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Phase I of Alpha Two testing will occur on weekends. Each weekend is scheduled to start on Fridays at 10 AM PT and end on Sundays at 10 PM PT. Find out more here.
Check out Alpha Two Announcements here to see the latest Alpha Two news and update notes.
Our quickest Alpha Two updates are in Discord. Testers with Alpha Two access can chat in Alpha Two channels by connecting your Discord and Intrepid accounts here.
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Some are more aligned towards healing/purification, others are more war-like and combat oriented, some deal with powerful elemental beings, and others are more evil aligned or necromantic. Literally tons of ways to play a cleric, in a tabletop game.
The cleric can best be described as a type of battlefield priest. While he in some ways is like a knight of holy orders (and is so described), such a designation better describes a paladin or cavalier. The cleric is much less a fighter, much more a "man of the cloth". They serve a fully religious function within the game, rendering aid to those in need, but at the same time are able to fight adequately, better than any other original non-fighter class, should the need arise.
The cleric is dedicated to one or more deities. Holy symbols of the faith are used in the performance of ritual spells. They may not use edged or pointed weapons, weapons which principally draw blood.
The combat table for clerics is not as good at advancing levels as that for fighters, and they do not gain multiple attacks; however, they are better and advance in combat skill faster than magic-user or thief classes, and may use any armor. Likewise, their spells are much less aggressive.
Although there are attack spells, these are less powerful than those in the magic user classes for the same level, and are overwhelmed by the number of healing and protection spells.
Unlike magic user classes, the cleric does not need to keep a spell book, and has access to any spell of any level which he is experienced enough to cast; at higher levels, the cleric may have to justify the selection of certain powerful spells to his god, who ultimately controls the granting of such more potent spells and expects them to be used in a way consistent with his alignment and interests.
Clerics also have the power to "turn" undead creatures, such as skeletons, driving them away from or destroying them by virtue of his own holy presence. Such power has a chance of working against ghasts, ghosts, ghouls, liches, mummies, shadows, skeletons, spectres, wights, wraiths, vampires, zombies, many other undead creatures, certain minor demons and devils, and rarely character types who have an extremely powerful connection to a god opposed to the cleric (an evil cleric may for example drive away a paladin). Generally the power is effective against creatures whose hit dice are not greater than the level of the cleric.
http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spellLists/clericSpells.htm
It'll mostly depend on how the spell functions, that may determine whether it has an "evil" feel to it. If it's a damaging spell, that has an added component of healing, then that aligns more with a "good" Discipline Priest.
If some of the spells do have a life drain effect, that gives the life stolen to PC's, then that would feel more "evil" Shadow Priest-like.
Though, to be honest, what's the difference between draining life, and just straight up damaging someone. Either way, harm is done. It's all about intent, imo. But, I know people have various ways they want to flavor their character. Especially if they're RP'ers.
In D&D, Clerics were expected to engage in melee, as well as heal, because spells were limited to a relatively small amount per day, rather than basically being constantly available except for cooldowns.
There might be 2 or 3 battles per day, so a party would not want Clerics to burn through all of their spells, especially healing spells, in the first fight of the day.
A healer would not simply support a party via heal spells or buff. They would also have to deal damage - usually with a mace or staff...sometimes a cudgle.
So, in an MMORPG, that would translate to being a dps/healer by default.
Ashes is making their classes feel more like classic tabletop RPGs - including adding utilities. But, also nice that they're making abilities work mostly the same in PvP as they work in PvE - like Taunt actually working on Player Characters as well as Non-Player Characters.
Cleric/Cleric is one way to maximize the healing you can do.
Also, expect there to be buffs from other archetypes, like Bard.
And there very well may be Racial/Religion/Social/Guild augments that focus on or boost Heals.
There's only 10 slots on the hotbar. I imagine you will be able to fill the hotbar with mostly pure heals if you want and have the rest be buffs... if you don't want to use any spells that deal damage. But, you'll probably end up wanting one or two damage abilities on there as well.
Seems like the devs only shared a handful of abilities, so, it's a bit early to be pessimistic that it's impossible to make a pure support Cleric.
But, keep your eyes peeled and share your concerns and feedback to help devs know what/how players want to play.
mark 24:52
STEVEN: In regards to healing, you're going to see the ability to do group heals, to do spot healing, you're going to see sustainability, you're going to see heals over time, you're going to see a lot of standard healing abilities.
JEFFREY: Yeah, and also within that class you're going to be able to spec out how you do your healing. And that's also going to be dependent on your sub-class, but there's going to be some really clever ways that we get people to recover within battle.
STEVEN: Right. And the most important part of support within the healer class is that they're actively involved. They're not just sitting there.
JEFFREY: Right. They're a part of the game. They're not a passive that you get to bring around. It's going to be an active play session in order to make that happen.
The way they Defined the Cleric ... seemed to resembled a Life-Drain Style Combat that'll revolve too much on Debuffs ... debuffs that can be seemingly cleansed
( based on my experience ) .
I was hoping for more of a ... Mage-like Combat, but having Defensive-Capabilities with Staff / Scepter for Close-Range Shenanigans.
(The Video below as an example )
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X1oWM28ZGAA
18:43 - 19:07
but never challenging / rivaling the Tank-Archetype defensive capabilities - just minor / basic abilities that could only be slightly-improved upon
( something I'd hoped for all Classes to have - a Basic Palette of abilities that could be Branched out, but it'll never be " out-shined " by another Class that Specializes in that Specific Area / has more Emphasis in that Specific Area. But noticeable / viable enough to where it could save the User's from being killed via PvE & PvP & Open-World PvP. )
Maybe Water / Wind Elemental Spells/Attacks to Emphasize Healing ? Water can be used to Heal some injuries & Wind is somewhat Therapeutic ... depending on how you look at
How the " Bud of the Staff " ? Hits the ground & Emits a healing Wave?
( Similar to the Below Video ... maybe More Emphasis on the Wave ? )
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nFipSZz0tJg
(0:03 - 0:06 )
The " Wave of Mana " could Both inflict Damage to the Opponents & Heal the Party Members
Note ... the 2nd Video took Forever to Find
That iteration of Cleric is of the most classic kind. Depending on the rulebook, Clerics of War gods, or specific portfolios, could use bladed weapons. Of course, the GM's could use, not use, or change rules as they saw fit, to play the game to the liking of all participating.
That portfolio idea would possibly be where the religion augments comes in. Just that it could affect the other classes as well.
A fighter form the God of War could have a subtle difference from the fighter from the God of nature.
A Healer in chain/plate mail wielding a mace and shield has always been what I've pictured when I think clerics. aD&D's to blame for that. Haha. Oh yes... And holy symbol wielding/undead turning.
*Summons @Illrathuleon for D&D talk.
I feel the Cleric/Cleric would be the main back of the group meter watcher and hybrids would give you the options to be more of a "melee healer" like the WAR WarriorPriest/Disciple of Khaine or DAoC Friar.
If you stood in the back and avoided direct conflict you could be considered as had taken a passive role, but not a peaceful one. If, like in real war, your soldiers came back to you at some sort of base camp to be healed, or you retrieved and removed the wounded from the battlefield maybe you could pull off a peaceful Cleric. Although, according to my argument that would still not be peaceful if any of those soldiers ever made it back to battle.
I do however feel sorry for those that have truly become accustomed to said passive/healer roles if there is not an option in Ashes. If that does become the case, maybe it's time to take your God's will to the front line!
The post that have indicated that the Cleric explained is for a play-test, that the weapon choice is default for the play-test, and that we are still really far out from any finalized character concepts have made the most sense to me in this thread.
That could be melee or range dps although the devs indicated that there will be times that the Cleric will want to be within melee range in order to get the most out of some abilities that deal both damage and heals at the same time.
The devs don't really want Clerics to just be in the back passively watching the group meter. Rather, they want the Cleric, especially, to be actively moving around the field of battle.
Sub-class will affect role.
All classes will have dps.
Whether or not you chose to put those skills on your bar is up to you, but don't complain when you can't do anything without someone holding your hand.
i never imagined the cleric as a pacifist priest. There are many games where the God they follow, impacts how the cleric acts. If they follow a dark or evil god like @nagash
they are more similar to necromancer. If they follow a God of War they are more similar to Paladins.
But what i liked about their explanation is, the life the cleric gives has to come from somewhere.This is interesting point of view. What if you fight an enemy that's not alive like a undead? you can't siphon life from them, to heal your party, it even may hurt them!
This is interesting! Not simple, hotbar healing like in most MMOs these days, but the healer has also to consider the battlefield!
And I use the term "melee healer" as opposed to dps healer because the skills mentioned were frontline or melee distance only. I don't consider ranged dps to fit that presented model because that would mean they could stand in the back and *pew*pew* and heal. Maybe a Cleric/Mage will have that as an option?
So if you want a pure back seat healer you may have to go bard/Cleric.
Also it can be very weapon depenant, their cleric they said uses a melee weapon.
Clerics should be able to solo and gain xp by Purging and healing and exploring rather than by killing stuff - if that's what they want to do.
mark 24:52
STEVEN: Right. And the most important part of support within the healer class is that they're actively involved. They're not just sitting there.
JEFFREY: Right. They're a part of the game. They're not a passive that you get to bring around. It's going to be an active play session in order to make that happen.
Though, the devs have said that though all classes would be "role agnostic", they prefaced by saying that certain classes would be naturally better in certain roles than others.
A "Mage/Tank" may be able to tank effectively, if equipped with heavy armor, and shield. The tank secondary class, may add a "taunt effect" to fireballs, "paralyze effect" to lightning bolts, add a "wall/barrier" or "slow" effect to ice spells...just theory crafting.
These would allow a Mage primary class to tank, in it's own way, but it wouldn't have the battlefield control that a Tank primary class would.
And I'm expecting my Mage/Tank to be able to augment Fireball and Lightning Bolt with Taunt.
A Tank/Tank is going to be the best tank.
A Cleric/Cleric is going to be the best healer.
But, adding Rogue to Tank means the Tank's role can be stealth and recon.
Adding Mage to Tank, means the Tank's role can be detecting hidden rooms and passageways.
How the character build maximizes their augments significantly affects their role.
That a Mage/Tank won't be as effective at tanking as a Tank/Tank is a different issue/topic than the assertion that sub-class won't affect role.
Sub-class will significantly affect one's role.
As I stated, in one of the earliest pod casts, this was a question asked of the devs, and they specifically stated that the secondary classes skills would only "flavor" the primary classes skills, not add to them. They even specifically stated that there would be no "fireball throwing tanks", and such.
As always, this is early development, and things are always subject to change. But, for now, until they say otherwise, it is what it is.
Having said that, a Tank/Mage may be able to add elemental damage to it's primary abilities, like a "fire/ice/lightning barrier", or something. Or, a augmented taunt may have some kind of ice damage added to it, as was described in your post.
But, if someone is picturing a Tank/Mage simply raising a hand, and casting a standard fireball then, as of now, no.
FFT ftw