The same reason why others and myself don't want pve servers, is the same reason we don't want full pvp servers. It segregates the player bases, it isn't the pvx MMO that we were promised and are excited for, and it's a slippery slope. If we get pvp servers we may as well have pve servers also because we are already going to squander development time to make one small group happy, may as well take time to make the significantly larger group happy. I want neither of those types of servers, people should find a way to coexist with each other on a pvx server as Steven intended. If people wanted a full loot pvp game they should try Rust, Ark, or V Rising instead.
The same reason why others and myself don't want pve servers, is the same reason we don't want full pvp servers. It segregates the player bases, it isn't the pvx MMO that we were promised and are excited for, and it's a slippery slope. If we get pvp servers we may as well have pve servers also because we are already going to squander development time to make one small group happy, may as well take time to make the significantly larger group happy. I want neither of those types of servers, people should find a way to coexist with each other on a pvx server as Steven intended. If people wanted a full loot pvp game they should try Rust, Ark, or V Rising instead.
I agree, everyone should be together to experience how it is rather then splitting up the player base. Sure some people might leave, but atleast the maximum amount of people are introduced to it and im sure plenty will stay so long as it is a good game.
If Ashes can reach players that they cannot with current concept and if different servers would be benefical for the company, then I have nothing against different kinds of servers. If I can play on a server I like most, I do not mind if others can do the same.
I would play most likely on a PvX server anyway because I want some owPvP action, however, full loot can be sometimes a little bit too stressful.
Mortal Online 2 is a perfect example of how certain, self-described "Hardcore PvP" players, will destroy a game and burn it to the ground if only they can be king of the ashes.
As others have said. AoC aims to be a PvX game and spending precious time and resources on segmenting the base probably isn't the best approach.
I mean, this kind of suggestion feels like corruption has the effect to limit PvP on the game.
Real PvPer won't care that corruption exist, (by "real" i mean those who focus on PvP and only it)
There are way to limit the impact of corruption like a lesser cost stuff simply.
I never understood why people said that such system reduce PvP...
This idea is to solve a problem that doesn't exist in fact. PvPer complaining about corruption should ask themselve why corruption is a problem for their favourite activity in MMORPG
aaaand... i don't think it would be a good idea to have 2 kind of servers.
Also remember why corruption is defended by so much (and not only there)
Without risk for a totally free PvP, some dude can become the pinnacle of toxicity, going in killing frenzy because "lol it is fun, and this is real PvP lol" and just avoiding new players to simply ... play the game.
Sure "if only some servers not a problem for the game" but i feel that soon enough, due to this kind of behaviour, those server could be quite empty... And ashes needs decent populations for each server to have it work decently.
"they could gather to push some nodes" no, a full pvP will make people more spread to have some time to rest, gather, and travel to attack others...
No thanks. I dont want any special servers. I want PvX with the intended game design. No full PvP, no full PvE...just the one type so all of the systems work and have a healthy population of players from both sides.
whats with people wanting full loot, now im a pvper and from experience in every pvp game with full loot in it they dont work in the long run -.-
Full loot games be, worst 10% of players quit cause there constantly farming to requip only to die again then they quit the the next worst 10% quit for same reason and so till no one is left.
Game has punishing concepts enough - we don't need full loot anyway - greens drop materials on death, conflicted will drop some, and corrupt can lose a piece of gear on death so where the benefit in full loot? if you can lose gear via corruption
"Bravery only means something to those who are afraid of death."
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FuryBladeborneMember, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
@Mag7spy
Part of the world with consequences concept is that other players can kill if your behaving badly.
Also, there is no full loot from PvP. Dying only drops a percentage of gatherables and processed goods. Not finished good unless corrupted; and, even corrupted only have a percentage chance to drop a percentage of finished goods.
I think much of the commentary here is around resourcing or lack of interest; I'd add that full loot is often requested but isn't a good feature or incentive for PvP gameplay.
PvP gameplay needs to do everything it can to facilitate that - gameplay. People play the odds when you introduce risk/reward frameworks, like full-loot, and this deviates the experience away from engaging in PvP gameplay.
This can be seen in many games with loot-drop PvP; people either:
Won't fight when they don't have the odds in their favour, e.g. running away a lot or not engaging.
Won't risk "the good stuff" and wear crappy gear, lowering the reward but not the risk.
More likely to stack/guarantee odds & only fight when they have the advantage - numbers are the most common one. People will roll deep and fight those 10/20v5 style fights. Hard loss for the 5. Even if the 5 punch up, whoever holds the field gets the loot; and that's usually the zerg. Solos or small-mans must keep repositioning the fight to maintain an advantage, leaving any loot behind - or fight on the loot and die anyway.
Friendly looting - even in close groups it happens. The bigger the group the more likely it is for stuff to go "missing". This just causes drama.
Robs momentum from fights - if you lose, you must spend time regearing. When fights are going on, you want to get back into it, stuck in and cracking skulls. Instead you and any parties have to visit a bank first, make sure everyone has consumes etc, and by the time you're done, the fight is over. Usually, in full loot PvP games, a wipe = time for bed or a break.
Deincentivises casuals and new entrants. Full loot has a barrier to entry to participate properly; otherwise, people risk an immediate negative experience, losing their stuff, and becoming negative advocates.
I really liked the idea of full-loot PvP games, but having played most of the ones that come to market, the above issues usually result in a slow negative spiral. It's very much one of those things that seems great on paper but sadly, in practice, isn't.
I feel the same way about full loot PVP servers as I do the PvE servers
If someone else wants to play on it, go for it... I'm not interested though so it doesn't make any difference to me.
But if they do make other servers the should make both... I guess an RP server too...
Actually I might enjoy the PvX servers more if the people that want the full PvP servers left.
People out the really bringing threads back from the dead, this is a juxtaposed thread in relation to the PvE only servers and peoples bias for less pvp restrictions. Read my post if you want to see my view points on this matter as the post is a question and has nothing to do with my view point.
PvX is the way to go for the future, Pve content gets old, rinse and repeat doing dungeons and the mechs. Started to realize that with lost ark when you are doing the top current content out there. There is little reason to do other things that gives you less loot and gets into kind of a cycle you will eventually get bored of.
Though that could be partly of my own desire for more pvp and some people just have fun doing pve, but maybe that is more because of the social experience than running circles doing the same end game content over and over again. Having the PvE and a world with other players running around and the conflicts that can show up adds a lot more life into the game. As bad as BDO pVE was that is why i played the game for yeas. Theme park tracks with instanced dungeons honestly is content that is going to be dying over the years in its current form atleast.
whats with people wanting full loot, now im a pvper and from experience in every pvp game with full loot in it they dont work in the long run -.-
Full loot games be, worst 10% of players quit cause there constantly farming to requip only to die again then they quit the the next worst 10% quit for same reason and so till no one is left.
Full loot drop can be rough but it can really help drive the crafting economy (e.g. Eve Online) and strengthen PvE roles. To make it work, the gearing system/variety has to be well designed and there needs a security zoning system with npc cops.
Eve Online had high (1.0 to 0.5 rating), low (0.5 to 0.1), and null security (0.0 rating) solar systems. The rating would affect how fast the npc cops would respond. In low security, there were only static turrets at the travel points and no roaming cops. In high security, you still had the chance to assassinate somebody if you had high enough alpha damage (first shot).
I assume the OP means "without corruption and WITH full loot"?
I never understood the desire for full loot in an MMORPG. I myself am a hardcore DayZ PvPer but there's just something not right about grinding an item (or currency to buy it) for maybe weeks in an MMORPG, only to lose it because you lost in PvP (regardless if you got outplayed, outnumbered or simply lagged/DC'd). I know people want rewards, but full loot is just not the way. Portion of resources? Sure. But not gear. The possibility of losing precious items is not gonna make PvP more popular - the only thing lost should be time and maybe PvP "rank". Leave full loot to games that are designed around it, such as easy access to high tier items (Albion). I doubt Intrepid would bother creating and configuring a different kind of server for such purpose.
As for no corruption? You don't want griefing, but I do think the punishment should be toned down. I don't think it's fair that going on a rampage randomly causes you to be less effective (even if not against everyone, but that's even weirder). I understand that you're just calling for trouble, but getting a debuff because you killed some guys that were harassing you shouldn't punish you like that.
Long-term persistence games should always have anti-griefing measures in place to encourage the PvX ecosystem to flourish. As for grinding difficult-to-acquire items, you should be encouraged to develop a strategy to haul the high-value items to safety. Whether it'd be recruiting/hiring allies or having an escape route. Also, just not bringing expensive gear that you can't afford to replace helps (this is where a good gearing ecosystem needs to be designed).
Comments
I agree, everyone should be together to experience how it is rather then splitting up the player base. Sure some people might leave, but atleast the maximum amount of people are introduced to it and im sure plenty will stay so long as it is a good game.
I would play most likely on a PvX server anyway because I want some owPvP action, however, full loot can be sometimes a little bit too stressful.
As others have said. AoC aims to be a PvX game and spending precious time and resources on segmenting the base probably isn't the best approach.
Real PvPer won't care that corruption exist, (by "real" i mean those who focus on PvP and only it)
There are way to limit the impact of corruption like a lesser cost stuff simply.
I never understood why people said that such system reduce PvP...
This idea is to solve a problem that doesn't exist in fact. PvPer complaining about corruption should ask themselve why corruption is a problem for their favourite activity in MMORPG
aaaand... i don't think it would be a good idea to have 2 kind of servers.
Also remember why corruption is defended by so much (and not only there)
Without risk for a totally free PvP, some dude can become the pinnacle of toxicity, going in killing frenzy because "lol it is fun, and this is real PvP lol" and just avoiding new players to simply ... play the game.
Sure "if only some servers not a problem for the game" but i feel that soon enough, due to this kind of behaviour, those server could be quite empty... And ashes needs decent populations for each server to have it work decently.
"they could gather to push some nodes" no, a full pvP will make people more spread to have some time to rest, gather, and travel to attack others...
Full loot games be, worst 10% of players quit cause there constantly farming to requip only to die again then they quit the the next worst 10% quit for same reason and so till no one is left.
Solid thumbs down from me, sorry.
Part of the world with consequences concept is that other players can kill if your behaving badly.
Also, there is no full loot from PvP. Dying only drops a percentage of gatherables and processed goods. Not finished good unless corrupted; and, even corrupted only have a percentage chance to drop a percentage of finished goods.
PvP gameplay needs to do everything it can to facilitate that - gameplay. People play the odds when you introduce risk/reward frameworks, like full-loot, and this deviates the experience away from engaging in PvP gameplay.
This can be seen in many games with loot-drop PvP; people either:
I really liked the idea of full-loot PvP games, but having played most of the ones that come to market, the above issues usually result in a slow negative spiral. It's very much one of those things that seems great on paper but sadly, in practice, isn't.
If someone else wants to play on it, go for it... I'm not interested though so it doesn't make any difference to me.
But if they do make other servers the should make both... I guess an RP server too...
Actually I might enjoy the PvX servers more if the people that want the full PvP servers left.
Though that could be partly of my own desire for more pvp and some people just have fun doing pve, but maybe that is more because of the social experience than running circles doing the same end game content over and over again. Having the PvE and a world with other players running around and the conflicts that can show up adds a lot more life into the game. As bad as BDO pVE was that is why i played the game for yeas. Theme park tracks with instanced dungeons honestly is content that is going to be dying over the years in its current form atleast.
I love WPvP but i think full loot is too much. Respawning far away in a game without fast travel is already a big punishment.
Hide yo kids hide yo wife’s!
The purge exist already when you destroy a city haha
Full loot drop can be rough but it can really help drive the crafting economy (e.g. Eve Online) and strengthen PvE roles. To make it work, the gearing system/variety has to be well designed and there needs a security zoning system with npc cops.
Eve Online had high (1.0 to 0.5 rating), low (0.5 to 0.1), and null security (0.0 rating) solar systems. The rating would affect how fast the npc cops would respond. In low security, there were only static turrets at the travel points and no roaming cops. In high security, you still had the chance to assassinate somebody if you had high enough alpha damage (first shot).
I never understood the desire for full loot in an MMORPG. I myself am a hardcore DayZ PvPer but there's just something not right about grinding an item (or currency to buy it) for maybe weeks in an MMORPG, only to lose it because you lost in PvP (regardless if you got outplayed, outnumbered or simply lagged/DC'd). I know people want rewards, but full loot is just not the way. Portion of resources? Sure. But not gear. The possibility of losing precious items is not gonna make PvP more popular - the only thing lost should be time and maybe PvP "rank". Leave full loot to games that are designed around it, such as easy access to high tier items (Albion). I doubt Intrepid would bother creating and configuring a different kind of server for such purpose.
As for no corruption? You don't want griefing, but I do think the punishment should be toned down. I don't think it's fair that going on a rampage randomly causes you to be less effective (even if not against everyone, but that's even weirder). I understand that you're just calling for trouble, but getting a debuff because you killed some guys that were harassing you shouldn't punish you like that.
I will play AoC even with full loot (i don't mind and love PvP) but i know for sure that it'll make most of the players run away from the game.
Find an other way to keep death punishing but full loot is too much for the modern playerbase.