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[Feedback Request] Alpha Two Village Node Update Shown in August Livestream

VaknarVaknar Moderator, Member, Staff
edited October 2023 in General Discussion
Hello glorious community,

We’d like your feedback on the Alpha Two Village Node Update shown during the August 2023 Development Update Livestream.

To help guide this conversation, here are a few thought starters you can choose from:
  • How do you feel about the Village Node Update so far?
  • What excites you about playing and interacting with the Node system?
  • Is there anything in particular you’re excited or concerned about regarding what was shown with the Village Node Update?
  • What are your thoughts about the visual fidelity of what was shown with the Village Node Update?
Please don’t feel limited by the thought starters above. Feel free to share anything you’d like about Ashes of Creation’s Alpha Two Village Node Update shown during the August Development Update

We’ll be compiling a report for the design team on Friday, September 15, 2023, so please try to get your feedback into this thread by then!

Everyone here at Intrepid Studios looks forward to reading all the feedback you have to share!

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Edit:
Here is the VOD for the gameplay segment of the livestream, ICYMI: https://youtu.be/bJwLHPGPH5s
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Comments

  • NiKrNiKr Member
    edited September 2023
    Loved the presentation. Was engrossed in the powerpoint discussion even though I was on my 20th hour of being awake. Love this change towards a way more detailed and deep discussion about topics.

    As for the designs related to nodes. I'll need to rewatch the stream several times to properly understand everything, but on the first go-through it definitely felt like mayorship has become a purely guild-based thing. Steven liked to say that guilds won't "own" nodes and all that, but with the current design of "even non-citizens can contribute to the node and give mayor mandates" with the combo of "mandates let the mayor overrule citizen voting" - this kinda feels like "my group of friends can get me to become a mayor and then we rule it however we want".

    Now on that note of "friends can make me a mayor". We now have a change of the military elections. Before you, seemingly, could become a military mayor if you were good at the champion pvp. You could be a solo player who was just great at pvp and you'd earn your place at the top of the mountain.

    Now others can help you and iirc even non-citizens can be involved (I'll edit this later if I'm remembering wrong). This kinda goes directly against the "guilds don't own nodes", cause this design lets them do exactly that.

    And once they put their own mayor in place, they then can do non-citizen activities to produce some mandates for the mayor, who would then use said mandates to overrule citizens' voting. Now this will obviously depend on balancing of things and, hell, might even get completely changed by the time of release, but you wanted feedback on the current choices - so here it is.

    One counterbalancing design to everything above is the node specification feature. But it will only be a true counterbalance if citizens get HUGE benefits to being citizens, when compared to other people. You said that specification is there to attract others to the node and for it to stand out from other nodes. This kinda implies that non-citizens can enjoy the majority of node benefits. So, in theory, a guild wouldn't need to have majority of their members as node citizens to enjoy the fruits of their "we make our own mayor" labor.

    Oh and on an additional note. Enemy of the State system not letting us influence other players is bad imo. The entire forum had smth like a week-long discussion of "environmental terrorism" and EotS was one of the system that could potentially prevent that type of thing, but now we've got none of that? I hope I misunderstood that part of the stream or that it'll get changed after testing.
  • Gaul_Gaul_ Member
    edited September 2023
    The progress in terms of visuals was great. The elevated node layout was by far my favorite part. The building animation was nice for this stage of development with the scaffolding and workers moving around, despite it being procedural. The ceremonial area with the large tree and arbors near the townhall is a great space that I'm sure role-players will take advantage of. I did notice the stockades nearby as well. Perhaps the guards will make use of them?

    The NPC behaviors were very simple, but I assumed they were mostly placeholder.

    The windmill looked iconic on the top of the hill, but it didn't seem to have a function when Steven walked by it. I think having a reason to interact with iconic structures is important. If the windmill isn't meant to be a service building, then I recommend at least having some quest content involve it.

    All of the design choices in the slides seemed very solid. The mandate system is a brilliant way to reflect the mayor's political capital. Allowing nodes to choose their specialization sounds like it will work well. Finally, giving refugees a special status to avoid double punishment is a good move, and I encourage Intrepid to continue with this line of thinking.
  • MybroViajeroMybroViajero Member
    edited September 2023
    Negative things

    1.- In some parts of the node it felt like some places became too dark or too bright , it went from a very bright hue to a very dark hue and vice versa , I do not know if it's because of Twitch or because Intrtepid try to be as realistic as possible ( which would make sense since that's what happens when you go from a very bright place to a dark place and vice versa ) . But I think for the eye of the spectator it's something a little bit out of the ordinary, different.
    What will happen in autumn, winter or spring? That darkness will be darker or lighter depending on the weather? Will it be something different? Will there be darker and lighter fog? Will this darkness affect the visibility of things in AoC?
    That darkness can be used for future content creation, mechanics, skills/spells in AoC?
    Sounds promising and interesting.


    I don't know if that's good or bad actually , it might be something interesting if well developed or it might be something heavy on the eye of the beholder ( thinking about the viewers of future AoC Streamers ) .
    It might be something very interesting to keep that in mind .

    darkness and light Clip : https://youtube.com/clip/UgkxH_fj0CwjiyoQ95kKp6kdfUj9lCBHd3GZ?si=vtOiaT-pfXB6W7JF


    2.- Some NPCS that have more importance than other NPCS look like dummies I understand they are "NPCS" but if those NPCS that have more importance than other NPCS are so static without expressing anything and other random NPCS have more movements than them then how could I differentiate one from the other in terms of immersion?

    I understand that things are still in development and probably in the future those NPCS will have more dynamism to show their importance within the NPCS but I think the term NPC is very unbalanced in the world of MMORPGS, they are part of the daily life of a player, they are part of the immersion of the world and the player, you have to give all the love to those NPCS that have more importance than other random NPCS.

    NPC CLIP : https://youtube.com/clip/UgkxgvWkUikDiLh1U8R4btQQg5sIS_QNo56l?si=fLBnzY6fQOuHj9er


    Positive things

    Overall for the NEW start and development for the nodes I think the path is very correct.

    1.- I loved the little details to the things we have already seen before like the stone mining , the builders building the buildings in the node , systems improving , the visibility of things all over the road , the interaction of nature with the node , everything little by little is slowly taking shape to how Intrepid wants to create its things , Intrepid style with its own DNA.
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  • CCC_HANCCC_HAN Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    edited August 2023
    Exhausting stream.
    Not much was said in the first 40 minutes of the talk that we didn't already know. Alpha 1 compared to Alpha 2 nodes were just some visual updates. 99% of the people won't use the major menu anyway.

    For example I would have liked to see the effects of the race, in terms of visual effects related to the nodes, the different stages of the nodes, impact on/from nodes/environment etc. and not just running threw a node doing some rpg and a bit of crafting.

    What also looks strange is that the scaffolding is only invisible and then slowly shown visually. (From the button to the top.) It looks like the plank is "growing".

    [Edit: I liked the powerpoint sheets & the overall visuals are nice.]

    Well, my guildmates see it very similarly. 3-4/10 Stream.
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  • LinikerLiniker Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    edited September 2023
    This was def the best livestream ever for me, perfect showcase of the progress made.

    How do you feel about the Village Node Update so far?
    All I have to say is congrats to the devs that pulled this off. Very impressive, I have extensive footage of Winstead in Alpha 1 and comparing it side by side, actually looking at the systems that were in place (mayorship, crafting, building etc.) and seeing this much progress with a lot of complexity and development on top of those systems + more is very reassuring. I simply can't understand the mind of someone who says "we've already seen this" when the amount of progress is this big, both front end and back end.


    What excites you about playing and interacting with the Node system?
    I just want to get to testing, hands-on. It's simply a very complex system to give feedback and comment without testing first.

    Is there anything in particular you’re excited or concerned about regarding what was shown with the Village Node Update?
    I absolutely loved the node-currency system - Mandates are an amazing idea to prevent mayors from messing up the node, love it

    I also really enjoyed that you moved away from the NPC champion for military elections, I hated that idea, hate when games make me play other characters that are not my main, the new approach seems awesome and lots of fun! can't wait to test it

    Love the buy order idea, this can cause friction with the mayor decisions on who to inform, and I like friction, I miss being emotionally invested in MMOs


    What are your thoughts about the visual fidelity of what was shown with the Village Node Update?
    Visuals are simply stunning, you managed to give Winstead a very unique visual style for Kaelar humans with the architecture and layout and it looks honestly ready for launch, didn't look like an Alpha at all (besides bugs) lighting and colors are good, NPCs look good with the new models, and armor style on the characters are 10/10, well done
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  • Song_WardenSong_Warden Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    edited September 2023
    I love the change to the military node. It sounds stellar. I just wonder if corrupted players can partake or not.
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  • Arag0nArag0n Member
    edited August 2023
    I think it looks really good so far on the Village node level! It looks amazing in terms of the art. Can't wait to see what other nodes with look like and how the village will progress to town and metropolis level!

    Was looking forward to seeing something more with regards to how these nodes develop from a small encampment, up to higher levels and how it will interact with the environment but I guess that will have to wait for another time, as it would be a lot of work creating those presets.

    I'm excited to see how developing nodes with unlock new content for players. How the general populations of npc's and monster will react to a node developing. Hoping to see things like dungeons unlocking, PvE raids on your node settlement (with enough forewarning) and raid bosses appearing within it's zone of influence.

    I worry for the shear amount of content these nodes are going to require on a development standpoint. It is going to take quite sometime to build up the visuals and layouts for each of the 6 stages of all the 80+ nodes for a world. But I trust you guys can get it done, just will take some time. Lots of patience required :)

    I think the visuals are outstanding! I haven't experienced a game much better than this. The shear amount of decoration, and artistic small things, is wonderful to see. That attention to details!

    With regards to the new building up visuals, I think the scaffolding going up and down, doesn't feel right. Not sure if that was intended or not, but I feel the scaffolding should go up, and then remain until the entire part of the building that was being constructed, is built before removing the scaffolding. It would be just a real pain for the builders to keep having to take it down and put it up again in the same place xD Finish the whole side of a building, before taking it down.

    Can't wait to see more!
  • How do you feel about the Village Node Update so far?

    Fidelity looks great, I also like the size of the village and how organic it feels.

    What excites you about playing and interacting with the Node system?

    Node Sieges and also create a stable comunity to create the type of node that we want.

    Is there anything in particular you’re excited or concerned about regarding what was shown with the Village Node Update?

    I am afraid peoples mounts can be a little too much clutter for a node. Lets say 1000 or more.

    What are your thoughts about the visual fidelity of what was shown with the Village Node Update?

    Kaelar looks pretty good. Would love to see other races node buildings too. I feel like alot people are.
  • edited August 2023
    @Vaknar Noo i missed the stream. Is it possible for your team to post in IG story the day before with a countdown timer so you can get notified in app? I keep forgetting date/time because I don't use twitter and don't always have this forum open. My IG is always open though.
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  • VaknarVaknar Moderator, Member, Staff
    RIP lil ducky. Long live The Applesmith.
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  • Side note, you can tell that town was created by the Kaelar. Us Empyreans would never have mud on the street like that *flips flowing elven hair*
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  • VaknarVaknar Moderator, Member, Staff
    @Vaknar Noo i missed the stream. Is it possible for your team to post in IG story the day before with a countdown timer so you can get notified in app? I keep forgetting date/time because I don't use twitter and don't always have this forum open. My IG is always open though.

    Oh no! I'm sorry to hear that you missed it! We may have missed the 'We're Live' notification on our IG story this time. I apologize for that! We will be posting the VOD tomorrow, and the gameplay section is currently live right now to view on YouTube! It's posted in the OP :)

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  • VaknarVaknar Moderator, Member, Staff
    CCC_HAN wrote: »
    Exhausting stream.
    40 minutes of talking without saying much we didn't already know. Alpha 1 compared to Alpha 2 nodes were just some visual updates. 99% of the people won't use the major menu anyway.

    Thank you for the livestream feedback! Do you have any feedback for what was shown on the stream itself as well you'd like to share? <3
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  • arsnnarsnn Member, Intrepid Pack, Alpha One
    .
  • I would prefer it if the mayor actually had to go to the town hall to use mayor features. Just opening a UI defeats a lot of the purpose of making a physical town.
  • How do you feel about the Village Node Update so far?
    Like the freehold stream I think this showed a lot of promise, and I like the depth and richness to the systems being developed. I'd have liked to have seen the node develop up to a village and understand more about how conflict will affect node level etc, or at least more from the perspective of a citizen of a node rather than the mayor.

    What excites you about playing and interacting with the Node system?
    I'm really interested in the effects it has on the zone and how they progress generally, particularly coming back to somewhere to discover how it has changed over time. Given how many nodes there will be and the fact they will be spread across levels, I am glad that we won't lose the visuals of the more quaint villages as other nodes are developed further.

    Is there anything in particular you’re excited or concerned about regarding what was shown with the Village Node Update?
    One part that was spoken about was upgrading buildings according to a tech tree so that they gradually become more specialised, and how the node would be affected by conflict and siege - such as downgrading of stations. A similar mechanic was present in New World where it was expected for there to be some churn on station levels (due to Invasions being hard to win to prevent it), which meant periods of inconvenience for players when stations needed to be upgraded again.

    What mitigates that in Ashes? The fact that there will be many more nodes in a region and therefore a reduced chance of all stations being unavailable, or the fact that freeholds will offer an alternative for those stations?

    What are your thoughts about the visual fidelity of what was shown with the Village Node Update?
    Looked good visually, particularly liked the NPCs roaming the streets - the village felt lived in. It's nice to think that one could be semi-AFK in a village just soaking in the atmosphere and watching the NPCs go about their day.
  • First off, i loved everything you showed knowing that this is still early testing phase and everything is going to be polished or even totally changed.
    I want to thank every person participating in this project actually making a game that ive dreamt of for years now and im not even that old LOL! (22 yo)

    But one thing, that for me and imo in general is an important aspect for immersion: character physics! and i think rdr2 did an amazing job, because the character actually feels like it has some weight.

    Also you could make it vary regarding armor weight.
    e.g. higher jumps that require less momentum and lower jumps that require a lot of impetus because of the heavy armor.

    Starting your walk or run could be initiated by frontal body movement animation.

    I think this is also visually important because seeing other players walking around and speeding up from 0-15 mph in just 0.1 sec doesnt feel immersive to me at all.
    I understand that for pve or pvp it is important to have instant pace, but you could compensate it by making a roll an instant transition into running.

    So in case you want to escape or need to dodge, you can roll and the pace is build to 100% twice as fast as usual e.g.
    Also turning or stopping should happen with some rest momentum and not instantly.
    And if everybody "suffers" the same circumstances, its balancable haha.

    Pvp in rdr2 is also balanced and makes a lot of fun even while controlling a freaking horse that runs with 30mph and limited side/back view.

    Im talking too much, rather take rdr2 as comparison.

    much love as always.
  • Gui10Gui10 Member
    edited August 2023
    I'm aware lighting has had it's load of criticism. It can be hard to have great lighting. Lighting is such an important of player immersion/gameplay/graphics/realism/feel to the game.

    Here is my opinion/suggestions on how it could be better and make the game more fun to play (for me)

    A bit less dark in the shadow area,a bit less glaring in the glaring area. Shadows dont mean a total eclipse of light.. and light doesnt mean total glaring brightness, especially on some natural ground (would be different on a metalic surface, for example)

    It's easier on the eyes, more pleasing, soothing, lets me see more things, more details, all the while being more realistic.

    hgodv5slm520.png


    Cheers
  • JamationJamation Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    I really enjoyed seeing the amount of development and changes that have happened from A1. When we saw the upgrade tree for the smithy building, I was shocked by how many specialties there were going to be. I really enjoyed the deep dive into the information behind the system as well as everything that would be a part of the mayoral duties. Even if most of us never become a mayor it's nice to know what goes on behind the scenes with the anyways so we can be more informed in our voting choices, etc.

    Node currency
    The node currency was something I might not have fully understood/might need to be explained on further. It seems like each node will have their own individual currency which is tied to the node for the individual. One of the things I wasn’t sure about was whether the currency would persist for the node if the node was destroyed. Would it be reset, or would you be able to maintain your currency once the node was rebuilt?
    Would there be some UI element/wallet where a person could track their node currency throughout the map without actually being at the node? For example, if I gathered 100 coins from Node A but traveled to Node H, would I be able to check a window to see that I had 100 coins in Node A or would I just need to remember that?

    Buildings in Progress
    One of the other things I was concerned about was the ability to announce buildings that are in progress. When the smithy was being built the group had to travel to the sight to supply the materials to get it built. However, is there going to be a system in place to alert those who enter the node that there is a project in place? I know there was mention of a Message of the Day system, but if that isn’t implemented how will travelers/citizens know where to go to donate their materials without wandering through the node aimlessly. It might be more obvious from the village side since it’s smaller, but once we start having buildings/upgrades in massive cities I can see some projects getting passed by without realizing if there isn’t some sort of alert/acknowledgment system.

    Overcrowding
    With the persistent mounts and collision of players what’s the plan to mitigate/prevent streets from getting over clogged or players not able to reach facilities because it’s crowded? I saw a lot of open areas in the village we were shown, but there were also some narrow alleyways and some of the facilities had stations all crowded together. What measures are being put in place to prevent towns from getting overcrowded if people go AFK or block facilities? The map might be big, but the towns are going to be the central hub for a lot of people, especially the crafting stations.
  • I liked the scale of the buildings, street width, clutter.
    Nodes aren't flat as a pancake +++
    The selection of PVP Mayor is an improvement.
    Limits to what a Mayor can do without support is good.
  • Whilst I never want to be too negative, I was pretty disappointed by this month's stream. It also confirmed for me, that this project is in fact many years away (regardless of what Steven said about Alpha 2 not being years away). It felt like there was about 10 minutes worth of substance, padded out to over 2 hours.

    After all this time I had hoped we might actually see the progression of a node from Wilderness>Expedition>Encampment>Village>Town (I think it is pretty clear that Cities and Metropolis are NOT going to be in Alpha 2 until the very end) but we didn't see any type of in-game Node progression.

    I thought we might see some kind of comparison between Divine, Economic, Military and Scientific Node types. We didn't see that, we were told (once again) that there are differences between them but apart from the electoral system, there doesn't seem to be any differentiating aesthetic variation. No additional concept art (The slides at the beginning used concept art from years ago) No character art.

    I REALLY thought we might see some kind of comparison between different racial influences. Although it seems that from the comments of the Devs, they haven't even begun working on that yet. I still do not see how this Node will work given its location if the primary racial influence is Nikua, Vaelune or Py'Rai. (or any of the other races to be frank.)

    The video was 53:38 seconds long. The first 15 minutes = Steven and Chris talking and gathering (which we have seen before, although the addition of dust particles was nice). and walking through a pleasant but uninspired environment. (I am really starting to worry that Verra is going to feel big... and empty.)

    The settlement itself was nice, but I just couldn't help but feel... "Is this it?" The buildings and assets were ok but I genuinely think that I could create that entire settlement myself in Blender/Unreal Engine in about a week. We were told that the placement and the way in which the Nodes are dynamic makes the process 100% more complicated, but again, we didn't really see how.

    No interiors was a big disappointment and considering we were told that there was a set amount of "standard" buildings in the Node that offered basic functions it wasn't clear which building was which (even Steven didn't seem to know what building was the Town Hall for goodness sake)

    Steven met up with other players in the game... why? (apart from padding) We could have been shown a map/layout of the Winstead node. With clear markings for what comes online when and the number of current plots. We could have gone into an Inn and seen what the transition to an instanced space looks like.

    The NPC's walking around was good (although a little stilted) the devs should look at having a bit more fun with that. Perhaps an NPC opening a window along the main drag and throwing out some shitty water. A group of flirtatious brothel types. Or some scoundrels hanging around in the shadows. Some dogs and ducks (the piglet was nice but again we have seen it before)

    The construction of the building was nice.

    A final point, I appreciate that Steven takes on the role of "newbie" for these streams, allowing devs to explain and guide (and by extension the audience) through things. Parts of this video actually felt like Steven didn't know what he was doing (or hadn't prepared at all) like the vendor aspect, not having money and having a full itinerary. etc. It felt to me for the first time, almost worrying.

    Anyway, the post is long enough. Some initial thoughts.
  • AzheraeAzherae Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    The presentation itself was great, the format and flow, I consider it another step forward. (I don't really need to SEE the devs but I'm sure some people prefer that). The information sequence and directness was absolutely spot on.

    The presentation however provided no positive information for me to interact with or give feedback on at this stage.

    There was lots of stuff that I didn't like, but it was all in line with Ashes' evolving philosophy, and 'this game is not for everyone'. Briefly below for those:

    Military Node Election System: Hate it. It's not interesting, it's not balanced, it's going to get completely cheesed, and it creates friction with other claims for gameplay, even claims within this same stream. But it falls into 'not my problem'. What I can say is that I wouldn't avoid a Military Node because I felt 'we can't win this', but that I would avoid it because I would not want any of my group to be Mayor even if we did due to my expectations of how that would play out after.

    Enemy of the State: This seemed less clear, but taking it at face value, this also sucks, in my perception. Don't even feel like talking in detail about this one, I'll just wait on clarity.

    Mandates: I'd have to see what your political scientist/sociologist thinks will happen here. From my experiences, this concept is terrible compared to just... 'having more people involved'. Why this system is this way, instead of the arguably simpler 'having a small council along with the mayor', I can't even guess (other than the general philosophy that Steven APPEARS to have which I dislike).

    Policy: Why bother going to all the trouble to make a system this deep and then effectively make it a Metagamable WoW 'World Buffs' situation? Maybe the example given was just bad? I'm just gonna hope Policies are all Tradeoffs (within themselves, not just slots). I'd say 'don't go sprinkling in Civ/Tropico mechanics', you either make this a whole subgame or you do less of it and let the players sorta-sandbox it. Or you're using a lot of energy to make something that people will just deconstruct and generally create pure friction... yay...

    Service Buildings: The level of potential 'overspecialization' in this system sounds absolutely terrible to me as an Econ player. But I know that when I get that sense of 'wow how is this so unimaginably bad?' either it's a massive philosophy difference, or it's one of those things that needs testing that I don't understand all the bits of. Knee-jerk reaction is 'how did y'all even come to this one as a good idea?' Plots and all that? See above Civ/Tropico thing.

    Buy Orders: This is literally laughable as described. Obviously the Mayor should inform all their allies to gather up the required items FIRST and then set the buy order. This doesn't even have a good way around it. Don't reward people for 'having items to sell to the Node' and then put the Mayor in charge of it, and then generate Mandates for the Mayor... what...?

    Steven even specifically mentions this in the Showcase part and then doesn't address it other than the usual 'aha but you can act in bad faith instead!'. So... I'll put this down to 'unpleasant philosophy'. After relaying this to my group (since they obviously put me in charge of watching this first), if relevant, this is the moment where you lost their interest in even bothering to give feedback, because obviously, the game Steven wants to make is not the game they want to play.

    Global inspection of Buy Orders is also ... a negative for me, I guess I'll leave it at that.

    Node Currency: Node currency can be carried forward to other Nodes. WHAT NOW? Subject to testing I guess. No, 'but it's usage is locked behind Node Rep so it's fine!'... seriously what? I suppose I must assume that I just don't understand.

    So basically, the usual concerns. All the macro-ideas, even I'd say 'two levels down' from the standard 'I imagine it being cool like this' are good, and two levels down the execution sounds like it sucks, due to a lack of experience somewhere. Could be with the current Econ design head. Could be me not having the experience in gaming. Could be me not having the internal experience of 'Ashes design'. But as an effort of 'giving feedback, based on information given', this is pretty much all bad for me.


    General Visuals
    Don't like the new lighting model, still like the road, grass be ok.

    Node Visuals
    In the leadup to entering Winstead I really felt 'please don't let me like the old one better, please don't let me like the old one better...'

    I like the old one better.

    Of course, there's no way to know how interesting it would look in total because obviously, the dynamic is the point. But I don't like the base. There was talk about 'selling the Ashes of Creation look'. For me, you absolutely did not. You had that before. You don't have it now. I'm kind of sad that you chose the theme you did, for the Node, but so it is.

    It's not like I was expecting this to look super special or really unique, I'm not complaining about that. I just don't like the style compared to the old. I'll just trust that going up to this level won't cause another 2 years of QA.

    Hopefully the glorious Empyreans will cobble the roads of even their villages so everything isn't a muddy mess. How the Kaelar live like this is beyond me, truly.

    Mayoral Control Stuff
    Looks fine, but I'd assume the UI is going to change either way.

    Construction Visuals
    This doesn't affect my immersion, so I hope the effort put in here is really doing something for someone else. The methodology really gives a 'cheap' feeling, though. Basically it gives the impression that you're trying to 'sell' a MineCraft build algorithm as something more than that. And I say this as a person who absolutely loves the idea of just 'using something like that and moving on'. Moreso saying that I hope this was as low effort as it looked.

    Conclusion:
    As always, big thanks to all of the developers that joined for the stream, they did a great job, and were both entertaining and informative about everything. Information felt a little less clear this time around but I understand that it's a huge system.

    I therefore hope that this feedback was somehow useful, whether as a catalyst for change, or incentive to double down knowing that I/we are not the intended audience and therefore negative reactions from me are a positive sign for y'all.
    Sorry, my native language is Erlang.
    
  • George_BlackGeorge_Black Member, Intrepid Pack
    I havent even got to the video, I am still watching them talk over the slides.

    Good information breakdown, but what stands out in this months Dev update is how much the developers take charge of the stream, know what they talk about and dont ommit to clarify or include vital info.
    They control the pace and they give concrete knowledge.

    I will write some more.
    (Increase lv cap duration from 45 to 120 days. This game has so much to do that racing to lv cap should not take centre stage. Centre stage should be LIVING the game, whether you get involved with your node or you pirate or you set up trade routes.

    Freeholds should be accessible at lv30.
  • I really enjoyed the stream. The only thing I do want to comment on is the lighting. I don't think the super dark shadows are pleasant.
    the contrast is too high. Maybe the lumite settings are just too drastic? seeing as this game does not feature a brightly colored vivid scenery, the bounce light off walls and buildings aren't really doing much to brighten up those pitch black shadows.

    That would be my only real criticism after watching this stream, as for the nodes and the systems. I am super excited about it and I think it all sounds great.
    As long as I have chickenwings, I'm happy.
  • love the verticality and use of terrain with the node layout, adding the extra defensivness of a the ramp to the upper section is nice since it adds a choke point to defend when walls are breached.
    Design wise for seiges i think was on point for this one and would actually be interested to see how the node progresses up the ranks. Does seem like you can attack from the upper section however at this stage of the node which is fine its only a village level but would be nice to see some even more defensable layout in the future. I will say the more defensive a node can become via terrain the less benefits it should provide in other area's like building slots.
    aka flat open castle with low terrain defensivness should get extra building slots where heavy defendable nodes with choke point to push in (like within a cave with 2 tunnels to enter in) would provide less building slots. this one shown seems to be in the middle of those defensive wise.
  • VeeshanVeeshan Member
    edited September 2023
    I would like to see wonders too tbh one for each race designed around each race (and pirate) so 10 total these wil be in a random node and player wont know there node contains one till they hit Rank 5 or 6, these will provide a bonus however require a large investment to build along with more resources to pillage on destruction so a bit risk vs reward there. Wonder will allow devs to make some large scale unique structures and build a node around that design wise.
    For example
    Pyrai wonder could be a World tree or a great garden which could provide the buff of increase resource yield when gathering for all citizens
    Empyrean wonder Could increase quality of armor crafting (was either gonna be Empyrean or Kaelar here but went elfs since didnt want weapon and armpr bonuses on the same island)
    Dunirs could have the great forge which incxreases quality of weapon crafting
    Niküa could be increased fishing yield or quality/boost to sport fishing
    Vaelune could be citizens get discount on trade tax globaly to promote trade/caravan (the colossus maybe)
    Pirate wonder could be on an island node and provides citizens with greater naval combat buff 10% cannon dmg/boat speed for example


  • SolvrynSolvryn Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    In Darkfall there was a concept called asset wars, (all city assets were destructible). And what you would do is level cities and never claim them, thus making it so the guild who owned the city had to empty out their personal assets (time) until they had nothing left in their banks and they had to go out and farm to repair the city.

    This became an incredibly taboo practice would get you kicked out of your guild.

    After watching the stream, it's very clear to me that asset wars (see above) and asset exhaustion (the constant grind of repairing a city) can become a real thing in Ashes too.

    I hope the cost of wars are incredibly costly and steep, an up front cost to a conflict cycle. So we don't have asset burnout on the end of a conflict cycle causing players to quit.


    Some ways to mitigate this:

    -Siege tech being timely and expensive
    -Make Assets only damaged by siege tech
    -Siege tech cannot go in bags - only the parts in appropriate boxes that must be escorted via caravans everywhere
    -Siegetech Stations having decay with an expensive upkeep

    The biggest problem with Darkfall is that the siege tech was easy to carry around as a munition.




  • How do you feel about the Village Node Update so far?

    It was really great to get to see elaboration on the Node system. It re-affirmed a lot of what we already knew/suspected, and introduced some food-for-thought.

    What excites you about playing and interacting with the Node system?

    Measuring my own contribution versus that of others, even if there isn't a leaderboard for such things; If you're fulfilling so many contracts and there's only so many available, then you can know you've personally made a difference.

    Is there anything in particular you’re excited or concerned about regarding what was shown with the Village Node Update?

    I would have liked to have seen the city-generator in-action, again; Nodes 2 shows it generating city-blocks, and seeing it working its magic in a variety of different landscapes would have been great. It was good to know that things like hillsides / variable terrain won't be an issue.

    What are your thoughts about the visual fidelity of what was shown with the Village Node Update?

    UE5 was definitely a great choice. The wagon in the center of town with wheel-tracks in the mud behind it and the shimmer/glare we caught off the puddles in the lowest parts of the road really emphasizes how modern of a game engine our game will employ. It's just detail we've haven't seen a lot of, in the past. RDR2 might be the only comparison, for world-and-town composition, even if RDR2 employs pre-fabricated towns. Certainly an improvement, over the Alpha One footage - as displayed.


    Overall, a good reason to have taken the day off. Watching the live-stream *live* is always pleasurable, but this one was a very long time in coming, for those of us who have been following the project. I hope the IS team has a good weekend off, and keeps up the great (and impressive!) work!



  • How do you feel about the Village Node Update so far?
    I feel pretty good honestly. The general structure and ideas seem pretty well there already. I feel like its a good give and take between the mayor and their citizens. Hopefully this culminates into a good communities working together, communicating back and forth about the direction of their node.

    What excites you about playing and interacting with the Node system?
    I'm excited to see it over time. The growth of villages into cities across the server. Seeing a map develop into communities and where the metropolises land will be very interesting. I'm also excited to see the structures of different races popping into these to see how diverse or concentrated populations are.

    Is there anything in particular you’re excited or concerned about regarding what was shown with the Village Node Update?
    I'm sure everyone is a little concerned about the struggle of a bad mayor and that seems pretty flushed out so far. I'd also be a little worried about snowballing possibilities of groups, how often power and economic strength will change hands and so on. A server will lose a lot of character and intrigue if along the life cycle everything is run by one or two groups. I would be very interested to see what implementations could be created to encourage a constant balance of wealth/power.

    What are your thoughts about the visual fidelity of what was shown with the Village Node Update?
    Honestly for Alpha gameplay I think it looks amazing. Just to see how far it has come from Alpha 1 to now is an outstanding leap. I can only imagine how Beta footage will be and eventually release.

    Just want to give some love to the entire team. I cannot imagine the amount of hard work going into this, love you guys, amazing work so far. <3
  • SjeldenSjelden Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    edited September 2023
    How do you feel about the Village Node Update so far?
    Art, look and feel, topography, atmosphere and visuals were absolutely fantastic. I had hoped we would see more different states of the node system, and more racial artstyles.

    What excites you about playing and interacting with the Node system?
    Exploring the nodes of Verra, seeing how different nodes are being run by the groups of people that settle across the world, and how different races impact the look and feel of the nodes. More importantly, how will different racial artstyles make the node look like it belongs in the different biomes. This seems like it is one of the more complex challenges to solve, and I am exited to hear how you approach this task.

    Is there anything in particular you’re excited or concerned about regarding what was shown with the Village Node Update?
    There was too much focus on a system only relevant to select few individuals (mayoral systems), and not enough focus on the underlying node systems, or how these systems will impact players.
    I also expected to see more updated concept art for different stages of nodes, and different racial artstyles. Concept art for underrealm nodes and artstyles would be awesome.

    Edit: Node currency. Did I understand this correct, that node currency could be obtained in one node, and spent in another node? What can it be spent on?
    If node currency could be spent on player housing, I personally think node currency should be tied to the node it was obtained from, to prevent players from "gaming" the currency system to obtain Freeholds or houses in cities they never visited, nor helped build. No skin in the game, so to speak. If this is a misunderstanding on my part, or something you already thought of, then disregard this feedback


    What are your thoughts about the visual fidelity of what was shown with the Village Node Update?
    Your team did a fantastic job, what was shown was absolutely breathtaking.
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