PvP arena in cities (like a colosseum)

Having public arenas in cities, that anyone can spectate.
I don't know if this has been discussed already, if it has im sorry.

Since pvp will be a core part of the game, adding a social pert to it would benefit the game it could be an interesting thing if you could make a name for yourself with it. Since in most mmo-s arena style pvp is always just instanced, and you can only do basic duels out in the world.
With a public arena (maybe like wows brawler's guild) thats in a core part of the node, people would always be around to watch.(I'm not saying this should be the only form of arena pvp, just an addition.)
Just as you will have a mayor in the node, you could have champions(maybe even some ai enemies) that you could challenge in the city arena.
Making events around it could make it even better. (slap on the option to make bets in some form and its a win)
Though its important to mention that since this would be in a public place in the world (and not instanced) only 1 match could be played at a time in 1 arena (you could have multiple ofc) so maybe some form of restrictions should be made for them, like events, or who can challenge who, but thats the design part that im not good at.

I hope something like this could get into the game, for me this was always missing from pvp (though i will probably not be good enough to get into these arenas)

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Ludullu

Azherae wrote: »

So a huge room that people can have entirely unregulated Free-for-Alls in?

I don't really see how that 'matches up' with the Lawless Zone experience.

Well yeah, my point is that the entire premise of lawless zones is dumb. It's a ffa for the strongest players, with rewards for killing everyone else.

I want a space where people can just properly pvp at all times with no restrictions and then the rest of the world to be at constant danger from anyone around you, because corruption system will only fuck them over if they didn't clear their PK count well enough.

One is a pure pvp place, but still in the open world, so that there's none of that matchmaking/queue bs and the other is a dangerous PvX world. Both have pvp in it, but one is for pure fights, while the other is fights over some other content rather than "well, I gank people just because I want some pvp", even though the sheer process of "ganking" implies that the other person was preoccupied with something else, wasn't properly prepared for you and barely responded to your actions (if at all).

All of this is, once again, based on years of enjoying this exact setup with shitton of different pvp/x encounters.

Kallysha wrote: »

Im sorry but i am having an hard time believing that after all you have said.

Yes, you do find it hard to understand that someone could've had a similar experience to you, but didn't come out with the same result in terms of their POV on the mechanic.

Kallysha wrote: »

And btw who hurt you?

No one. I simply grew out of the weakest kind of pvp out there. I did all of that stuff in my earlier years, because I thought that killing weaklings was something cool and worth bragging about.

Then I grew up and realized that having proper wars and equal fights (or fighting upwards against stronger people) is a much more interesting activity and IS actually worth bragging about, if you come out on top.

And then defending the weaklings for the gankers felt even better, because gankers would often cry that I'm spoiling their fun, even though they literally drive people away from the game.

But I want all 3 types of people to coexist in Ashes, which is exactly why I've been suggesting a system that would allow gankers to kill people, allow BHs to hunt those gankers and would allow victims to have a higher chance of getting their lost items back (while still losing a portion of loot, cause it gets sunken).

Kallysha wrote: »

Also ye there was sort of 'open' arenas in separated wvw instances, i can put a video so you see the huge difference of environment between the 2 (open wvw arena and wvw), plus also an extremely good pvper (and even avid pver solo bosses player) ganking some well known gankers back (in the second wvw video)

Again, as I showed in the video I posted, my experience of open world arenas is also "it's just a basic open field". Which is exactly why I'm asking for something MUCH BETTER from Intrepid. I've been trying to hold them up to better standards than what I (or Steven) experienced before. And I believe they can match those standards, but Steven seems to prefer the easy way out.

Though, of couuuuuurse, everything is subject to change and a work in progress, so, by some miracle, we might still see some complex and deep systems later on. I'm just worried that if I stop yelling at Steven about those kinds of systems - the "pvpers" will just make him create a ton of lawless zones and that's gonna be that.

I played with lawless zones - they're shit and boring.

Ludullu

Oh and btw, here's my reaction to the first flagged people that I saw during P2.5's start
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/DWGrumMhSaQ

Definitely a reaction of someone who's completely and totally not a pvper, yes.

EDIT: and here's me at my 24th hour of straight gamplay, not realizing that war enemies show up as red (this one the first that I saw at the time) thinking "oh, some bastard was PKing lowbies near Lionhold, I can take him" and then seeing that he's lvl20 and is about to body me. All while I had super rare mats on me and literally a few minutes ago in the stream I said "nah, I'm just running to Windstead, cause my loot is too precious".

https://www.twitch.tv/ludullu/clip/CarelessIgnorantCocoaKappaClaus-SKYXUPz2MfN48NUf

Also definitely not a pvpers response to seeing a pvpable target.

Kallysha

Ludullu wrote: »

I want a space where people can just properly pvp at all times with no restrictions and then the rest of the world to be at constant danger from anyone around you, because corruption system will only fuck them over if they didn't clear their PK count well enough.

I played with lawless zones - they're shit and boring.

Funny that, it already existed, were called lawless zones! And it looks like you are pretty much the only one on a constant complaining about it, like everywhere; while the majority of the pvpers seemed to have fun in there hence why they are asking for it back.
(what is also funny is that you keep contradicting yourself and changing your narrative gradually)
And once more what you want its evidently not what everyone wants... also honestly i couldnt care less about your reactions, as far as it goes to me you do not own a competitive mindset, been beyond obvious when you prioritize pve related stuff over pvp, plus you can say/post whatever you want it wont shake my certainty.
Surely we do not have a similar experience btw.

Ludullu wrote: »

I simply grew out of the weakest kind of pvp out there. I did all of that stuff in my earlier years, because I thought that killing weaklings was something cool and worth bragging about.

Oh the strike of irony, so as you did the others must not... gotcha

Ludullu

Kallysha wrote: »

(what is also funny is that you keep contradicting yourself and changing your narrative gradually)

I wasn't about to respond, but I am curious, where exactly is the contradiction in my statements?

Kallysha

Ludullu wrote: »

I wasn't about to respond, but I am curious, where exactly is the contradiction in my statements?

All you need to do is to go back and read what you have written

Ludullu

Kallysha wrote: »

All you need to do is to go back and read what you have written

Ah, so you won't explain yourself, just as you refuse to watch me literally pvp when the pvp opportunity arises. So yeah, I'm totally contradicting myself and totally not a pvper. Got it

Kallysha

Ludullu wrote: »

Ah, so you won't explain yourself, just as you refuse to watch me literally pvp when the pvp opportunity arises. So yeah, I'm totally contradicting myself and totally not a pvper. Got it

In a matter of fact i did just watch, also got curious
Now im not going to do an essay of every single time you contradicted yourself, just go back and read

Ludullu

Kallysha wrote: »

In a matter of fact i did just watch, also got curious
Now im not going to do an essay of every single time you contradicted yourself, just go back and read

I don't need an essay. Point to a single contradiction, that's it.

Kallysha

Ludullu wrote: »

Nah, they do have a point. I'm not a pvper.

Ludullu wrote: »

I've been a ganker in PK guilds.

Ludullu

Kallysha wrote: »

Ludullu wrote: »

Nah, they do have a point. I'm not a pvper.

Ludullu wrote: »

I've been a ganker in PK guilds.

And as I said in my last big post, it's what I did in the past. Once I realized that just killing people for no reason (especially when they're weaker) is boring - I moved on to being a proper PvXer.

The present tense of "I'm not a pvper" and the past tense of "I've been a ganker" were meant to signify that. Just as if I said "I'm not a kid" and "I've been a kid for several years of my life" - it would not suddenly mean that I'm still a kid.

I do hope you had some better examples, cause if all of them are examples of something that was true at some point in the past vs something that I'm asking for right now - I guess you don't believe that people can change. Though that does obviously track with your views on being a pvper yet having a differing POV on it from your own.

Kallysha

Omg and here we go again... you wanted a contradiction and there is one, if you not happy with that one go look for others.
((admits that he's not a pvper, claims himself as pvxer, then i afirme he is not a pvper and proceeds to say that is a pvper, go figure) plus everything you've said thus far proved you indeed aint one)
So conclusion your vision of playing an mmo shifted for a more carebear perspective, and you simply dont want pvpers to have fun (truly you dont want pvpers around in the game, but in fact, as you've pleaded multiple times, you want them enclosed/contained (out of view out of mind, am i right)), thats literally it. [No need to come debate this because you have already confirm the statement along the way]
Also no need to constantly keep on repeating yourself over and over again, like a broken record.

1º

Once I realized that just killing people for no reason is boring

Again talk for yourself, you dont talk for everyone, because you aint everyone, seems like you struggle to understand that, when you systematically insist to imply that to everyone else
2º

it's what I did in the past.

Then you should have written 'I was' instead of 'I've been' just saying

Ludullu

Kallysha wrote: »

and you simply dont want pvpers to have fun

I want PKers and gankers who only want to kill with no penalties to have limited fun. Literally the same as Steven.

Here's him describing the og plan for ship pvp
1:06:45

https://youtu.be/tpieQoKYOjE?t=4005

Here's a quote from a few month later of the same year
https://ashesofcreation.wiki/Player_corruption
"Q: Will there be any large-scale consequences when many players in a group guild region religion etc become corrupted frequently or for an extended period of time?
A: There are not group dynamics or mechanics that revolve around mass murdering people in the world. The corruption system is intended to deter mass murdering, not to provide incentives by which players can go out and gain corruption.[43] – Steven Sharif"

And only a year later (3 years ago) they implemented a change that goes directly against the quote above, in the form of open seas.
1:00:16

https://youtu.be/4XLJelgfO3g?t=3617

And then suddenly for A2 they decided to go with land lawless zones as well, because they're supposed to, somehow, represent ship pvp behavior, even though there's nothing similar between the 2 activities or interactions (let alone investments).

All of this has been a total shift in design direction. All of this has been highly discussed and argued against by a ton of people, all the way from the announcement of open seas. I'm simply one of the remaining active posters who are vehemetly against this bs.

As for repeating myself, I keep doing it beceause you keep saying that I don't want pvp in the game, while I've been saying from the start that I want more of it than what we have right now or what we would have in the lawless zones. You just refuse to believe that Lineage 2 existed and worked just fine with the system I'm suggesting (and the system that Steven himself copied from L2 into Ashes).

If anything, it's been Steven that crippled that very system by making it way harsher than L2's implementation. And I've been asking for a much laxer balancing for years now, but you wouldn't know that, cause you've been here for barely over a year.

Kallysha wrote: »

Again talk for yourself, you dont talk for everyone, because you aint everyone, seems like you struggle to understand that, when you systematically insist to imply that to everyone else

All the things that I've been saying here have been from my own perspective and for my own preferences. This is also one of the things I've been repeating over and over, yet you still fail to notice it. I keep saying "I'm giving feedback because I dislike the changes". Where exactly have I stated that everyone else must or do agree with me?

Kallysha wrote: »

Then you should have written 'I was' instead of 'I've been' just saying

Ludullu wrote: »

I've been a ganker in PK guilds. I've played on servers with lawless zones where pvp never stopped. My main guild's name for half a decade has been WarToAll, where literally the first thing we do on the server is declare war ON EVERY SINGLE GUILD IN THE GAME. I've been top one in the ranked arena on several servers. I've PKed lowbies on PK alts too.

All of this was pretty much a constant experience for 12 years. But yes, Kallysha, I definitely don't know what pvp is and definitely never experienced it.

If a list of things that I have done, which is then summed up by "All of this WAS..." does not imply that this was in the past - I guess my attempts to learn english as the third language failed, cause I'm fairly sure that's how you construct a list of things that happened at some point in time.

I used those examples to explain my knowledge and understanding of pvper POV, which, imo, fits the "has a present result" definition just fine. I've done those things in the past, hence I understand the activity and what it entails.

Kallysha

Dude you a bit of a thick head arent you, reality check, he did "copied" right? its there (not fully implement tho), and right now there are no real decent lawless zones, and look at the game, look how alive it is, cant you see, have you seen many pvpers around havent you since it got removed? And you keep on a constant insisting dont you, as to see if people cater your way and agree with you (I dont know who you trynna gaslight in here but certainly not me)
And look and behold once more contradicting himself

'does not imply that this was in the past' = 'it's what I did in the past.'

Surely im on the wrong in here as well

You dont even realize what you write or what you have written
unless you trynna to convince me now too that the PAST is the present (perfect tense) dude spare me

Plus clearly you also must know better than Steven and Intrepid for sure
Seems what you want is indeed a replica of lineage 2 but "better", and i dont think thats what Steven and Intrepid really want or what they doing, they may have taken some influence from it as in the form of some systems/features, but i dont believe Steven is trynna to create (or more like recreate) a new lineage 2

'I want PKers and gankers who only want to kill with no penalties to have limited fun.'

I feel im talking wiht a toddler at this point
flash news the penalty you looking for already exists called corruption and what it follows

Pyrolol

Always the same few people against any competitive gameplay 😂

Ludullu

Pyrolol wrote: »

Always the same few people against any competitive gameplay 😂

Not any. I'm all for competitive. I'm against genocidal areas with 0 risk for the strong. Where exactly is the competition there?

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