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"I like mmos!" Ya ok snowflake

I think too many people give themselves credit for liking mmos. MMOs are a struggling genre for a reason, and one of them is their fan base. You guys give yourselves too much credit. You think you know what you like, but then you realize over time that you were wrong about yourselves and about your games. Some of you found your game to be lacking after a while or that the direction the game went after a while was wrong to you. To you I say sack up. IF this is a genre you care for, then its up to you to save it, and half of that is just knowing yourself. If you know whats fun FIND it. Ignore what you tell yourself is fun, and RUN toward what is fun for you. If you're telling yourself you like mmos, but you really haven't found FUN in one yet, I say ignore the genre. I say trust your gut, and I say if you think the genre is holding back then don't hold back, RUN.

Too many players stick it out with something they don't like, or with a game that's made decisions that harm everyone in its community, and I say that its the communities fault for not being agile. Not being hungry enough for better, for more, or for what they precisely want.

I'm NOT an mmo player. I'm an FPS player, and I found the FUN lacking in the early 2000s I didn't just keep with it, backing the same filler game after filler game. I went to where the fun was. I went to MOBAs. I went to league of legends.

I played the crap out of league of legends and I knew, in my gut. Right in my heart that I didn't like a core part of the game. Last hitting. Last hitting was my bane, it held me back, it kept me from having fun. I found more even MORE insidious problems with the game I liked, I found out that I HATED how items created obscure power. Stats created confusion over what was good and what wasn't and what was good in what situation. It was a flaw. I found flaws in my favorite game. The game that had SAVED me from my boredom with FPS was crushing me slowly. I had to find a solution, and one came.

I bailed on my favorite game. I decided my money was better spent elsewhere. That the design in my favorite game wasn't good enough for me or the genre.

Now I've found a fun moba called Heroes of The Storm and I'm happy with my moba experience. I KNOW this is what I want from mobas, from gaming, and now that I'm happy. Resting. I'm planning. I want another game, another genre available to me.

I know MMOs have failed. I played WoW, WoW was a beautiful experience, but just like LoL it had problems for me, even more insidious problems, and more then that. It had taken a directive from on high from corporate middle men and money grubbers and it decided its gameplay wasn't what I wanted after all. The flawed gameplay that had insidious problems was being changed to be EVEN WORSE!

A string of MMOs appeared after WoW to entice me to the genre and I tried and bailed tried and bailed, and I came to realize that the core game designers of MMOs were weak. Rudderless and uninspired.

They couldn't muster another WoW let alone something creatively different and yet GOOD enough to entice me.

I bailed on MMOs, and now I'm back. I backed Star Citizen, I backed Hex, I backed Crowfall, and now, I've backed Ashes of Creation. Offering value to those I see bringing back value to the genre.

I hope you "MMO lovers" have enjoyed your sinking ships, because good people like me sunk them for a reason. I hope you MMO lovers WANT and HUNGER for the pinnacle of FUN and find it with me. Either here or elsewhere.
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    No offense, but this reads a bit like a manifesto. 
    And one that I'm not quite sure where you mean to head with it.

    But it's certainly your opinion, and you're welcome to it!

    I for one have been enjoying MMORPGs since 1996 with Meridian 59.  Every one I've played has been different, each with their own pros and cons.  But I can say the same for every other type of game I've played. 

    I don't see the genre as failure, other than the fact that they ALL rely on a decent playerbase because they just don't work as single player games unto themselves.  They are social by nature.  When everyone is looking for something slightly different in a game, they often move on to other pastures with what limited gaming time they might have in their lives.  

    I don't see any game lasting forever, though.  Especially with MMORPGs, they are social games as I said, that means they live and breathe and change over time as the people who play them do....  Sometimes it's a long healthy life, sometimes it falters and dwindles away.   But, such is the nature of life itself. 

    When this game comes out, I will play it for as long as I play it.  Maybe it will be for a decade, maybe for a period far far less.  Who is to say?  But for as long as I play it, I imagine I'll enjoy it for what it is all the same.   ;)
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    ArchivedUserArchivedUser Guest
    edited June 2017
    @Zomnivore What the hell did I just read? (Interesting, but a bit eh manifesto as @Rumbleforge said).

    Edit: Good FPS IMO right now PUBG, if you're still into that.
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    I'm not sure what was the purpose of this post but I can see you care about something even if I have no idea what it is
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    ArchivedUserArchivedUser Guest
    edited June 2017
    As a burned MMO player MMO makers deserve a manifesto.

    As for you MMO players who ride sinking ships, I hope you wake up.
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    Zomnivore said:
    As a burned MMO player MMO makers deserve a manifesto.
    Hmm I see your point, most of the time I don't think the devs look that much at the forums though. But hope fully this game is the exception :)
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    Not sure where you are coming from or what roads you have traveled but you need to take a deep breath and relax.  
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    ArchivedUserArchivedUser Guest
    edited June 2017
    Coming to a forum of a genre that you profess to dislike, and imposing your opinion, your thoughts and your "knowledge" on others reeks of arrogance. You spout conjecture as absolute facts with no sources to back your assumptions. Just because YOU have come to dislike the genre, doesn't mean that this same experience is but a matter of time for others.

    EDIT: What is really amazing about your post, is that you mask this disdain with a thinly veiled declaration that you are backing this game, and are hoping that will drag you out of this anti-mmo sentiment you keep declaring. Even your title, from the first moment, goes out of its way to insult this community as "snowflakes", or as a soft people that seek to be unique. You are absolutely astonishing.
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    Krojak said:
    Coming to a forum of a genre that you profess to dislike, and imposing your opinion, your thoughts and your "knowledge" on others reeks of arrogance. You spout conjecture as absolute facts with no sources to back your assumptions. Just because YOU have come to dislike the genre, doesn't mean that this same experience is but a matter of time for others.
    I'm not here to argue. I've said what I've wanted to say to MMO makers, and their players and hopefully you take a hint. Either way you've misrepresented my own words.
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    Zomnivore basically you've played several games/genres, got bored and moved on. Fine. But you then somehow conclude that MMO's are dead. Yet, MMOs are clearly not dead, neither are FPS games.
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    ArchivedUserArchivedUser Guest
    edited June 2017
    You're absolutely wrong about the MMO genre. This very game professes a deep concern for the genre at large in its kickstarter.
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    Krojak said:
    Coming to a forum of a genre that you profess to dislike, and imposing your opinion, your thoughts and your "knowledge" on others reeks of arrogance. You spout conjecture as absolute facts with no sources to back your assumptions. Just because YOU have come to dislike the genre, doesn't mean that this same experience is but a matter of time for others.
    This is true. 
    He flat out says in his post, "I'm NOT an mmo player. I'm an FPS player," so coming here to criticize the genre is a bit like me going to a debutante ball and complaining about the opulent dresses and extravagant pageantry - just because I'll never be a pretty pretty princess.  I may have an opinion on the matter, but going to the ball to voice them is just asking for drama and conflict.  ;)
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    Zomnivore said:
    I'm not here to argue. I've said what I've wanted to say to MMO makers, and their players and hopefully you take a hint. Either way you've misrepresented my own words.
    My friend, take a deep breath, go for a long walk, and come back and read what you wrote. Read it from an outside perspective if you can, and truly remove your bias from your interpretation. If after doing so you still believe that I've misinterpreted your words and their meaning, then I want you to take another deep breath, go for another walk and continue this cycle until you're ready to see the barely masked contempt that you have for not only the genre, but the people who enjoy it.
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    @Zomnivore What the hell did I just read? (Interesting, but a bit eh manifesto as @Rumbleforge said).

    Edit: Good FPS IMO right now PUBG, if you're still into that.
    PUBG is an awesome game to play and also very entertaining to watch on streams. I hope AoC takes streamers (and also esports) into consideration in the core game experience.

    Not saying that every part of AoC should be streamer or esport friendly, but certain aspects such as PvP should take these into account.
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    ArchivedUserArchivedUser Guest
    edited June 2017
    I think I can describe my position better. I'm here, in America, about to dump the tea in the river, and you all are cheery-hoeing your tea and crumpets while downplaying the taxes you pay and their newly risen prices.

    At least thats the impression I get when you try to argue with me.
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    Zomnivore said:
    I think I can describe my position better. I'm here, in America, about to dump the tea in the river, and you all are cheery-hoeing your tea and crumpets while downplaying the taxes you pay and their newly risen prices.

    At least thats the impression I get when you try to argue with me.
    So the genre is the tea, and you're dumping it, while others are calmly and happily enjoying their afternoon tea? 
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    get your hands of my tea you fiend!


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    nagash said:
    get your hands of my tea you fiend!

    I think I love you a little more than I did before.
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    Krojak said:
    Zomnivore said:
    I think I can describe my position better. I'm here, in America, about to dump the tea in the river, and you all are cheery-hoeing your tea and crumpets while downplaying the taxes you pay and their newly risen prices.

    At least thats the impression I get when you try to argue with me.
    So the genre is the tea, and you're dumping it, while others are calmly and happily enjoying their afternoon tea? 
    So in this case, my example would be me espousing a revolutionary view, and taking action, and you would be the one trying to reconcile with the status quo. I sincerely hope you don't actually confuse the point of what I'm saying, just so you can appear to be "right" and "one up" me.
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    Ha.
    I like RPGs. I like online RPGs. I have enjoyed MMORPGs a great deal.
    But, I realized 4 years ago, after playing vanilla NWO, that I was pretty much done with MMORPGs. I had pre-ordered Mists of Pandaria, but I still haven't played it.

    We need a game design that will revolutionize the MMORPG genre. We need a WoW 2.0 that is way more different than EQ2 is compared to EQ.
    A couple of weeks later, the reveal for EQNext hit and that had the kind of revolutionary design that I feel the genre needs.

    Ashes has many of those same pillars that EQNext had...with nodes as the successor of Storybricks, building/destruction and meaningful conflict as the successor to EQNext's PvP conflict.

    Requiring us to build a city over the course of months and also requiring us to defend that city from destruction inherently builds community. A city that stays relevant as it levels along with the characters. The world changing dynamically as it responds to our actions rather than remaining static and static regardless of what we do.
    Those are the kinds of features we need to keep the genre alive.
    Rather than continuing to produce games where we level for 2 months and then repeat the same dailies and raids day after day for 22 months while we wait for the next expansion to drop.

    We're backing these games.
    After the fall of KOA and EQNext and Revival, I don't know how wise that is.
    Star Citizen and Crowfall aren't doing all that great. Verdict is still out.
    I'm backing Ashes so that I can fund devs working to create the features I feel the genre needs to thrive.
    Even if we have to wait a decade for something to successfully release with those features.

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    Zomnivore said:
    Your absolutely wrong
    Everyone who generalises is wrong my friend, even you.
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    Zomnivore said:
    So in this case, my example would be me espousing a revolutionary view, and taking action, and you would be the one trying to reconcile with the status quo. I sincerely hope you don't actually confuse the point of what I'm saying, just so you can appear to be "right" and "one up" me.
    Ah, but here is the great distinction! Let's continue with your revolution metaphor here You're coming into a lovely fledgling country, one that everyone here has big dreams and aspirations to help build, one that hasn't even been created yet and is but a thought, and you're shouting for revolution. Not only are you shouting at the top of your lungs, your insulting each and every person who has placed a FINANCIAL investment into the development of this nation.

    In your head, what you're saying may make sense or be logical, especially coming from these other, much bigger, much older countries (WoW, etc.), but your missing a fundamental truth: no one here wants to listen to your revolution rantings and ravings. We're quite happy supporting and building THIS country, thank you very much.
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    Meh, no button to throw you a "confused" point rather than a "like".

    Sometimes I suppose that people just need to dish out a "rambling something-something".

    At least it wasn't one huge block of text, :D

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    ArchivedUserArchivedUser Guest
    edited June 2017
    Kratz said:
    Zomnivore said:
    Your absolutely wrong
    Everyone who generalises is wrong my friend, even you.
    Am I a nitpicking grammer-nazi if I want to point out his use of "your" is wrong?

    Cause, I kinda want to point that out.


    Just sayin.  ;)
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    I can't honestly be mad at Star Citizen for taking its successful monetization campaign and going wild with it. Scope creep is a problem and I hope the game launches eventually although the extended release date is saddening. As for Crowfall I don't know how well its doing I know the premise and found it exciting, haven't kept up with the day to day runnings of the game, so that I don't bore myself before launch.
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    @Dygz I don't think people have a problem with what he said, more to do with how he said it.
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    Krojak said:
    nagash said:
    get your hands of my tea you fiend!

    I think I love you a little more than I did before.

    That makes two of us! 
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    Kratz said:
    @Dygz I don't think people have a problem with what he said, more to do with how he said it.
    Now that I think about it, this is very true. There is a difference between discussion, and being spoken down to from on top of a pedestal. 
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    ArchivedUserArchivedUser Guest
    edited June 2017
    Zomnivore said:
    I can't honestly be mad at Star Citizen for taking its successful monetization campaign and going wild with it. Scope creep is a problem and I hope the game launches eventually although the extended release date is saddening. As for Crowfall I don't know how well its doing I know the premise and found it exciting, haven't kept up with the day to day runnings of the game, so that I don't bore myself before launch.

    I'm pretty happy with Star Citizen, with where they're going and what they've accomplished so far.  They release more progress update information than any other game I've ever seen.  More than I can keep up with actually. And yes the scope is huge, but that's why I'm realistic with how much time it needs to take. 

    I'm in for that one long haul and all.  Besides, it gives me a couple years to make the space sim-pit room of my dreams.  :)
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    Lol, why have any problem with even "how he said it"? We are Gamers! Quite a few of us are probably a bit eccentric.
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    Krojak said:
    nagash said:
    get your hands of my tea you fiend!

    I think I love you a little more than I did before.

    That makes two of us! 

    You're making me blush 


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