Character Models

Andi

This is supposedly a female.

Where are her hips?

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kadimir

Noaani wrote: »

**uninspired contrarian white noise**

Fascinating how fast it went from others being narrow minded lacking imagination to "it's alright I don't look at my characters"

Nobody should even respond to you at this point.

Noaani

Carlisle wrote: »

Once human is a mmo and the CC is amazing, the characters are pretty as well. (Throne and liberty has a lot of problems but their characters visual is pretty and amazing. another mmo) your point is totally invalid since both of the games mentioned are from UE4 and put massive amounts of players in the screen, but still remain with quality and detailed characters

Cool.

Are either of them still in alpha?

Carlisle

Noaani wrote: »

Carlisle wrote: »

Once human is a mmo and the CC is amazing, the characters are pretty as well. (Throne and liberty has a lot of problems but their characters visual is pretty and amazing. another mmo) your point is totally invalid since both of the games mentioned are from UE4 and put massive amounts of players in the screen, but still remain with quality and detailed characters

Cool.

Are either of them still in alpha?

So now the topic has changed? Yes for a alpha the characters in ashes are fine, we are just making sure it wont be released anywhere close to this disgusting thing we have right now (related to characters and CC)

Ulderek

I wonder if intrepid is interested in feedback for their character creator

kadimir

Noaani wrote: »

Are either of them still in alpha?

CC is fine
IF you can't you lack imagination
I zoom out dont look at my character
Are any of those games in alpha?

Sir do you know how fast your goal post was going?

Going 4 post in a 1 page thread is 6 points on your license, you may opt to take a class to remove these points but you'll have to concede the argument.

Noaani

Carlisle wrote: »

Noaani wrote: »

Carlisle wrote: »

Once human is a mmo and the CC is amazing, the characters are pretty as well. (Throne and liberty has a lot of problems but their characters visual is pretty and amazing. another mmo) your point is totally invalid since both of the games mentioned are from UE4 and put massive amounts of players in the screen, but still remain with quality and detailed characters

Cool.

Are either of them still in alpha?

So now the topic has changed? Yes for a alpha the characters in ashes are fine, we are just making sure it wont be released anywhere close to this disgusting thing we have right now (related to characters and CC)

Nope.

It's almost as if there are many factors, and people should be aware of the obvious ones, but they sometimes need to be remoinded of them.

Noaani

kadimir wrote: »

Sir do you know how fast your goal post was going?

What goal post?

Andi

@Noaani at this point, nobody takes you seriously anymore. You don't even provide feedback, you're just trolling.

kadimir

Andi wrote: »

@Noaani at this point, nobody takes you seriously anymore. You don't even provide feedback, you're just trolling.

yeah, I realized that I don't think they even have the opinions they have, I feel like they are just looking for interaction.

GreatPhilisopher

Noaani wrote: »

GreatPhilisopher wrote: »

Noaani wrote: »

Vhaeyne wrote: »

Noaani wrote: »

Vhaeyne wrote: »

Noaani wrote: »

In my opinion, all this means is thst you have too narrow a mindset of what "good" can be.

Go ahead send me your best screenshot with the current character creator.

I would love to see something good in Ashes.

Why go in game?

There are examples in this thread.

I may have misunderstood you. You stated that I have a narrow mind set of what "good" can be.

I was just challenging you to show me what you think "good" can be with the current tools.

From my perspective, the character in the OP is fine - which I consider a version of good (because it is not bad)

There are obviously bugs, and there are a lot more options to come, but it is fine.

Keep in mind, I play MMORPG's for the gameplay, not the fashion. I'm not going to sit here and obsess over the size of a female characters hips because I just don't care. As such, I think we would both agree that this means I have a very different definition for what I consider "good" to you.

At maximum camera zoom (the only way an MMORPG should ever be played) the characters all look fine - even this early in alpha.

So yeah, a more open mindset of what "good" means would immediately fix the issue for you, not that this is overly helpful for you.

It is also worth pointing out (more generally than to you specifically) that the comparisons to Monster Hunter really aren't helpful. In Ashes, you may need to have the details of hundreds of player characters held on your system at any one point in time, where as with Monster Hunter you need 4. Every option Intrepid adds requires more data transfer between server and client, and if they go far enough gives me yet another method to crash the server at will (though this may only crash game clients).

That isn't to say we shouldn't expect more options than we have now, but rather to say that people doing this comparison should be comparing Ashes to a comparible game - one that also has hundreds of characters in the same in game location (I can only think of a few).

Comparing it to a game that only has 4 is not doing anyone any favors.

new monster hunter have dozens of players on screen and its an Open world game and the comparison is about the CC of what they let them create vs the abominations we got

Dozens is still well short of hundreds.

it goes over a 100

and they all look great in game and i played ashes with maxed settings (cinematic) barely saw over a dozen or so players on screen ,everyone disappear from players to mobs to npcs when they are further than like 10-20 meters away so your point is worthless

Noaani

kadimir wrote: »

Andi wrote: »

@Noaani at this point, nobody takes you seriously anymore. You don't even provide feedback, you're just trolling.

yeah, I realized that I don't think they even have the opinions they have, I feel like they are just looking for interaction.

No, people just can't read, and seem to have no idea what an alpha is about.

As I said to Vhaeyne, I find the current models just fine, because I have a different opinion of what "good" is to them, and perhaps to you. To me, good character models are models that don't get in the way of gameplay - and the models in Ashes absolutely do that.

As a comment, that isn't even about the models, it is about expectations and priorities.

Then I commented that the games many people are comparing Ashes to are vastly inappropriate to compare them to - even when the game is live. Monster Hunter is not a comparible game to compare Ashes to.

Then I also pointed out that Ashes is in alpha. Things like the in game model not matching up to what the character creator showed is because the character creator and the in game models are technically different development aspects - it is reasonable that they don't match up at this point in development.

What you people all need to understand is that one of the games mentioned in this thread as being a better example of characters was one I was about this early in testing (friends and family test). That game at this point in it's development had a single default character model to use. That is now a game a number of people are sayiong "be more like this game" - Intrepid is ahead of that game, you guys just don't know how development works.

Sathrago

Noaani wrote: »

kadimir wrote: »

Andi wrote: »

@Noaani at this point, nobody takes you seriously anymore. You don't even provide feedback, you're just trolling.

yeah, I realized that I don't think they even have the opinions they have, I feel like they are just looking for interaction.

No, people just can't read, and seem to have no idea what an alpha is about.

As I said to Vhaeyne, I find the current models just fine, because I have a different opinion of what "good" is to them, and perhaps to you. To me, good character models are models that don't get in the way of gameplay - and the models in Ashes absolutely do that.

As a comment, that isn't even about the models, it is about expectations and priorities.

Then I commented that the games many people are comparing Ashes to are vastly inappropriate to compare them to - even when the game is live. Monster Hunter is not a comparible game to compare Ashes to.

Then I also pointed out that Ashes is in alpha. Things like the in game model not matching up to what the character creator showed is because the character creator and the in game models are technically different development aspects - it is reasonable that they don't match up at this point in development.

What you people all need to understand is that one of the games mentioned in this thread as being a better example of characters was one I was about this early in testing (friends and family test). That game at this point in it's development had a single default character model to use. That is now a game a number of people are sayiong "be more like this game" - Intrepid is ahead of that game, you guys just don't know how development works.

Why are you even commenting on this if you dont care about the looks of the character models??? Jesus man. "good character models are models that don't get in the way of gameplay". Show me an example of a game that makes models that gets in the way of gameplay, unless you are talking about clear bugs that expand the model into your camera or so tiny that you cant even see the model, I dont know what you are talking about.

Noaani

Sathrago wrote: »

Why are you even commenting on this if you dont care about the looks of the character models??? .

I mean, I was clear in my first post in this thread (that you replied to), that I thought the issue was more to do with peoples expectations than anything else.

Show me an example of a game that makes models that gets in the way of gameplay, unless you are talking about clear bugs that expand the model into your camera or so tiny that you cant even see the model, I dont know what you are talking about.

There are a number of games that have character models that don't match the hitboxes they have.

That is what a bad character model that isn't a bug looks like.

See, all we have in Ashes is an unfinished character creation system, and people (such as the OP) are calling for it to all be thrown out and Intrepid start again from the beginning. That is the comment you should be calling out - not someone saying "technically the models are fine, they don't interfere with gameplay, and there are still many character crator features that haven't been implemented yet".

Songcaller

Please be patient. Be thankful hit boxes are working most of the time and that the characters are functioning in various character functions. There is so much time to polish. Wax on, wax off.

Vhaeyne

Noaani wrote: »

What you people all need to understand is that one of the games mentioned in this thread as being a better example of characters was one I was about this early in testing (friends and family test). That game at this point in it's development had a single default character model to use. That is now a game a number of people are sayiong "be more like this game" - Intrepid is ahead of that game, you guys just don't know how development works.

Actually, we don't "need" to understand anything about how a product is being developed as a customer.

My peroneal goal as a customer right now is to leave feedback and hold the company accountable if they mislead me:

As an enthusiastic customer I personally can forgive this misleading statement, but I will continue to leave the feedback that I want better than what I am seeing currently.

Most of the feedback in the thread is just people like me expressing our concern that we are not yet seeing what we have been led to believe we are getting and we don't like what we are currently seeing.

Which is all perfectly fair and valid feedback.

Andi

So Steven is comparing their CC to that of BDO, which means they have to have one banger of a creator lying around there somewhere. Hope they'll build it in soon.

Actually, I'm not convinced. This seems like an old post from before the transition, when the old CC was still in and chars didn't look like crack heads.

@Songcaller we're aware that this is an alpha. we're giving this feedback now because it is one. It's still possible to build a great char creator (and great character models), and we're letting them know there's demand in the player base.

Of course, the alpha is mainly about stability and performance right now, but that doesn't mean we can't highlight other issues - aesthetical ones like this, or mechanical ones, like the family teleport system.

I'd like to add once more, that if they were hoping for sales of outfits etc in the future cosmetic shop, they better make it possible to have pretty characters.

pooka1

The one thing I'm hoping for is that my character will look the same in game as what I made in character creation. No matter what game it is, I always end up recreating more than once to get it right. This is not just in AoC. I believe it has to do with the lighting effects in the creator. Being able to save a template will help but If there was a way to see exactly what your character looks like in game would be a big thing for me.

kadimir

pooka1 wrote: »

The one thing I'm hoping for is that my character will look the same in game as what I made in character creation. No matter what game it is, I always end up recreating more than once to get it right. This is not just in AoC. I believe it has to do with the lighting effects in the creator. Being able to save a template will help but If there was a way to see exactly what your character looks like in game would be a big thing for me.

It's not lighting, the actual proportions look different from creator to game. I actually do some photography and 1. The soft broad lighting would be more revealing of weird shapes and 2. I even used rembrandt lighting in my CC to in-game comparison which is a pretty common portrait lighting technique

I haven't felt like my characters from creators had ever looked different in game vs not, although I wish I had more armor previews rather than sculpting an aesthetic physique with no armor only to find out how it works with actual armor models in game.

Noaani

Vhaeyne wrote: »

Actually, we don't "need" to understand anything about how a product is being developed as a customer.

Sure, but right now you are a tester, not a customer.

As to your claim of Intrepid misleading you, you'll note that in the quote they said they will aim to, not that they will. While you may want to argue that this is semantics, it is actually just how language works. Saying you will try to do a thing is not the same as saying you will do a thing.

Most of the feedback in the thread is just people like me expressing our concern that we are not yet seeing what we have been led to believe we are getting and we don't like what we are currently seeing.

As opposed to the rest of the game where everything else is complete?

Ashes is a work in progress. We are seeing about 10% of it. That includes the character creator.

Fair and valid feedback is "this is not yet as complete as I would like to see it, I understand Intrepud still have these three features that are not yet implemented in to the character creator, I addition to that I would like to suggest...".

Fair and valid feedback is not

Andi wrote: »

We need completely new models from the get go.

Feedback without knowing what is planned is not overly valid. I've not seen any one of you state what you think the character creator will be like once blending and sculpting (both of which have been talked about) are added.

Once they are in the game, what complaints do you have left?

Valid feedback takes this in to account. Invalid feedback, or whining, does not.

Andi

Noaani wrote: »

Vhaeyne wrote: »

Actually, we don't "need" to understand anything about how a product is being developed as a customer.

Sure, but right now you are a tester, not a customer.

Nope. Nowhere did we sign a contract as QA. We did pay though for access to an alpha version. That makes us a customer, it does not make us a tester.

This is just like all your other arguments in this thread, so flimsy, you can hold it against the light and it shines through. You're not even trying, it's just pure trolling at this point.

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