling "EEEEEEEEEEE" in chat, but that player is RP'ing as a character that converses solely through the use of differently-lengthed "EEEE" sounds, as they've chosen to play as a mouse-like character and they don't feel that speaking English is particularly mousey. Which RP'er gets punished? How do you decide - how do you enforce? Why is one player's RP greater/more acceptable/better than others?

Most Rp ers have unwritten rrules. eg everything you say in character is said in normal, but if you want to tall ooc (Out Of Character) they use {{ This format }} If your "mouse" character would only be able to say different types of EEE's grunts and yelps youd often see " EEE {{ Translation: you are scary }}
Regardless if a ticket is made because someone claims its griefing, the GM would have to investigate. Its up to GM to determin what happens after.

Noaani

Kesthely wrote: »

Ofcourse not, its a different game, and eve has been continuesly evolving for nearly 2 decades. Even Stephen has mentioned Eve multiple times, i'm certain they are looking at it from some standpoint.

Yes they are, from an economic standpoint.

This is why nodes have their own markets, and why transporting materials between nodes has some value.

The political aspect of EVE is not really how Ashes will play out though.

Kesthely wrote: »

If your "mouse" character would only be able to say different types of EEE's grunts and yelps youd often see " EEE {{ Translation: you are scary }}
Regardless if a ticket is made because someone claims its griefing, the GM would have to investigate. Its up to GM to determin what happens after.

Why would you translate for players that don't speak your language?

If someone put through a ticket for this kind of thing saying it is ruining RP, that in itself is a good reason to either not have RP servers, or to charge an additional fee for them.

That ticket is - after all - a cost to Intrepid.

Kesthely

Noaani wrote: »

The political aspect of EVE is not really how Ashes will play out though.

You can't say that. We don't know how player behavior will be. A lot of my eve friends are looking at Ashes, because it has so many similarities, and a political system. They want to create an area that operates similarly to 0.0 / wormhole space. Alot of Eve's political landscape is designed around defending your home, and a tuck of war of expanding your home, invading other area or premeptive agression towards those that attack you.

These systems will be predominant in Ashes as well. Ofcourse there are differences, but those are primarily of the scale of the fights and the population limit. as well as tactical posibilities and compositions.

In a culture where worlds firsts and speedruns become more and more important in mmo's beeing able to control who has acces to certain raids is going to be important. Even if world first or speedrunning is not on your agenda, controlling a certain legendary crafting material is going to important. If you can safeguard the entrance of the only raid that produces crafting material x, you control the market of any item that requires crafting material x.

Noaani wrote: »

Why would you translate for players that don't speak your language?

Why wouldn't you?

Noaani

Kesthely wrote: »

Why wouldn't you?

It isn't exactly "RP", imo.

If my character speaks a different language to yours, we should not be able to communicate.

There are games where this happens on a system level, I see no reason why it should not happen in regards to RP as well.

Seems odd to me if you are going to say that you speak a different language, and then make it so that this means nothing.

daveywavey

Noaani wrote: »

Seems odd to me if you are going to say that you speak a different language, and then make it so that this means nothing.

I dunno. Seems like trying to find the balance between the two. It'd be pretty isolating to refuse to communicate with anyone, just cos of RP, when part of the fun of RP is involving yourself with others regardless of whether or not they're doing it too.

Noaani

daveywavey wrote: »

Noaani wrote: »

Seems odd to me if you are going to say that you speak a different language, and then make it so that this means nothing.

I dunno. Seems like trying to find the balance between the two. It'd be pretty isolating to refuse to communicate with anyone, just cos of RP, when part of the fun of RP is involving yourself with others regardless of whether or not they're doing it too.

This is why I wouldn't opt to pick a race that speaks another language - unless the game had facility to do that, and where others could learn that language.

It's just opting in to do something mediocre, imo.

George_Black

daveywavey wrote: »

Noaani wrote: »

Seems odd to me if you are going to say that you speak a different language, and then make it so that this means nothing.

I dunno. Seems like trying to find the balance between the two. It'd be pretty isolating to refuse to communicate with anyone, just cos of RP, when part of the fun of RP is involving yourself with others regardless of whether or not they're doing it too.

Is this in relation to the "EEEEEEE"?

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