The RP Community Must Unite or Die

Galvyr

I’m an Roleplayer, but I don’t just stay in a chateau all day and play pretend. I view RP as another layer that enhances the already existing systems than acting as an entirely separate entity. I have been a progression raider and an avid PvPer while also engaging in comprehensive RP. However, not every RPer views RP the same way. Some don’t like PvP at all and hate it with a fiery passion, especially world PvP. My fear is this: a Hardcore PvP guild emerges on the RP preferred server and proceeds to destroy every node occupied by RPers and actively ambushes them at events and other activities. These insular and creative communities will be annihilated on the battlefield. The only way I can see them competing with a guild like that is by forming a defensive coalition and overwhelming them with numbers. If every RP guild acts in one bloc, it would be much harder for their play style to be consistently inconvenienced by people who only care about PvP. It’s something I think about often as an RPer, but what do you think? Do you think my concerns are unfounded? Do you think there is an easier solution? Let me know!

Arya_Yeshe

I do love PvP RP with alts, specially for extorting, ganking, stealing, etc, nothing good. Even tough, to me, it is fine being out of character within the guild, when in contact with outsiders it should always be within RP.

The scenario you described of one RP PvP guild destroying all others is not a concern to me it is in fact my wet dream. I can even daydream about being a mayor of such a node, my first email would be to the other node's mayor:


"Hello fellow mayor,

I am writing to you to let you know that you can avoid having your node hazed to the ground by sending me 10 milion gold coins, otherwise I will declare war on your node.

Best Regards
Arya Yeshe, Mayor of the Riverlands"

Azherae

I think the easiest solution is to make loss just as interesting from the RP perspective as success.

Unfortunately this falls under the same problem as most other such games. Player characters don't die, and informationally, people who don't RP too will 'play by OOC rules', and they're entitled to do that.

It's one of those things that I think the Ashes RP community will need to adapt to, but I hope Intrepid manages to make it viable enough to 'accept loss', and that the PvP guild of the type you are thinking about are just good at being RP villains too.

People like Arya above are fine, and I sometimes do the villain thing too, but PvP RP is very different than the 'lol killed you while you were talking to people for an event' crowd.

I always thought the issue wasn't with whether or not you could manage to form a group to defeat those people, though, it's that they never really have to stop, and are often both erratic and almost overbearing.

Ludullu

RPers will have to RP proper knights who defend their brethren from the scourge of the lands. And if you wanna be able to defend against a strong force (and there'll definitely be at least on dick guild that decides to fuck up RPers) - you gotta plan way ahead and prepare accordingly.

Galvyr

For some reason this posted twice. I do not know why.

Arya_Yeshe wrote: »

I do love PvP RP with alts, specially for extorting, ganking, stealing, etc, nothing good. Even tough, to me, it is fine being out of character within the guild, when in contact with outsiders it should always be within RP.

The scenario you described of one RP PvP guild destroying all others is not a concern to me it is in fact my wet dream. I can even daydream about being a mayor of such a node, my first email would be to the other node's mayor:


"Hello fellow mayor,

I am writing to you to let you know that you can avoid having your node hazed to the ground by sending me 10 milion gold coins, otherwise I will declare war on your node.

Best Regards
Arya Yeshe, Mayor of the Riverlands"

Napoleon once said he would be an Atilla to Venice. You’ll kind of be an Atilla to that Riverland Node.

MybroViajero

My RP will be killing Tulnars so cool

Dygz

Azherae wrote: »

I think the easiest solution is to make loss just as interesting from the RP perspective as success.

Unfortunately this falls under the same problem as most other such games. Player characters don't die, and informationally, people who don't RP too will 'play by OOC rules', and they're entitled to do that.

It's one of those things that I think the Ashes RP community will need to adapt to, but I hope Intrepid manages to make it viable enough to 'accept loss', and that the PvP guild of the type you are thinking about are just good at being RP villains too.

People like Arya above are fine, and I sometimes do the villain thing too, but PvP RP is very different than the 'lol killed you while you were talking to people for an event' crowd.

I always thought the issue wasn't with whether or not you could manage to form a group to defeat those people, though, it's that they never really have to stop, and are often both erratic and almost overbearing.

I think everyone will be RPing - at least to some small degree.
Just asking, "What happened to that City that used to be over there?" or "Who owns the Castle right now?" are RP questions.
The Ashes world is dynamic, rather than static. And, that makes it easier for us to talk about what's happening in the virtual world rather than only talking about what's happening in the real world.

Azherae

Dygz wrote: »

Azherae wrote: »

I think the easiest solution is to make loss just as interesting from the RP perspective as success.

Unfortunately this falls under the same problem as most other such games. Player characters don't die, and informationally, people who don't RP too will 'play by OOC rules', and they're entitled to do that.

It's one of those things that I think the Ashes RP community will need to adapt to, but I hope Intrepid manages to make it viable enough to 'accept loss', and that the PvP guild of the type you are thinking about are just good at being RP villains too.

People like Arya above are fine, and I sometimes do the villain thing too, but PvP RP is very different than the 'lol killed you while you were talking to people for an event' crowd.

I always thought the issue wasn't with whether or not you could manage to form a group to defeat those people, though, it's that they never really have to stop, and are often both erratic and almost overbearing.

I think everyone will be RPing - at least to some small degree.
Just asking, "What happened to that City that used to be over there?" or "Who owns the Castle right now?" are RP questions.
The Ashes world is dynamic, rather than static. And, that makes it easier for us to talk about what's happening in the virtual world rather than only talking about what's happening in the real world.

In my experience, EVEN with this relatively loose definition (which I do agree with mostly) this isn't what actually happens when dealing with the sort of person whose goal is to just destroy and shut down other player's gameplay, because 'explicitly causing the person stress' is the point.

Like, the sort of people that will refuse to interact or answer questions because they know that you (as an 'RPer') are trying to put their actions in context, explicitly because they believe it will lessen your experience (whether or not they are correct).

I can definitely see that being the case in Ashes too, unfortunately, but we'll see if Steven changes the thing I expect to cause it.

Dygz

I suppose that might work on hardcore RPers. Sure.

Arya_Yeshe

It's easier when the guild itself is thematic, personal experience.

RazThemun

A PVP guild is not going to care if you RP or not. They will kill you all the same. There is discussion in the discord of RP guilds trying to all choose the same server. But this won't stop a random PVP guild who does not RP from jumping in. Welcome to MMORPG. This is and will be a pvp game... and people are there to win. "whatever their view on winning is, may differ from the RP Community"

Dygz

Galvyr wrote: »

My fear is this: a Hardcore PvP guild emerges on the RP preferred server and proceeds to destroy every node occupied by RPers and actively ambushes them at events and other activities. These insular and creative communities will be annihilated on the battlefield. The only way I can see them competing with a guild like that is by forming a defensive coalition and overwhelming them with numbers. If every RP guild acts in one bloc, it would be much harder for their play style to be consistently inconvenienced by people who only care about PvP. It’s something I think about often as an RPer, but what do you think? Do you think my concerns are unfounded? Do you think there is an easier solution? Let me know!

I think the concerns you posited above are unfounded.
I don't understand why you think one hardcore PvP guild would be able to destroy every Node occupied by RPers - as if RPers inherently suck at PvP compared to hardcore PvPers.
Also, yes, you should expect most of the RPers on the designated RP server to rally and form Alliances that would overwhelm the PvP guild during Node Sieges.

If you don't want your RP events ambushed by PvPers - hold the events in Houses, Guild Halls and Freeholds - where permissions are in effect such that it's invite-only.

Arya_Yeshe

Well, the most efficient alliance/guild in history among all games, is in fact a RP PvP alliance!

That's right, it is the CODE alliance from EVE Online, the RP is so intense that even blogs were created just to register stories about it and how the RP should be conducted.

They have +340,000 pvp kills over the years, which is quite a lot for a handful of RPers!
Dealing 28 times more destruction than receiving (based on ISK, the ingame currency)... this is extremely high for a 100% loss game.

If a bunch of bloodthirsty RP PvPers band up and fix their RP around sieges, they can deal with anyone, literally.

Depraved

Galvyr wrote: »

I’m an Roleplayer, but I don’t just stay in a chateau all day and play pretend. I view RP as another layer that enhances the already existing systems than acting as an entirely separate entity. I have been a progression raider and an avid PvPer while also engaging in comprehensive RP. However, not every RPer views RP the same way. Some don’t like PvP at all and hate it with a fiery passion, especially world PvP. My fear is this: a Hardcore PvP guild emerges on the RP preferred server and proceeds to destroy every node occupied by RPers and actively ambushes them at events and other activities. These insular and creative communities will be annihilated on the battlefield. The only way I can see them competing with a guild like that is by forming a defensive coalition and overwhelming them with numbers. If every RP guild acts in one bloc, it would be much harder for their play style to be consistently inconvenienced by people who only care about PvP. It’s something I think about often as an RPer, but what do you think? Do you think my concerns are unfounded? Do you think there is an easier solution? Let me know!

you answered yourself. if they are killing you, get your people together and kill them back

Azherae

If anything, I'd expect Ashes to attract many more PvP RPers, since it's currently the best conceptual fantasy-type game for it after Albion, and with no P2W, the RP would be what some consider 'more pure'.

No factions? Meaningful reasons for most combat and a central theme of defending something other than 'the status quo of being on top'?

That sounds like a winning formula to me. In my experience, people don't always lose motivation just because they can't be the best, they lose it when 'the best' is 'the only thing worth being' in the contest for them. Ashes offers the option to be 'strong enough to defend your Node' instead of just 'strongest on the server' (at least until the strongest on the server take interest in razing your Node).

daveywavey

MybroViajero wrote: »

My RP will be killing Tulnars so cool

Kilion

There are tons of different types of players interested in Ashes and I think that these communities would be well advised to find the likeminded members beforehand via the forum - like the guild recruitment sub - to then at launch pick a server on which they will play, which is as simple as as having one person pick one server name at launch, they post it in the prior established thread and then everyone of that community can join in. It is only a declaration of intent, sure, but with that the number of players looking for a gaming similar to your own will definitely increase and there is a higher chance to get exactly that than when you just pick at random.

So I definitely agree that this is a matter of the community.

Sathrago

Like all games you have communities of people that, when lacking any formal in-game tools, will build their own way of interacting with the game. Be it discord or their own websites and such. I think they will be fine. Especially since unlike most other games, this one is wanting to give more tools to those that want to rp.

Gospell

rp rp... It's complicated with rp players. I believe that such players will always be subject to ridicule and they will be interfered in every possible way, no one will wait for them to write something in the chat. They will simply be seen as crazy trying to imitate NPCs, many ppl see rp players for the first time. I'm sure that people would enjoy rp they need rp servers where no one will interfere with them

Kesthely

Galvyr wrote: »

I’m an Roleplayer, but I don’t just stay in a chateau all day and play pretend. I view RP as another layer that enhances the already existing systems than acting as an entirely separate entity. I have been a progression raider and an avid PvPer while also engaging in comprehensive RP. However, not every RPer views RP the same way. Some don’t like PvP at all and hate it with a fiery passion, especially world PvP. My fear is this: a Hardcore PvP guild emerges on the RP preferred server and proceeds to destroy every node occupied by RPers and actively ambushes them at events and other activities. These insular and creative communities will be annihilated on the battlefield. The only way I can see them competing with a guild like that is by forming a defensive coalition and overwhelming them with numbers. If every RP guild acts in one bloc, it would be much harder for their play style to be consistently inconvenienced by people who only care about PvP. It’s something I think about often as an RPer, but what do you think? Do you think my concerns are unfounded? Do you think there is an easier solution? Let me know!

A hardcore pvp guild will not go to the designated rp server, it will go to the designated pvp server. What you should be weary about is the disruptive player, Fortunatly with the vast size of Vera, and the length it will take to level up and transverse the world, the disruptive player will be to a minimum

Terrifying_Truth

I can imagine that some groups of people will fight each other constantly, even when they lose their nodes they will regroup and build another node and freeholds just to provoke fights.

Build a house right in front of your enemy, just to show him you want some fights.

ClintHardwood

I would love to join a guild that regularly raids RPer nodes. Easy pickings.

Galvyr

Kesthely wrote: »

A hardcore pvp guild will not go to the designated rp server, it will go to the designated pvp server. What you should be weary about is the disruptive player, Fortunatly with the vast size of Vera, and the length it will take to level up and transverse the world, the disruptive player will be to a minimum

It happened in WoW Classic. Just saying.

Vaknar

While some may not see it, or agree, IMO - Roleplayers play a super important role in making a world feel alive.

Similarly to other thoughts in this thread, that might be through the storytelling of events that occur. However, it is important to us that roleplayers feel they have a home in Ashes of Creation. I believe we'll be doing a Dev Discussion on this topic in the future, and I can't wait to see what everyone has to say in addition to threads like these!

daveywavey

RPG = Role Playing Game.

Clue's in the name!

Gospell

Rp and rpg different concepts

Enigmatic Sage

Does thou prefer burial or cremation? or shall I let the crows feast upon thou rotten corpses.

on a serious note, who knows, the game design could just make an official RP relatively pointless in comparison to "normal" servers. Could be an interesting dev discussion down the line as @Vaknar mentioned.

It's definitely not a new subject/topic to the forums.

Arya_Yeshe

There's plenty of roleplayers who are fantastic pvpers in other games!
Where you people have been, why do you think rpers are bad pvpers?
In my experience, the rpers are the most fun and competent pvpers.


Ultima Online:
Who else played in rp Ultima Online shards? I did play as pk ORC!
Always being hunted by everybody, always ambushing unsuspecting victims.
You gotta be an exceptional PvPer in UO to take this rp, otherwise people will snow plow you.

EVE Online:
The most significant and competent war alliance in EVE is Blackflag alliance, they rp as mercenaries who ramsom player structures. If the player who is a station owner doesn't pay them, they will pretty much destroy your station.

The most significant and efficient gankers among all games in history are the alliances CODE and Safety, both rp around asking mining permits from miners and ganking miners. They have fantastic players skill wise and rp wise.

Both groups are fantastic PvPers, they crush their targets... they keep their rp going and the pvp being delivered.

Ashes of Creation:
There is plenty of space for PvP rp, guilds and nodes will be able to bring piracy and sieges to a whole new level. If savagery is the rp itself, the PvP will delivered.

Barab

We welcome all challengers big or small, self-proclaimed hardcore or elite pvp, rp or not rp on whatever server the RP community chooses as home.

Anduin Kayvaan

@Galvyr you already know my group has your back. Bring on the PVP and the RP PVP.

Plus as @Barrab has stated, bring on the challengers. Larger PVX rp guilds like Mithril Warhammers, Dunhold, and my own guild fully intend to not only actively hunt griefers but to fight larger threats. Besides it will be fun when someone encroaches on the Dwarven holds and an army of Elves show up to answer their oath by defending their friends and allies.

Roleplay in this game will be amazing stories but also be mixing content with story telling.

Looking forward to fighting along side you Master Dwarf @Barrab may we always be on the same side cleaving enemies.

Mag7spy

Rp community will be calling me Thanos because when i show up they disappear.