Do you guys think Ashes will be just another MMORPG or will it be something entirely different?

QUASI

genna wrote: »

Do you guys think Ashes will be just another MMORPG or will it be something entirely different?

Just another MMORPG, only with some different bells, skins, and whistles.


Yes I know I talk a lot, and communicate poorly, but I've done my best to express why I feel this way:


The idea the initially sold to the community was a great one, but (just through my own interactions), I've seen no drive to produce anything significantly game changing.


What this game could be, even now, if the desire was there. Would be one that actually created a much needed shift and a break in all of the old negative ingrained MMORPG players behaviours and playstyles.


It is my strong opinion that this game will be nothing truly special, because whilst it uses a different engine, and has a different look, it won't address any attention towards a shift in players behaviors and attitudes towards MMO's



If they REALLY intended this game to be different, then they should have been coming at that from the beginning, rather than stating, "we're going to be different" only to then show by actions that actually they are just the same.


IF however, they DID want to achieve their goal for something other than 'just another MMORPG', then they would be better off looking at the much bigger picture, working on removing negative habits that have been ingrained in players over the years of poor MMORPGs and working on adressing a culture change.

I'm not talking about forcing all players to suddenly start playing one way or another, I'm talking about creating a cultural shift.

If you want ALL play styles to be relevant, then THAT needs to be your foundation. Don't say they will be, then decide to shilly shally about and ask if they should or not.

If you want to make an inclusive environment then THAT is a foundation. Don't mock or ignore minority players just because it's not something that gels with you personally.

No major society shifts happened because of one individual in their own local town. No, change happens when it is bought to the attention of all, when it becomes a necessity; when it gets legislated on and enforced by those in power (aka here, Intrepid)

I'm sorry, but at the moment, Intrepid seems to be trying to fix [insert minority clause here: MMORPG, racism, sexism, equal or gay rights] by doing nothing but paying lip service to the cause.

Intrepid, YOU are the ones with the power to make a change.

Seriously, why do you appear uninterested in doing so now?
Is it that the reality of making the game has left you falling into the same rut left by game developers that have gone before?
Those making those ordinary mmorpgs?
That actually and practiality of achieving even simple things like communicating to the community has overwhelmed you and that you've given up as a result on stretching yourself with the challenge of achieving what you had originally told us you wanted? Something game-changing and new.


Oh, you still want it? Maybe it's just too difficult to believe that shifting peoples acceptance of 'new' ideas and a 'new' way of doing things is possible.

I'm sure that you are aware that here in the UK, our government employs a 'nudge' unit. I'd be surprised if America didn't have one, but not surprised that American culture wouldn't be happy if they actually knew one existed.

It's officially called the behavioral insights team, but whilst it gathers insights, it's role is really to help the government of the time to achieve it's goals.
The government wants to reduce the landfill amount the country generates,? Gently encourage (nudge) the culture towards more active participation in recycling and recyclable choices.
The government is spending too much money on health because people are all obese? Gently nudge the culture towards one which embraces a more active way of life.


I genuinely believed when I read your initial presentations as to Ashes of creation, that you understood that cultural shifts and changes were necessary to put an actual game changer on the table.

So far... *shrug*.... same old same old.

And that's why I personally believe that it will be nothing but an average MMORPG, only with different bells and whistles and skins.

But I also know for the lack of common decency you've shown me, that you're probably likely to dismiss me once again as a nutjob idiot whos ideas are worth less than pondslime.

*Behavioral insights team websight
https://bi.team/
Inside the unit book by David Halpern
https://amazon.co.uk/Inside-Nudge-Unit-changes-difference/dp/0753556553/ref=sr_1_1?adgrpid=54043622355&gclid=CjwKCAjw8e7mBRBsEiwAPVxxiNGokrajSKxvyzjeo2VGfDos1NkODMYW3_WxLmAerwl7OZz2e3OSnRoCpVUQAvD_BwE&hvadid=259020178683&hvdev=c&hvlocphy=9045248&hvnetw=g&hvpos=1t1&hvqmt=e&hvrand=12857922197815235531&hvtargid=kwd-301268734737&hydadcr=24403_1748879&keywords=inside+nudge+unit&qid=1557914822&s=gateway&sr=8-1

They're game devs, not twitter warriors. The goal is to make a great game, not to solve all of society's cultural inadequacies. Are you in the right forum?

Plateau

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Wandering Mist

leonerdo wrote: »

QUASI wrote: »

Are you in the right forum?

There's nothing wrong with wanting a better social atmosphere in a largely social game. There's no need to be so unwelcoming. You can make your point without that last jab.

The point is valid, even if the delivery was unnecessary. I don't understand this mindset that it's the dev's responsibility to fix all the problems for the community.

grisu

You can always find faults in how people meant what they said and what people wanted to hear/interpreted.

I had a recent example of that happening around me. The "March is Node month"" thing. a lot of your probably are aware of it, but what's interesting here is how out of proportion it was blown.
It's one simple statement that doesn't promise anything, but people took is as ground to believe they will get this and this and this and this and more. >>EVEN THO Margareth came in a few minutes later to clarify that it will be node themed. It set expectation that something node related will be in march, but that's the extend of it.
That didn't stop people from blowing it out of proportion and now feel "betrayed" for not getting what they wanted, even tho noone ever actually said they will get exactly that. People start to rip statements out of context and sell it as "another failure of IS" and crap like that.

IS isn't perfect and made mistakes. I'm skeptical on several topics myself, but this, like a lot of complains recently are of the described type and it just get's annoying.

What they feel like should bring rpg (rp AND g, not just rp that is a very real distinction. RPG doesn't entail that you will roleplay any of the characters, it means you have character building, character focused stories and moments.)
back into MMORPGs is what they decide, not what you interpret into it. They never said they will make rp "socially acceptable" It never was inacceptable to begin with and playing victim because there are people out there trolling you means nothing for rp as a playstyle. Those people will go to low level zones and kill leveling people too, or gatheres that have no combat desire.
Does that make them socially unaccepted too? Because they got ganked by a subcategory of players? I don't think so. Whining about it just reinforces that you are a push over that can be ganked. After all they simply look for easy targets, like rpers, gatheres and leveling people.

Dygz

Yeah, even as Steven talked about RP in today's Livestream, it was mostly about how to help players look unique - rather than about tools to help players engage in what I refer to as "Theatre RP", where the participants are trying to make up their own stories as directed by a player GM.