Your generalization distorted the point that I was trying to make and you know that very well.
Anyway #2: Not really interested in your demagogy and doublespeaking at the moment
See, you haven't explained why the use of a different word materially changes the meaning of what was said. To anyone reading, with the context in place, using either word would result in exactly the same understanding.
That is why it was quite literally the same thing.
This is why context is important - words often have different meanings, or encompass many similar terms, Context is what allows people to work out which meaning of that word is intended, or if the word is being used to refer to a single one of the similar terms if encompasses.
This last one was the case here. I am unsure at this point if you don't actually understand this basic aspect of communication, or if you are being purposefully obtuse.
I mean, Noaani's comment count won't magically increase by itself, you know.
I do find it interesting that the few people that come to these forums and decide to pick a fight with me (seems to happen every 15 or so months) are obsessed with my post count - while I don't even know what my post count is.
I'm more surprised that you are still trying to hammer this in, even though people don't seem very concerned with this at this point in time.
It just doesn't seem like any significant number of future players sees the current leveling speed or progress systems as an issue.
Yeah, if this thread can prove one thing, it is that most people either don't want leveling to be too long, or they don't really care - but a very small number of people (one?) *REALLY* care, to a kind of creepy level.
I do find it interesting that the few people that come to these forums and decide to pick a fight with me (seems to happen every 15 or so months) are obsessed with my post count - while I don't even know what my post count is.
Just as I said, you've got a finger in every pie. Those who come to the forum simply get overwhelmed with amount of your meaningless spam, clownery and doublespeaking. You basically kill the threads with your pathetic garbage. And you are perfectly aware of the number of comments you have. First of all, just because you are. Secondly, because I told you. So stop pretending lol.
Yeah, if this thread can prove one thing, it is that most people either don't want leveling to be too long, or they don't really care - but a very small number of people (one?) *REALLY* care, to a kind of creepy level.
Straight one manipulation again. As I said above, nobody wants to interact with your spam. I'm going to quote those who care about it as well from another thread. There were people who were against it in that thread too, and it had a proper discussion with people sharing opinions. Why? Because @Noaani wasn't there killing the thread with his trash. Link: https://forums.ashesofcreation.com/discussion/58957/leveling-speed/p1
Slower, I'm not gonna lie I will be playing at least 10 hour sessions and I'm sure some will be far exceeding that. I want it to really feel like a accomplishment when I get there.
Slower. I think a lot of players are seeing Ashes as the game that will restore their faith in well... games. And so intend to maximise it's value and enjoy every moment. And the longer that takes, the better.
If you reduced the power given by levels and allowed players to participate in content as combatants at lower levels then I'm fine with having a long leveling experience, I might even prefer it.
The level should be in accordance with the amount of lore there is and also the new expansions, which intrepid will also increase the level, but I also like it slower, since I had an unpleasant experience with NW on this topic.
Personally I'd enjoy slower. I feel like ashes is a very journey focused mmo with the dynamic content thats planned. So I think having the longer journey to also level up matches that aim.
Slower, I want it to feel like I have to put in work to max my character and feel like more of an accomplishment then something that can be done quickly
but a very small number of people (one?) *REALLY* care, to a kind of creepy level.
So yeah, "a very small number of creepy people", huh? What is truly creepy is the amount of time you spend on this forum without contributing anything to the game, but whining, lying, manipulating and killing threads with your nonsense.
It ain't gonna work, sweet summer child and here you are - called out for you generalizations and manipulations again.
I'm gonna add this to the list of references in the first comment.
And you are perfectly aware of the number of comments you have. First of all, just because you are. Secondly, because I told you.
I'm not aware, though if I cared I know how to check.
And even if you have said how many in a comment, we have already been over the fact that I have many reasons for not reading some of your posts - or reading only parts of them.
If I didn't quote something you said, you should probably assume I didn't read it. Others need not make that assumption, but you should.
So yeah, "a very small number of creepy people", huh?
No, the very small number of creepy people were just you. That is why I said (one?) in the comment.
"NO NO, I MEAN YES, I SAID THAT, BUT NOW YOU GOT ME AND RIGHT NOW I MEAN A DIFFERENT THING, HAHA I GOT YOU!!!! YOU UNDERESTIMATE MY ABILITY TO SWITCH TOPICS AND SHIFT GOALPOSTS!!!"
Later that night
"Mommy, Flanker keeps calling me out for my bs, there is nothing I can do!!!! I'm afraid of his superpower to open my profile and check my past comments!!! I think he is stalking me, mommy, I'm so scared!!! He also wrote "Avada Kedavra" so now he also threatens me!!!! *crying on mommy's shoulder*"
Sweet summer child, if you google the translation of that from Aramaic language, you'd realize that it's exactly what has been done to you in this thread and another one.
If I didn't quote something you said, you should probably assume I didn't read it. Others need not make that assumption, but you should.
Of course, I noticed how you skip all points you have 0 chance to argue with and find one sentence or a paragraph that might allow you to continue you pointless spam xD
Of course, I noticed how you skip all points you have 0 chance to argue with and find one sentence or a paragraph that might allow you to continue you pointless spam
Nah, it's points I don't see any need to argue, because anything I would say is basically self evident.
Not that I expect you to see it, you stopped arguing points and started just arguing against anything I said quite a while ago.
Not that I expect you to see it, you stopped arguing points and started just arguing against anything I said quite a while ago.
That's another straight-up lie. I never argue with a person, I always argue with an argument. If you were actually fair and did not try to lie or be manipulative, you'd notice that I have comments where I agree with some of the points you make in other threads and also like your comments when I agree with them.
So here is it, another blatant accusation based on thin air, cuz you want to play that victim card so badly.
Damn Noaani, you found someone with even more time to waste than you
To be fair, I don't have a whole lot of time to waste - that is why I won't read all of any posts from someone like this. I'll skim them, see the most egregous parts and then reply to that.
I probably spend a total of 45 mintes a day on the forums - but that is broken down in to many 2 or 3 minute slots where I am waiting on something or someone. You can tell if I have too much time to waste by the length of my posts - short ones like this mean I only expect to have a minute or two, longer ones mean I probably have a decent chunk of time to kill.
Inb4 outraged rant by Flanker about how Noaani admitted to not thoroughly reading his posts before replying.
I called him out for intentional ignoring of important points many pages ago, nothing new here
Hey, maybe you did, maybe you didn't.
Not 100% sure I read it though.
I did read you claiming I didn't pay attention to things you thought were important but were actually not even worth my time to read, however. Maybe that is what you meant.
The funny thing is, because everyone here has seen it many times, they all know I'm basically just treating you as a form of entertainment. You have long since proven that you currently have no points worth discussing.
I did read you claiming I didn't pay attention to things you thought were important but were actually not even worth my time to read, however. Maybe that is what you meant.
The funny thing is, because everyone here has seen it many times, they all know I'm basically just treating you as a form of entertainment. You have long since proven that you currently have no points worth discussing.
Ah yes, of course, it all was your "genius 9000 iq plan"
You should be ashamed of your behavior
Get lost, forum fauna
I did read you claiming I didn't pay attention to things you thought were important but were actually not even worth my time to read, however. Maybe that is what you meant.
The funny thing is, because everyone here has seen it many times, they all know I'm basically just treating you as a form of entertainment. You have long since proven that you currently have no points worth discussing.
Ah yes, of course, it all was your "genius 9000 iq plan"
I mean, people here have seen it many times.
As I said earlier, some random seems to get themselves all obsessed with me about every 15 months or so.
And my IQ isn't 9000. I can see how someone like you looks at any number with 3 or more digits as being "unfathomly large", and can see how all such 3 or more digit numbers may just kind of blend in together in to a mass of "numbers you don't need to understand" - but my IQ is not even 900 (shock), let alone 9000.
As to "I should be ashamed of behavior", nope.
You came in here ranting about shit, using data from an inappropriate source that is unable to be verified, claiming it to be the only true data that matters, ignoring more accessable, more acurate data simply because it proves that a different demographic has a different opinion, ignoring a poll that you yourself ran on Reddit, and attempted to slam home your point with the above. It was right back here (before I even looked in to where your charts came from) that you proved to not be worth the time to have a real discussion or debate with. You weren't interested in truth, just in your opinion and in being right - and you would twist and contort things to that end.
Actually great that you linked this one because reading through the comments there it seems to me that the agreement to "slower" seems to be based on the fact that is was a VERY general question, but not only that, I can see you reasons for wanting a lower leveling speed find MUCH less agreement than. Nikr got 13 upvotes for saying slower, cool. But when you explained your reasons that got 2, on the first page. Feels to me that once people dive into actual information and think about the consequences of stretching leveling time the idea loses its luster - much like minimum wage. Also, after you laid out your reason Nerror got 4 upvote for pointing out that barring casuals from vertical progress / forcing tham into grind gameplay by increasing the time to reach max level is a bad idea.
Heck lets dive into the mysteries of page 2, there is a guy Kilion even laying out a framework for what criteria might be the ones that guide the decision of how long it should take to reach max level.
Usually the idea behind shortening the time span necessary to reach max level seems to be related to repetitive, non-engaging gameplay with no significance beyond teaching you the core mechanics of the game.
We now have a better idea about the things players will be barred from when not being level 50 - mainly the high end areas of dungeons, castles and freeholds. We've been over this before, this might be fine.
But: The vertical progression in terms of skill trees is tied to the character level so this is important - once a player has mastered their skillset of that level, they should progress soon after. Levels are meant to increasingly add complexity, master that new level of complexity until, at max level, the player has ALL the complexity (options, layerd abilities, game mechanics) to choose from.
Delaying the leveling progress only makes sense when there are additional things to master based on that current level. Most systems can be - have to be - mastered independent of your character level, so they do not warrant a longer levelling process. With the only thing to master based on level seemingly being active ability composition and augmentation, this seems to me like the only reasonable metric by which to assess whether the leveling process is fast enough or not.
In my opinion there wouldn't be an issue to say it should take around 300 hours to reach max level (That would be 4 months of playing 3 hours 6 days a week) especially since even lower level characters contribute significantly to the growth and maintenance of their Nodes, meaning being slower than others is not bad either.
This is exactly the reason why I even back then felt that 30% would be plenty. Going back to the game time study and the weighted average gaming time of 20,5 hours per week, that means the average player takes around 14-15 weeks (3,5 months) to reach max level. I think that is perfectly reasonable to grab all the basic active abilties and learn the rest of the game at higher levels.
If the argument is to make "more meaningful gameplay at lower levels" at lower levels, I'd say the level requirement for freeholds should be reduced to lv 40 if only to get rid of the misconception that there is something like a hugely different "endgame"
Ultimately, the entire discussion could be postponed into early 2025 when we have a feel for how Ashes of Creation actually plays and we have a feel for how much there is to learn, what level actually influences etc. So with this I will end my contribution to this.
Comments
See, you haven't explained why the use of a different word materially changes the meaning of what was said. To anyone reading, with the context in place, using either word would result in exactly the same understanding.
That is why it was quite literally the same thing.
This is why context is important - words often have different meanings, or encompass many similar terms, Context is what allows people to work out which meaning of that word is intended, or if the word is being used to refer to a single one of the similar terms if encompasses.
This last one was the case here. I am unsure at this point if you don't actually understand this basic aspect of communication, or if you are being purposefully obtuse.
It just doesn't seem like any significant number of future players sees the current leveling speed or progress systems as an issue.
I do find it interesting that the few people that come to these forums and decide to pick a fight with me (seems to happen every 15 or so months) are obsessed with my post count - while I don't even know what my post count is.
Yeah, if this thread can prove one thing, it is that most people either don't want leveling to be too long, or they don't really care - but a very small number of people (one?) *REALLY* care, to a kind of creepy level.
1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 So yeah, "a very small number of creepy people", huh? What is truly creepy is the amount of time you spend on this forum without contributing anything to the game, but whining, lying, manipulating and killing threads with your nonsense.
It ain't gonna work, sweet summer child and here you are - called out for you generalizations and manipulations again.
I'm gonna add this to the list of references in the first comment.
Avada Kedavra
And even if you have said how many in a comment, we have already been over the fact that I have many reasons for not reading some of your posts - or reading only parts of them.
If I didn't quote something you said, you should probably assume I didn't read it. Others need not make that assumption, but you should.
Later that night
"Mommy, Flanker keeps calling me out for my bs, there is nothing I can do!!!! I'm afraid of his superpower to open my profile and check my past comments!!! I think he is stalking me, mommy, I'm so scared!!! He also wrote "Avada Kedavra" so now he also threatens me!!!! *crying on mommy's shoulder*"
Sweet summer child, if you google the translation of that from Aramaic language, you'd realize that it's exactly what has been done to you in this thread and another one.
Of course, I noticed how you skip all points you have 0 chance to argue with and find one sentence or a paragraph that might allow you to continue you pointless spam xD
Not that I expect you to see it, you stopped arguing points and started just arguing against anything I said quite a while ago.
So here is it, another blatant accusation based on thin air, cuz you want to play that victim card so badly.
i check the thread to see if there is new stuff or i just close it.
Im pretty experienced in knowing nit will never end unless to just meme him. Way too much time to waste lmao.
✓ Occasional Roleplayer
✓ Kinda starting to look for a Guild right now. (German)
I probably spend a total of 45 mintes a day on the forums - but that is broken down in to many 2 or 3 minute slots where I am waiting on something or someone. You can tell if I have too much time to waste by the length of my posts - short ones like this mean I only expect to have a minute or two, longer ones mean I probably have a decent chunk of time to kill.
Not 100% sure I read it though.
I did read you claiming I didn't pay attention to things you thought were important but were actually not even worth my time to read, however. Maybe that is what you meant.
The funny thing is, because everyone here has seen it many times, they all know I'm basically just treating you as a form of entertainment. You have long since proven that you currently have no points worth discussing.
You should be ashamed of your behavior
Get lost, forum fauna
As I said earlier, some random seems to get themselves all obsessed with me about every 15 months or so.
And my IQ isn't 9000. I can see how someone like you looks at any number with 3 or more digits as being "unfathomly large", and can see how all such 3 or more digit numbers may just kind of blend in together in to a mass of "numbers you don't need to understand" - but my IQ is not even 900 (shock), let alone 9000.
As to "I should be ashamed of behavior", nope.
You came in here ranting about shit, using data from an inappropriate source that is unable to be verified, claiming it to be the only true data that matters, ignoring more accessable, more acurate data simply because it proves that a different demographic has a different opinion, ignoring a poll that you yourself ran on Reddit, and attempted to slam home your point with the above. It was right back here (before I even looked in to where your charts came from) that you proved to not be worth the time to have a real discussion or debate with. You weren't interested in truth, just in your opinion and in being right - and you would twist and contort things to that end.
On release the developers anticipate max level should be attainable in approximately 45 days if playing 4-6 hours per day.
This is equivalent to approximately 225 hours to reach level 50. What is your opinion on this? Would you prefer it to be faster, slower, or keep it as it is? Why?
Closed • 557 total votes
139
Slower
306 < that's called a majority
Keep it as it is
112
Faster
Voting closed 7 months ago
this is the link
https://www.reddit.com/r/AshesofCreation/comments/1arkw7s/leveling_speed/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button
So what does a majority do? it rules!
Actually great that you linked this one because reading through the comments there it seems to me that the agreement to "slower" seems to be based on the fact that is was a VERY general question, but not only that, I can see you reasons for wanting a lower leveling speed find MUCH less agreement than. Nikr got 13 upvotes for saying slower, cool. But when you explained your reasons that got 2, on the first page. Feels to me that once people dive into actual information and think about the consequences of stretching leveling time the idea loses its luster - much like minimum wage. Also, after you laid out your reason Nerror got 4 upvote for pointing out that barring casuals from vertical progress / forcing tham into grind gameplay by increasing the time to reach max level is a bad idea.
Heck lets dive into the mysteries of page 2, there is a guy Kilion even laying out a framework for what criteria might be the ones that guide the decision of how long it should take to reach max level.
We now have a better idea about the things players will be barred from when not being level 50 - mainly the high end areas of dungeons, castles and freeholds. We've been over this before, this might be fine.
But: The vertical progression in terms of skill trees is tied to the character level so this is important - once a player has mastered their skillset of that level, they should progress soon after. Levels are meant to increasingly add complexity, master that new level of complexity until, at max level, the player has ALL the complexity (options, layerd abilities, game mechanics) to choose from.
Delaying the leveling progress only makes sense when there are additional things to master based on that current level. Most systems can be - have to be - mastered independent of your character level, so they do not warrant a longer levelling process. With the only thing to master based on level seemingly being active ability composition and augmentation, this seems to me like the only reasonable metric by which to assess whether the leveling process is fast enough or not.
Which leads me to my final point:
This is exactly the reason why I even back then felt that 30% would be plenty. Going back to the game time study and the weighted average gaming time of 20,5 hours per week, that means the average player takes around 14-15 weeks (3,5 months) to reach max level. I think that is perfectly reasonable to grab all the basic active abilties and learn the rest of the game at higher levels.
If the argument is to make "more meaningful gameplay at lower levels" at lower levels, I'd say the level requirement for freeholds should be reduced to lv 40 if only to get rid of the misconception that there is something like a hugely different "endgame"
Ultimately, the entire discussion could be postponed into early 2025 when we have a feel for how Ashes of Creation actually plays and we have a feel for how much there is to learn, what level actually influences etc. So with this I will end my contribution to this.