As for realism, i´d say that´s out the window pretty fast considering we are gonna run around in plate and chainmail at full speed.
Actually you can semi do that. Pathfinder actually has pretty realistic rules for that, as in you lose like... 5ft of movement in heavy armour I believe? That's pretty accurate.
I think the head of the axe is rather small, it could use a slight increase overall. I'm not interested in Final Fantasy sized weapons, but they should be intimidating.
A small framed woman with a two-handed sword, probably a Claymore.
A dwarf with a hammer.
I'd say these proportions are good. However If realism is of concern, the axe from the tweet would break upon impact. The point where it is attached is far too thin and definitely weak.
Eh.... as far as I know, a claymore was usually wieldable only by men because of strength differences so a lot of realism is instantly thrown out of the window (not saying women can't wield it, but it is biologically factual that men are stronger) so tbh, no point dwelling into realistic proportions....
Just gotta make sure Titan Grip is fighter main only if it ever comes 🤣
As for realism, i´d say that´s out the window pretty fast considering we are gonna run around in plate and chainmail at full speed.
Actually you can semi do that. Pathfinder actually has pretty realistic rules for that, as in you lose like... 5ft of movement in heavy armour I believe? That's pretty accurate.
Well, one could surely do some running, but armor is not light. A short sleeve chainmail as an example is between 11 and 14 KG ( 24 to 30 pounds ) and that´s just one piece. Just walking in that a few hours, and your shoulders feel like that are down on your hips.
Sure, this will be a game, and all things have it´s limits in how far they are to be taken, but i always feel that i miss some sort of weight distribution and effect when armored.
As for realism, i´d say that´s out the window pretty fast considering we are gonna run around in plate and chainmail at full speed.
Actually you can semi do that. Pathfinder actually has pretty realistic rules for that, as in you lose like... 5ft of movement in heavy armour I believe? That's pretty accurate.
Well, one could surely do some running, but armor is not light. A short sleeve chainmail as an example is between 11 and 14 KG ( 24 to 30 pounds ) and that´s just one piece. Just walking in that a few hours, and your shoulders feel like that are down on your hips.
Sure, this will be a game, and all things have it´s limits in how far they are to be taken, but i always feel that i miss some sort of weight distribution and effect when armored.
That is false, please do some research about armour before saying this sort of thing. Armour, is specifically made to balance its weight around the whole body. Chainmail for example is mostly held on to you by a huge belt which focuses the weight in your waist area, making the weight more equally distributed. In battles, ppl need to be ready to fight for hours at end.
As for realism, i´d say that´s out the window pretty fast considering we are gonna run around in plate and chainmail at full speed.
Actually you can semi do that. Pathfinder actually has pretty realistic rules for that, as in you lose like... 5ft of movement in heavy armour I believe? That's pretty accurate.
Well, one could surely do some running, but armor is not light. A short sleeve chainmail as an example is between 11 and 14 KG ( 24 to 30 pounds ) and that´s just one piece. Just walking in that a few hours, and your shoulders feel like that are down on your hips.
Sure, this will be a game, and all things have it´s limits in how far they are to be taken, but i always feel that i miss some sort of weight distribution and effect when armored.
That is false, please do some research about armour before saying this sort of thing. Armour, is specifically made to balance its weight around the whole body. Chainmail for example is mostly held on to you by a huge belt which focuses the weight in your waist area, making the weight more equally distributed. In battles, ppl need to be ready to fight for hours at end.
Well, that´s nice in text, but a chainmail is not being held in place by a belt for long if you do running or fighting. Neither do any piece of armor to be honest, due to it being a shell on your body, 9 times out of 10 not molded after you.
I claim this because i have worn armor, made armor pieces, used chainmail, made chainmail, am friends with fighters in both medieval style as Viking age, so i am not just pulling this out of thin air.
As for realism, i´d say that´s out the window pretty fast considering we are gonna run around in plate and chainmail at full speed.
Actually you can semi do that. Pathfinder actually has pretty realistic rules for that, as in you lose like... 5ft of movement in heavy armour I believe? That's pretty accurate.
Well, one could surely do some running, but armor is not light. A short sleeve chainmail as an example is between 11 and 14 KG ( 24 to 30 pounds ) and that´s just one piece. Just walking in that a few hours, and your shoulders feel like that are down on your hips.
Sure, this will be a game, and all things have it´s limits in how far they are to be taken, but i always feel that i miss some sort of weight distribution and effect when armored.
That is false, please do some research about armour before saying this sort of thing. Armour, is specifically made to balance its weight around the whole body. Chainmail for example is mostly held on to you by a huge belt which focuses the weight in your waist area, making the weight more equally distributed. In battles, ppl need to be ready to fight for hours at end.
Well, that´s nice in text, but a chainmail is not being held in place by a belt for long if you do running or fighting. Neither do any piece of armor to be honest, due to it being a shell on your body, 9 times out of 10 not molded after you.
I claim this because i have worn armor, made armor pieces, used chainmail, made chainmail, am friends with fighters in both medieval style as Viking age, so i am not just pulling this out of thin air.
Anyone can claim anything. And yes, while belt won't hold on for weeks, even during battle it can last a long time, otherwise its made poorly. And well, if its made poorly that's a different story altogether
As for realism, i´d say that´s out the window pretty fast considering we are gonna run around in plate and chainmail at full speed.
Actually you can semi do that. Pathfinder actually has pretty realistic rules for that, as in you lose like... 5ft of movement in heavy armour I believe? That's pretty accurate.
Well, one could surely do some running, but armor is not light. A short sleeve chainmail as an example is between 11 and 14 KG ( 24 to 30 pounds ) and that´s just one piece. Just walking in that a few hours, and your shoulders feel like that are down on your hips.
Sure, this will be a game, and all things have it´s limits in how far they are to be taken, but i always feel that i miss some sort of weight distribution and effect when armored.
That is false, please do some research about armour before saying this sort of thing. Armour, is specifically made to balance its weight around the whole body. Chainmail for example is mostly held on to you by a huge belt which focuses the weight in your waist area, making the weight more equally distributed. In battles, ppl need to be ready to fight for hours at end.
Well, that´s nice in text, but a chainmail is not being held in place by a belt for long if you do running or fighting. Neither do any piece of armor to be honest, due to it being a shell on your body, 9 times out of 10 not molded after you.
I claim this because i have worn armor, made armor pieces, used chainmail, made chainmail, am friends with fighters in both medieval style as Viking age, so i am not just pulling this out of thin air.
Anyone can claim anything. And yes, while belt won't hold on for weeks, even during battle it can last a long time, otherwise its made poorly. And well, if its made poorly that's a different story altogether
I have no reason to lie bud. This topic is one very close to my own heart, and one i hope they get as right as possible. I saw the latest dev stream, and in the start they speak of a real importance for realism and how the devs appreciated the feedback to work from. Bacons team specifically are on point in this. A game can look amazing, and fall on any number of elements, just as it can look horrible, and gain on these same elements.
Weapon size, armor size, a decent body armor / weapon ratio....it all combines into something that will either look good, or feel very off.
I don´t think the devs are looking for realism in terms of actual historical measurements, but rather, something that makes a realistic amount of sense. We know it´s a game, and we know you do not run 500 meters full sprint in a plate armor and then fight for 10 min straight.... but we do still want said armor and weapons, and even fighting style to look " realistic ".
It´s a tricky collection of issues, but i think they are very much on the right track.
I haven't seen a lot of current in game weapons but the over-sized 'cartoony' stuff is (hopefully) not where they're headed. I also don't want things bland like ESO ended up being but some art styles are so over the top they break the immersion for me.
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AtamaMember, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
So tired of these realism arguments. as stated by @Tyranthraxus and his chiropractor "joke"... like we're fighting dragons and casting meteors. Your argument is that a weapon that is oversized isn't realistic and they will need to go to the doctor or will be to slow for enemies. Well I would argue that casting fireballs is unrealistic and that you would burn your hand off.
Anyway difference in opinion, I don't need them to be gargantuan, just normal to plus size.
The ridiculously-oversized weapon style for Asian MMOs does not fit the aesthetic of Ashes, and the creator of the game has declared it won't have them.
I haven't seen a lot of current in game weapons but the over-sized 'cartoony' stuff is (hopefully) not where they're headed. I also don't want things bland like ESO ended up being but some art styles are so over the top they break the immersion for me.
Um.... How *exactly* are you so certain that those 110lbs toons aren't *SO* into working out at the gym 5 days a week that they don't have the developed muscular systems to wield those 300lbs weapons?
How strong are AOC characters? Are we really limited by real life human strength?
I don't want my greatsword to be 2x the size of my character but I don't want it to be the size of your usual real life sword neither.
How strong are AOC characters? Are we really limited by real life human strength?
I don't want my greatsword to be 2x the size of my character but I don't want it to be the size of your usual real life sword neither.
This is a fair sentiment. As someone who usually makes a toon as tall as they can be, something slightly bigger than proportionate feels about right, for high-fantasy. It still shouldn't weigh an unreasonable amount. Here's an IRL greatsword:
According to the caption I found with it, this was a "zweihander" sword that belonged to a mideval pirate-lord named Grutte Pier (1480-1520). It'd be on the biggest end of weapons IRL, but pretty reasonable for fantasy settings. As someone who tried Kendo and Iai for a short period of time, yours truly can attest to the fact that swords don't weigh as much as you'd think before having one. Anime, however, really goes straight to overkill.
At the end of the day, a healthy in-between medium should really be the goal. AoC will feature a lot of magics and probably fantasy metals (i.e. lighter than titanium), but it'd really be immersion-killing to see a blade as thick as a character's torso being swung around.
this problem is solved if they make it so that each race has their weapons scaled to them.. for example humans should have the size of their weapons similar to that of irl weapons ..maybe a little bigger whereas races like dwarfs which are far FAR stronger and have much more stamina than the average human should have their weapons scaled up quite a bit more..
this problem is solved if they make it so that each race has their weapons scaled to them.. for example humans should have the size of their weapons similar to that of irl weapons ..maybe a little bigger whereas races like dwarfs which are far FAR stronger and have much more stamina than the average human should have their weapons scaled up quite a bit more..
In game dev, weapon size scaling is typically done on height - but perhaps along the lines of what you're expressing, maybe races should have a weapon "thickness" scale by race, as well.
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Actually you can semi do that. Pathfinder actually has pretty realistic rules for that, as in you lose like... 5ft of movement in heavy armour I believe? That's pretty accurate.
Eh.... as far as I know, a claymore was usually wieldable only by men because of strength differences so a lot of realism is instantly thrown out of the window (not saying women can't wield it, but it is biologically factual that men are stronger) so tbh, no point dwelling into realistic proportions....
Just gotta make sure Titan Grip is fighter main only if it ever comes 🤣
Well, one could surely do some running, but armor is not light. A short sleeve chainmail as an example is between 11 and 14 KG ( 24 to 30 pounds ) and that´s just one piece. Just walking in that a few hours, and your shoulders feel like that are down on your hips.
Sure, this will be a game, and all things have it´s limits in how far they are to be taken, but i always feel that i miss some sort of weight distribution and effect when armored.
That is false, please do some research about armour before saying this sort of thing. Armour, is specifically made to balance its weight around the whole body. Chainmail for example is mostly held on to you by a huge belt which focuses the weight in your waist area, making the weight more equally distributed. In battles, ppl need to be ready to fight for hours at end.
Well, that´s nice in text, but a chainmail is not being held in place by a belt for long if you do running or fighting. Neither do any piece of armor to be honest, due to it being a shell on your body, 9 times out of 10 not molded after you.
I claim this because i have worn armor, made armor pieces, used chainmail, made chainmail, am friends with fighters in both medieval style as Viking age, so i am not just pulling this out of thin air.
Anyone can claim anything. And yes, while belt won't hold on for weeks, even during battle it can last a long time, otherwise its made poorly. And well, if its made poorly that's a different story altogether
I have no reason to lie bud. This topic is one very close to my own heart, and one i hope they get as right as possible. I saw the latest dev stream, and in the start they speak of a real importance for realism and how the devs appreciated the feedback to work from. Bacons team specifically are on point in this. A game can look amazing, and fall on any number of elements, just as it can look horrible, and gain on these same elements.
Weapon size, armor size, a decent body armor / weapon ratio....it all combines into something that will either look good, or feel very off.
I don´t think the devs are looking for realism in terms of actual historical measurements, but rather, something that makes a realistic amount of sense. We know it´s a game, and we know you do not run 500 meters full sprint in a plate armor and then fight for 10 min straight.... but we do still want said armor and weapons, and even fighting style to look " realistic ".
It´s a tricky collection of issues, but i think they are very much on the right track.
The ridiculously-oversized weapon style for Asian MMOs does not fit the aesthetic of Ashes, and the creator of the game has declared it won't have them.
/thread
Um.... How *exactly* are you so certain that those 110lbs toons aren't *SO* into working out at the gym 5 days a week that they don't have the developed muscular systems to wield those 300lbs weapons?
GOSH!
How strong are AOC characters? Are we really limited by real life human strength?
I don't want my greatsword to be 2x the size of my character but I don't want it to be the size of your usual real life sword neither.
This is a fair sentiment. As someone who usually makes a toon as tall as they can be, something slightly bigger than proportionate feels about right, for high-fantasy. It still shouldn't weigh an unreasonable amount. Here's an IRL greatsword:
According to the caption I found with it, this was a "zweihander" sword that belonged to a mideval pirate-lord named Grutte Pier (1480-1520). It'd be on the biggest end of weapons IRL, but pretty reasonable for fantasy settings. As someone who tried Kendo and Iai for a short period of time, yours truly can attest to the fact that swords don't weigh as much as you'd think before having one. Anime, however, really goes straight to overkill.
At the end of the day, a healthy in-between medium should really be the goal. AoC will feature a lot of magics and probably fantasy metals (i.e. lighter than titanium), but it'd really be immersion-killing to see a blade as thick as a character's torso being swung around.
In game dev, weapon size scaling is typically done on height - but perhaps along the lines of what you're expressing, maybe races should have a weapon "thickness" scale by race, as well.