Am I just missing something or what? Streamers always get backed up by their audience. If someone starts griefing them they are gonna get wacked by the full force of the subscriber army. They have their own antigriefing system.
Am I just missing something or what? Streamers always get backed up by their audience. If someone starts griefing them they are gonna get wacked by the full force of the subscriber army. They have their own antigriefing system.
Yeah man, you understand the Social Systems, unfortunately OP believes Streamers should have invulnerability but makes no mention of Streamers not being able to PvP when the invulnerability is applied. OP then ignores feedback and decides to continue on the Crusade, whilst any sane person wouldn't actually go corrupted to kill the Streamer, they would simply Guild War (Streamers are never without a Guild).
To me the whole topic is ridiculous. Streamers can delay streams, upload later and choose not to stream, but none of that will protect them from a Guild War. Ashes is a game where Invulnerabilities should only be enabled for 10 Seconds after a Res Pad Resurrection to protect against Spawn Campers. Beyond that I am against Invulnerabilities.
Let’s be honest, if a streamer is on a server then they’re going to have a flying mount which is a significantly faster way of travel than anything else the majority of the player base will have. I’m not a fan of making this comparison but the ease of travel is a large reason why griefing is significantly higher in classic WoW than it is retail WoW.
I don’t really want streamers to be griefed because their longevity on the game matters for the health of the game itself but I really don’t think there’s anything to be concerned about.
So streamers should be protected from "griefing" but they're allowed to take all the gold/donations from players in game?
How does that work?
Does this rule also applies to Mayors and Guild Leaders? They will also be public figures in game? Do they deserve extra protection?
So streamers should be protected from "griefing" but they're allowed to take all the gold/donations from players in game?
How does that work?
Does this rule also applies to Mayors and Guild Leaders? They will also be public figures in game? Do they deserve extra protection?
Are you for real man? Mayors and Guild Leaders deal with hundreds of players. NOT THOUSANDS. Streamers like Asmongold, Summit, Tim, etc. all pull in 20k+ viewers. Asmongold in particular, averages 40k.
So they deserve safety nets that prevent them from being mass griefed. And not just them, everyone should.
EVERYONE should be protected from mass, continuous griefing. I'm not talking about granting streamers unique protections, no, I'm talking about implementing systems to deal with mass griefing so that streamers, social personalities, heck even mayors and guild leaders, won't be the target of continuous, targeted, harassment.
Have corruption shared by all combatants who participated in a kill against a green. There, problem solved with continued group griefing.
Streamers are not special. They’re entertainers. They play a game, they play the game.
If they’re stupid and don’t delay their stream, then they get all the attention they’re after (positive and negative)
The non-killing griefing is easily recorded and reported. How many people are gonna risk getting their account banned just to say a naughty word at a streamer?
People are allowed to fight streamers, they’re allowed to combat the massive hoard of followers they lead around. These things should be allowed and encouraged, otherwise streamers can wreck a server with no recourse.
I enjoy watching streams etc myself, the problem is when some streamers get killed even once, they call it a stream snipe.
This game and its vision should not be changed or altered for ANYONE, because once you start going down that path it becomes another shitty mmo not worth playing.
Every thread I see you in Chuck, it just comes across you are straight terrified of open world pvp and you bring up so many different points to try and back up your stance on it. Maybe WoW is the game for you, and thats not me being a dick about it.
Conflict is going to be a thing, ofc there will some idiots, just like there will be a ton of people who will help kill those idiots, Open World PvP is not griefing, and it is and always has been one of the main pillars of this game, without it the game loses all meaning.
Who cares? It only affects 0.0001% of the population of the game. The game shouldn't change itself for that small group. Streamers can play other games.
I enjoy watching streams etc myself, the problem is when some streamers get killed even once, they call it a stream snipe.
This game and its vision should not be changed or altered for ANYONE, because once you start going down that path it becomes another shitty mmo not worth playing.
Every thread I see you in Chuck, it just comes across you are straight terrified of open world pvp and you bring up so many different points to try and back up your stance on it. Maybe WoW is the game for you, and thats not me being a dick about it.
Conflict is going to be a thing, ofc there will some idiots, just like there will be a ton of people who will help kill those idiots, Open World PvP is not griefing, and it is and always has been one of the main pillars of this game, without it the game loses all meaning.
I personally can't wait for open world pvp. I am not afraid. But in other games, ghosting and stream sniping is extremely common. So imagine just HOW MANY times that would occur in a game that has open world PvP.
Being stream sniped and killed 5 to 10 times a day should be ok. But 15 times? 50? 100? That is not fun for anyone.
Who cares? It only affects 0.0001% of the population of the game. The game shouldn't change itself for that small group. Streamers can play other games.
Not true. Streamers aren't just individual players. They determine whether their viewers play a game or not. If they don't like it, the viewers will form a negative opinion of the game.
So if a streamer like Asmongold, who at his peak pulls in 70k viewers, keeps constantly getting killed in open world PvP and is not able to enjoy the game, his viewers will form a negative opinion of the game. He also has a YouTube channel where he averages 200 to 300k views on a regular basis. So in reality, no, it will affect a MUCH larger population of the game.
Who cares? It only affects 0.0001% of the population of the game. The game shouldn't change itself for that small group. Streamers can play other games.
Not true. Streamers aren't just individual players. They determine whether their viewers play a game or not. If they don't like it, the viewers will form a negative opinion of the game.
So if a streamer like Asmongold, who at his peak pulls in 70k viewers, keeps constantly getting killed in open world PvP and is not able to enjoy the game, his viewers will form a negative opinion of the game. He also has a YouTube channel where he averages 200 to 300k views on a regular basis. So in reality, no, it will affect a MUCH larger population of the game.
You vastly overestimate the influence of streamers, and vastly underestimate the intelligence of their viewers.
Who cares? It only affects 0.0001% of the population of the game. The game shouldn't change itself for that small group. Streamers can play other games.
Not true. Streamers aren't just individual players. They determine whether their viewers play a game or not. If they don't like it, the viewers will form a negative opinion of the game.
So if a streamer like Asmongold, who at his peak pulls in 70k viewers, keeps constantly getting killed in open world PvP and is not able to enjoy the game, his viewers will form a negative opinion of the game. He also has a YouTube channel where he averages 200 to 300k views on a regular basis. So in reality, no, it will affect a MUCH larger population of the game.
You vastly overestimate the influence of streamers, and vastly underestimate the intelligence of their viewers.
hmmm streamers or influencers... Oh wait they are almost the same thing.
Viewers play with the streamers yes, but the majority of those same viewers would still play the game if the streamer didn't stream/play. Its a p2p game not a f2p game.
Not true. Streamers aren't just individual players. They determine whether their viewers play a game or not. If they don't like it, the viewers will form a negative opinion of the game.
So if a streamer like Asmongold, who at his peak pulls in 70k viewers, keeps constantly getting killed in open world PvP and is not able to enjoy the game, his viewers will form a negative opinion of the game. He also has a YouTube channel where he averages 200 to 300k views on a regular basis. So in reality, no, it will affect a MUCH larger population of the game.
Incorrect. Viewers doesnt have the streamer problems, even if the streamer hates it they know the game is safe for them. AND people is gonna defend streamers even more than gank them, he will have much more bodyguards than gankers. Thats a fact.
We need equality for everyone and the community will sort it out.
If low level players are griefing a higher level player through pvp, if they fight back then there should be no reason to worry as their corruption status will not grow and the trolls with splat. I am sure there will be some form of harassment report system.
If a streamer is worried about getting trolled either through PVE aspects or PVP aspects of the game that just comes with the job, its to be expected and they can easily add a delay (although not convenient) or just not stream the game all together. Many of the streamers get their content from getting stream sniped constantly or having the 'anti stream sniper' groups which follow them around to fight their battles for them.
All in all I believe that there shouldn't be any advantages for a streamer when it comes to corruption system especially when they will use streamer benefits to grow as fast as possible and become powerful through their community.
If he really cared about this then he could easily just... not stream the game? Nothing stopping Asmon and other streamers from taking time off when the game releases, rolling on a random server, and playing the game the same as everyone else.
Let's agree that being a bigger streamer and having a lot of people watching you is just high risk, high reward. You have a private army as well as having a marker on your head. As well with the fact that I think most bigger streamers will be the major of voting nodes and therefore will have flying mounts.
I think that mid-tier steamers. Maybe those with 50-500 viewers will probably get the worse of it. But really, who really goes out of their way that much/often. Streamers could set traps as well. Dying without attacking and getting a few friends to gank the corrupted man. I don't see this being a major problem. It just adds more social movement to the game?
Let's agree that being a bigger streamer and having a lot of people watching you is just high risk, high reward. You have a private army as well as having a marker on your head. As well with the fact that I think most bigger streamers will be the major of voting nodes and therefore will have flying mounts.
I think that mid-tier steamers. Maybe those with 50-500 viewers will probably get the worse of it. But really, who really goes out of their way that much/often. Streamers could set traps as well. Dying without attacking and getting a few friends to gank the corrupted man. I don't see this being a major problem. It just adds more social movement to the game?
Oh you'd be surprised at just how willing people are to dedicate large amounts of their time to troll celebrities.
They gain enjoyment from ruining other's experience with the game. Most of them are just teenagers who think that they're cool for doing so.
I don't really think that streamers should get extra protection, AOC does not seem like a great game to stream, you can be PvP'd anywhere it seems, and they are broadcasting their position and the position of their groups / guilds for 8+ hours a day.
Also, this problem has natural in game solutions, like for example, roll around in large groups, I imagine that guild leaders / mayors will receive similar treatment, albeit far less severe because they are not broadcasting a target on their back.
This is not a problem the Devs need to address IMO, but a problem the community needs to address, and solutions need to be made by the players involved, streamers just need to be prepared and equipped to deal with griefers that want to ruin their fun for a quick laugh.
This game will also probably be TERRIBLE to grief in, when you die you lose XP, when you die while corrupt, you lose MORE XP, and gear. If a player griefs often, they also become corrupt much quicker, they're just going to lose levels and gear exponentially, eventually probably making it trivial to defeat them, especially since corrupt players deal LESS damage in PvP.
I don't see how a streamer would be getting griefed, if he is going to most likely be in a party with stronger people. You think a ton of people are going to want to try and grief a streamer for some camera time when streamer will most likely have name plates off and the dude dies in 1 hit?
If a player in game has a lot of people that want to kill them, they would be forced to deal with the reprocussions of that.
I see no reason why a player that is importing that along with them should be any different.
Its different as these players bring a TON of new people into your game. Its in your best interest to protect them. Just look at all the popularity increase after Asmongold's interview with Steven.
They just have to deal with what you do or do not bring to the game, just like every other player has to deal with what they do or do not bring to the game.
No. Do not equate them to normal players. They are content creators, so they will have a MUCH higher amount of people wanting to harass them than an average player. They bring attention to your game, so its your duty to protect them from harassment.
Its important to make changes to the corruption system so that it affects High level griefing significantly, which won't be experienced by 95% of the playerbase.
It's no ones duty to protect anyone.
If they go to a game knowing it is PvP, then that is on them.
All they need to do to get around it is to level up while not streaming - but they won't do that because they are not getting paid if they are not streaming.
I don't know what your problem is with streamers. But if someone brought a ton of attention to my game, I would be interested in providing some safety nets to ensure that they won't be excessively harassed in my game.
We just don’t have some disturbing hero worship of them.
They play the game and upload it. Okay. Big freaking deal.
Who cares? It only affects 0.0001% of the population of the game. The game shouldn't change itself for that small group. Streamers can play other games.
Not true. Streamers aren't just individual players. They determine whether their viewers play a game or not. If they don't like it, the viewers will form a negative opinion of the game.
So if a streamer like Asmongold, who at his peak pulls in 70k viewers, keeps constantly getting killed in open world PvP and is not able to enjoy the game, his viewers will form a negative opinion of the game. He also has a YouTube channel where he averages 200 to 300k views on a regular basis. So in reality, no, it will affect a MUCH larger population of the game.
You vastly overestimate the influence of streamers, and vastly underestimate the intelligence of their viewers.
hmmm streamers or influencers... Oh wait they are almost the same thing.
Viewers play with the streamers yes, but the majority of those same viewers would still play the game if the streamer didn't stream/play. Its a p2p game not a f2p game.
Whatever people wanna call them, unless their viewers are pure sheeple, criticism based on problems the streamer made for themselves isn't gonna be the deciding factor on if they like the game or not.
Maybe it'll teach them to play smarter and not loudly announce their location to thousands of people in an openworld PvP game.
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ogreMember, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
If you're playing a game with open world PvP and streaming to potentially tens of thousands of people then you should fully expect to be targeted/griefed by a small portion of those people. Deciding to stream a game is a choice, and if a streamer doesn't want to or is unable to deal with the conseqences of this choice then they should either add a delay to their stream or not stream the game at all.
Giving any specific subset of players any sort of advantage or protection that the rest of the playerbase has no access to would be sending a troubling message to the community.
Of course having a large audience of people interested in the game and potentially deciding to play it is a good thing...but streamers should have to play the game just like everybody does, even if they do have thousands of people watching them, i think that even they would agree would with that statement.
Comments
Yeah man, you understand the Social Systems, unfortunately OP believes Streamers should have invulnerability but makes no mention of Streamers not being able to PvP when the invulnerability is applied. OP then ignores feedback and decides to continue on the Crusade, whilst any sane person wouldn't actually go corrupted to kill the Streamer, they would simply Guild War (Streamers are never without a Guild).
To me the whole topic is ridiculous. Streamers can delay streams, upload later and choose not to stream, but none of that will protect them from a Guild War. Ashes is a game where Invulnerabilities should only be enabled for 10 Seconds after a Res Pad Resurrection to protect against Spawn Campers. Beyond that I am against Invulnerabilities.
I don’t really want streamers to be griefed because their longevity on the game matters for the health of the game itself but I really don’t think there’s anything to be concerned about.
How does that work?
Does this rule also applies to Mayors and Guild Leaders? They will also be public figures in game? Do they deserve extra protection?
https://strawpoll.com/qjojxcyub
This should make things a lot clearer.
Are you for real man? Mayors and Guild Leaders deal with hundreds of players. NOT THOUSANDS. Streamers like Asmongold, Summit, Tim, etc. all pull in 20k+ viewers. Asmongold in particular, averages 40k.
So they deserve safety nets that prevent them from being mass griefed. And not just them, everyone should.
EVERYONE should be protected from mass, continuous griefing. I'm not talking about granting streamers unique protections, no, I'm talking about implementing systems to deal with mass griefing so that streamers, social personalities, heck even mayors and guild leaders, won't be the target of continuous, targeted, harassment.
Streamers are not special. They’re entertainers. They play a game, they play the game.
If they’re stupid and don’t delay their stream, then they get all the attention they’re after (positive and negative)
The non-killing griefing is easily recorded and reported. How many people are gonna risk getting their account banned just to say a naughty word at a streamer?
People are allowed to fight streamers, they’re allowed to combat the massive hoard of followers they lead around. These things should be allowed and encouraged, otherwise streamers can wreck a server with no recourse.
You have to trust the community.
This game and its vision should not be changed or altered for ANYONE, because once you start going down that path it becomes another shitty mmo not worth playing.
Every thread I see you in Chuck, it just comes across you are straight terrified of open world pvp and you bring up so many different points to try and back up your stance on it. Maybe WoW is the game for you, and thats not me being a dick about it.
Conflict is going to be a thing, ofc there will some idiots, just like there will be a ton of people who will help kill those idiots, Open World PvP is not griefing, and it is and always has been one of the main pillars of this game, without it the game loses all meaning.
I personally can't wait for open world pvp. I am not afraid. But in other games, ghosting and stream sniping is extremely common. So imagine just HOW MANY times that would occur in a game that has open world PvP.
Being stream sniped and killed 5 to 10 times a day should be ok. But 15 times? 50? 100? That is not fun for anyone.
Not true. Streamers aren't just individual players. They determine whether their viewers play a game or not. If they don't like it, the viewers will form a negative opinion of the game.
So if a streamer like Asmongold, who at his peak pulls in 70k viewers, keeps constantly getting killed in open world PvP and is not able to enjoy the game, his viewers will form a negative opinion of the game. He also has a YouTube channel where he averages 200 to 300k views on a regular basis. So in reality, no, it will affect a MUCH larger population of the game.
You vastly overestimate the influence of streamers, and vastly underestimate the intelligence of their viewers.
hmmm streamers or influencers... Oh wait they are almost the same thing.
Viewers play with the streamers yes, but the majority of those same viewers would still play the game if the streamer didn't stream/play. Its a p2p game not a f2p game.
Incorrect. Viewers doesnt have the streamer problems, even if the streamer hates it they know the game is safe for them. AND people is gonna defend streamers even more than gank them, he will have much more bodyguards than gankers. Thats a fact.
We need equality for everyone and the community will sort it out.
If a streamer is worried about getting trolled either through PVE aspects or PVP aspects of the game that just comes with the job, its to be expected and they can easily add a delay (although not convenient) or just not stream the game all together. Many of the streamers get their content from getting stream sniped constantly or having the 'anti stream sniper' groups which follow them around to fight their battles for them.
All in all I believe that there shouldn't be any advantages for a streamer when it comes to corruption system especially when they will use streamer benefits to grow as fast as possible and become powerful through their community.
I think that mid-tier steamers. Maybe those with 50-500 viewers will probably get the worse of it. But really, who really goes out of their way that much/often. Streamers could set traps as well. Dying without attacking and getting a few friends to gank the corrupted man. I don't see this being a major problem. It just adds more social movement to the game?
Twitch
Twitter
Oh you'd be surprised at just how willing people are to dedicate large amounts of their time to troll celebrities.
They gain enjoyment from ruining other's experience with the game. Most of them are just teenagers who think that they're cool for doing so.
Also, this problem has natural in game solutions, like for example, roll around in large groups, I imagine that guild leaders / mayors will receive similar treatment, albeit far less severe because they are not broadcasting a target on their back.
This is not a problem the Devs need to address IMO, but a problem the community needs to address, and solutions need to be made by the players involved, streamers just need to be prepared and equipped to deal with griefers that want to ruin their fun for a quick laugh.
This game will also probably be TERRIBLE to grief in, when you die you lose XP, when you die while corrupt, you lose MORE XP, and gear. If a player griefs often, they also become corrupt much quicker, they're just going to lose levels and gear exponentially, eventually probably making it trivial to defeat them, especially since corrupt players deal LESS damage in PvP.
Not that the outcome should be any different.
They play the game and upload it. Okay. Big freaking deal.
Whatever people wanna call them, unless their viewers are pure sheeple, criticism based on problems the streamer made for themselves isn't gonna be the deciding factor on if they like the game or not.
Maybe it'll teach them to play smarter and not loudly announce their location to thousands of people in an openworld PvP game.
Giving any specific subset of players any sort of advantage or protection that the rest of the playerbase has no access to would be sending a troubling message to the community.
Of course having a large audience of people interested in the game and potentially deciding to play it is a good thing...but streamers should have to play the game just like everybody does, even if they do have thousands of people watching them, i think that even they would agree would with that statement.