VFX
Teleport- still don't like the look of this ability, looks cheesy like something out of OG Runescape. Make it look more like this:
[GIF]
Nighttime
-brightness levels are looking better than before, but I would like it a bit darker so that vision is impaired at the end of line of sight away from your character or on the horizon. Like others have said it feels like dusk and not a true nighttime. Would be great if there can be different brightness levels based on the moon cycles and have darker locations like forests, caves, and dungeons that may require an illumination spell or torch. Would also be nice if clouds covering the moon/sun cast shadows below and make it darker. Also make the night sky darker to help those colors pop. Hopefully there will be some variation in color so it's not always a blend of purple/pink, I feel that this could be a bit much. Just a dark sky with scattered stars would be nice too.
-The new moons look great and the sky looks great. Would like to see less clouds in the desert biome and more often clear skies to match the climate while places like the mountains/forests are cloudy more often than not.
-remove the floating green particles, they are out of place in a Desert biome
-The fire and torches shown in the video should flicker and not have static brightness levels like this -
[GIF]
Agree with the parts I included, which is most of your post.
The teleport GIF you included looks somewhat like the "teleport" they showed off ages ago during the first weather/season tech stream, but never clarified what class it was meant for. It looked really cool. Sort of a fast, invulnerable smoke cloud.
Agree on nighttime brightness. I also think a lantern would be an awesome mechanic. Perhaps it's something your character always has on their person, stowed in their "backpack" during the day and fastened on their hip at night. There could be a quick animation to take it out, light it, and put it on your hip whenever you're ready to use it, then to put it out and stow it when you're done. You can choose whether to light it for better vision at night or in deep, unlit caves, or leave it unlit to remain less visible. Obviously, nameplates are a thing, but if you're a rogue or any class with a stealth ability, you'd want to have it unlit when trying to hide or pass through somewhere unseen. No fuel though, that's just annoying unless it's a core mechanic of a game. Could also be a great opportunity to sell an additional category of cosmetic. That's a cosmetic I'd actually spend money on, since it's just a lantern and not supposed to be some big accomplishment like gear or a mount.
looking good, love the VFX on the wand changing elements, the camera blur/shakes in some skills made it a lot better and more impactful, audio is 10/10 really nailing it,
love the fireflies and camera particles, keep it up, they sell the environment and mood, the ambient fog is looking awesome, overall spot on visuals, skybox is looking great as well
dont make the night any darker, its good - and don't tone down vfx, they are in a good spot
combat is looking much, much better, looking forward to see the Bard and Rogue,
I loved to see that we now have target of target UI, hoping we still have time to have target markers before A2, very important UI element for wars/sieges
- this level of darkness is a good benchmark for what the maximum darkness at night should be - I wouldn't mind a bit brighter but it still looked great
- lightning spell casting, animations, colours, vfx all look fantastic!
- skybox was beautiful!
- fireball could be a bit bigger and have some flames flaking off it, or something to give more of a chaotic fiery look - currently it looks like a very clean linear streak of particles, which is nice but maybe not very distinct
- the impact of fireball looks strange, like a few angled planes with the fire effect...it somehow doesn't look very organic as an explosion effect
Edit: rethinking the darkness, I think a bit brighter and more vibrant would be better. If I'm logging on for a 4 hour play session and it's all night, I'd want to be able to see and appreciate the character/mob models more than seeing all darkened figures.
Even the mob attacks are targeted, no way to counterplay.
What you're asking for is full action combat though because the current counter play comes in the form of skills which for some reason they barely show off. There will be movement abilities that disjoint projectiles and defensive shields you can cast
A projectile fired from a player targeting another player will always hit that target (Given the target does nothing). We can argue this until the cows come home but this is what is chosen for this game. Just give them some time to add in some more combat mechanics via skills, such as blocking, reflecting, dodging aoes, disjointing projectiles and so on, and it won't seem so static.
IMO, this is a better route to take since we know how action combat truly goes when large amounts of players are involved (Spoiler: Not well). But at the end of the day, if you want Black Desert combat, this game isn't doing that. Request skills that give you agency.
OK, sounds like you want specific feedback on the actual skill tree items.
First off. I love the idea that we can set up how long we want our combos to be. Considering that its not just the mage using the wands, but potentially every class, there could be some really cool builds around ability cooldown times and weapon combos lining up.
Being able to add different elemental damage is a cool way to stack on other team synergies, class builds, and monster resistances. Makes sense for a wand I'd say. I like that they had already thought of putting frost damage on the wand to balance out the fire/lightning build by the mage in this case. Smart.
The two procs in the top left, Echo and Perfect Timing, look like they could be really cool.
Echo says when you strike a target with direct damage, it gets struck again for magical damage. My assumption is that this means after you proc this on a combo, whether you wand them or use an ability on them, it doubles it. So you probably want to watch out for this proc and then land some really big ability to get double damage (and effect!). Also like that it acts as a way to add "magical damage" which may be useful when using huge physical damage abilities against high armour mobs etc.
Perfect Timing is cool. Any time you get cooldown reduction in a game you have to look out for possibly breaking something. I'm always a big fan of these mechanics when they are balanced. Considering that the perfect time to use an ability is right after your weapon combos go off, I can see this being a very important pick for many builds.
Both of these have huge potential as part of the regular combat game play. Doubling an ability or reducing CD by 5s is huge, so watching out for the combo is a fun attention grabber and can separate high skilled from medium skilled players. Especially with Echo, because if you miss the proc, your wand attack might get doubled rather than an ability.
Overall, I think weaving between abilities and weapon combos is a very interesting way to implement combat in this game. It's a dynamic playstyle with a strong incentive for wise ability use rather than just spamming them constantly on cooldown. The combo system makes you want to keep using the weapon swings, but sometime you just NEED the right ability at the right time, and that tension is really good to have in regular gameplay to keep the combat fun and exciting. Even strategy around stunning/snaring an enemy before they can get their weapon combo off could be something you see in high level pvp.
I can see that the 3 tiers of +15%, +15,%, +15% damage or whatever for each branch on the tree provides some weapon progression while levelling, that's fine.
Only criticism I have is that the whole tree looks like it is filled out when maxed, and the only options appear to be weapon elemental damage and Echo/Perfect Timing. Would be nice to have a few more things that we are deciding on, even after the thing is maxed.
I'm really looking forward to trying this out in Alpha 2, and for just messing around with the system in general to see how different styles and tree paths feel to play.
Q: How do you feel about the Alpha Two Midnight Magic Preview?
A:Looking good Overall its definitely moving in the right direction. I think that no matter what there will always be room for improvement so even though i am happy with what i saw i will still provide my constructive feedback for the team to so by release we can have the best possible MMO we could want.
Q:What excites you about playing and interacting with the Wand Weapon Combo system?
A: It feels kind of bland. I am digging the elemental change proc but other than that it feels very samey as an auto attack. It would be nice if he has just done some more regular auto attacks so we could see exactly how the things in the tree are effecting the attack. Having multiple different proc types beyond the laser could be interesting. like maybe on the end attack you draw power reducing the cooldown of your chosen element or other interesting procs that you could choose from.
Q:What are your thoughts on the night-time lighting shown during the livestream?
A: I think it could be darker yet. In the middle of the desert you would get some moon glow but it would be pretty dark when away from other light sources. I feel like that darkness could be used as an interesting mechanic for players. Using the dark as a mechanic in an MMO HAS NEVER BEEN truly taken advantage of. Like when you see a light in the distance you dont know if its an enemy or friendly or if its monster camps or a possible caravan. Maybe your moving through the desert with a caravan that's all lit up this gives you the advantage of being able to see where you are going but will also make it easier for enemies to spot you. Maybe at night the world becomes more dangerous. Also the darkness open up options for torch off hand/lantern belt slot or off hand as well as support spells that light up the areas. Different lantern types could be had like ones that provide less overall light but let you see stealth or some provide a larger glow around, and some provide a light that casts out forward more. There is a lot of mechanics that could be leveraged in just having a really dark night time as well as some dark caves. You can quickly kill your lights on pvp servers to hide from other players assuming they aren't close enough for nameplates as well as a bonus to stealth classes.
Q:Is there anything in particular you’re excited or concerned about regarding what was shown during the Alpha Two Midnight Magic Preview?
A: I would like to see less generic skill presses. In almost every mmo every its just the basic press button>attack or press>cast>attack>damage. I would like to see a variety of types of button press types.
"priming skills (x amount of time to use x attacks, cd starts at prime)" "charge" based skills (x uses on separate cds) Multi-press attack (x seconds to cast all attacks, attacks must be used in succession unlike priming) Charging up holding Hold timing release
Explained more below. With some examples. Obviously its up to the devs to incorporate our ideas along with their own but its up to them how in-depth and dynamic they want it. Personally I think with the UE engine being so powerful in the right hands they could really do a lot.
These combo presses add a whole extra layer to each players and can be incorporated into skill trees/talent so they can be more optional for bonus damage for players who don't want more simple experience or talent deeper into these skills for a more skill based experience with the possibilities for more damage.
Q:Are there similar systems to the Wand Weapon Combo system you’ve seen in other games that you like or dislike? If so, please explain!
A:I don't think having proc/combo attacks at the end of a attack combo is exactly a new but i do like it being incorporated into mmo.
Q: Are there other games with night-time lighting that you like or dislike? If so, what are they and why?
A: Dragons Dogma 1+2 has a nice balance of needing lantern to see but also dark enough you don't need to blast your brightness to see. Sometimes those darker environments can really work nice since you can get insane contrast do draw players to specific places and give and overall sense of dread not knowing where you are in the complete darkness and not being able to see what's over the hill.
Please don’t feel limited by the thought-starters above. Feel free to share anything you’d like about Ashes of Creation’s Alpha Two Midnight Magic Preview shown during the April Development Update
If you happen to read my post I would like you to make the suggestion to the combat team to make more interactive spells and abilities. Adding multi-press abilities adds a whole extra depth to the combat. As an example i will reference some of the skills in the video how it would add an extra layer of depth. The triple fire ball could be reworked so when you press the button you do a quick cast (priming) and then you get 6 second to throw 3 fireballs so after the initial press you can triple tap it and send all 3 or weave it into other skills since you get 6 seconds that resets each throw. you can throw out another spell and then follow it with a fireball multiple times but the CD for the spell would still start at the initial prime so it doesn't feel wasted if you don't throw them all together to start the CD. The lightning strike spell could be reworked to a way so its either so instead of just a cast it has a charge up and the longer you hold it the stronger the spell is where it always deals the base damage but can deal more if able to hold longer. The ball lighting maybe you can press it 2 times after its traveling outward to release static pulses. The fire patch could have a second press where if you time it on the cast bar right it deal extra damage and has a larger patch. I think adding multi-press skills adds an extra depth to the combat system giving "combo" potential. The function of the fireball spell can work with multi hit melee skills as well for comboing. So in an ideal world you could cast the fireball "priming", throw the lightning ball out, follow with a full charge lightning strike then 1st fireball, do the lightning pulse and 2nd fireball and then combo the fire area spell timing and hit 3rd fireball.
I get that the purpose of Weapon Combo System is to ensure that weapons are more than stat sticks, that's cool and original, but it shouldn't be used at all when 90% of your skills are off-cooldown. Clearly the skills are not good enough to be worth using. Spamming 1 key is not a fun part of the combat, it's lazy and it doesn't matter how good it looks if the skill ceiling is nonexistent. A 6-years old can outplay a grown man in this game. It's already bad enough that it's almost entirely tab target.
Even the mob attacks are targeted, no way to counterplay. I feel suffocated just looking at it, from how restrictive the combat is.
I actually feel the exact opposite. In games where you can just side step/dodge projectiles you don't even need gear progressions or great builds to do well. I've seen someone beat Elden Ring with just basic items because they dodged/rolled everything. Personally I find that more tedius than fun. At any rate, it's a different game design and they aren't changing it at this point.
You might not understand the direction they are going with timing abilities and trying to get weapon combos as the combat loop rather than trying to dodge/roll attacks all the time. The perfect time to use an ability is right after landing a weapon combo. Hence why one of the wand skills was called "Perfect Time" and reduces the cooldown of your next ability by 5s.
The whole point of the system is dynamically switching between your abilities and the weapon combos. Not just mindlessly spamming one or the other and dodge/rolling monster attacks. If you don't want to get hit, find a tank. If you don't want to rest, find a healer. That's the whole idea behind these games.
This is probably all to come, but I would really like it if spell effect lighting interacted with the environment / character model more.
For example, the lightning and fireball spells should highlight the floor and walls around them and potentially remove the player's shadow from being visible when it is cast, or cast new shadows.
Ranged attacks/spells that don't emit light should instead, cast a shadow in the environment as they move. The spell effects are a good start but they currently float in the environment and don't seem connected in the world.
A decent example of how a fireball could look and interact with the environment is No Rest for the Wicked.
How do you feel about the Alpha Two Midnight Magic Preview?
This preview is visually stunning. It was a bunch of well delivered information and the topics went well together and flowed into one another well. Appreciate the emphesis on the improvements made from feedback from the community.
What excites you about playing and interacting with the *Wand &* Wand Weapon Combo system?
I think the most impressive part of the wand was the sheer impact that you feel with a wand! It's really quite something. I think having something like a beam build is cool, I look forward to seeing if there is a rapid hitting kind of build or the other builds to see if there's something that could work with a rogue. I am curious how ranged weapons will work with 'on-hit' style builds and if something like a rapid-fire wand can be used for bleed fighter builds, for example. The combo system is a brain tickler, just the way I like it lol
What are your thoughts on the night-time lighting *& Skybox* shown during the livestream?
Beautiful. Natural. Terrific. I cannot say how perfect I think this all looks. From the way the fires from the torches falls off. The ambience that it lends to the fireflies. The nebula from/around the broken moon and the dynamic animations for the moon! And the other moon looking so unique! 100/10 Seriously my favorite skybox in any game, maybe ever?
Is there anything in particular you’re excited or concerned about regarding what was shown during the Alpha Two Midnight Magic Preview?
I think going for the more grounded, real to life look with the night time is great, obviously. The VFX of the spells glowing around their immediate effects is gorgrous. There is a strange blue corona around the intact moon, if this is intentional it looks cool, if there isn't an in game reason though I would be curious as to the cause. The only improvement I would recommend is having the spell effects reflect on the environment around it, this was addressed on stream. If this is not possible due to compatability issues, I still think this looks amazing!
*Other Feedback*
The updated Lightning Ball is super cool. Love the new effect.
The Carphin set looks awesome. It looks way better than I personally thought it would from the concept art, and seeing it move was really a selling point. Though the tassle in the front didn't seem to be moving as much as it maybe should be in response to rapid movement.
The Risen Warhorns look dope, good job on those guys and their weapon effects look super cool.
As a person interested in potentially playing a Rogue main I am curious as to what the intended effects, if any, night time has on stealth mechanics?
As a person interested in Animal Husbandry I am curious if there are animals that are more/less active during different times of days and seasons? It would be cool to have a stable of exclusivly nocturnal animals, just saying.
Professional Skeptic, Entertainer, and Animal Enthusiast
I do rather like the new skybox, and I feel like a greater emphasis on stuff in the environment that glows at night (say, magic mushrooms or whatnot) would help with the aesthetic. A greater emphasis on bloom lighting from abilities and effects could have the potential to make nighttime visuals really interesting and distinct... OR possibly overstimulating; a visual designer, I am not, I just adore Satorl Marsh in Xenoblade.
I couldn't find a video that cleanly shows the transition, but... here's Satorl Marsh in the daytime...
Beyond that... the Ball Lightning looked pretty great, but I'm not really a fan of the 'concentration' lightning spell staying stationary for quite as long as it does; I'd rather my lightning be a bit more spastic. But MECHANICALLY speaking...
Without good PVE, to me this mostly just looks pretty. A system is only as good as its mechanical depth, and in the process of watching I realized something important I felt Ashes was missing:
Interrupts from FFXI.
To explain... spells in FFXI have cast times (let's call it an average of 2-3 seconds, with 5-6 for certain spells), and if a caster - whether player or mob - gets hit sufficiently hard/fast enough while prepping their spell, it has a chance to get 'interrupted' and not cast. There's gear and buff effects that can mitigate the Interrupt rate, and it can be a valid thing to build for against some enemy types.
FFXI uses an auto-attack system, and player input comes from things like your specific positioning, spell casts, 'weaponskills', etc, but the Interrupt system especially made a strong impact on me (pun not intended) when I started playing. My first and most-leveled class in the game is Black Mage, see. I went into the game having a good general idea of how it worked and what I wanted to build, but my bestie didn't explain Interrupts to me at ALL - I speculate this was on purpose. So, the first time I went to fight some low level mobs outside of the starter city I chose and my spell cast was interrupted by an enemy, I STILL remember suddenly realizing - "Oh, hits MATTER."
FFXI has nowhere near the tactile feedback of a game like Monster Hunter, but systems like that fill in the blanks really well - when you're sufficiently immersed, you can FEEL those hits, and it greatly incentivizes learning enemy attack timings, so as to cast your spells with as little chance of getting Interrupted as possible.
TLDR I would argue that a system like this should apply to several of the ability types in Ashes - not ALL of them, of course, some things are intended to be instant and riskless to use - but I feel stuff like this adds substantial depth to a system, provides a crucial sense of feedback and consequence, adds strategic depth, makes mobs more threatening, boosts immersion, and gives players more to learn with each enemy type. And that's putting aside the potential PVP shenanigans that can ensue.
What are your thoughts on the night-time lighting shown during the livestream?
- I think it looks good but some changes/improvements i would like to see is: 1. bright spells to light up the close are of that spell, the bright flames felt a bit weird when it was so dark around them. 2. If you have any equipment, like a lantern as a off-hand to give some light in a very small area around your character. Overall it looks really good
Is there anything in particular you’re excited or concerned about regarding what was shown during the Alpha Two Midnight Magic Preview?
- Excited for most of it but got really hyped when you showed how the ball of lightning looks now. It looks way better in my opinion. just love watching the progression of this wonderul game
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Even the mob attacks are targeted, no way to counterplay.
What you're asking for is full action combat though because the current counter play comes in the form of skills which for some reason they barely show off. There will be movement abilities that disjoint projectiles and defensive shields you can cast
A projectile fired from a player targeting another player will always hit that target (Given the target does nothing). We can argue this until the cows come home but this is what is chosen for this game. Just give them some time to add in some more combat mechanics via skills, such as blocking, reflecting, dodging aoes, disjointing projectiles and so on, and it won't seem so static.
IMO, this is a better route to take since we know how action combat truly goes when large amounts of players are involved (Spoiler: Not well). But at the end of the day, if you want Black Desert combat, this game isn't doing that. Request skills that give you agency.
I get that the purpose of Weapon Combo System is to ensure that weapons are more than stat sticks, that's cool and original, but it shouldn't be used at all when 90% of your skills are off-cooldown. Clearly the skills are not good enough to be worth using. Spamming 1 key is not a fun part of the combat, it's lazy and it doesn't matter how good it looks if the skill ceiling is nonexistent. A 6-years old can outplay a grown man in this game. It's already bad enough that it's almost entirely tab target.
Even the mob attacks are targeted, no way to counterplay. I feel suffocated just looking at it, from how restrictive the combat is.
I actually feel the exact opposite. In games where you can just side step/dodge projectiles you don't even need gear progressions or great builds to do well. I've seen someone beat Elden Ring with just basic items because they dodged/rolled everything. Personally I find that more tedius than fun. At any rate, it's a different game design and they aren't changing it at this point.
You might not understand the direction they are going with timing abilities and trying to get weapon combos as the combat loop rather than trying to dodge/roll attacks all the time. The perfect time to use an ability is right after landing a weapon combo. Hence why one of the wand skills was called "Perfect Time" and reduces the cooldown of your next ability by 5s.
The whole point of the system is dynamically switching between your abilities and the weapon combos. Not just mindlessly spamming one or the other and dodge/rolling monster attacks. If you don't want to get hit, find a tank. If you don't want to rest, find a healer. That's the whole idea behind these games.
need
It's an MMORPG. Time is money, money is progress. If you dodge every weak mob's basic attack, you're wasting time, so gear is always needed to facetank basic attacks and kill faster. This mage can spam Wand attacks while running sideways if the attacks weren't targeted, but it will be slower than stopping and casting a powerful spell.
That said, sitting down to regen HP after every 3 kills is also a waste of time, hence the many solutions I proposed. We don't even have active blocking anymore, it got replaced by RNG blocking. (╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻
I'm surprised the nighttime feedback is so positive. It's fairly grey now in my eyes. I'd like to see more contrast in the distance, right now the feel is very average-videogame-y. Which isn't always a bad thing, since it gives people a feeling of familiarity, but I think it clashes with the semi-realistic look of Ashes. Both the sky and the landscape should have more extreme dark tonal ranges and higher contrasts.
@Skills: This is just a vague impression, but I'm really not seeing enough dedicated buff and debuff abilities in most classes. I know there are balancing concerns and class identity concerns at play here, but quite frankly, playstyle prioritisation between the types of abilities that have to be prepared and set up, and abilities that deal damage and directly disable the opponent, is a ton of fun. And I hope the skill design team doesn't get too in their heads about creating a consistent balancing system structured around everyone executing the same mindless number-optimising skill rotations, and every class having unique roles, at the cost of making the individual player's gameplay diverse and fun.
Less hyperfocus on chaining and proccing and synergising (which is fun, don't get me wrong), more room for genuine, tangible, play-style-deciding differences in build choices, and powerful, non-damaging buff/debuff abilities. Where one player relies on high cooldown buffs to reach their full potential, one player focuses much more on controlling the enemy than dealing damage themselves (not only Bards should have debuffs); and one player is just that reliable DPS machine that's ready for battle at full capacity in any given moment. Less focus on skill ceilings and skill floor, more focus on variation and fun.
No one but yourself can validate you for all the posts you *didn't* write.
That moon seems comparatively large in the sky compared to Earth's. It seems like it would be very easy to have Eclipses.
Might be neet to have proper orbits for the moons and have Eclipses occur as emergent gameplay. Sorry I thought this was the feedback link and I can't find a delete button in mobile.
The moon seems comparatively larger compared to Earth's (as a percentage of the sky it takes up) It might be neat to have an established orbit and determine when Eclipses might happen for emergent gameplay.
This could be a little bit of a controversial but i think nameplates should be always off and never able to be turned on they only pop up when u select somone. Couple reasons for this, add way more immersion to the world it a beautiful world and having nameplates everywhere just destroys that, Adds the ability for mobs/players to sneak up without name plates giving them away especialy at night time, Helps with performance in large scale content nameplates in all games ive played has cause lag issues in large scale. The darker nights are somewhat pointless when there glaring name plates everywhere.
Imo remove all name plates and only have them show up when either:
A) your target somone (or hover over them if ur in the action camera mode) The mob/player has hit yourself or somone in the party
I personaly think this would be the best but there is another option of having nameplate up during the day and disabled during the night time cycle of the game to make night feel a little more dangerous with things being able to sneak up on you easier but i still think you should get rid of them all together especially for a PvX game. If you have the option to enable or disable them they will always be on with the exception of maybe screenshots which is a shame since the world is much more immersive without them.
yea I saw the narc video, absolutely not for removing name plates, visible nameplates are a huge must for many of us, optional settings is the way, AoC is not a survival game, its not too dark that you cant see people, just dont go any darker than that its in a good spot
I get that the purpose of Weapon Combo System is to ensure that weapons are more than stat sticks, that's cool and original, but it shouldn't be used at all when 90% of your skills are off-cooldown. Clearly the skills are not good enough to be worth using. Spamming 1 key is not a fun part of the combat, it's lazy and it doesn't matter how good it looks if the skill ceiling is nonexistent. A 6-years old can outplay a grown man in this game. It's already bad enough that it's almost entirely tab target.
Even the mob attacks are targeted, no way to counterplay. I feel suffocated just looking at it, from how restrictive the combat is.
(P.S The realistic water splash is refreshing to see, though. Make use of that beautiful UE5 graphics and give us water magic! instead of copying dead games.) Another major problem is HP/MP recovery. The fact that you need to pause and sit down after every 2-3 mobs is crazy. Pausing should never be part of the gameplay. Imagine sitting down in the middle of a war as a Cleric, meditating as your teammates are dying. Ridiculous.
Can't mage heal via life/nature/water/time/spirit magic? Or combine fire & earth to create life/plant magic. Ashes of Creation has one of the weakest mage fantasies I have ever seen. Mage in my opinion should be the "jack of all trade, master of none" class, the king of utility. Not just an Elementalist.
Here Steven accidentally used the Magma Field on himself while backpedaling, judging by how the tab-target skills icons turned gray, he might have walked out of range while casting, if not mouse misplacement.
Therefore, there needs to be distance meter next to the target's nameplate, like this.
The meter is especially essential for the Ranger class to maintain the maximum distance from the target.
I believe damage over time ground skills like Magma Field and Ball Lightning should be instant-cast, and not stay for too long & cause visual clutter, otherwise at least the Ball Lightning needs to be gone for good, since combat in Ashes is planned to be balanced around group PVP.
I watched the video multiple times, both skills are difficult to fully utilize, and this is even more true in PVP, making them insta-cast seems to be the balanced solution.
While staring at the skill tree, I realized that every element is separated into its own tree, does that mean in the future when there are more skills and new trees available, players can choose 1-3 elements/role/playstyle to specialize in?
If that's the case, then I hope instead of forcing us to unlock the previous skill, it becomes based on how many points are invested into the element and the total invested points, that way we have more freedom to customize our builds when the tree gets bigger. Perhaps new trees can be unlocked when a player invests 10 points in two elements, like Fire & Frost = Water/Mist/Illusion magic. | Earth & Lightning = Storm/Wind magic. | Fire & Earth = Life/Plant/Wood magic.
Just throwing in random ideas. Sorry I wrote so much >_<"
Thank you for reading.
''It's already bad enough that it's almost entirely tab target.''
We were promised hybrid combat and we got full on tab targeting archaic 90's MMORPG.
I get that the purpose of Weapon Combo System is to ensure that weapons are more than stat sticks, that's cool and original, but it shouldn't be used at all when 90% of your skills are off-cooldown. Clearly the skills are not good enough to be worth using. Spamming 1 key is not a fun part of the combat, it's lazy and it doesn't matter how good it looks if the skill ceiling is nonexistent. A 6-years old can outplay a grown man in this game. It's already bad enough that it's almost entirely tab target.
Even the mob attacks are targeted, no way to counterplay. I feel suffocated just looking at it, from how restrictive the combat is.
(P.S The realistic water splash is refreshing to see, though. Make use of that beautiful UE5 graphics and give us water magic! instead of copying dead games.) Another major problem is HP/MP recovery. The fact that you need to pause and sit down after every 2-3 mobs is crazy. Pausing should never be part of the gameplay. Imagine sitting down in the middle of a war as a Cleric, meditating as your teammates are dying. Ridiculous.
Can't mage heal via life/nature/water/time/spirit magic? Or combine fire & earth to create life/plant magic. Ashes of Creation has one of the weakest mage fantasies I have ever seen. Mage in my opinion should be the "jack of all trade, master of none" class, the king of utility. Not just an Elementalist.
Here Steven accidentally used the Magma Field on himself while backpedaling, judging by how the tab-target skills icons turned gray, he might have walked out of range while casting, if not mouse misplacement.
Therefore, there needs to be distance meter next to the target's nameplate, like this.
The meter is especially essential for the Ranger class to maintain the maximum distance from the target.
I believe damage over time ground skills like Magma Field and Ball Lightning should be instant-cast, and not stay for too long & cause visual clutter, otherwise at least the Ball Lightning needs to be gone for good, since combat in Ashes is planned to be balanced around group PVP.
I watched the video multiple times, both skills are difficult to fully utilize, and this is even more true in PVP, making them insta-cast seems to be the balanced solution.
While staring at the skill tree, I realized that every element is separated into its own tree, does that mean in the future when there are more skills and new trees available, players can choose 1-3 elements/role/playstyle to specialize in?
If that's the case, then I hope instead of forcing us to unlock the previous skill, it becomes based on how many points are invested into the element and the total invested points, that way we have more freedom to customize our builds when the tree gets bigger. Perhaps new trees can be unlocked when a player invests 10 points in two elements, like Fire & Frost = Water/Mist/Illusion magic. | Earth & Lightning = Storm/Wind magic. | Fire & Earth = Life/Plant/Wood magic.
Just throwing in random ideas. Sorry I wrote so much >_<"
Thank you for reading.
''Can't mage heal via life/nature/water/time/spirit magic? Or combine fire & earth to create life/plant magic. Mage in my opinion should be the "jack of all trade, master of none" class, the king of utility. Not just an Elementalist.''
The only thing I don't agree in this post. Mage should never be able to heal unless it has Cleric augment or its using some sort of consumable like potion or bandage.
This is probably all to come, but I would really like it if spell effect lighting interacted with the environment / character model more.
For example, the lightning and fireball spells should highlight the floor and walls around them and potentially remove the player's shadow from being visible when it is cast, or cast new shadows.
Ranged attacks/spells that don't emit light should instead, cast a shadow in the environment as they move. The spell effects are a good start but they currently float in the environment and don't seem connected in the world.
A decent example of how a fireball could look and interact with the environment is No Rest for the Wicked.
Why stop there?
Clouds at night should cast shadow on the ground too and god rays should peak through from time to time, just like in No Rest for the Wicked.
Wands: It might be satifying to have some random shake in the wand during channeled attacks.
Night-Time Lighting: Much improved, good work.
I was thinking mid-night would be the Rogue's high point of natural stealth benefit, could it be made darker, or darker shadows for that time? Cloud shadows?
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I get that the purpose of Weapon Combo System is to ensure that weapons are more than stat sticks, that's cool and original, but it shouldn't be used at all when 90% of your skills are off-cooldown. Clearly the skills are not good enough to be worth using. Spamming 1 key is not a fun part of the combat, it's lazy and it doesn't matter how good it looks if the skill ceiling is nonexistent. A 6-years old can outplay a grown man in this game. It's already bad enough that it's almost entirely tab target.
Even the mob attacks are targeted, no way to counterplay. I feel suffocated just looking at it, from how restrictive the combat is.
(P.S The realistic water splash is refreshing to see, though. Make use of that beautiful UE5 graphics and give us water magic! instead of copying dead games.) Another major problem is HP/MP recovery. The fact that you need to pause and sit down after every 2-3 mobs is crazy. Pausing should never be part of the gameplay. Imagine sitting down in the middle of a war as a Cleric, meditating as your teammates are dying. Ridiculous.
Can't mage heal via life/nature/water/time/spirit magic? Or combine fire & earth to create life/plant magic. Ashes of Creation has one of the weakest mage fantasies I have ever seen. Mage in my opinion should be the "jack of all trade, master of none" class, the king of utility. Not just an Elementalist.
Here Steven accidentally used the Magma Field on himself while backpedaling, judging by how the tab-target skills icons turned gray, he might have walked out of range while casting, if not mouse misplacement.
Therefore, there needs to be distance meter next to the target's nameplate, like this.
The meter is especially essential for the Ranger class to maintain the maximum distance from the target.
I believe damage over time ground skills like Magma Field and Ball Lightning should be instant-cast, and not stay for too long & cause visual clutter, otherwise at least the Ball Lightning needs to be gone for good, since combat in Ashes is planned to be balanced around group PVP.
I watched the video multiple times, both skills are difficult to fully utilize, and this is even more true in PVP, making them insta-cast seems to be the balanced solution.
While staring at the skill tree, I realized that every element is separated into its own tree, does that mean in the future when there are more skills and new trees available, players can choose 1-3 elements/role/playstyle to specialize in?
If that's the case, then I hope instead of forcing us to unlock the previous skill, it becomes based on how many points are invested into the element and the total invested points, that way we have more freedom to customize our builds when the tree gets bigger. Perhaps new trees can be unlocked when a player invests 10 points in two elements, like Fire & Frost = Water/Mist/Illusion magic. | Earth & Lightning = Storm/Wind magic. | Fire & Earth = Life/Plant/Wood magic.
Just throwing in random ideas. Sorry I wrote so much >_<"
Thank you for reading.
''Can't mage heal via life/nature/water/time/spirit magic? Or combine fire & earth to create life/plant magic. Mage in my opinion should be the "jack of all trade, master of none" class, the king of utility. Not just an Elementalist.''
The only thing I don't agree in this post. Mage should never be able to heal unless it has Cleric augment or its using some sort of consumable like potion or bandage.
Originally, the Mage had a self-heal skill in the form of a lifeforce drain attack, it wasn't strong or even worth the skill points outside of solo PVE, but it was good enough to not need to sit down every 3-4 kills.
Only 3.62% of the HP was healed (50/1380 HP). Meanwhile a Cleric can heal 50% HP in one skill.
What crazy gamebreaking balace disaster would there be if other classes could self-heal in such a tiny amount instead of being forced to sit down and idly stare at your screen in which absolutely nothing is happening?
Anyhow, it doesn't have to be a healing skill, the HP/MP problem needs to be addressed somehow.
How do you feel about the Alpha Two Midnight Magic Preview?
I really enjoyed the updates on the feedback that was given before as well as the new detail about the weapon progressions.
What excites you about playing and interacting with the Wand Weapon Combo system?
Specific to the wand weapon combo system, I think the beam was very cool. In general for weapon system progression for different weapons, I hope that it means that different weapons will result in different casting as well. For example, wands seem like they should be for players that want a more rapid casting time or more 1v1 combat type, while a grimoire for example might mean spells take longer to cast but they have higher area of effects on impact or geared to maybe being able to combo spells at once? I think it would make for good risk vs reward, one takes longer to cast but has more AOE or effects etc. and the wand has more rapid casting, maybe less single spell damage, and of course less area of effects
What are your thoughts on the night-time lighting shown during the livestream?
I think the night time lighting has definitely improved. I was not a fan of prior stream night time lightings it seemed to bright and even the torch lightings seemed like it didn't matter because it didn't really provide any more value to being able to see. I think in this stream it has definitely improved. The only thing I am hoping for is that the weather effects the lighting as well and that moon phases (if there are any) also affect the lighting. If it is stormy and rainy at night with lots of cloud cover, I think it should be even darker than a clear night with the moon out. It just makes sense to have less field of vision with less light in the sky. Similarly, if there are moon phases, we know that when it is a full moon it looks very bright at night if it is a clear sky. You can walk and see pretty clearly, but if the moon is in a phase where it isn't as lit up, it is much darker. This effect would be cool to see in game too.
- How do you feel about the Alpha Two Midnight Magic Preview?
Pretty good, I liked seeing the wand changes and some changes to the night! The desert still feels a bit more sparse on vegetation than I'd hope to see, but it is far better than just being sand dunes and saguaro cacti like a Warner Bros cartoon.
- What excites you about playing and interacting with the Wand Weapon Combo system?
What we have looks like fun, I can see the wand being really effective for a lot of archetypes!
- What are your thoughts on the night-time lighting shown during the livestream?
I watched the YT version and I like the progress quite a bit! I feel like the lighting was maybe a bit washed out like an ambient light set across the scene was making things less crisp and clear, but it could be the recording not capturing the details or maybe my monitor not being beefy enough to properly represent these contrasts. I could see more of an emphasis on reducing contrast on more lowly lit things and focusing on more pop/shine/appeal for interactable features (creatures, resources, POIs, etc) as well as using moonlight direction to cast shadows and create a corona for strong silhouettes. There's no rush though, it isn't launching tomorrow, there's plenty of time to keep at it!
- Is there anything in particular you’re excited or concerned about regarding what was shown during the Alpha Two Midnight Magic Preview?
Excited for A2 mostly. Concerned that there won't be as much room for weapon expression for every archetype, so a wand for warriors or a bow for casters is "playable but not optimal" still gives me a bit of concern. For example I'd imagine all Py'Rai to be experts with bows like a classic Wood Elf, and to have a desire or preference towards them despite their archetype--and that may even be the case, but there will still be archetypes that use the bow better than a Wood Elf caster. I love how separated weapons are from power sets in DCUO where each weapon is it's own whole kit that doesn't need or prefer a specific power set, so players can try and master them all to really find what works or feels best for their playstyle.
- Are there similar systems to the Wand Weapon Combo system you’ve seen in other games that you like or dislike? If so, please explain!
I really want blast and beam to be like "light" and "heavy" attacks that can be selectively accessed instead of (if I got it right) beams being an upgraded blast. I thought DCUO did a great job of combining a weapon's light and heavy attacks into useful combos that made weapons stand out from hotbar-slotted power sets. If it is all one click for weapon attacks, I could see other ways to weave the wand in... Tap to burst, hold to charge and release a beam, tap while defending for a timed wand parry, hold while defending to create an elemental "okay hit me but some damage will go back to you" defense, and create combos where the tap and hold patterning can do different effects like tap then hold to do a UT Shock Rifle beam-through-ball airburst.
- Are there other games with night-time lighting that you like or dislike? If so, what are they and why?
I'd have to do a bit of a deep dive. I like how dark Nightingale gets, but I feel like lamps and placed light sources don't cast far enough out, and there isn't enough magical/bioluminescent glow to make up for it.
How do you feel about the Alpha Two Midnight Magic Preview?
I was wanting to see more of the talent/skill tree systems, and what they are.
Overall, amazing preview!
What excites you about playing and interacting with the Wand Weapon Combo system?
Honestly love mages, and all things magic! The visuals of the spells and abilities are so entertaining and beautiful to see. Can't wait to burn things with fire!
What are your thoughts on the night-time lighting shown during the livestream?
I was wanting and expecting the nighttime to be darker still though. Not sure how much light that massive moon was providing for the nighttime though. Am hoping for darker nights though, not to the point of my screen looking like it just shut off or that I feel the need to enhance my vision by squinting, but wanting the nighttime to feel like nighttime. This preview felt like daytime with very heavy clouds...
Is there anything in particular you’re excited or concerned about regarding what was shown during the Alpha ]Two Midnight Magic Preview?
Concerned about aggro range and reset range being to LOW! I can understand if the mobs have bad vision at night or in general, but I was thinking both the ranges would be alot more intense. One of the mobs took like 20 steps and then reset...
Are there similar systems to the Wand Weapon Combo system you’ve seen in other games that you like or dislike? If so, please explain!
YES! mostly just towards the wand Autos. In Alpha 1 the wand autos would shoot STRAIGHT, and then would dissipate (due to magic loosing it power) and I thought this was the PERFECT wand auto attack system!!! The look of the magic, the sound was extremely unique and amazing, the straight line was the MOST satisfying I've seen in ANY GAME! And then you guys changed it to an arcing system with less visual and sound effects... it was like a roman candle you could be using and EVERY SHOT was addictingly perfect! It's a wand (the base for all spells), they shoot big beautiful spells not some small arcing color lines... when I first saw the change, my heart sank with depression and annoyance because it was so freaking PERFECT the first time
I do like the beam system though.
Are there other games with night-time lighting that you like or dislike? If so, what are they and why?
YES, OUTWARD Definitive Edition!!! I don't think this game is super well known or popular, but damn they made so many things in that game so satisfying! Nighttime did get pretty dark, so you would mostly have to have a light source (depending on what zone you were in) but Nighttime should feel like Night! It should be harder to see and you should question what mobs or items actually are, because you vision is impaired by the dark of the night!
1. Everything looked, hazy, fuzzy, and washed out. That can happen, but a lot of the time a moonlight night where I live is still CRISP under moonlight.
I know the team is working hard on making weapon trees able to give options to all classes even though they may not make sense.
I just want to reiterate that I feel if this system if done right will be a huge highlight of Ashes.
I would also assume I'm not the only one that feels this way.
Wand seems to be heavily designed on elemental damage / procs which is fine, but as stated by others. How does that play into let's say a Ranger? I would assume a wand is a ranged weapon, so a Ranger wouldn't even be able to use a wand since 95% of their abilities require a bow. If a wand is a main-hand weapon, and is not classified as ranged, what type of abilities does the Ranger have that are not bow related? Do we only get the basic-attack option with a main-hand weapon?
It currently feels like bow and wand are on this crazy island and is heavily restricted in usage and gameplay.
Where melee weapons could seemingly be designed and used by all classes at a reasonably easy capacity.
Let's now look at the Greatsword. It's obvious they are building the weapon tree around Fighter gameplay, but that makes it feel like it's locked into the fighter, nearly as much as the bow is locked into the Ranger, and the wand into the Mage. (apparently Bard, Cleric, and maybe Summoner)
It's a big ask to get these weapons to be compatible and viable to all classes, and that's why I want to bring it to attention the community and the devs that this to me is important for the flexibility of builds.
How do you feel about the Alpha Two Midnight Magic Preview?
All in all it was really a good stream! A lot of diversity, a lot of good showcasing and some solid commentary from the developers. One of the better streams for sure.
What excites you about playing and interacting with the Wand Weapon Combo system?
It's really cool to having to balance between numbers of attacks in a combo, and the impact of each attack in the combo. The tree looks good, and it seems like you can down alot of different directions which is very neat. I'll say that the current wand tree looks better than the 2h weapon tree.
What are your thoughts on the night-time lighting shown during the livestream?
Absolutely amazing. The skybox looked the perfect mixture of fantasy and reality and the lighting this time really seemed to be spot on! You really get the gloomy feeling of night, but without your vision being totally impared. Great job.
Is there anything in particular you’re excited or concerned about regarding what was shown during the Alpha Two Midnight Magic Preview?
Badstuff The cloud movement were a bit "boxy" and pixilated. Not a big thing, but it was a shame to see it on your otherwise awesome Skybox.
Badstuff There were no footprints in the sand
Badstuff It seems weird, that the enemy NPCs keep turning in your direction when they're sleeping (under the influence of Slumber)
Greatstuff The updated mage VFX is by fare the best animations I've seen from you so fare. That was really really awesome looking all the way around. The magma field was perhabs a little too dark/black, but even then everything looked great!
- The Skybox and lighting effects looked great. The broken moon was extremely cool.
- While I'm aware it's still WIP, the visual appearance of the weapon skill trees we've seen so far have left something to be desired. The square path does not immediately communicate a direction of progression like a vertical progression would. The icons do not communicate the effect of the skills well.
- I like that there are weapon and ability skill trees. It opens the door for experimentation. Some might argue that some of the skill nodes are uninteresting, like giving +1% accuracy, for example, but these are perfectly fine to me.
- I never thought the old ball lightning vfx were problematic, in fact I liked the thick border of the vfx that gave visual clarity to its area of effect. The new vfx, while looking good, have lost this visual clarity.
Comments
Agree with the parts I included, which is most of your post.
The teleport GIF you included looks somewhat like the "teleport" they showed off ages ago during the first weather/season tech stream, but never clarified what class it was meant for. It looked really cool. Sort of a fast, invulnerable smoke cloud.
Agree on nighttime brightness. I also think a lantern would be an awesome mechanic. Perhaps it's something your character always has on their person, stowed in their "backpack" during the day and fastened on their hip at night. There could be a quick animation to take it out, light it, and put it on your hip whenever you're ready to use it, then to put it out and stow it when you're done. You can choose whether to light it for better vision at night or in deep, unlit caves, or leave it unlit to remain less visible. Obviously, nameplates are a thing, but if you're a rogue or any class with a stealth ability, you'd want to have it unlit when trying to hide or pass through somewhere unseen. No fuel though, that's just annoying unless it's a core mechanic of a game. Could also be a great opportunity to sell an additional category of cosmetic. That's a cosmetic I'd actually spend money on, since it's just a lantern and not supposed to be some big accomplishment like gear or a mount.
love the fireflies and camera particles, keep it up, they sell the environment and mood, the ambient fog is looking awesome, overall spot on visuals, skybox is looking great as well
dont make the night any darker, its good - and don't tone down vfx, they are in a good spot
combat is looking much, much better, looking forward to see the Bard and Rogue,
I loved to see that we now have target of target UI, hoping we still have time to have target markers before A2, very important UI element for wars/sieges
- lightning spell casting, animations, colours, vfx all look fantastic!
- skybox was beautiful!
- fireball could be a bit bigger and have some flames flaking off it, or something to give more of a chaotic fiery look - currently it looks like a very clean linear streak of particles, which is nice but maybe not very distinct
- the impact of fireball looks strange, like a few angled planes with the fire effect...it somehow doesn't look very organic as an explosion effect
Edit: rethinking the darkness, I think a bit brighter and more vibrant would be better. If I'm logging on for a 4 hour play session and it's all night, I'd want to be able to see and appreciate the character/mob models more than seeing all darkened figures.
What you're asking for is full action combat though because the current counter play comes in the form of skills which for some reason they barely show off. There will be movement abilities that disjoint projectiles and defensive shields you can cast
A projectile fired from a player targeting another player will always hit that target (Given the target does nothing). We can argue this until the cows come home but this is what is chosen for this game. Just give them some time to add in some more combat mechanics via skills, such as blocking, reflecting, dodging aoes, disjointing projectiles and so on, and it won't seem so static.
IMO, this is a better route to take since we know how action combat truly goes when large amounts of players are involved (Spoiler: Not well). But at the end of the day, if you want Black Desert combat, this game isn't doing that. Request skills that give you agency.
OK, sounds like you want specific feedback on the actual skill tree items.
First off. I love the idea that we can set up how long we want our combos to be. Considering that its not just the mage using the wands, but potentially every class, there could be some really cool builds around ability cooldown times and weapon combos lining up.
Being able to add different elemental damage is a cool way to stack on other team synergies, class builds, and monster resistances. Makes sense for a wand I'd say. I like that they had already thought of putting frost damage on the wand to balance out the fire/lightning build by the mage in this case. Smart.
The two procs in the top left, Echo and Perfect Timing, look like they could be really cool.
Echo says when you strike a target with direct damage, it gets struck again for magical damage. My assumption is that this means after you proc this on a combo, whether you wand them or use an ability on them, it doubles it. So you probably want to watch out for this proc and then land some really big ability to get double damage (and effect!). Also like that it acts as a way to add "magical damage" which may be useful when using huge physical damage abilities against high armour mobs etc.
Perfect Timing is cool. Any time you get cooldown reduction in a game you have to look out for possibly breaking something. I'm always a big fan of these mechanics when they are balanced. Considering that the perfect time to use an ability is right after your weapon combos go off, I can see this being a very important pick for many builds.
Both of these have huge potential as part of the regular combat game play. Doubling an ability or reducing CD by 5s is huge, so watching out for the combo is a fun attention grabber and can separate high skilled from medium skilled players. Especially with Echo, because if you miss the proc, your wand attack might get doubled rather than an ability.
Overall, I think weaving between abilities and weapon combos is a very interesting way to implement combat in this game. It's a dynamic playstyle with a strong incentive for wise ability use rather than just spamming them constantly on cooldown. The combo system makes you want to keep using the weapon swings, but sometime you just NEED the right ability at the right time, and that tension is really good to have in regular gameplay to keep the combat fun and exciting. Even strategy around stunning/snaring an enemy before they can get their weapon combo off could be something you see in high level pvp.
I can see that the 3 tiers of +15%, +15,%, +15% damage or whatever for each branch on the tree provides some weapon progression while levelling, that's fine.
Only criticism I have is that the whole tree looks like it is filled out when maxed, and the only options appear to be weapon elemental damage and Echo/Perfect Timing. Would be nice to have a few more things that we are deciding on, even after the thing is maxed.
I'm really looking forward to trying this out in Alpha 2, and for just messing around with the system in general to see how different styles and tree paths feel to play.
"priming skills (x amount of time to use x attacks, cd starts at prime)"
"charge" based skills (x uses on separate cds)
Multi-press attack (x seconds to cast all attacks, attacks must be used in succession unlike priming)
Charging up holding
Hold timing release
Explained more below. With some examples. Obviously its up to the devs to incorporate our ideas along with their own but its up to them how in-depth and dynamic they want it. Personally I think with the UE engine being so powerful in the right hands they could really do a lot.
These combo presses add a whole extra layer to each players and can be incorporated into skill trees/talent so they can be more optional for bonus damage for players who don't want more simple experience or talent deeper into these skills for a more skill based experience with the possibilities for more damage.
Please don’t feel limited by the thought-starters above. Feel free to share anything you’d like about Ashes of Creation’s Alpha Two Midnight Magic Preview shown during the April Development Update
If you happen to read my post I would like you to make the suggestion to the combat team to make more interactive spells and abilities. Adding multi-press abilities adds a whole extra depth to the combat. As an example i will reference some of the skills in the video how it would add an extra layer of depth. The triple fire ball could be reworked so when you press the button you do a quick cast (priming) and then you get 6 second to throw 3 fireballs so after the initial press you can triple tap it and send all 3 or weave it into other skills since you get 6 seconds that resets each throw. you can throw out another spell and then follow it with a fireball multiple times but the CD for the spell would still start at the initial prime so it doesn't feel wasted if you don't throw them all together to start the CD. The lightning strike spell could be reworked to a way so its either so instead of just a cast it has a charge up and the longer you hold it the stronger the spell is where it always deals the base damage but can deal more if able to hold longer. The ball lighting maybe you can press it 2 times after its traveling outward to release static pulses. The fire patch could have a second press where if you time it on the cast bar right it deal extra damage and has a larger patch. I think adding multi-press skills adds an extra depth to the combat system giving "combo" potential. The function of the fireball spell can work with multi hit melee skills as well for comboing. So in an ideal world you could cast the fireball "priming", throw the lightning ball out, follow with a full charge lightning strike then 1st fireball, do the lightning pulse and 2nd fireball and then combo the fire area spell timing and hit 3rd fireball.
I actually feel the exact opposite. In games where you can just side step/dodge projectiles you don't even need gear progressions or great builds to do well. I've seen someone beat Elden Ring with just basic items because they dodged/rolled everything. Personally I find that more tedius than fun. At any rate, it's a different game design and they aren't changing it at this point.
You might not understand the direction they are going with timing abilities and trying to get weapon combos as the combat loop rather than trying to dodge/roll attacks all the time. The perfect time to use an ability is right after landing a weapon combo. Hence why one of the wand skills was called "Perfect Time" and reduces the cooldown of your next ability by 5s.
The whole point of the system is dynamically switching between your abilities and the weapon combos. Not just mindlessly spamming one or the other and dodge/rolling monster attacks. If you don't want to get hit, find a tank. If you don't want to rest, find a healer. That's the whole idea behind these games.
For example, the lightning and fireball spells should highlight the floor and walls around them and potentially remove the player's shadow from being visible when it is cast, or cast new shadows.
Ranged attacks/spells that don't emit light should instead, cast a shadow in the environment as they move. The spell effects are a good start but they currently float in the environment and don't seem connected in the world.
A decent example of how a fireball could look and interact with the environment is No Rest for the Wicked.
This preview is visually stunning. It was a bunch of well delivered information and the topics went well together and flowed into one another well. Appreciate the emphesis on the improvements made from feedback from the community.
What excites you about playing and interacting with the *Wand &* Wand Weapon Combo system?
I think the most impressive part of the wand was the sheer impact that you feel with a wand! It's really quite something. I think having something like a beam build is cool, I look forward to seeing if there is a rapid hitting kind of build or the other builds to see if there's something that could work with a rogue. I am curious how ranged weapons will work with 'on-hit' style builds and if something like a rapid-fire wand can be used for bleed fighter builds, for example. The combo system is a brain tickler, just the way I like it lol
What are your thoughts on the night-time lighting *& Skybox* shown during the livestream?
Beautiful. Natural. Terrific. I cannot say how perfect I think this all looks. From the way the fires from the torches falls off. The ambience that it lends to the fireflies. The nebula from/around the broken moon and the dynamic animations for the moon! And the other moon looking so unique! 100/10 Seriously my favorite skybox in any game, maybe ever?
Is there anything in particular you’re excited or concerned about regarding what was shown during the Alpha Two Midnight Magic Preview?
I think going for the more grounded, real to life look with the night time is great, obviously. The VFX of the spells glowing around their immediate effects is gorgrous. There is a strange blue corona around the intact moon, if this is intentional it looks cool, if there isn't an in game reason though I would be curious as to the cause. The only improvement I would recommend is having the spell effects reflect on the environment around it, this was addressed on stream. If this is not possible due to compatability issues, I still think this looks amazing!
*Other Feedback*
The updated Lightning Ball is super cool. Love the new effect.
The Carphin set looks awesome. It looks way better than I personally thought it would from the concept art, and seeing it move was really a selling point. Though the tassle in the front didn't seem to be moving as much as it maybe should be in response to rapid movement.
The Risen Warhorns look dope, good job on those guys and their weapon effects look super cool.
As a person interested in potentially playing a Rogue main I am curious as to what the intended effects, if any, night time has on stealth mechanics?
As a person interested in Animal Husbandry I am curious if there are animals that are more/less active during different times of days and seasons? It would be cool to have a stable of exclusivly nocturnal animals, just saying.
Professional Skeptic, Entertainer, and Animal Enthusiast
I couldn't find a video that cleanly shows the transition, but... here's Satorl Marsh in the daytime...
And here it is at night.
Beyond that... the Ball Lightning looked pretty great, but I'm not really a fan of the 'concentration' lightning spell staying stationary for quite as long as it does; I'd rather my lightning be a bit more spastic. But MECHANICALLY speaking...
Without good PVE, to me this mostly just looks pretty. A system is only as good as its mechanical depth, and in the process of watching I realized something important I felt Ashes was missing:
Interrupts from FFXI.
To explain... spells in FFXI have cast times (let's call it an average of 2-3 seconds, with 5-6 for certain spells), and if a caster - whether player or mob - gets hit sufficiently hard/fast enough while prepping their spell, it has a chance to get 'interrupted' and not cast. There's gear and buff effects that can mitigate the Interrupt rate, and it can be a valid thing to build for against some enemy types.
FFXI uses an auto-attack system, and player input comes from things like your specific positioning, spell casts, 'weaponskills', etc, but the Interrupt system especially made a strong impact on me (pun not intended) when I started playing. My first and most-leveled class in the game is Black Mage, see. I went into the game having a good general idea of how it worked and what I wanted to build, but my bestie didn't explain Interrupts to me at ALL - I speculate this was on purpose. So, the first time I went to fight some low level mobs outside of the starter city I chose and my spell cast was interrupted by an enemy, I STILL remember suddenly realizing - "Oh, hits MATTER."
FFXI has nowhere near the tactile feedback of a game like Monster Hunter, but systems like that fill in the blanks really well - when you're sufficiently immersed, you can FEEL those hits, and it greatly incentivizes learning enemy attack timings, so as to cast your spells with as little chance of getting Interrupted as possible.
TLDR I would argue that a system like this should apply to several of the ability types in Ashes - not ALL of them, of course, some things are intended to be instant and riskless to use - but I feel stuff like this adds substantial depth to a system, provides a crucial sense of feedback and consequence, adds strategic depth, makes mobs more threatening, boosts immersion, and gives players more to learn with each enemy type. And that's putting aside the potential PVP shenanigans that can ensue.
I'll tend to the flame, you can worship the ashes.
It's an MMORPG. Time is money, money is progress. If you dodge every weak mob's basic attack, you're wasting time, so gear is always needed to facetank basic attacks and kill faster. This mage can spam Wand attacks while running sideways if the attacks weren't targeted, but it will be slower than stopping and casting a powerful spell.
That said, sitting down to regen HP after every 3 kills is also a waste of time, hence the many solutions I proposed. We don't even have active blocking anymore, it got replaced by RNG blocking. (╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻
@Skills: This is just a vague impression, but I'm really not seeing enough dedicated buff and debuff abilities in most classes. I know there are balancing concerns and class identity concerns at play here, but quite frankly, playstyle prioritisation between the types of abilities that have to be prepared and set up, and abilities that deal damage and directly disable the opponent, is a ton of fun. And I hope the skill design team doesn't get too in their heads about creating a consistent balancing system structured around everyone executing the same mindless number-optimising skill rotations, and every class having unique roles, at the cost of making the individual player's gameplay diverse and fun.
Less hyperfocus on chaining and proccing and synergising (which is fun, don't get me wrong), more room for genuine, tangible, play-style-deciding differences in build choices, and powerful, non-damaging buff/debuff abilities. Where one player relies on high cooldown buffs to reach their full potential, one player focuses much more on controlling the enemy than dealing damage themselves (not only Bards should have debuffs); and one player is just that reliable DPS machine that's ready for battle at full capacity in any given moment. Less focus on skill ceilings and skill floor, more focus on variation and fun.
Might be neet to have proper orbits for the moons and have Eclipses occur as emergent gameplay. Sorry I thought this was the feedback link and I can't find a delete button in mobile.
Imo remove all name plates and only have them show up when either:
A) your target somone (or hover over them if ur in the action camera mode)
I personaly think this would be the best but there is another option of having nameplate up during the day and disabled during the night time cycle of the game to make night feel a little more dangerous with things being able to sneak up on you easier but i still think you should get rid of them all together especially for a PvX game. If you have the option to enable or disable them they will always be on with the exception of maybe screenshots which is a shame since the world is much more immersive without them.
''It's already bad enough that it's almost entirely tab target.''
We were promised hybrid combat and we got full on tab targeting archaic 90's MMORPG.
''Can't mage heal via life/nature/water/time/spirit magic? Or combine fire & earth to create life/plant magic. Mage in my opinion should be the "jack of all trade, master of none" class, the king of utility. Not just an Elementalist.''
The only thing I don't agree in this post. Mage should never be able to heal unless it has Cleric augment or its using some sort of consumable like potion or bandage.
Why stop there?
Clouds at night should cast shadow on the ground too and god rays should peak through from time to time, just like in No Rest for the Wicked.
Night-Time Lighting: Much improved, good work.
I was thinking mid-night would be the Rogue's high point of natural stealth benefit, could it be made darker, or darker shadows for that time? Cloud shadows?
Originally, the Mage had a self-heal skill in the form of a lifeforce drain attack, it wasn't strong or even worth the skill points outside of solo PVE, but it was good enough to not need to sit down every 3-4 kills.
Only 3.62% of the HP was healed (50/1380 HP). Meanwhile a Cleric can heal 50% HP in one skill.
What crazy gamebreaking balace disaster would there be if other classes could self-heal in such a tiny amount instead of being forced to sit down and idly stare at your screen in which absolutely nothing is happening?
Anyhow, it doesn't have to be a healing skill, the HP/MP problem needs to be addressed somehow.
I really enjoyed the updates on the feedback that was given before as well as the new detail about the weapon progressions.
What excites you about playing and interacting with the Wand Weapon Combo system?
Specific to the wand weapon combo system, I think the beam was very cool. In general for weapon system progression for different weapons, I hope that it means that different weapons will result in different casting as well. For example, wands seem like they should be for players that want a more rapid casting time or more 1v1 combat type, while a grimoire for example might mean spells take longer to cast but they have higher area of effects on impact or geared to maybe being able to combo spells at once? I think it would make for good risk vs reward, one takes longer to cast but has more AOE or effects etc. and the wand has more rapid casting, maybe less single spell damage, and of course less area of effects
What are your thoughts on the night-time lighting shown during the livestream?
I think the night time lighting has definitely improved. I was not a fan of prior stream night time lightings it seemed to bright and even the torch lightings seemed like it didn't matter because it didn't really provide any more value to being able to see. I think in this stream it has definitely improved. The only thing I am hoping for is that the weather effects the lighting as well and that moon phases (if there are any) also affect the lighting. If it is stormy and rainy at night with lots of cloud cover, I think it should be even darker than a clear night with the moon out. It just makes sense to have less field of vision with less light in the sky. Similarly, if there are moon phases, we know that when it is a full moon it looks very bright at night if it is a clear sky. You can walk and see pretty clearly, but if the moon is in a phase where it isn't as lit up, it is much darker. This effect would be cool to see in game too.
Pretty good, I liked seeing the wand changes and some changes to the night! The desert still feels a bit more sparse on vegetation than I'd hope to see, but it is far better than just being sand dunes and saguaro cacti like a Warner Bros cartoon.
- What excites you about playing and interacting with the Wand Weapon Combo system?
What we have looks like fun, I can see the wand being really effective for a lot of archetypes!
- What are your thoughts on the night-time lighting shown during the livestream?
I watched the YT version and I like the progress quite a bit! I feel like the lighting was maybe a bit washed out like an ambient light set across the scene was making things less crisp and clear, but it could be the recording not capturing the details or maybe my monitor not being beefy enough to properly represent these contrasts. I could see more of an emphasis on reducing contrast on more lowly lit things and focusing on more pop/shine/appeal for interactable features (creatures, resources, POIs, etc) as well as using moonlight direction to cast shadows and create a corona for strong silhouettes. There's no rush though, it isn't launching tomorrow, there's plenty of time to keep at it!
- Is there anything in particular you’re excited or concerned about regarding what was shown during the Alpha Two Midnight Magic Preview?
Excited for A2 mostly. Concerned that there won't be as much room for weapon expression for every archetype, so a wand for warriors or a bow for casters is "playable but not optimal" still gives me a bit of concern. For example I'd imagine all Py'Rai to be experts with bows like a classic Wood Elf, and to have a desire or preference towards them despite their archetype--and that may even be the case, but there will still be archetypes that use the bow better than a Wood Elf caster. I love how separated weapons are from power sets in DCUO where each weapon is it's own whole kit that doesn't need or prefer a specific power set, so players can try and master them all to really find what works or feels best for their playstyle.
- Are there similar systems to the Wand Weapon Combo system you’ve seen in other games that you like or dislike? If so, please explain!
I really want blast and beam to be like "light" and "heavy" attacks that can be selectively accessed instead of (if I got it right) beams being an upgraded blast. I thought DCUO did a great job of combining a weapon's light and heavy attacks into useful combos that made weapons stand out from hotbar-slotted power sets. If it is all one click for weapon attacks, I could see other ways to weave the wand in... Tap to burst, hold to charge and release a beam, tap while defending for a timed wand parry, hold while defending to create an elemental "okay hit me but some damage will go back to you" defense, and create combos where the tap and hold patterning can do different effects like tap then hold to do a UT Shock Rifle beam-through-ball airburst.
- Are there other games with night-time lighting that you like or dislike? If so, what are they and why?
I'd have to do a bit of a deep dive. I like how dark Nightingale gets, but I feel like lamps and placed light sources don't cast far enough out, and there isn't enough magical/bioluminescent glow to make up for it.
I was wanting to see more of the talent/skill tree systems, and what they are.
Overall, amazing preview!
What excites you about playing and interacting with the Wand Weapon Combo system?
Honestly love mages, and all things magic! The visuals of the spells and abilities are so entertaining and beautiful to see. Can't wait to burn things with fire!
What are your thoughts on the night-time lighting shown during the livestream?
I was wanting and expecting the nighttime to be darker still though. Not sure how much light that massive moon was providing for the nighttime though. Am hoping for darker nights though, not to the point of my screen looking like it just shut off or that I feel the need to enhance my vision by squinting, but wanting the nighttime to feel like nighttime. This preview felt like daytime with very heavy clouds...
Is there anything in particular you’re excited or concerned about regarding what was shown during the Alpha ]Two Midnight Magic Preview?
Concerned about aggro range and reset range being to LOW! I can understand if the mobs have bad vision at night or in general, but I was thinking both the ranges would be alot more intense. One of the mobs took like 20 steps and then reset...
Are there similar systems to the Wand Weapon Combo system you’ve seen in other games that you like or dislike? If so, please explain!
YES! mostly just towards the wand Autos. In Alpha 1 the wand autos would shoot STRAIGHT, and then would dissipate (due to magic loosing it power) and I thought this was the PERFECT wand auto attack system!!! The look of the magic, the sound was extremely unique and amazing, the straight line was the MOST satisfying I've seen in ANY GAME! And then you guys changed it to an arcing system with less visual and sound effects... it was like a roman candle you could be using and EVERY SHOT was addictingly perfect! It's a wand (the base for all spells), they shoot big beautiful spells not some small arcing color lines... when I first saw the change, my heart sank with depression and annoyance because it was so freaking PERFECT the first time
I do like the beam system though.
Are there other games with night-time lighting that you like or dislike? If so, what are they and why?
YES, OUTWARD Definitive Edition!!! I don't think this game is super well known or popular, but damn they made so many things in that game so satisfying! Nighttime did get pretty dark, so you would mostly have to have a light source (depending on what zone you were in) but Nighttime should feel like Night! It should be harder to see and you should question what mobs or items actually are, because you vision is impaired by the dark of the night!
1. Everything looked, hazy, fuzzy, and washed out. That can happen, but a lot of the time a moonlight night where I live is still CRISP under moonlight.
2. Weapon Trees. I'll quote my other post text, and link the thread.
https://forums.ashesofcreation.com/discussion/59359/viability-of-all-weapons-for-all-classes
A full moon having a bright night like the previous night time showcase would be awesome.
All in all it was really a good stream! A lot of diversity, a lot of good showcasing and some solid commentary from the developers. One of the better streams for sure.
What excites you about playing and interacting with the Wand Weapon Combo system?
It's really cool to having to balance between numbers of attacks in a combo, and the impact of each attack in the combo. The tree looks good, and it seems like you can down alot of different directions which is very neat. I'll say that the current wand tree looks better than the 2h weapon tree.
What are your thoughts on the night-time lighting shown during the livestream?
Absolutely amazing. The skybox looked the perfect mixture of fantasy and reality and the lighting this time really seemed to be spot on! You really get the gloomy feeling of night, but without your vision being totally impared. Great job.
Is there anything in particular you’re excited or concerned about regarding what was shown during the Alpha Two Midnight Magic Preview?
- While I'm aware it's still WIP, the visual appearance of the weapon skill trees we've seen so far have left something to be desired. The square path does not immediately communicate a direction of progression like a vertical progression would. The icons do not communicate the effect of the skills well.
- I like that there are weapon and ability skill trees. It opens the door for experimentation. Some might argue that some of the skill nodes are uninteresting, like giving +1% accuracy, for example, but these are perfectly fine to me.
- I never thought the old ball lightning vfx were problematic, in fact I liked the thick border of the vfx that gave visual clarity to its area of effect. The new vfx, while looking good, have lost this visual clarity.