To some the effects are so distracting that they take away from the focus of the showcase. Or the fans of the game see them as not good at all, which is an obvious issue for a fan who may be trying to convince their friends to play at some point.
Others may like them or want even more intensity. Since they can’t use strobe lights on their cars in real life, they need an escape. Because, after all annoying other players is “winning”.
Understand testing with the intensity set to 100% (or even higher), but not for a showcase which I hope would be set at an average level. Looks like there’s a gap between the developers and many would be customers on what “average” intensity means.
On several showcases they’ve had different POVs. Perhaps they could do a showcase where each view shows the different levels of effects/intensity so that everyone can decide which one they like. May not be the focus of a showcase, but it should reduce the distraction effect and yet another month where we are talking about it.
have you guys considered that maybe that feature isn't added yet because its not important right now?
steven also explained how many of these things are done later on, so they don't have to do double the work, or undo previous work when they change global lightning etc...
The main thing is that we can continue to understand what skills we are being beaten with . Otherwise, everything will be turned off now and it will be unclear what is worth dodging and what is not.
The main thing is that we can continue to understand what skills we are being beaten with . Otherwise, everything will be turned off now and it will be unclear what is worth dodging and what is not.
But that's the thing, there is sooo much, that you cannot even see the enemies character model anymore.
We need simply - Options.
We need to be able to got into the Game Settings - and adjust from "SUPER-Low" or so - to "SUPER-High" or so, how detailed and present we want to have all those Particle- and other Effects.
Problem solved.
And i won't believe anyone who is going to tell me, that Unreal Engine 5.4. or higher can not do this.
✓ Occasional Roleplayer
✓ Kinda starting to look for a Guild right now. (German)
We need simply - Options.
We need to be able to got into the Game Settings - and adjust from "SUPER-Low" or so - to "SUPER-High" or so, how detailed and present we want to have all those Particle- and other Effects.
Problem solved.
And i won't believe anyone who is going to tell me, that Unreal Engine 5.4. or higher can not do this.
The problem with too much variance in options in a pvp game is that one setup will become advantageous over the others. If it's a huge advantage then it pretty much becomes mandatory for everyone in a competitive setting.
A far too extreme example, but shows the point, is Ark. Having the settings cranked to the bottom is required or you are toast. Better that we settle on a happy medium for everyone and let all of us adjust the usuals, like bloom, ambient etc. That way everyone is on the same playing field.
For me WoW and SWTOR are happy mediums, or maybe a bit flashier. FFXIV is way too much, Darksouls is way too boring (and slow) for a magic focused MMO.
Darksouls animations perfectly fit it's slow, heavy combat style. I don't want that combat style in an MMO.
I think perhaps FromSoftware should make a Darksouls MMO. Everyone seems desperate for it. Although I don't know if people will actually have as much fun with it as they think they will. Your average MMO player definitely wouldn't.
We need simply - Options.
We need to be able to got into the Game Settings - and adjust from "SUPER-Low" or so - to "SUPER-High" or so, how detailed and present we want to have all those Particle- and other Effects.
Problem solved.
And i won't believe anyone who is going to tell me, that Unreal Engine 5.4. or higher can not do this.
There should be a good and working standard for a pvp game. It's just not good if everything is full of flashes and explosions. You can't read the battle or the enemy group at all.
We need simply - Options.
We need to be able to got into the Game Settings - and adjust from "SUPER-Low" or so - to "SUPER-High" or so, how detailed and present we want to have all those Particle- and other Effects.
Problem solved.
And i won't believe anyone who is going to tell me, that Unreal Engine 5.4. or higher can not do this.
There should be a good and working standard for a pvp game. It's just not good if everything is full of flashes and explosions. You can't read the battle or the enemy group at all.
You're really pushing your narrative here. The AoEs and laser-like abilities need some more refined colours, and *perhaps* some of the screen flashing effects (meteor) need to be tweaked (though personally, I think they're fine if they are rare enough), but overall the visual feedback is very clearly contrasted and easily legible. It's better than 95% of MMOs where effects either blend with the environment or you can't tell abilities apart because they're all the same vague, unremarkable colour flashes that look like basic attacks.
Sounds like you've just never played games with more than 8 players on each side, tbh.
When the battlefield is large, there will be times when a lot of important high-tier abilities will be happening at the same time. That doesn't mean the visual clarity is insufficient, it just means there's a lot happening; and different players are going to have to pay attention to different aspects of it, so all of them are going to have to be visible, and you'll have to mentally filter out the parts relevant to you. (That usually happens automatically after a while, anyway.)
The only one who can validate you for all the posts you didn't write is you.
We need simply - Options.
We need to be able to got into the Game Settings - and adjust from "SUPER-Low" or so - to "SUPER-High" or so, how detailed and present we want to have all those Particle- and other Effects.
Problem solved.
And i won't believe anyone who is going to tell me, that Unreal Engine 5.4. or higher can not do this.
There should be a good and working standard for a pvp game. It's just not good if everything is full of flashes and explosions. You can't read the battle or the enemy group at all.
You're really pushing your narrative here. The AoEs and laser-like abilities need some more refined colours, and *perhaps* some of the screen flashing effects (meteor) need to be tweaked (though personally, I think they're fine if they are rare enough), but overall the visual feedback is very clearly contrasted and easily legible. It's better than 95% of MMOs where effects either blend with the environment or you can't tell abilities apart because they're all the same vague, unremarkable colour flashes that look like basic attacks.
Sounds like you've just never played games with more than 8 players on each side, tbh.
When the battlefield is large, there will be times when a lot of important high-tier abilities will be happening at the same time. That doesn't mean the visual clarity is insufficient, it just means there's a lot happening; and different players are going to have to pay attention to different aspects of it, so all of them are going to have to be visible, and you'll have to mentally filter out the parts relevant to you. (That usually happens automatically after a while, anyway.)
Bs, I played warhammer online, daoc and gw1 and two and in all games it's better. What is your reference? Some Asia game?
Even assuming you're right and it's better 95% of the mmo (not true), than it's still bad. There are no reasons for fighters having some glowing flashy cleave effect on every hit, there is no reason that a ranger is firering green neon bolts. They're not magicians
There should be a good and working standard for a pvp game. It's just not good if everything is full of flashes and explosions. You can't read the battle or the enemy group at all.
I get it. ^.^;"
✓ Occasional Roleplayer
✓ Kinda starting to look for a Guild right now. (German)
We need simply - Options.
We need to be able to got into the Game Settings - and adjust from "SUPER-Low" or so - to "SUPER-High" or so, how detailed and present we want to have all those Particle- and other Effects.
Problem solved.
And i won't believe anyone who is going to tell me, that Unreal Engine 5.4. or higher can not do this.
There should be a good and working standard for a pvp game. It's just not good if everything is full of flashes and explosions. You can't read the battle or the enemy group at all.
You're really pushing your narrative here. The AoEs and laser-like abilities need some more refined colours, and *perhaps* some of the screen flashing effects (meteor) need to be tweaked (though personally, I think they're fine if they are rare enough), but overall the visual feedback is very clearly contrasted and easily legible. It's better than 95% of MMOs where effects either blend with the environment or you can't tell abilities apart because they're all the same vague, unremarkable colour flashes that look like basic attacks.
Sounds like you've just never played games with more than 8 players on each side, tbh.
When the battlefield is large, there will be times when a lot of important high-tier abilities will be happening at the same time. That doesn't mean the visual clarity is insufficient, it just means there's a lot happening; and different players are going to have to pay attention to different aspects of it, so all of them are going to have to be visible, and you'll have to mentally filter out the parts relevant to you. (That usually happens automatically after a while, anyway.)
Bs, I played warhammer online, daoc and gw1 and two and in all games it's better. What is your reference? Some Asia game?
Even assuming you're right and it's better 95% of the mmo (not true), than it's still bad. There are no reasons for fighters having some glowing flashy cleave effect on every hit, there is no reason that a ranger is firering green neon bolts. They're not magicians
I mostly played Regnum Online - a DAOC clone; western RvR MMO - when it comes to 3d, and got very quickly bored of most modern titles. The only aspect Rengum had an upper hand on DAOC in was graphics updates. Game looked pretty crisp for a niche title of its time. And still it wasn't much more restrained in graphical fidelity of ability effects than Ashes in its current state. [ 1 | 2 for context from a random channel with high-res gameplay footage.]
Mentioning DAOC here as an example of a standard that made you reject bright effect animations is...certainly a choice.
The cleaves aren't that big of a deal in games with character collision, and weapon effect trails are super easy to turn off in settings in the vast majority of MMOs that have them; that'll be the first thing that will be customisable.
As for archers, your argument is just weak. The game isn't meant to look realistic, it's meant to look engaging, fun, enticing to join the battle, and most importantly animations are supposed to communicate clearly when big important cooldowns have been used, and the current AoE animations do that, and their bright colours make sure the abilities are easy to identify.
Again, I do hope they will refine the colour palette to repalace some brighter colours with more muted/pastel and darker tones, but other than that, the skill design is very clean compared to many modern games where everything blends with the environment, and if you turn down the resolution the slightest bit, everything is just pixels, because the overly detailed shapes, high opacity, and mud colours fail to compute into anything identifiable.
The only one who can validate you for all the posts you didn't write is you.
+1 for the ability effects being too much. I know they’ve mentioned this is very much WIP so this post is just another one in that camp.
IMO the level of flashiness should be at about 50% of where it currently is, if not slightly less. Also do not want a slider on this at all. As others have said, this creates a settings meta where it’s too optimal to run the game with very low settings. They should find a good balance that the majority of players are happy with and run it.
After watching the Node War video my thoughts stands
Partical effects are to large and colorful. This does need to be scaled. It's way to busy and worst of all, it will be hard to tell what class is doing what in the battle.
So in your opinion this is fine and my argument "weak"?
I was pondering not sending the screenshot in order to avoid this type of a response, but I figured I had said so many other things to reply to, and trusted that no one could be disingenuous enough to get distracted from all the other points by a single screenshot.
Yet you somehow managed not only to ignore all the other points, but also misconstrue the one made by the DaoC example. And the superficial observation you chose to respond with was *also* already addressed in my comment.
So idk, guess if you don't want to make any effort to have a good faith discussion, I'll stop replying to you.
The only one who can validate you for all the posts you didn't write is you.
So in your opinion this is fine and my argument "weak"?
I was pondering not sending the screenshot in order to avoid this type of a response, but I figured I had said so many other things to reply to, and trusted that no one could be disingenuous enough to get distracted from all the other points by a single screenshot.
Yet you somehow managed not only to ignore all the other points, but also misconstrue the one made by the DaoC example. And the superficial observation you chose to respond with was *also* already addressed in my comment.
So idk, guess if you don't want to make any effort to have a good faith discussion, I'll stop replying to you.
But it proves that you have no argument in that. In no game stuff like that should be possible.
0
SolunaMember, Leader of Men, Kickstarter, Alpha One
Heyho :-) I already shared my thoughts to that in the "[Feedback Request] Alpha Two Node Wars Preview Shown in May Livestream" thread but imo the effects are indeed too much! In the feedback thread I shared some images of New World and imo they did a great job with balancing the amount of glow and particles. The glow and the particles that are emitted by the spells are pretty similar to the effects of torches and other VFX in the environment.
In Ashes however this isn´t the case imo. The environment looks rather desaturated and a bit more realistic but the effects, such as the red wall or the green particles that are shown in the image above look rather cartoonish.
And even if these particles are just visible for a part of a second how it is with the green ranger ability... Now think of a node war with maybe hundreds of players fighting against each other. You´d probably only see huge blobs of colors here and there! One spell in red, the other one in green, etc...
Imo the glow AND the amount of particles have to be reduced a lot. And another thing that´s on my mind here:
Ashes uses UE5 and with the environment AND the characters shown in the last livestreams they seem to aim for a more realistic approach (remember that stream where they recreated Asmongold? ). So the spells should look like they actually belong in a game like that but in their current state they remind me of games like Blue Protocol that have a completely different style.
Sure, that´s a bit exaggerated but if you compare these spells with the ones in New World for example (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YBm8Xip3mCI) you hopefully get what I mean
The colors and the color intensity of the spells rather match the spells in Blue Protocol and not the ones in New World imo. And I know that Ashes doesn´t want to be New World but as I said: The spell effects should at least match the environment and the effects of fireplaces, torches, etc.
So in your opinion this is fine and my argument "weak"?
I was pondering not sending the screenshot in order to avoid this type of a response, but I figured I had said so many other things to reply to, and trusted that no one could be disingenuous enough to get distracted from all the other points by a single screenshot.
Yet you somehow managed not only to ignore all the other points, but also misconstrue the one made by the DaoC example. And the superficial observation you chose to respond with was *also* already addressed in my comment.
So idk, guess if you don't want to make any effort to have a good faith discussion, I'll stop replying to you.
But it proves that you have no argument in that. In no game stuff like that should be possible.
bruh, the green effect lasts for 0.2 seconds. it disappears faster than blinking lol. you just chose to pause the video at that moment and screenshot it. that's why I asked how long does it last xD it literally doesn't interrupt the fight.
Hey buddy, this is not what most content will look like. This is specifically a BIG TEAM PVP scenario with 40+ on both sides. Yeah there will be lots of shit flying around, assuming each person is doing something once or more per second.
Its entirely possible that these spell effects are tuned for the Node War and Siege scenarios specifically. Without high contrast color coding in a setting like this, it's impossible to see what circle on the ground is damage from an enemy vs damage from an ally.
So in your opinion this is fine and my argument "weak"?
I was pondering not sending the screenshot in order to avoid this type of a response, but I figured I had said so many other things to reply to, and trusted that no one could be disingenuous enough to get distracted from all the other points by a single screenshot.
Yet you somehow managed not only to ignore all the other points, but also misconstrue the one made by the DaoC example. And the superficial observation you chose to respond with was *also* already addressed in my comment.
So idk, guess if you don't want to make any effort to have a good faith discussion, I'll stop replying to you.
But it proves that you have no argument in that. In no game stuff like that should be possible.
bruh, the green effect lasts for 0.2 seconds. it disappears faster than blinking lol. you just chose to pause the video at that moment and screenshot it. that's why I asked how long does it last xD it literally doesn't interrupt the fight.
Of course, this is just one example. It's always the case that players are covered, the big flashy aoes don't do any damage and you have no idea who casts which spell. This is not a good visualization for a pvp game. This is a very simple truth.
So in your opinion this is fine and my argument "weak"?
I was pondering not sending the screenshot in order to avoid this type of a response, but I figured I had said so many other things to reply to, and trusted that no one could be disingenuous enough to get distracted from all the other points by a single screenshot.
Yet you somehow managed not only to ignore all the other points, but also misconstrue the one made by the DaoC example. And the superficial observation you chose to respond with was *also* already addressed in my comment.
So idk, guess if you don't want to make any effort to have a good faith discussion, I'll stop replying to you.
But it proves that you have no argument in that. In no game stuff like that should be possible.
bruh, the green effect lasts for 0.2 seconds. it disappears faster than blinking lol. you just chose to pause the video at that moment and screenshot it. that's why I asked how long does it last xD it literally doesn't interrupt the fight.
Of course, this is just one example. It's always the case that players are covered, the big flashy aoes don't do any damage and you have no idea who casts which spell. This is not a good visualization for a pvp game. This is a very simple truth.
1- pretty sure these effects arent final, as steven said so like 10 times lol
2- even if they were, once you know the archetype skills and all that, its not that hard to know whats going on during a fight.
I agree with @Hinotori . I like all these whistleblowers too. on the other hand, there are a lot of people who don't like tis kind of thing. reputable developers can just add sliders to the settings menu to reduce the effects of both themselves and other players. although I'm sure the effects in general will be tweaked in the future
I don't get why this is worth arguing about. Steven said in the latest update. This kind of feedback does not help much as this area of the game will be getting adjusted later. It's coming. How we don't know. Maybe toggles and sliders. Maybe just toned down all together. We will see it scalled in A2 and that will be the time to give heavy feedback.
I’d like to see blood coming off enemies during melee attacks not mortal kombat level but just a cool touch
One of the fighter abilities causes a very exaggerated bleeding effect (I think it was called rupture?). It makes Mortal Kombat look realistic by comparison.
Comments
have you guys considered that maybe that feature isn't added yet because its not important right now?
steven also explained how many of these things are done later on, so they don't have to do double the work, or undo previous work when they change global lightning etc...
But that's the thing, there is sooo much, that you cannot even see the enemies character model anymore.
O . P . T . I . O . N . S
We need simply - Options.
We need to be able to got into the Game Settings - and adjust from "SUPER-Low" or so - to "SUPER-High" or so, how detailed and present we want to have all those Particle- and other Effects.
Problem solved.
And i won't believe anyone who is going to tell me, that Unreal Engine 5.4. or higher can not do this.
✓ Occasional Roleplayer
✓ Kinda starting to look for a Guild right now. (German)
The problem with too much variance in options in a pvp game is that one setup will become advantageous over the others. If it's a huge advantage then it pretty much becomes mandatory for everyone in a competitive setting.
A far too extreme example, but shows the point, is Ark. Having the settings cranked to the bottom is required or you are toast. Better that we settle on a happy medium for everyone and let all of us adjust the usuals, like bloom, ambient etc. That way everyone is on the same playing field.
For me WoW and SWTOR are happy mediums, or maybe a bit flashier. FFXIV is way too much, Darksouls is way too boring (and slow) for a magic focused MMO.
Darksouls animations perfectly fit it's slow, heavy combat style. I don't want that combat style in an MMO.
I think perhaps FromSoftware should make a Darksouls MMO. Everyone seems desperate for it. Although I don't know if people will actually have as much fun with it as they think they will. Your average MMO player definitely wouldn't.
There should be a good and working standard for a pvp game. It's just not good if everything is full of flashes and explosions. You can't read the battle or the enemy group at all.
Sounds like you've just never played games with more than 8 players on each side, tbh.
When the battlefield is large, there will be times when a lot of important high-tier abilities will be happening at the same time. That doesn't mean the visual clarity is insufficient, it just means there's a lot happening; and different players are going to have to pay attention to different aspects of it, so all of them are going to have to be visible, and you'll have to mentally filter out the parts relevant to you. (That usually happens automatically after a while, anyway.)
Bs, I played warhammer online, daoc and gw1 and two and in all games it's better. What is your reference? Some Asia game?
Even assuming you're right and it's better 95% of the mmo (not true), than it's still bad. There are no reasons for fighters having some glowing flashy cleave effect on every hit, there is no reason that a ranger is firering green neon bolts. They're not magicians
I get it. ^.^;"
✓ Occasional Roleplayer
✓ Kinda starting to look for a Guild right now. (German)
I mostly played Regnum Online - a DAOC clone; western RvR MMO - when it comes to 3d, and got very quickly bored of most modern titles. The only aspect Rengum had an upper hand on DAOC in was graphics updates. Game looked pretty crisp for a niche title of its time. And still it wasn't much more restrained in graphical fidelity of ability effects than Ashes in its current state. [ 1 | 2 for context from a random channel with high-res gameplay footage.]
Mentioning DAOC here as an example of a standard that made you reject bright effect animations is...certainly a choice.
Bonus unicorn puke
The cleaves aren't that big of a deal in games with character collision, and weapon effect trails are super easy to turn off in settings in the vast majority of MMOs that have them; that'll be the first thing that will be customisable.
As for archers, your argument is just weak. The game isn't meant to look realistic, it's meant to look engaging, fun, enticing to join the battle, and most importantly animations are supposed to communicate clearly when big important cooldowns have been used, and the current AoE animations do that, and their bright colours make sure the abilities are easy to identify.
Again, I do hope they will refine the colour palette to repalace some brighter colours with more muted/pastel and darker tones, but other than that, the skill design is very clean compared to many modern games where everything blends with the environment, and if you turn down the resolution the slightest bit, everything is just pixels, because the overly detailed shapes, high opacity, and mud colours fail to compute into anything identifiable.
So in your opinion this is fine and my argument "weak"?
IMO the level of flashiness should be at about 50% of where it currently is, if not slightly less. Also do not want a slider on this at all. As others have said, this creates a settings meta where it’s too optimal to run the game with very low settings. They should find a good balance that the majority of players are happy with and run it.
just curious, for how long did that last on the screen?
Partical effects are to large and colorful. This does need to be scaled. It's way to busy and worst of all, it will be hard to tell what class is doing what in the battle.
I was pondering not sending the screenshot in order to avoid this type of a response, but I figured I had said so many other things to reply to, and trusted that no one could be disingenuous enough to get distracted from all the other points by a single screenshot.
Yet you somehow managed not only to ignore all the other points, but also misconstrue the one made by the DaoC example. And the superficial observation you chose to respond with was *also* already addressed in my comment.
So idk, guess if you don't want to make any effort to have a good faith discussion, I'll stop replying to you.
But it proves that you have no argument in that. In no game stuff like that should be possible.
In Ashes however this isn´t the case imo. The environment looks rather desaturated and a bit more realistic but the effects, such as the red wall or the green particles that are shown in the image above look rather cartoonish.
And even if these particles are just visible for a part of a second how it is with the green ranger ability... Now think of a node war with maybe hundreds of players fighting against each other. You´d probably only see huge blobs of colors here and there! One spell in red, the other one in green, etc...
Imo the glow AND the amount of particles have to be reduced a lot. And another thing that´s on my mind here:
Ashes uses UE5 and with the environment AND the characters shown in the last livestreams they seem to aim for a more realistic approach (remember that stream where they recreated Asmongold?
Sure, that´s a bit exaggerated but if you compare these spells with the ones in New World for example (
The colors and the color intensity of the spells rather match the spells in Blue Protocol and not the ones in New World imo. And I know that Ashes doesn´t want to be New World but as I said: The spell effects should at least match the environment and the effects of fireplaces, torches, etc.
bruh, the green effect lasts for 0.2 seconds. it disappears faster than blinking lol. you just chose to pause the video at that moment and screenshot it. that's why I asked how long does it last xD it literally doesn't interrupt the fight.
Its entirely possible that these spell effects are tuned for the Node War and Siege scenarios specifically. Without high contrast color coding in a setting like this, it's impossible to see what circle on the ground is damage from an enemy vs damage from an ally.
Of course, this is just one example. It's always the case that players are covered, the big flashy aoes don't do any damage and you have no idea who casts which spell. This is not a good visualization for a pvp game. This is a very simple truth.
1- pretty sure these effects arent final, as steven said so like 10 times lol
2- even if they were, once you know the archetype skills and all that, its not that hard to know whats going on during a fight.
No ty
One of the fighter abilities causes a very exaggerated bleeding effect (I think it was called rupture?). It makes Mortal Kombat look realistic by comparison.