I prefer the last version as well. I loved the dragon-like features.
This looks like a sick Asian about to throw up...
The older model just needed a few adjustments in the nose and bigger fangs.
Ill be honest the old version looked more akin to an ogre than it did to an orc. This new version or at least this art reflects both the japanese and orc influence equally and feels good to me. I highly doubt these orcs are suddenly going to be shorter or slimmer either, just more detailed in the facial features to give them more human-like features. Plus you cannot argue that the new tusks do not look better, the older versions looked like tiny toothpicks.
The faces look great. But what about the size of the characters ? Have they also changed it compared to the first concept art ? From the presented new arts, it looks like they are a only bit larger than humans. It seems to me that one race should deviate in size from the others. An excellent example are Giants from Black Desert!
Mongolian Swamp Orc Example: Growing Moss on the skin denotes the swamp life, slightly disfigured for a more lord of the rings orc feel, prominent Mongolian features are masculine and beefy while still providing an Asian aesthetic. This example is missing tusks it should have as a key orc feature I think (get your artists to add them and repost it would be cool).
I always played as an Orc since I started DND when I was like 10. Since I'm Asian, this is like, perfect for me. I actually cheered for it when i saw it lmao.
This brings up a major question to me though. For the Human race, will it consist of features regarding all different types of real people? Meaning, the real races. Since there's also a split between the Humans, the Kaelar and the Vaelune, will the Vaelune be a significantly deviated version of a real-life Human, or is it going to represent just a different existing race?
I saw the wiki says Vaelune will be of a middle-eastern influence. Kaelar are of a European influence.
Even though it's not for me personally, I think it would be weird to be forced to play Orcs to play a character that represented my particular race. I think in terms of just physical features, Kaelars should consist of all real life races. The cultural aspect is different and cool to be associated with different in-game races.
Disagree, there should be diffrence between kaelar and vaelune regarding skin color just like pyrai are darker and has antlers compared to Empyrean. Stop trying to make a certain race into a cesspit of several races. What would be the diffrence between kaelar and vaelune then?? trying to find logical reason for your request here. Or is the problem that kaelar are white and based on europe? If you are Asian and wants "representation" so bad just make a kaelar with slanted eyes and darker features im sure it will be available no big deal
My first reaction was "thats not an orc". Its a good model, i like the cheekbones, ears and nose. But the mouth, forehead and eyes are a bit off, on both models. I like the change to fit better with the concept art, that's very good. I think the eyes need more anger and brute to them, maybe some wrinkles or bags under neath, perhaps not too long on the outsides, keep the inner part Asian. The female is too good looking. I think large foreheads and a long jaw could be better. The hair and beards look good, want to see more beard types. I like green skin.
Ork not savage, den ork not ork. Orkz do da krumpin, needz tah be bigger ork fer moar krumpin. Howz you be da boss if youz not da biggest ork? Dis new ork ganna git krumped.
I 100% prefer this new direction.
When I look at these I see Ren'kai. The last models were cool but they didn't feel like the Ren'kai.
I can understand people who love beefy characters are disappointed with the facial structure but I've not doubt that players will be able to create more chunky muscular faces in character creator.
This model feels like it will offer more flexibility in character creator.
I look forward to seeing the full body and scale patterns! I hope this race is still the tallest ^^ I can't wait to see all the races in game next to each other!
I liked the previous state of the race far better, they looked more realistic, robust and dangerous. Now they look harmless and cartoonish. I will stay away from that race now because of it. That's only my opinion of course.
I have to be honest I did like the older version better. I think it felt more aggressive and brutish which is what I would expect. That version with a more light or sage green would be best. The green is a bit too colorful.
As far as the Asian vibe, I think that should be an option in the character creator. I would hope that's not a locked look for the general race. In all honesty I believe that kind of trait (for all actual races around the world) should be optional for all game races, but subtle and not a key feature. This way you can allow all game races to subtly include actual human race like traits. The player can create themselves in their own image! (kinda).
Much more distinct and unique than the standard Orc look of the OG concepts. Really liking the Asian influences. If I had to nit pick I'd say they look too anime and cartoon-soft in comparison to other concepts, but they are just concepts. Could just be the green. I'm getting some serious bad She-Hulk CG vibes with all the smooth
Love the concepts compared to the old Ren'kai. Facial structure looks a lot better in terms of proportion. I can see this going alongside the cultural influences much more than the original models.
What do you like about the current art direction of this race?
- The entirety of the nose, mouth, and chin area looks very good and has a nice identity.
- I really like the wrinkles and roughness on the male model’s skin, especially around his crows feet and on his cheeks. I feel it gives him a bit of that ruggedness people want to see.
Is there anything you dislike about the art direction for this race, and why?
- The strong, high cheekbones with thin cheeks are giving me a bit too much of an elf vibe. I think they should be filled out a bit more and potentially lowered a bit.
- The jawline might be a bit too soft. I think a little closer to the squared off jawline of the previous model might help the aggressive look desired.
- The female brow is very straight and soft compared to the angular, aggressive look from the male model.
- I feel there may be too much ogre influence in the ears, especially the female ear being a bit pig-like. I think the elongated cylindrical shape for the ear opening comes off as looking passive instead of powerful.
- The almond shaped eyes are very small and may not look good from far away, especially on the male.
I think the team has made great steps in making the orcs represent their values: Honor. Power. Tranquility. I think the new concept art fits better with the art shown for Ren'Kai buildings, and armour sets as these have a distinct Asian atheistic to them.
However like others have mentioned part of the Ren'Kai identity is their sheer size and power, When a Ren'Kai becomes enraged though, there aren't many men or beasts who can live and tell the tale and They are considerably taller than their human counterparts.
So while i think this was a great step in the right direction, I believe having slightly more muscular facial features in both the male and female models would go a long way in portraying their terrifying power. (Please don't have the whole "female orc is just a green elf") Also make the Ren'Kai have large, muscular proportions, like the previous model, however with slightly more athleticism to match the facial features. I truly believe you have an amazing orc in the making, it's just hitting the sweet spot between the two versions you have shown us.
Lastly, as a side note. I think the new concept art does a brilliant job with real life inclusion, and while this shouldn't be the main focus of the races, it is a nice touch that will most likely attract a wider player base.
Their more asian look makes sense since orcs are supposed to be based on the mongol-tatar demon-like people who stormed Europe causing massive carnage and destruction.
But I also hope there is an option for the more hulk/shrek like orcs like in WoW.
I preferred the original overall. Though aspects of each could be had.
Original: The large size was great, and with the tattoos / skin it made them almost look scaly and gave me the impression of dragon lineage. True that prolly should be more Tulnar but I liked it and thought it was a fresh interpretation on Orc. The original design seems like a large Samoan to me. Ear styling seems more bat like which again lended to Dragon motif. The jaw was big, kinda too pudgy, which went more to a traditional pig motif for Orc. The teeth are way to small, they're little baby teeth on a mountain of a character, totally out of place.
New:
The new design seems more Asian influenced, which make sense considering the architecture. Ear styling seems more elfish, which pays homage to LOTR that Orcs are tortured elves I believe? Though I'd prefer getting away from the lore that Orcs are tortured Elves and prefer them being their own race. I do like the more angular features on the new design, compared to the pudgy features originally, my ideal would be a more sheer rock face (Dwarves would more round and boulder faced.) I like the larger canines on the new design.
Overall:
On both I like the stretched area between the mouth and nose (weird but unique). When you have the tendon lines stretching it again makes me thing of bat wings / dragon. The scrunched nose seems appropriate for traditional pig orcs (again weird but unique). The limbs seem too uniform in diameter, but I guess its good, makes each limb look more like a single trunk instead of articulating joints, might be better outside T-Pose and in their resting posture. The forehead on the new one is better to give a more angular resting scowl almost but I like the round of the outer brow to take it away from being too elven angular. Original's strong rounded cheekbones are good. Tightening up the jawbone a bit, or making it more of a sheer jawbone instead of a soft rounded jawline. (Hard to compare against new with the full beard).
Take away notes:
I like how the current designs can express full range of emotions based on their default pose here. But orcs need to be savage and almost feral. Bigger canines to the point where you see all there teeth sharper and pressing against their lips causing them to portrude some (not to the extreme of where someone wears those cheap plastic Dracula teeth). More tendons with the muscle (neck, upper lip, ear down neck, jaw down neck), continue to exercise a bat wing to flex the dragon motif more, like their power is constantly stretching them and morphing to contain more. Continue with stubby nose. Continue with tiny eyes, almost like their skull is a helmet and their eyes are safely tucked back.
I actually like how they don't have a typical orcish 'thug-like' look and I noted on the stream there were other colour options and it wasn't green only which I thought was a good choice.
I really love these characters! Was not at all interested in playing this race until I saw the concept art! I am seeing comments here similar to the situation with the Pyrians and players wanting a traditional character.
However, I really hope you stick with your guns on this one because I would love to play this race!
Orcs are traditionally U G L Y you ain't got no alibi. These are pretty Orcs and it entices me to play one opposed to never playing one but I can't really say if that's a good thing or not.
IMO looks too much like its based on real-world influences. It looks good, but I preferred the more wow-esque orc X dragon look that they had before.
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AtamaMember, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
Based solely on culture I liked the Ren'Kai. But this newest iteration is your best one yet from a visual perspective.
I know that you have real world ethnic inspirations for your game races and cultures (which I love). That seemed to be missing in the past for this race, but I see it now. Both in the facial features and the hair style/accessories/tattoos.
I was initially concerned with the green color, because I still wanted the option for a red-skinned orc, but then you mentioned that it was still an option.
Unlike your previous versions, I have no feedback for things you could improve. I can't find a fault in this. Maybe I would seeing the full-body model (or concept art) but for now, all I can say is well-done. I have been planning on using a Ren'Kai as my main, and you've made this player extremely happy.
I enjoy the softer features on the females while the males are more brutish. They look complementary to each other- similar in design, but still unique from one another.
This is so far my favorite race design, even though I do not usually play Orc-like races. This has to do because I do not like big and brutish characters, so being able to play a softer female Ren'Kai would work for me.
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T ElfMember, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
Comments
This looks like a sick Asian about to throw up...
The older model just needed a few adjustments in the nose and bigger fangs.
Disagree, there should be diffrence between kaelar and vaelune regarding skin color just like pyrai are darker and has antlers compared to Empyrean. Stop trying to make a certain race into a cesspit of several races. What would be the diffrence between kaelar and vaelune then?? trying to find logical reason for your request here. Or is the problem that kaelar are white and based on europe? If you are Asian and wants "representation" so bad just make a kaelar with slanted eyes and darker features im sure it will be available no big deal
When I look at these I see Ren'kai. The last models were cool but they didn't feel like the Ren'kai.
I can understand people who love beefy characters are disappointed with the facial structure but I've not doubt that players will be able to create more chunky muscular faces in character creator.
This model feels like it will offer more flexibility in character creator.
I look forward to seeing the full body and scale patterns! I hope this race is still the tallest ^^ I can't wait to see all the races in game next to each other!
As far as the Asian vibe, I think that should be an option in the character creator. I would hope that's not a locked look for the general race. In all honesty I believe that kind of trait (for all actual races around the world) should be optional for all game races, but subtle and not a key feature. This way you can allow all game races to subtly include actual human race like traits. The player can create themselves in their own image! (kinda).
2 cents
- The entirety of the nose, mouth, and chin area looks very good and has a nice identity.
- I really like the wrinkles and roughness on the male model’s skin, especially around his crows feet and on his cheeks. I feel it gives him a bit of that ruggedness people want to see.
Is there anything you dislike about the art direction for this race, and why?
- The strong, high cheekbones with thin cheeks are giving me a bit too much of an elf vibe. I think they should be filled out a bit more and potentially lowered a bit.
- The jawline might be a bit too soft. I think a little closer to the squared off jawline of the previous model might help the aggressive look desired.
- The female brow is very straight and soft compared to the angular, aggressive look from the male model.
- I feel there may be too much ogre influence in the ears, especially the female ear being a bit pig-like. I think the elongated cylindrical shape for the ear opening comes off as looking passive instead of powerful.
- The almond shaped eyes are very small and may not look good from far away, especially on the male.
However like others have mentioned part of the Ren'Kai identity is their sheer size and power, When a Ren'Kai becomes enraged though, there aren't many men or beasts who can live and tell the tale and They are considerably taller than their human counterparts.
So while i think this was a great step in the right direction, I believe having slightly more muscular facial features in both the male and female models would go a long way in portraying their terrifying power. (Please don't have the whole "female orc is just a green elf") Also make the Ren'Kai have large, muscular proportions, like the previous model, however with slightly more athleticism to match the facial features. I truly believe you have an amazing orc in the making, it's just hitting the sweet spot between the two versions you have shown us.
Lastly, as a side note. I think the new concept art does a brilliant job with real life inclusion, and while this shouldn't be the main focus of the races, it is a nice touch that will most likely attract a wider player base.
But I also hope there is an option for the more hulk/shrek like orcs like in WoW.
Original:
The large size was great, and with the tattoos / skin it made them almost look scaly and gave me the impression of dragon lineage. True that prolly should be more Tulnar but I liked it and thought it was a fresh interpretation on Orc. The original design seems like a large Samoan to me. Ear styling seems more bat like which again lended to Dragon motif. The jaw was big, kinda too pudgy, which went more to a traditional pig motif for Orc. The teeth are way to small, they're little baby teeth on a mountain of a character, totally out of place.
New:
The new design seems more Asian influenced, which make sense considering the architecture. Ear styling seems more elfish, which pays homage to LOTR that Orcs are tortured elves I believe? Though I'd prefer getting away from the lore that Orcs are tortured Elves and prefer them being their own race. I do like the more angular features on the new design, compared to the pudgy features originally, my ideal would be a more sheer rock face (Dwarves would more round and boulder faced.) I like the larger canines on the new design.
Overall:
On both I like the stretched area between the mouth and nose (weird but unique). When you have the tendon lines stretching it again makes me thing of bat wings / dragon. The scrunched nose seems appropriate for traditional pig orcs (again weird but unique). The limbs seem too uniform in diameter, but I guess its good, makes each limb look more like a single trunk instead of articulating joints, might be better outside T-Pose and in their resting posture. The forehead on the new one is better to give a more angular resting scowl almost but I like the round of the outer brow to take it away from being too elven angular. Original's strong rounded cheekbones are good. Tightening up the jawbone a bit, or making it more of a sheer jawbone instead of a soft rounded jawline. (Hard to compare against new with the full beard).
Take away notes:
I like how the current designs can express full range of emotions based on their default pose here. But orcs need to be savage and almost feral. Bigger canines to the point where you see all there teeth sharper and pressing against their lips causing them to portrude some (not to the extreme of where someone wears those cheap plastic Dracula teeth). More tendons with the muscle (neck, upper lip, ear down neck, jaw down neck), continue to exercise a bat wing to flex the dragon motif more, like their power is constantly stretching them and morphing to contain more. Continue with stubby nose. Continue with tiny eyes, almost like their skull is a helmet and their eyes are safely tucked back.
However, I really hope you stick with your guns on this one because I would love to play this race!
I know that you have real world ethnic inspirations for your game races and cultures (which I love). That seemed to be missing in the past for this race, but I see it now. Both in the facial features and the hair style/accessories/tattoos.
I was initially concerned with the green color, because I still wanted the option for a red-skinned orc, but then you mentioned that it was still an option.
Unlike your previous versions, I have no feedback for things you could improve. I can't find a fault in this. Maybe I would seeing the full-body model (or concept art) but for now, all I can say is well-done. I have been planning on using a Ren'Kai as my main, and you've made this player extremely happy.
This is so far my favorite race design, even though I do not usually play Orc-like races. This has to do because I do not like big and brutish characters, so being able to play a softer female Ren'Kai would work for me.
Formerly T-Elf