Will Streamers Take Over Our Servers?

Githal

Laetitian wrote: »

Ludullu wrote: »

To me this is literally nothing different from a powerful guild doing the exact same thing. And the game is built around strong guilds doing strong guild things.

Strong guilds are united by shared goals, or at least compatible personalities. Streamer guilds are united by a king crowned through parasocial relationships. Making his clan's actions less representative of real people's interests, and more like mindless drones executing the will of their overlord.
It's just less interesting for the server realm's community at large to engage with that.

Githal wrote: »

Noaani wrote: »

Uncommon Sense wrote: »

just let them have their server and watch it fall off in about a month as the views for the new hype wave disappears ...

This is the correct response.

Streamers won't be in Ashes long term - not if they want an audience. This game is too niche to provide the viewers they need.

Correct response for what exactly?
This is not solution for the problem at hand. You just saying:
"Get oppressed by Streamers in your server for couple of months, Have some miserable experience all the time, AND AFTER THIS, after they leave you will enjoy your EMPTY server that has no players left coz they followed the streamer, and now you need to merge to another server"

Get real and think of the consequences. Coz Intrepid has to take this seriously if we want a great experience.
And they wont if you keep telling BS.

No, the quoted comment by Uncommon Sense hits the nail on the head. Make it easy for players to join servers that don't have large streamers on them, and it'll be fine. There will be a lot of servers, and several streamers will likely join the same ones anyway. As long as you and your existing community make sure you don't join on the servers that the top streamers start playing on, you'll mostly be interacting with real guilds.

Why would streamers join the same server as other streamers?
I dont see what they will win by doing so. But i see what they might lose..
Imagine 2 streamers go in 1 server. obviously 1 of the streamers will be the dominating force on the server. And this will hurt the other streamer views, reputation and ect.

Imagine you are streamer. Why tf would you risk being in server with other streamer where 1 of you will lose from this. Instead to go in server with no other streamer, dominate the server, get free wins everywhere and ect?

Laetitian

Weird out-of-touch question. Streamers don't play to win, they play to entertain. Streamer 1 fighting with or against Streamer 2 is content.

I didn't say they'll all play on the same server realm either. Obviously some of them benefit from keeping their community locked in with them isolated from subscription competition, but a lot of them will still want to play together.

You missed my main point anyway. There will be many server realms. Just avoid them. On release, find out which server realms the top 30 streamers will go on. Pick a different one. Other server realms will primarily have communities that don't revolve around streamers.
There will probably be forum threads tracking this information on launch day.

Githal

Laetitian wrote: »

Weird out-of-touch question. Streamers don't play to win, they play to entertain. Streamer 1 fighting with or against Streamer 2 is content.

I didn't say they'll all play on the same server either. Obviously some of them benefit from keeping their community locked in with them isolated from subscription competition, but a lot of them will still want to play together.

Yeh,... NO!
If you want to watch videos of good fights, you wont be watching Big Streamers with zerg community in the first place. The content these streamers make, and that people watch is them dominating zones. Griefing other players, and ect. People dont expect them to make some grand fights at all,

Laetitian

"The content these streamers make, and that people watch is them dominating zones. Griefing other players, and ect."

Weird reality you created for yourself there. Anyway, I'm unclear on what you think we disagree about when it comes to avoiding streamers.

Githal

Laetitian wrote: »

"The content these streamers make, and that people watch is them dominating zones. Griefing other players, and ect."

Weird reality you created for yourself there. Anyway, I'm unclear on what you think we disagree about when it comes to avoiding streamers.

that they will split in all servers, instead them all going in 1 server

Kilion

Noaani wrote: »

Kilion wrote: »

I really cant stress this enough, I don't think it is reasonable to assume that people waiting for years to play this game have to become subject to the ingame actions of someone who is not primarily driven by the enjoyment of gaming, but the commercial interest of entertaining others on a different platform.

Streamers and their audience have the same "rights" to the game as you and I do. They have just as much right to enjoy Ashes in their own way as we do.

The fact that Ashes is a game where others can fairly significantly negatively impact your own experience is something those of us that have been here a long time should be well aware of, and so those that have been here the longest have the least validity to any complaints in this regard.

Where do I state ANYTHING about them "not having the same right" to play the game? Did you even read my comment? And the fact that you would then go on to tell others who has more or less "validity" is just icing on the cake. Better keep it down, mate.

Blip

Laetitian wrote: »

Weird out-of-touch question. Streamers don't play to win, they play to entertain. Streamer 1 fighting with or against Streamer 2 is content.

I didn't say they'll all play on the same server realm either. Obviously some of them benefit from keeping their community locked in with them isolated from subscription competition, but a lot of them will still want to play together.

You missed my main point anyway. There will be many server realms. Just avoid them. On release, find out which server realms the top 30 streamers will go on. Pick a different one. Other server realms will primarily have communities that don't revolve around streamers.
There will probably be forum threads tracking this information on launch day.

How will you know if you are not watching the streamer(s)?
Find out 2 months in that things are shit becuse of this and you are stuck or have to re-roll.

Better have servers with a streamer tag and some that are for regular joe.

Laetitian

Blip wrote:

How will you know if you are not watching the streamer(s)?

You invest a little research and look up their communities to find out. Look up the top 20 streamers from AoC, WoW, FFXIV, and ESO, and the top 10 streamers from Throne & Liberty and ArcheAge. Check their Reddit or Discords to find out where they're going. If you want to speed up your selection process, put the realm names in a spreadsheet and compare to a list of available realms in your continent; let the spreadsheet manager filter out all names already mentioned in your streamer list. Done.

Again, there will be threads discussing this at launch, if you don't want to do it yourself, or you can share the work with other people you're playing with.

Better have servers with a streamer tag and some that are for regular joe.

I agree that that would be ideal, I'm just saying it won't be a problem whether the devs do this or not. And Steven has said he's not particularly interested in doing it.

Ludullu

Laetitian wrote: »

Strong guilds are united by shared goals, or at least compatible personalities. Streamer guilds are united by a king crowned through parasocial relationships. Making his clan's actions less representative of real people's interests, and more like mindless drones executing the will of their overlord.
It's just less interesting for the server realm's community at large to engage with that. I'd rather play against people who care about the results of their plans, not just making streamerdaddy happy.

I've seen and been in guilds that were based around just the charismatic leader.

Also, everyone plays in their own way. There's gonna be as many guilds as there are gameplay styles. And a lot of those could be "less representative of real people's interests". Like, if you're a pvper and then you come across a full RP guild - would their interests match yours? What about that RP guild meeting a hardcore raid guild that only cares about bosses?

In other words, there's nothing "normal" in mmos. And the only problem with streamers is that people drag that metanarrative into the game. If you just treat that megaguild as "a tyranical charismatic leader managed to control hundreds of people" - the game would be way more fun than going "waaaaah, this big twitch dumbass came to my server with his followers, waaaahhh".

midnight2024

Githal wrote: »

TBH i have always wondered why people play PVE focused MMORPG games. And the answers i reached were that: The PVP in those game sucks and has no PVP content, The players have no Skill and dont want to feel like they are bad when they lose in pvp, so they play PVE where they have 0% chance to lose since the content is for brain dead people.

But i am yet to find the answer how can doing the exact same pve content for the 200th time be any interesting for a person? I mean why do this instead play some RPG game or whatever.

I play both.

It can be hard to relax in games with open PvP.

I totally get someone who wants to be in MMOs while PvE relaxing, although I've returned to doing the RPG thing for my PvE relaxation.

Lodrig

I, for one, Welcome our new Streamer Overlords.

Uncommon Sense

Streamers and influencers will self designate their own server, the lure of clout chasing will be enough.

All Intrepid has to do is provide the right number of servers at launch and anticipate the drop off and merge system mechanics when the hype train derails...

Though if Intrepid wants to provide and accommodate streamers by making a specific server for them that is also ok, as long as it does not result in non streamer servers being neglected or effected in some detrimental way as a result.

Personally would not be pleased if Intrepid shows favoritism or get sucked into the streamer hype train themselves. In which case having all the servers be the same is more appropriate.

As a player you either have the choice to join and participate in 'streamer content' or join another server with other like minded players who don't want to interact with streamers...

there a pros and cons to both options.

Noaani

Githal wrote: »

Pretty sure there will be core group of players that will stick to the game.

For sure.

They are the ones that will populate those last few servers.

Keep in mind, if there is only 1 European server and 2 NA servers, that is still up to 150k active accounts, and 30k concurrent players.

If the game has those 3 servers and they maintain that population 3 years after launch, that is actually still a financially successful game. That is $27 million a year in revenue just from subscriptions.

Noaani

Kilion wrote: »

Noaani wrote: »

Kilion wrote: »

I really cant stress this enough, I don't think it is reasonable to assume that people waiting for years to play this game have to become subject to the ingame actions of someone who is not primarily driven by the enjoyment of gaming, but the commercial interest of entertaining others on a different platform.

Streamers and their audience have the same "rights" to the game as you and I do. They have just as much right to enjoy Ashes in their own way as we do.

The fact that Ashes is a game where others can fairly significantly negatively impact your own experience is something those of us that have been here a long time should be well aware of, and so those that have been here the longest have the least validity to any complaints in this regard.

Where do I state ANYTHING about them "not having the same right" to play the game? Did you even read my comment? And the fact that you would then go on to tell others who has more or less "validity" is just icing on the cake. Better keep it down, mate.

You don't.

I'm saying that there is nothing Intrepid could or should do about it, because playing the game their way is perfectly fine.

You are suggesting that people that have been waiting years to play shouldn't be subject to *whatever* other players wish to do in game, and that is just outright incorrect.

This game is literally about you being subjected to what others are doing.

Aszkalon

So what if they do ?






This should be a NIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIICE Warning-Test of what happens if You are still to unsocial to form and join Guilds when the Game gets released.


GET ALLIES.

Or be dominated by those who managed to get some.

Githal

midnight2024 wrote: »

Githal wrote: »

TBH i have always wondered why people play PVE focused MMORPG games. And the answers i reached were that: The PVP in those game sucks and has no PVP content, The players have no Skill and dont want to feel like they are bad when they lose in pvp, so they play PVE where they have 0% chance to lose since the content is for brain dead people.

But i am yet to find the answer how can doing the exact same pve content for the 200th time be any interesting for a person? I mean why do this instead play some RPG game or whatever.

I play both.

It can be hard to relax in games with open PvP.

I totally get someone who wants to be in MMOs while PvE relaxing, although I've returned to doing the RPG thing for my PvE relaxation.

Ye i mean when Wow for example provide new expansion, it can be quite fun the first few months till you explore everything. After this it becomes a chore that me personally dont find fun.

Would much rather play something like God of war, Dark souls, Elden ring or something like this to relax from a PVP experience. But The PVP has its own charms that bots in pve cant provide.

RedLeader1

RocketFarmer wrote: »

Are we thinking casual solo players are running nodes?

Putting the MMO back in MMORPG means larger groups. Streams will be part of that. Fortunately there should be enough servers and nodes to spread things out. If the problem is that all of the nodes are full on all of the servers, then you have a successful game. Right now in Alpha 2 there are a total of 30 nodes. Very easy to have streamers and large guilds fill that up.

Git gud, find frens.

Not 30 nodes, only 5.

I haven't seen anywhere that the optimal size of a node is, "As many as possible" though, and you can't exclude people from a node AFAIK. So if I want to go to a streamers node and become a citizen, as long as I pay my taxes I'm using up a slot and I don't have to join the guild..

Aszkalon

They already took over.

Kilion

Noaani wrote: »

You are suggesting that people that have been waiting years to play shouldn't be subject to *whatever* other players wish to do in game, and that is just outright incorrect.

That is false. Read again. My entire point is INFLUENCE FROM OUTSIDE THE GAME like trying to run an entertainment show. I have no problem that some people want to do that.
But what I don't understand, nor accept which you didn't address either is, why I have to be subjected to someone elses business endeavor in my freetime. Without consent, without payment. That is why the only thing I ask for is an information option so I can avoid being used as a prop in someones entertainment business. And giving players the information to make an informed decisions is not much to ask.