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PVP system thoughts

I'm curious if you guys can find any flaws in this system. Would this be a viable PVP system?
Set it to where players cannot attack/heal/buff another player that is more than 10 levels above or below you.
Add a hidden system that starts a timer when player 1 kills player 2.
During this active timer, player 1 CANNOT start a fight against player 2.
Player 2 CAN start a fight with player 1 during this timer, if they choose. (Some people want revenge!)
This will kill his timer and allow player 1 to defend himself.

The timer could completely keep you from starting combat against a player you recently killed or it could just corrupt you, making you lootable and marking your location on the map for bounty hunters.
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Comments

  • CROW3CROW3 Member, Alpha Two
    What are you trying to effect with this proposal?

    My preference is that anyone can attack anyone else, but there are consequences to that action, not barriers.
    AoC+Dwarf+750v3.png
  • AzrayaAzraya Member
    CROW3 wrote: »
    What are you trying to effect with this proposal?

    My preference is that anyone can attack anyone else, but there are consequences to that action, not barriers.

    I was trying to think of a PVP system that discourages griefing and bullying lower level players.

    I think what AoC is going to do will work just fine, tho. As long as corrupted players can be looted in some form.
  • CROW3CROW3 Member, Alpha Two
    Azraya wrote: »
    I was trying to think of a PVP system that discourages griefing and bullying lower level players.

    I think what AoC is going to do will work just fine, tho. As long as corrupted players can be looted in some form.

    I think we're all super curious to test the corruption system - and REALLY push it so it's calibrated correctly. It's going to be the linchpin of open-world player combat, and (maybe overstating it a bit) probably the success of the game (at least until it's balanced and corrected).

    You're not wrong to be thinking about other guardrails, I think we just need to dive in an feel how corruption balances owpvp.

    AoC+Dwarf+750v3.png
  • DygzDygz Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    Corrupted players drop gear as well as resources and raw materials.
  • LudulluLudullu Member, Alpha Two
    Azraya wrote: »
    I was trying to think of a PVP system that discourages griefing and bullying lower level players.
    Your suggestion wouldn't discourage, it would remove griefing of lowbies. It's good in that aspect, but it completely defeats the goal of "risk vs reward" in Ashes. You want to kill a lvl20 dude as a lvl50 dude, for whatever reason? You can in the current system, but in yours you'd have to level up a lowbie of your own.

    Now, the chances are, people will do that either way, but your system doesn't stop lowbie alts from griefing other lowbies so it's not like you're solving this problem.

    And as Dygz said, Corrupted players are pretty much loot piñatas, so that is not an issue either.
  • tautautautau Member, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    As @Dygz said. If the player who is 10 level lower does not hit back, the higher-level player goes red when the lower-level player dies. BINGO, the lower-level player has instant revenge because the higher-level player just screwed themselves.

    Keep in mind that the lower-level player is going to die whether he fights back or not. While he may drop a trivially larger number of gatherable materials since he is green rather than purple, eventually the corrupt killer will drop a lot more materials and likely some very valuable gear as well.

    Back in L2, I occasionally saw the gear dropped from the corrupt player returned to the lower-level player as compensation for their death.
  • CROW3CROW3 Member, Alpha Two
    < Crimson Loot Pinatas > is another good guild name, @NiKr
    AoC+Dwarf+750v3.png
  • AzrayaAzraya Member
    Otr wrote: »
    Azraya wrote: »
    CROW3 wrote: »
    What are you trying to effect with this proposal?

    My preference is that anyone can attack anyone else, but there are consequences to that action, not barriers.

    I was trying to think of a PVP system that discourages griefing and bullying lower level players.

    I think what AoC is going to do will work just fine, tho. As long as corrupted players can be looted in some form.

    There will be no material benefit to kill a low level player. And the leveling up does not take 12 months. Is relatively short.
    After that, or even before, each will find it's way of living in the world. PvE players will have their ways probably, by crafting, buying and selling things, staying away from danger.

    Stop ruining the fun of other players who want danger to exist. If you are terified of losing anything, you will not enjoy the game. Even losing your caravan is griefing.

    The difference between a player killing you and a group of players destroying and looting your caravan is like the difference between a solo assassin and organized crime. By griefing I understand anything which will trigger that grief emmotion:
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grief

    Why did players became so sensitive?

    I think you misunderstand. I was just tossing around ideas and curious what others thought. Thats not my personal opinion on whats good or what I would like for myself.
    If I had MY way, everyone would have the option to flag as pvp around level 10 but if you choose to flag PVP youre stuck that way. I'd also allow looting in some form every time you die in a pvp fight.
    I would also give a currency reward for winning pvp fights that you could use to buy special gear that is lootable if you die in pvp.
    I dont do PVE my dude. Only when forced to.
  • LudulluLudullu Member, Alpha Two
    Azraya wrote: »
    If I had MY way, everyone would have the option to flag as pvp around level 10 but if you choose to flag PVP youre stuck that way.
    That's already kinda the case because everyone can kill anyone from lvl1.
    Azraya wrote: »
    I'd also allow looting in some form every time you die in a pvp fight.
    Also the case. Green players drop a particular amount of gatherables and processed goods on death. And flagged people drop 50% of that amount on death.
    Azraya wrote: »
    I would also give a currency reward for winning pvp fights that you could use to buy special gear that is lootable if you die in pvp.
    That's the case in a way. There'll be pvp seasons of different kinds, with some kind of rewards, so killing someone will give you "currency" that gets you that reward.
  • DepravedDepraved Member, Alpha Two
    edited July 2022
    CROW3 wrote: »
    Azraya wrote: »
    I was trying to think of a PVP system that discourages griefing and bullying lower level players.

    I think what AoC is going to do will work just fine, tho. As long as corrupted players can be looted in some form.

    I think we're all super curious to test the corruption system - and REALLY push it so it's calibrated correctly. It's going to be the linchpin of open-world player combat, and (maybe overstating it a bit) probably the success of the game (at least until it's balanced and corrected).

    You're not wrong to be thinking about other guardrails, I think we just need to dive in an feel how corruption balances owpvp.
    tautau wrote: »
    As @Dygz said. If the player who is 10 level lower does not hit back, the higher-level player goes red when the lower-level player dies. BINGO, the lower-level player has instant revenge because the higher-level player just screwed themselves.

    Keep in mind that the lower-level player is going to die whether he fights back or not. While he may drop a trivially larger number of gatherable materials since he is green rather than purple, eventually the corrupt killer will drop a lot more materials and likely some very valuable gear as well.

    Back in L2, I occasionally saw the gear dropped from the corrupt player returned to the lower-level player as compensation for their death.


    the corruption system has been in mmorpg for over 20 years now, so we all know how it works and feels. what its not obvious to most people, and maybe the OP is trying to guard against, is players (usually scrubs who cant compete at high level because they suck) will make an alt, level it (doesnt even have to be to max level), equip it with easy to acquire storebought gear and go to low level areas and just murder everyone. lower level players have 0 chance of fighting back or running away. corruption doesnt matter for these people since they are using an alt with trash gear, so going red isnt really a risk and they dont really care about losing corruption score since its a character that doesnt matter.

    also, some players will have pk alts (or just equip their mains with trash gear) and go to a low level area, kill every1 and then level their alts (lets say they wanna level multiple character ot max) so low level players cant really fight back.

    also, some high level players will gear up with low level gear and try to fight players and provoke them to attack them back, then once they are purple, they will switch to their high level gear and 1 shot the purple player and farm their mats or clear the leveling spot for a friend. no chance of the low level player fighting back.

    yes u can always call friends etc etc to help but they arent always available, and u still gonna take the death penalty.

    im against barriers like OP wants, however, if a high level char kills u when ur white or purple, u shouldnt incur death penalty.

    the only benefits of no barriers ow pvp is bot hunting :D which i hope devs take care of those lol.

    hopefully we will only be allowed 1 char per server/account. this will mitigate the issue a bit, even though people with multiple accounts/pc will still have an advantage
  • AzrayaAzraya Member
    edited July 2022
    Depraved wrote: »
    CROW3 wrote: »
    Azraya wrote: »
    I was trying to think of a PVP system that discourages griefing and bullying lower level players.

    I think what AoC is going to do will work just fine, tho. As long as corrupted players can be looted in some form.

    I think we're all super curious to test the corruption system - and REALLY push it so it's calibrated correctly. It's going to be the linchpin of open-world player combat, and (maybe overstating it a bit) probably the success of the game (at least until it's balanced and corrected).

    You're not wrong to be thinking about other guardrails, I think we just need to dive in an feel how corruption balances owpvp.
    tautau wrote: »
    As @Dygz said. If the player who is 10 level lower does not hit back, the higher-level player goes red when the lower-level player dies. BINGO, the lower-level player has instant revenge because the higher-level player just screwed themselves.

    Keep in mind that the lower-level player is going to die whether he fights back or not. While he may drop a trivially larger number of gatherable materials since he is green rather than purple, eventually the corrupt killer will drop a lot more materials and likely some very valuable gear as well.

    Back in L2, I occasionally saw the gear dropped from the corrupt player returned to the lower-level player as compensation for their death.


    the corruption system has been in mmorpg for over 20 years now, so we all know how it works and feels. what its not obvious to most people, and maybe the OP is trying to guard against, is players (usually scrubs who cant compete at high level because they suck) will make an alt, level it (doesnt even have to be to max level), equip it with easy to acquire storebought gear and go to low level areas and just murder everyone. lower level players have 0 chance of fighting back or running away. corruption doesnt matter for these people since they are using an alt with trash gear, so going red isnt really a risk and they dont really care about losing corruption score since its a character that doesnt matter.

    also, some players will have pk alts (or just equip their mains with trash gear) and go to a low level area, kill every1 and then level their alts (lets say they wanna level multiple character ot max) so low level players cant really fight back.

    also, some high level players will gear up with low level gear and try to fight players and provoke them to attack them back, then once they are purple, they will switch to their high level gear and 1 shot the purple player and farm their mats or clear the leveling spot for a friend. no chance of the low level player fighting back.

    yes u can always call friends etc etc to help but they arent always available, and u still gonna take the death penalty.

    im against barriers like OP wants, however, if a high level char kills u when ur white or purple, u shouldnt incur death penalty.

    the only benefits of no barriers ow pvp is bot hunting :D which i hope devs take care of those lol.

    hopefully we will only be allowed 1 char per server/account. this will mitigate the issue a bit, even though people with multiple accounts/pc will still have an advantage

    I'm so confused as to why most people dont just put in a system that doesnt let someone level 60 start a fight with someone more than 10 levels below them. Just code it to where you can't start combat against someone not in your level range.
  • One if the best old games I played rewarded pvp kills with points you can change for the best armor of the game and it was very difficult to achieve. For a modern game usaually discriminates pvp items non usable for pve and I think its important to be able to use a pvp earned armor to show your status with other players not only in pvp mode, so I think it should be some kind of sistem that the pvp armor could be useful on pve too. Maybe a system where it is not the most efective armor in pve but its good enough and adds buff to party members so your friends and you get a benefit. Maybe another sistem is decrease the protection with the pvp armor but empower attack or a sinergy between the two sistems.

    The other aspect of pvp is how is set up. For me it's cool to be able to kill others anywhere except on city maybee. It should get a limitation on lvl to not get abused. And last I would implement a sistem of mutual acceptance of pvp wich there is not penalization for anybody, and if agreed put a reward. Despite this I wold allow pvp anyways but if attacker dies loses something meaningful and if kills the victim would be marked for others as a target and if killed should lose something important and compensate the killer.

  • LudulluLudullu Member, Alpha Two
    Azraya wrote: »
    I'm so confused as to why most people dont just put in a system that doesnt let someone level 60 start a fight with someone more than 10 levels below them. Just code it to where you can't start combat against someone not in your level range.
    As Depraved (and I before this) has already said, this would not solve the issue of lowbies dying. The only thing you would influence is the number of alts on the server. Those who really want to PK others will always find a way to do so, and, more often than not, do so in the least detrimental way for them.
  • Mag7spyMag7spy Member, Alpha Two
    Azraya wrote: »
    Depraved wrote: »
    CROW3 wrote: »
    Azraya wrote: »
    I was trying to think of a PVP system that discourages griefing and bullying lower level players.

    I think what AoC is going to do will work just fine, tho. As long as corrupted players can be looted in some form.

    I think we're all super curious to test the corruption system - and REALLY push it so it's calibrated correctly. It's going to be the linchpin of open-world player combat, and (maybe overstating it a bit) probably the success of the game (at least until it's balanced and corrected).

    You're not wrong to be thinking about other guardrails, I think we just need to dive in an feel how corruption balances owpvp.
    tautau wrote: »
    As @Dygz said. If the player who is 10 level lower does not hit back, the higher-level player goes red when the lower-level player dies. BINGO, the lower-level player has instant revenge because the higher-level player just screwed themselves.

    Keep in mind that the lower-level player is going to die whether he fights back or not. While he may drop a trivially larger number of gatherable materials since he is green rather than purple, eventually the corrupt killer will drop a lot more materials and likely some very valuable gear as well.

    Back in L2, I occasionally saw the gear dropped from the corrupt player returned to the lower-level player as compensation for their death.


    the corruption system has been in mmorpg for over 20 years now, so we all know how it works and feels. what its not obvious to most people, and maybe the OP is trying to guard against, is players (usually scrubs who cant compete at high level because they suck) will make an alt, level it (doesnt even have to be to max level), equip it with easy to acquire storebought gear and go to low level areas and just murder everyone. lower level players have 0 chance of fighting back or running away. corruption doesnt matter for these people since they are using an alt with trash gear, so going red isnt really a risk and they dont really care about losing corruption score since its a character that doesnt matter.

    also, some players will have pk alts (or just equip their mains with trash gear) and go to a low level area, kill every1 and then level their alts (lets say they wanna level multiple character ot max) so low level players cant really fight back.

    also, some high level players will gear up with low level gear and try to fight players and provoke them to attack them back, then once they are purple, they will switch to their high level gear and 1 shot the purple player and farm their mats or clear the leveling spot for a friend. no chance of the low level player fighting back.

    yes u can always call friends etc etc to help but they arent always available, and u still gonna take the death penalty.

    im against barriers like OP wants, however, if a high level char kills u when ur white or purple, u shouldnt incur death penalty.

    the only benefits of no barriers ow pvp is bot hunting :D which i hope devs take care of those lol.

    hopefully we will only be allowed 1 char per server/account. this will mitigate the issue a bit, even though people with multiple accounts/pc will still have an advantage

    I'm so confused as to why most people dont just put in a system that doesnt let someone level 60 start a fight with someone more than 10 levels below them. Just code it to where you can't start combat against someone not in your level range.

    Because if I see a lowbie in another guild I'm at war with I will 100% kill them without mercy lmao. And if their guild wants to protect them, they can show up. There are consequences with war after all.

    Am i going to kill a random lvl 10 lowbie talking crap, most likely not corruption isn't worth it for that. They pretty much lose nothing and i can lose a whole lot. Am i going to kill multiple lowbies, that sounds crazy.
  • AzrayaAzraya Member
    edited July 2022
    NiKr wrote: »
    Azraya wrote: »
    I'm so confused as to why most people dont just put in a system that doesnt let someone level 60 start a fight with someone more than 10 levels below them. Just code it to where you can't start combat against someone not in your level range.
    As Depraved (and I before this) has already said, this would not solve the issue of lowbies dying. The only thing you would influence is the number of alts on the server. Those who really want to PK others will always find a way to do so, and, more often than not, do so in the least detrimental way for them.

    It would solve the issue of someone low level dying to someone high level.
    If the game literally won't let you fight because you're out of each others level range...
    If people make alts and keep them low level so they can kill low levels? Thats a different beast. I don't see anything wrong with it.
  • DepravedDepraved Member, Alpha Two
    Azraya wrote: »
    NiKr wrote: »
    Azraya wrote: »
    I'm so confused as to why most people dont just put in a system that doesnt let someone level 60 start a fight with someone more than 10 levels below them. Just code it to where you can't start combat against someone not in your level range.
    As Depraved (and I before this) has already said, this would not solve the issue of lowbies dying. The only thing you would influence is the number of alts on the server. Those who really want to PK others will always find a way to do so, and, more often than not, do so in the least detrimental way for them.

    It would solve the issue of someone low level dying to someone high level.
    If the game literally won't let you fight because you're out of each others level range...
    If people make alts and keep them low level so they can kill low levels? Thats a different beast. I don't see anything wrong with it.

    well, lets say you are level 10 and you are in my farming spot, so i bring my friend who is level 30-60 (or maybe my dual boxed character), they hide behind a rock, i hit u, u hit me back, now ur purple, my friend comes out and 1 shots u. this is pretty common so it doesnt solve the issue.

    if the level 30-60 cant hit u unless u hit him, then scenario 2 happens.

    im level 30-60 cuz i play all day but my friend who only plays 2 hours a day is level 20. i wanna help him level, maybe im pulling mobs for him, maybe i even kill them since it would still be faster exp per hour. now you and 3 of ur friends come to our farming spot, you are all level 20-25, a 1v1 vs my friend would be fair, but its 4v1. now i cant defend my friend because i have the stupid level restriction for pvp.

    best thing to do is not put any barriers, maybe only if ur red u cant attack whites who are 10 levels below, unless they hit u first, but thats it
  • LudulluLudullu Member, Alpha Two
    Azraya wrote: »
    It would solve the issue of someone low level dying to someone high level.
    That issue is already solved by corruption. A single kill of a lowbie would throw you deep into corruption, at which point you'll have to die multiple times, you'll go back hours if not days of XP grinding, you might destroy whatever gear you have on your through decay (depending on a few variables), you'll lose some gear due to it just dropping - and even if you manage to not die as a deep Red, you'll have your stats slashed in pvp so you won't be able to keep killing for much longer.

    Will a few lowbies on the server die at the hand of a high lvl player? Probably. Will a waaaaay bigger amount of them die at the hands of an alt of that high lvl player? Most definitely. The first one is not much of a problem and the second one is the intended gameplay (even if it does make those lowbies feel bad).

    Now I could see account-wide corruption being a thing. Maybe if you go past some PK count value (which would be account-wide too), your future corruption begins to overflow onto your alts. This way you'd slash the number of PKs across the whole game. Any player that just PKs here and there can do the counter decreasing quest and be on their merry way, but anyone who wants to have a PKing alt would get fucked. Obviously this would have to be properly tested, but I think it might work.

    @Azherae what does your designer brain think of this additional solution for hardcore PKers? Or do you consider PKing alts a non-issue and deem this suggestion to be pointless?
  • AzheraeAzherae Member, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    This is pointless relative to what Ashes wants.

    (I try not to judge these systems outside of what the Devs or Head Designer says they want).

    I would absolutely accept it myself, if Corruption on one character could affect your alts, but this would be unfair to people who make Alts specifically to 'roleplay as Corrupted'.

    The question is if Intrepid is condoning that type of behaviour as a Character Choice.

    If it is NOT something they want people to be doing generally ('just having Character A suffer the consequences and not Character B') then there is a case for making bleedover. But from the sounds of things Steven has said many times, he still really believes that the social stigma and other things will be enough.

    (note that I cannot bring myself to agree with this because of my own experiences, but they're just anecdotal).
    ♪ One Gummy Fish, two Gummy Fish, Red Gummy Fish, Blue Gummy Fish
  • AzrayaAzraya Member
    NiKr wrote: »
    Azraya wrote: »
    It would solve the issue of someone low level dying to someone high level.
    That issue is already solved by corruption. A single kill of a lowbie would throw you deep into corruption, at which point you'll have to die multiple times, you'll go back hours if not days of XP grinding, you might destroy whatever gear you have on your through decay (depending on a few variables), you'll lose some gear due to it just dropping - and even if you manage to not die as a deep Red, you'll have your stats slashed in pvp so you won't be able to keep killing for much longer.

    Will a few lowbies on the server die at the hand of a high lvl player? Probably. Will a waaaaay bigger amount of them die at the hands of an alt of that high lvl player? Most definitely. The first one is not much of a problem and the second one is the intended gameplay (even if it does make those lowbies feel bad).

    Now I could see account-wide corruption being a thing. Maybe if you go past some PK count value (which would be account-wide too), your future corruption begins to overflow onto your alts. This way you'd slash the number of PKs across the whole game. Any player that just PKs here and there can do the counter decreasing quest and be on their merry way, but anyone who wants to have a PKing alt would get fucked. Obviously this would have to be properly tested, but I think it might work.

    @Azherae what does your designer brain think of this additional solution for hardcore PKers? Or do you consider PKing alts a non-issue and deem this suggestion to be pointless?

    Corruption could very well eliminate griefing. I was just saying I also think coding the system to simply not allow you to attack anyone outside of a pre-determined level range would also work. If the goal is to eliminate higher levels killing lower levels. There should never be a solution to people making an alt and keeping him low level for the sole purpose of PVP against other low levels.
  • LudulluLudullu Member, Alpha Two
    Azraya wrote: »
    Corruption could very well eliminate griefing. I was just saying I also think coding the system to simply not allow you to attack anyone outside of a pre-determined level range would also work. If the goal is to eliminate higher levels killing lower levels. There should never be a solution to people making an alt and keeping him low level for the sole purpose of PVP against other low levels.
    So you want to prevent people from being free to attack anyone they want (with consequence) under the pretense of protecting lowbies, yet you're against direct in-system prevention of the same lowbies dying even more? That's a weird take.
  • CROW3CROW3 Member, Alpha Two
    Azraya wrote: »
    Corruption could very well eliminate griefing.

    I think corruption will curb the widespread mass-murder of Greens, but it won't eliminate griefing. There will still be reasonable (I'm going to get those mats!) and unreasonable (I don't like your face!) green-icides occuring.

    AoC+Dwarf+750v3.png
  • AzrayaAzraya Member
    edited July 2022
    Its not what I want. I want everyone to choose at character creation if youre flagged for PVP and make it permanent... that aint gonna happen, tho. All this really boils down to is just a discussion about pvp and how to do it without being a poopypants to other players. I do think its fine to make a character and stop leveling him at 20 for the sole purpose of killing other level 20s. I do not think its cool to be level 48 and smashing on level 20s because you can. Not sure how any of thats weird but we are all different, so.
  • CROW3CROW3 Member, Alpha Two
    Azraya wrote: »
    I do not think its cool to be level 48 and smashing on level 20s because you can. Not sure how any of thats weird but we are all different, so.

    That's ok. :)

    AoC+Dwarf+750v3.png
  • AzheraeAzherae Member, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    It keeps coming up so I might as well since I'm in that mood today.

    Note, @NiKr this is mostly for you and as I always always say about it, it does not work in Ashes (which is why I have no problem sharing it because I don't think Intrepid would ever use it and honestly I also don't care if they do).

    Imo the correct way to do this is.

    1. Combatant attacks Non-Combatant and does damage, a Gauge fills up relative to those two players only. The value of that Gauge applies a percentage reduction to any further damage the Non-Combatant takes, increasing as you get lower, but does NOT affect DoT in exactly the same way.
    2. If Non-Combatant changes to Combatant, the Gauge is zeroed and the two can battle 'fairly'. This allows a player to treat an initial hit as a challenge not a panic moment. If Non-Combatant agrees to flag up and fight for the position, they can heal first. If Combatant is not okay with them healing first, they keep attacking.
    3. Every time Non-Combatant heals themselves or is healed, the Gauge is reduced. You can run, stall, or negotiate, but that's it.
    4. Combatant can continue all the way to killing Non-Combatant at which point the Gauge converts into Corruption. If anything ELSE kills the Non-Combatant, same deal. The Gauge increase is pretty exponential as health gets lower, mind you, so it's a LOT of potential Corruption to kill even one person. Multiply even higher for level gap situations.
    5. After a certain period of TIME, the Gauge also becomes Corruption whether you kill the target or not. So just 'raw griefing' will eventually corrupt you, but pinging people probably doesn't give much.

    There's a bunch of other stuff related to this Gauge and the Corruption in the system I have that makes it harder to steal bosses from people without a fairISH fight.

    None of this is what Ashes wants, but when you notice that I kinda 'dismiss' other options, it's because I've ran some scenarios and I only put effort into thinking about stuff that has an effect that I personally consider better than the above.

    This does not fit Ashes. There's no reason for anyone to care about it, but similarly, I don't care about Ashes' system and plan to just ignore it, other than the obvious unavoidable consequence of 'dying while Red' that I will just consider part of the game.

    ♪ One Gummy Fish, two Gummy Fish, Red Gummy Fish, Blue Gummy Fish
  • CROW3CROW3 Member, Alpha Two
    I like the concept of the gauge for attacking that can stack corruption when a green is killed later. The guage can decay over time, but you're right that would help curb the harassment by repeatedly attacking and not killing greens. I would just take away the damage reduction aspect to the Green.
    AoC+Dwarf+750v3.png
  • AzrayaAzraya Member
    edited July 2022
    CROW3 wrote: »
    I like the concept of the gauge for attacking that can stack corruption when a green is killed later. The guage can decay over time, but you're right that would help curb the harassment by repeatedly attacking and not killing greens. I would just take away the damage reduction aspect to the Green.
    Wherever he dies..... there shall he be buried!


  • CROW3CROW3 Member, Alpha Two
    That damage reduction only helps the one attacking by staving off their punishment for being a murder-hobo. If they're taking the risk, I don't want to minimize the risk.
    AoC+Dwarf+750v3.png
  • AzheraeAzherae Member, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    CROW3 wrote: »
    I like the concept of the gauge for attacking that can stack corruption when a green is killed later. The guage can decay over time, but you're right that would help curb the harassment by repeatedly attacking and not killing greens. I would just take away the damage reduction aspect to the Green.

    Right, because that would fit with Ashes' goals better.

    The game I am 'designing this for' is not intended to have the same type of player friction that Ashes does. It's meant to be more cooperative. So the idea would be that most people would think of fighting others as a natural part of the game, and the Gauge is there as a way of resetting the perspective.

    "You hit me, but I'm not disadvantaged terribly, if you want a fair fight, gimme a minute."
    "Nah I took you by surprise on purpose, if you just want to buff up before we even start, I'm not interested."
    "Oh well then you're just gonna have to finish killing me but I'm not fighting you if I can't even buff first, if you want the spot, go Red for it."

    (I'm still working out which Rogue skills give less Gauge on first attack in this system)

    Without the damage reduction, it still works fine for Ashes MAYBE but I've never thought about it, and don't plan to. They will do their own thing.
    ♪ One Gummy Fish, two Gummy Fish, Red Gummy Fish, Blue Gummy Fish
  • AzheraeAzherae Member, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    CROW3 wrote: »
    That damage reduction only helps the one attacking by staving off their punishment for being a murder-hobo. If they're taking the risk, I don't want to minimize the risk.

    Oh no, note again...

    If you 'bring a guy down to 1%' and have been annoying them so long that your Dv Gauge is up to like 1200, it's just going to turn into Corruption points ANYWAY in about... 10 minutes. It's in your best interest if you are willing to go red to JUST use a rotation meant to kill your opponent as quickly as possible with minimal Gauge gain.

    The better you are at PvP, the LESS risky it is supposed to be to do this, RELATIVE to 'the sort of person who is just trying to win by getting advantage but isn't as skilled'.

    Make Assassins Great Again.
    ♪ One Gummy Fish, two Gummy Fish, Red Gummy Fish, Blue Gummy Fish
  • CROW3CROW3 Member, Alpha Two
    Azherae wrote: »
    If you 'bring a guy down to 1%' and have been annoying them so long that your Dv Gauge is up to like 1200, it's just going to turn into Corruption points ANYWAY in about... 10 minutes. It's in your best interest if you are willing to go red to JUST use a rotation meant to kill your opponent as quickly as possible with minimal Gauge gain.

    Ooooh. Interesting. So, does that gauge act kind of like a fuse in the sense that it's going to blow up that player with corruption whether they kill another player or not?

    AoC+Dwarf+750v3.png
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