Narrow dungeons vs open dungeons

I always preferred narrow ones since it’s such a contrast to the open world we usually roam in and line of sight, movement, placement becomes more important in combat.

How about you?

Much love ❤️

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Ironhope

Diversity.

Everything from Elden Ring open space dungeons, to classical wow-like narrow hallway stuff to the permanently-shifting re-aranging pyramid from Alien vs Predator.

Plandemonium

Labyrinths, walking in the dark until you've gone through the maze 100 times and can do it with your eyes closed, which will prove your experience.

Individuated Soul

Variety is the spice of life! Artistic style/lore/engagement design etc mold the dungeon. Sometimes a loot hallway is the way. Sometimes an expansive maze is the way. All depends. I might argue that dungeon engagements typically follow a linear path anyways so might as well have dungeons with beautiful vistas.

WHIT3ROS3

As others have said. Variety. It might also be cool to have multiple different layouts for different stages of a dungeon, which then randomly generate each time you enter so that you have lots of variety.

Sunboy

Yes! Variety is refreshing but if there is both open space and narrow space in a dungeon at the same time, from experience I prefer the narrow parts.

Much love ❤️

Ludullu

Big intricate rooms with narrow corridors in-between. Big room allows for big pvps, while narrow corridors allow for chokepoint defenses.

WHIT3ROS3

I'd like to see dungeons that are non-linear that have layouts similar to that of a DnD map.

Lots of different pathways, rooms and hidden POIs. Upon entry, you have no mini-map and you only unlock that dungeon's map once you have manually explored and found all the different rooms.

Something like this for an Instanced dungeon accessed through Open-World instanced entrances (Hopefully instanced dungeon content is accessed through open-world exploration and not just a Menu UI system) You would only have access to sections of it depending on the development of a Nodes ZOI. It would unlock more as the Node progresses.

Once you manually explore the dungeon it would unlock a mini-map of it which could be sold to other players.

Scarbeus

Agreed with variety, is it a series of cave tunnels or a huge underground temple? I like both. Dungeon of the Mad Mage was an interesting D&D campaign, but the Dark Souls stuff has also been amazing. It's really down to what works for you, part of what AoC is doing for people is providing all sorts of content in it's vast world. I don't want to be a sailor and fight in the open seas, but I'm not against that as I know there are people that love it and I think it's an interesting element to the game.

Ludullu

WHIT3ROS3 wrote: »

Something like this for an Instanced dungeon accessed through Open-World instanced entrances (Hopefully instanced dungeon content is accessed through open-world exploration and not just a Menu UI system) You would only have access to sections of it depending on the development of a Nodes ZOI. It would unlock more as the Node progresses.

No instances! This would be an amazing layout for an open world dungeon. Perfect even. A ton of rooms for a ton of parties to farm mobs in. Several hidden bosses in deep rooms and a huge potential for different triggers between rooms, so that you could keep the "difficulty increases with better clears" design direction.

And I'm pretty sure that Steven wants something very similar because L2's dungeons looked soooomewhat like this, with just fewer rooms.

Asgerr

I only hope that not all dungeons are subterranean affairs.

I want some dungeons being in the open. Maybe a mountain pass. Maybe another one is a castle, which includes the courtyard just as well as the actual halls.

I don't want all of the dungeons being a cave or an ancient mine below ground.

Ludullu

Asgerr wrote: »

I only hope that not all dungeons are subterranean affairs.

I want some dungeons being in the open. Maybe a mountain pass. Maybe another one is a castle, which includes the courtyard just as well as the actual halls.

I don't want all of the dungeons being a cave or an ancient mine below ground.

L2 had towers, horizontal rooms that were hanging in the air, huge maze-like buildings too. Can't see why Ashes wouldn't have a variety like that.

Scarbeus

NiKr wrote: »

Asgerr wrote: »

I only hope that not all dungeons are subterranean affairs.

I want some dungeons being in the open. Maybe a mountain pass. Maybe another one is a castle, which includes the courtyard just as well as the actual halls.

I don't want all of the dungeons being a cave or an ancient mine below ground.

L2 had towers, horizontal rooms that were hanging in the air, huge maze-like buildings too. Can't see why Ashes wouldn't have a variety like that.

Hidden valleys, a route leading up to a mountain or mesa, some large pit or quarry, who knows the choices are pretty much endless. But yeah, not just inside only, why not both!

Abarat

i think both are awesome. but.. i like the cramped ones to really feel cramped and the open ones to feel expansive

WHIT3ROS3

NiKr wrote: »

WHIT3ROS3 wrote: »

Something like this for an Instanced dungeon accessed through Open-World instanced entrances (Hopefully instanced dungeon content is accessed through open-world exploration and not just a Menu UI system) You would only have access to sections of it depending on the development of a Nodes ZOI. It would unlock more as the Node progresses.

No instances! This would be an amazing layout for an open world dungeon. Perfect even. A ton of rooms for a ton of parties to farm mobs in. Several hidden bosses in deep rooms and a huge potential for different triggers between rooms, so that you could keep the "difficulty increases with better clears" design direction.

And I'm pretty sure that Steven wants something very similar because L2's dungeons looked soooomewhat like this, with just fewer rooms.

Both Instanced and Open world dungeons are planned. There will be instances.

I think there should be dynamically spawning instanced dungeon entrances that appear across the open world in a similar way to resource nodes.

Ludullu

WHIT3ROS3 wrote: »

Both Instanced and Open world dungeons are planned. There will be instances.

I think there should be dynamically spawning instanced dungeon entrances that appear across the open world in a similar way to resource nodes.

Instances will be one-time things and comprise only 20% of the overall dungeon amount. I'd rather see that kind of dungeon design as a huge open world thing rather than a one-time thing with no good gear and no pvp interaction.

Sapiverenus

I don't think Dungeons are a good premise. Many 'raid level' or 'dungeon level' places should exist out in the world and have their numbers replenish over time if it makes sense. For those that should go down once and stay down (like the Corrupted apparently since they don't procreate) then make them incredibly survival oriented and intelligent, with allies.
Undead civ would be nice. . . constant threat, replenishing numbers. . . use your corpse against you or something. . .

If it's a location with a faction holing up then they should be alarmed, alerting others and all coming out to take your group of aggressors down. If they keep getting attacked then they will try sealing the place while sending most of their numbers out to raid and ambush. Smart stuff.
Imagine some idiots stirring up the hornets nest of some usually neutral though territorial NPC faction and Ranger ambushes occuring all throughout the forest because of it. Or Undead Faction turning their attention to your Node and general direction because groups keep trying to take advantage of half the Undead being out and sieging a neighboring node/ general area.

Gotta shift the focus. Threats shouldn't hang out and do nothing; and they should take advantage of terrain & building features.

WHIT3ROS3

NiKr wrote: »

Instances will be one-time things and comprise only 20% of the overall dungeon amount. I'd rather see that kind of dungeon design as a huge open world thing rather than a one-time thing with no good gear and no pvp interaction.

I haven't read or heard anything that states that instanced content will be one and done. Source?

Only 20%? That's a lot considering the stated aims of how much content they are looking to create.

Why can't instanced dungeons provide rewards other than gear? There could be some gear drops, but I think it would be better to have a thematic cosmetic set that has an RNG chance of dropping. It means that the drops in instanced content would be cool cosmetic sets (perhaps dungeon master trophies for your house or furniture items) that wouldn't impact the overall player-driven economy because they would only be grinded to unlock achievements, cosmetics and wouldn't be a source for gold or significant XP.

There will be PVE in ashes of creation.

Ludullu

WHIT3ROS3 wrote: »

I haven't read or heard anything that states that instanced content will be one and done. Source?

https://ashesofcreation.wiki/Instancing

WHIT3ROS3 wrote: »

Only 20%? That's a lot considering the stated aims of how much content they are looking to create.

A lot of content doesn't mean a lot of dungeons. And considering how they've described their dungeon design, there'll probably be a fairly limited amount of dungeons that will just grow in size with their nodes. Even if there's 30 dungeons overall, 6 of them will be a one-time thing related to the story, while everything else will be repeatable/grindable stuff with bosses either throughout the dungeon or at the end of it.

WHIT3ROS3 wrote: »

Why can't instanced dungeons provide rewards other than gear? There could be some gear drops, but I think it would be better to have a thematic cosmetic set that has an RNG chance of dropping. It means that the drops in instanced content would be cool cosmetic sets (perhaps dungeon master trophies for your house or furniture items) that wouldn't impact the overall player-driven economy because they would only be grinded to unlock achievements, cosmetics and wouldn't be a source for gold or significant XP.

As the link states, no repeatable content, mostly story related and some gear but no BiS.

There's a chance they'll have a few repeatable "once a week or two" dungeons to provide a proper difficult boss encounter, but so far there have been no mention of this.

Sapiverenus

WHIT3ROS3 wrote: »

NiKr wrote: »

Instances will be one-time things and comprise only 20% of the overall dungeon amount. I'd rather see that kind of dungeon design as a huge open world thing rather than a one-time thing with no good gear and no pvp interaction.

I haven't read or heard anything that states that instanced content will be one and done. Source?

Only 20%? That's a lot considering the stated aims of how much content they are looking to create.

Why can't instanced dungeons provide rewards other than gear? There could be some gear drops, but I think it would be better to have a thematic cosmetic set that has an RNG chance of dropping. It means that the drops in instanced content would be cool cosmetic sets (perhaps dungeon master trophies for your house or furniture items) that wouldn't impact the overall player-driven economy because they would only be grinded to unlock achievements, cosmetics and wouldn't be a source for gold or significant XP.

There will be PVE in ashes of creation.

Why do you want 'loot' that has no tie to where it came from?
A trophy sounds alright tbh. Like a Dragon Tooth from the Dragon. Could be a reagent, could also be put in your house though.
Head of/ Hand of someone? Rots though. . . get it preserved? Your morbid trophy not mine I guess.
Someone's unique ring, armor. . . whatever they were wearing and what's around the place.

Strevi

NiKr wrote: »

WHIT3ROS3 wrote: »

Both Instanced and Open world dungeons are planned. There will be instances.

I think there should be dynamically spawning instanced dungeon entrances that appear across the open world in a similar way to resource nodes.

Instances will be one-time things and comprise only 20% of the overall dungeon amount. I'd rather see that kind of dungeon design as a huge open world thing rather than a one-time thing with no good gear and no pvp interaction.

When people say 'instanced' they also assume or know that they are in a private instance?
Instance could be just a dungeon on a separated server, with a transition waiting screen, but still accessible to multiple teams and with PvP enabled (or not enabled but still competitive).

So what kind of instanced dungeons will we have?

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