Mag7spy wrote: » If we are going with this thing where its only a battle pass, it isn't a lie since u can spend embers on increasing the battle pass levels and getting cosmetics / stuff that way. Though obviously there will be items of the day and such to buy.
NiKr wrote: » Mag7spy wrote: » If we are going with this thing where its only a battle pass, it isn't a lie since u can spend embers on increasing the battle pass levels and getting cosmetics / stuff that way. Though obviously there will be items of the day and such to buy. Increasing lvls is not the same as "I want this cosmetic so I buy it". Items of the day is also fomo, unless they're on a repeating cycle, but then why even have that feature. This is the god damn reason we're in the shithole of a corporate industry. Everyone is fucking ok with getting fucked over. And not only that, but everyone believes the direct lies that "all of this is for the good of the consuumer!" Such a damn shame.
Mag7spy wrote: » Not about how you feel I'm just stating its not a lie as you can buy them.
NiKr wrote: » Mag7spy wrote: » Not about how you feel I'm just stating its not a lie as you can buy them. Except you do not buy them. You buy the BP and then have to work more to get them. And if you can boost the BP lvls w/o doing gameplay - Intrepid are now asking more money for something that costs WAY less (cause you can supposedly get all the cosmetics in the BP by just doing gameplay). Like I said, people are getting fucked over and are welcoming it.
Mag7spy wrote: » Its a mechanic for whales mainly you are reading too much into it though. Just stating you can buy levels which would mean you can boost to get what you want. It wouldn't be a lie. End of the day battle pass saves you money so no one is really getting f'd over (unless you whale). Also its impossible to get f'd over there is 0 p2w and you can get in game gear with different looks. Its all exaggeration since it has 0 impact on gameplay.
Mag7spy wrote: » Saabynator wrote: » Mag7spy wrote: » Otr wrote: » Dygz wrote: » Otr wrote: » It can happen that AoC will not offer the kind of content which can be delivered by a battle pass. Asking for battle passes is like asking AoC to be that kind of game which requires them. That’s worded a bit strangely. Ashes will definitely have the in-game content that can be offered with a Battlepass. And, if Ashes has a Cosmetic Market it basically also has the rewards that typically come with modern Battlepasses. I didn’t state that Ashes has to have a Battlepass. I didn’t claim it’s certain that Ashes will have a Battlepass. Also, I didn’t ask for a Battlepass. I said I expect the Cosmetic Market will come in the form of a Battlepass. And then…we’ll see if my expectation is accurate. I’m not aware of any game that requires a Battlepass. Ok. Then was a misunderstanding from my side. I would prefer to pay a higher monthly subscription, because there was inflation meantime and it makes sense to adjust it. Then the development cost of whatever updates they inject into the game, in form of DLC expansions will be covered by them. Wiki states that DLC will be free and quite frequent:DLC expansions (post-launch releases) are planned on a monthly, quarterly, or six-monthly basis.[1][2] - The frequency and size of expansions will be based on the popularity and subscription base of the game.[1] - DLC will not cost anything more than the normal subscription.[3][4]https://youtube.com/watch?v=-fUWFkMvyHY&t=3758s - Larger expansions will add new content and increase various aspects of the game.[1][5] - New content will primarily be introduced through the node system. The goal is for existing content to remain relevant alongside the new content.[6] Each inflection point, which is those updates as expansions... you get to go back reevaluate. Hey, it seems like 89% of the servers out there never opened this door. Well, maybe the predicates were too granular. Maybe they were too focused. Maybe there's a reason why that didn't happen? Let's expand on that for the next expansion so that this content has an opportunity to come out and see the light of day.[7] – Steven Sharif So I have no idea why this thread has so many posts. (and I even had the chance to quote the largest post ever - I got no achievement though) If battlepass avoids increasing subscription id prefer that. Than a ton of people feeling the price point is too high a monthly sub. Its like a pizza and a half less a month, thats not to expensive man You really are not looking at the overall picture, there is a reason why games don't do a sub model anymore. You most likely don't understand tons of people out there that a sub model means they wont play the game. The larger that number the less players will be willing to play. But hey i guess your sub is more important so they will be fine if they up the price up to 25+$ a month.
Saabynator wrote: » Mag7spy wrote: » Otr wrote: » Dygz wrote: » Otr wrote: » It can happen that AoC will not offer the kind of content which can be delivered by a battle pass. Asking for battle passes is like asking AoC to be that kind of game which requires them. That’s worded a bit strangely. Ashes will definitely have the in-game content that can be offered with a Battlepass. And, if Ashes has a Cosmetic Market it basically also has the rewards that typically come with modern Battlepasses. I didn’t state that Ashes has to have a Battlepass. I didn’t claim it’s certain that Ashes will have a Battlepass. Also, I didn’t ask for a Battlepass. I said I expect the Cosmetic Market will come in the form of a Battlepass. And then…we’ll see if my expectation is accurate. I’m not aware of any game that requires a Battlepass. Ok. Then was a misunderstanding from my side. I would prefer to pay a higher monthly subscription, because there was inflation meantime and it makes sense to adjust it. Then the development cost of whatever updates they inject into the game, in form of DLC expansions will be covered by them. Wiki states that DLC will be free and quite frequent:DLC expansions (post-launch releases) are planned on a monthly, quarterly, or six-monthly basis.[1][2] - The frequency and size of expansions will be based on the popularity and subscription base of the game.[1] - DLC will not cost anything more than the normal subscription.[3][4]https://youtube.com/watch?v=-fUWFkMvyHY&t=3758s - Larger expansions will add new content and increase various aspects of the game.[1][5] - New content will primarily be introduced through the node system. The goal is for existing content to remain relevant alongside the new content.[6] Each inflection point, which is those updates as expansions... you get to go back reevaluate. Hey, it seems like 89% of the servers out there never opened this door. Well, maybe the predicates were too granular. Maybe they were too focused. Maybe there's a reason why that didn't happen? Let's expand on that for the next expansion so that this content has an opportunity to come out and see the light of day.[7] – Steven Sharif So I have no idea why this thread has so many posts. (and I even had the chance to quote the largest post ever - I got no achievement though) If battlepass avoids increasing subscription id prefer that. Than a ton of people feeling the price point is too high a monthly sub. Its like a pizza and a half less a month, thats not to expensive man
Mag7spy wrote: » Otr wrote: » Dygz wrote: » Otr wrote: » It can happen that AoC will not offer the kind of content which can be delivered by a battle pass. Asking for battle passes is like asking AoC to be that kind of game which requires them. That’s worded a bit strangely. Ashes will definitely have the in-game content that can be offered with a Battlepass. And, if Ashes has a Cosmetic Market it basically also has the rewards that typically come with modern Battlepasses. I didn’t state that Ashes has to have a Battlepass. I didn’t claim it’s certain that Ashes will have a Battlepass. Also, I didn’t ask for a Battlepass. I said I expect the Cosmetic Market will come in the form of a Battlepass. And then…we’ll see if my expectation is accurate. I’m not aware of any game that requires a Battlepass. Ok. Then was a misunderstanding from my side. I would prefer to pay a higher monthly subscription, because there was inflation meantime and it makes sense to adjust it. Then the development cost of whatever updates they inject into the game, in form of DLC expansions will be covered by them. Wiki states that DLC will be free and quite frequent:DLC expansions (post-launch releases) are planned on a monthly, quarterly, or six-monthly basis.[1][2] - The frequency and size of expansions will be based on the popularity and subscription base of the game.[1] - DLC will not cost anything more than the normal subscription.[3][4]https://youtube.com/watch?v=-fUWFkMvyHY&t=3758s - Larger expansions will add new content and increase various aspects of the game.[1][5] - New content will primarily be introduced through the node system. The goal is for existing content to remain relevant alongside the new content.[6] Each inflection point, which is those updates as expansions... you get to go back reevaluate. Hey, it seems like 89% of the servers out there never opened this door. Well, maybe the predicates were too granular. Maybe they were too focused. Maybe there's a reason why that didn't happen? Let's expand on that for the next expansion so that this content has an opportunity to come out and see the light of day.[7] – Steven Sharif So I have no idea why this thread has so many posts. (and I even had the chance to quote the largest post ever - I got no achievement though) If battlepass avoids increasing subscription id prefer that. Than a ton of people feeling the price point is too high a monthly sub.
Otr wrote: » Dygz wrote: » Otr wrote: » It can happen that AoC will not offer the kind of content which can be delivered by a battle pass. Asking for battle passes is like asking AoC to be that kind of game which requires them. That’s worded a bit strangely. Ashes will definitely have the in-game content that can be offered with a Battlepass. And, if Ashes has a Cosmetic Market it basically also has the rewards that typically come with modern Battlepasses. I didn’t state that Ashes has to have a Battlepass. I didn’t claim it’s certain that Ashes will have a Battlepass. Also, I didn’t ask for a Battlepass. I said I expect the Cosmetic Market will come in the form of a Battlepass. And then…we’ll see if my expectation is accurate. I’m not aware of any game that requires a Battlepass. Ok. Then was a misunderstanding from my side. I would prefer to pay a higher monthly subscription, because there was inflation meantime and it makes sense to adjust it. Then the development cost of whatever updates they inject into the game, in form of DLC expansions will be covered by them. Wiki states that DLC will be free and quite frequent:DLC expansions (post-launch releases) are planned on a monthly, quarterly, or six-monthly basis.[1][2] - The frequency and size of expansions will be based on the popularity and subscription base of the game.[1] - DLC will not cost anything more than the normal subscription.[3][4]https://youtube.com/watch?v=-fUWFkMvyHY&t=3758s - Larger expansions will add new content and increase various aspects of the game.[1][5] - New content will primarily be introduced through the node system. The goal is for existing content to remain relevant alongside the new content.[6] Each inflection point, which is those updates as expansions... you get to go back reevaluate. Hey, it seems like 89% of the servers out there never opened this door. Well, maybe the predicates were too granular. Maybe they were too focused. Maybe there's a reason why that didn't happen? Let's expand on that for the next expansion so that this content has an opportunity to come out and see the light of day.[7] – Steven Sharif So I have no idea why this thread has so many posts. (and I even had the chance to quote the largest post ever - I got no achievement though)
Dygz wrote: » Otr wrote: » It can happen that AoC will not offer the kind of content which can be delivered by a battle pass. Asking for battle passes is like asking AoC to be that kind of game which requires them. That’s worded a bit strangely. Ashes will definitely have the in-game content that can be offered with a Battlepass. And, if Ashes has a Cosmetic Market it basically also has the rewards that typically come with modern Battlepasses. I didn’t state that Ashes has to have a Battlepass. I didn’t claim it’s certain that Ashes will have a Battlepass. Also, I didn’t ask for a Battlepass. I said I expect the Cosmetic Market will come in the form of a Battlepass. And then…we’ll see if my expectation is accurate. I’m not aware of any game that requires a Battlepass.
Otr wrote: » It can happen that AoC will not offer the kind of content which can be delivered by a battle pass. Asking for battle passes is like asking AoC to be that kind of game which requires them.
NiKr wrote: » Google says average gamedev salary in Cali is ~130k. At 200 devs that's ~26mil a year. At 200k subs the game would be making 36mil a year. Let's say it's 30mil instead, because a part of those 200k would be outside of eu/us servers. That's still enough to pay the salaries and have stuff leftover, all w/o even counting all the cosmetics sales. And 200k for a good mmo is a fairly low estimate I'd assume. So, as I've been saying, as long as the game is good - we don't need a BP.
CROW3 wrote: » Most likely they won’t actually be profitable for a few years. MMOs are a long bet with plenty of highly probable pitfalls to sink the entire product.
NiKr wrote: » Mag7spy wrote: » Its a mechanic for whales mainly you are reading too much into it though. Just stating you can buy levels which would mean you can boost to get what you want. It wouldn't be a lie. End of the day battle pass saves you money so no one is really getting f'd over (unless you whale). Also its impossible to get f'd over there is 0 p2w and you can get in game gear with different looks. Its all exaggeration since it has 0 impact on gameplay. And how would directly selling cosmetics not make use of whales? If anything, directly selling expensive cosmetics is a way better method of attracting whales, cause everyone would know immediately that you spent big money on that cosmetic, rather than just think that you participated in the BP in the past. BPs go directly against exploiting whales. They simply trick poor people into thinking that BPs are worth the effort and the money.
Saabynator wrote: » Mag7spy wrote: » Saabynator wrote: » Mag7spy wrote: » Otr wrote: » Dygz wrote: » Otr wrote: » It can happen that AoC will not offer the kind of content which can be delivered by a battle pass. Asking for battle passes is like asking AoC to be that kind of game which requires them. That’s worded a bit strangely. Ashes will definitely have the in-game content that can be offered with a Battlepass. And, if Ashes has a Cosmetic Market it basically also has the rewards that typically come with modern Battlepasses. I didn’t state that Ashes has to have a Battlepass. I didn’t claim it’s certain that Ashes will have a Battlepass. Also, I didn’t ask for a Battlepass. I said I expect the Cosmetic Market will come in the form of a Battlepass. And then…we’ll see if my expectation is accurate. I’m not aware of any game that requires a Battlepass. Ok. Then was a misunderstanding from my side. I would prefer to pay a higher monthly subscription, because there was inflation meantime and it makes sense to adjust it. Then the development cost of whatever updates they inject into the game, in form of DLC expansions will be covered by them. Wiki states that DLC will be free and quite frequent:DLC expansions (post-launch releases) are planned on a monthly, quarterly, or six-monthly basis.[1][2] - The frequency and size of expansions will be based on the popularity and subscription base of the game.[1] - DLC will not cost anything more than the normal subscription.[3][4]https://youtube.com/watch?v=-fUWFkMvyHY&t=3758s - Larger expansions will add new content and increase various aspects of the game.[1][5] - New content will primarily be introduced through the node system. The goal is for existing content to remain relevant alongside the new content.[6] Each inflection point, which is those updates as expansions... you get to go back reevaluate. Hey, it seems like 89% of the servers out there never opened this door. Well, maybe the predicates were too granular. Maybe they were too focused. Maybe there's a reason why that didn't happen? Let's expand on that for the next expansion so that this content has an opportunity to come out and see the light of day.[7] – Steven Sharif So I have no idea why this thread has so many posts. (and I even had the chance to quote the largest post ever - I got no achievement though) If battlepass avoids increasing subscription id prefer that. Than a ton of people feeling the price point is too high a monthly sub. Its like a pizza and a half less a month, thats not to expensive man You really are not looking at the overall picture, there is a reason why games don't do a sub model anymore. You most likely don't understand tons of people out there that a sub model means they wont play the game. The larger that number the less players will be willing to play. But hey i guess your sub is more important so they will be fine if they up the price up to 25+$ a month. Honestly, I would pay 25 a moth, NP. When I play an MMO that i sub too, I hardly play anything else, so I get alot of value for my money. If I want a break, I can break the sub, and sub when i come back. I know the devs get paid, they make new content, and people cant buy themselves ahead of me. A free game with no sub, you hsave to sell progress, and that is game over. I use way more than 25% a month on games in general, so 25 for a sub, great news. 15, which is what they are aiming for, is more than fair, IMO.
bloodprophet wrote: » The idea people don't like sub's seems misguided at best.https://www.forbes.com/home-improvement/internet/streaming-stats/ 99% of all U.S. households pay for at least one or more streaming services. I don't understand the compulsion to say "This other company is abusing me. I expect, no DEMAND the next now abuse me as well." What value would be added to Intrepid if the added a BP? What value would be added to Ashes if they added a BP? What value would be added to the customers if they added a BP? If they add anything that gives XP to your characters or any kind of in game item other them cosmetics that seems like P2W.
Otr wrote: » "Everything is subject to change" is a disclaimer used during the monthly streams to prevent players assuming that the released game will look and feel like in that stream. Design concepts related to the game also make sense to be adjusted but "game pillars" not. I don't know about P2W. Monster coins can be balanced to become P2W as they are already in the store.
Otr wrote: » No matter how battlepasses are used in other games, in AoC we have the frequent updates promised and the word used for them was "DLC". Changing the name and calling them "battlepasse" does not mean they can now charge money for them. That would be a trick which they explicitly said they will not do it. It would betray the initial supporters.
Mag7spy wrote: » If you can use a BP and make someone spend additional money (on level ups) that is a whale trap. You play gotcha games so I'm guessing your bias against BP is kicking in to not see it.
bloodprophet wrote: » I don't understand the compulsion to say "This other company is abusing me. I expect, no DEMAND the next now abuse me as well."
bloodprophet wrote: » What value would be added to Intrepid if they added a BP? What value would be added to Ashes if they added a BP?
bloodprophet wrote: » What value would be added to the customers if they added a BP? Provides players with organized stuff to do - differently than Quests and Bulletin Board Tasks. And offers some new story and new in game content - in addition to new Cosmetics.
bloodprophet wrote: » If they add anything that gives XP to your characters or any kind of in game item other them cosmetics that seems like P2W.
NiKr wrote: » Mag7spy wrote: » If you can use a BP and make someone spend additional money (on level ups) that is a whale trap. You play gotcha games so I'm guessing your bias against BP is kicking in to not see it. Except this would go directly against Dygz' expectation of Intrepid not being assholes with their monetization designs. Guess you disagree with Dygz in this regard. And I don't hate BPs as a concept. I hate them in mmos (especially sub-based ones). And I hate them even more when there's already features that completely and directly replace what a BP does. I've been paying for a BP in genshin for 4 years w/o missing a period. I've paid for one in Star Rail as well for a year. But both of those games are f2p and I see the purchase of BP and another monthly daily login feature as "the sub to the game" ($18/m). But Ashes will already have a sub. And as I said before, I'd be way more willing to spend a few $ here and there if Intrepid simply directly sell their cosmetics, but I don't want a BP because no matter how they implement it - it's gonna be a chore-like money bait and I'd much rather simply have better rewards for already-existing in-game features.
NiKr wrote: » Except you do not buy them. You buy the BP and then have to work more to get them. And if you can boost the BP lvls w/o doing gameplay - Intrepid are now asking more money for something that costs WAY less (cause you can supposedly get all the cosmetics in the BP by just doing gameplay). Like I said, people are getting fucked over and are welcoming it.
Mag7spy wrote: » There isn't a feature to replace BP, the point of battle pass is to make additional money / have people more committed to the game. Any feature can be used on top of battlepass.
Mag7spy wrote: » You literally DO NOT NEED to buy the battle pass and ignore it. It has 0 impact on your gameplay and experience. If you don't like it in a mmorpg do not do it, it is that simple. A battlepass in a mmorpg will not be chore like you can also ignore dally task and play the game and any element you do gets you XP. (Even though you are going to have daily task in AoC with or without battle pass). Level up your characters, kill stuff, craft, etc would all give you xp to the battle pass without doing any kind of chore.
Dygz wrote: » You just get different rewards on the BP - and the way those rewards are organized are different than in-game Quests and Bulletin Board Tasks. All three of those can overlap. Eat Food 3/3 is a Battlepass Task. It's not work to complete that Task. And you're probably going to eat food three times during a play session anyway if you're playing.
