Pretty sure they said it would be only leaders of metro's and large guilds with castles and then only in certain times they could be used. Like during sieges. Gonna have to re-watch the live streams.
As far as flying in general is concerned there should be none IMO. For all reasons stated. I play the quit WOW after finishing the current content because of group finder and flying. There is no one left in the open world any more. Being on a PvP server was a challenge to go due dungeons. Now just que for it or fly to the raid door. Most times there isn't anybody even in the zones gets boring fast.
I don't think any single player should obtain gameplay (or fighting) advantage based on his political position.
I'ts always specific players (guild leaders) that eat the candy, while everyone else plays commonly. And I'm kinda sick of it.
If dragons are added for political positions I already know in advance I will never have it because I am not a guild leader. And this part of gameplay is already ruined for me, 2 years before game was even released.
Flight should be accessible to everyone, or to noone!
If you wish to separate castle leaders, then give flying mounts to every player (birds) but give dragon skins to castle leaders.
What's awesome about the fact that this game is an MMORPG is that no one is telling you not to become a guild leader! If you feel so strongly about guild leaders getting benefits, you're more than welcome to step up to the plate and try your hand at getting one! The position of being a guild leader isn't always eating the candy, there are lots of things we have to deal with to get to that point.
This being said, there are gliding mounts which are psudo-flying mounts that will be available commonly to players.
This is what happened with Jedi in SWG, and it led to it's demise.
?
People fighting about some elite class, or in this case a dragon. It'll be nerfed and upped and spun around but it'll never please everybody. The devs need to just ignore entire threads like this. The game hasn't even been played yet.
People fighting about some elite class, or in this case a dragon. It'll be nerfed and upped and spun around but it'll never please everybody. The devs need to just ignore entire threads like this. The game hasn't even been played yet.
Umm, they do. All the bitching and moaning accomplishes exactly 0. Doesn't stop the hype train. The only time they bowed to a vocal minority on the forums was for the Summer Backing, and after the shitshow that turned out to be if you think anything written by the extra chromosome carrying forum base is going to actually taken seriously you're deluded.
People fighting about some elite class, or in this case a dragon. It'll be nerfed and upped and spun around but it'll never please everybody. The devs need to just ignore entire threads like this. The game hasn't even been played yet.
Umm, they do. All the bitching and moaning accomplishes exactly 0. Doesn't stop the hype train. The only time they bowed to a vocal minority on the forums was for the Summer Backing, and after the shitshow that turned out to be if you think anything written by the extra chromosome carrying forum base is going to actually taken seriously you're deluded.
Guess I just get skeptical about things like this. It's how must MMO's kill themselves, either that or they get money hungry.
It's not about being accessible to anyone. It's about everyone having the same chance at it, and this is not how it is.
It is predetermined who will have dragons and this will be guild leaders as they will own the castles. And this is lame.
If anyone had same chance at getting a dragon I'd be more than fine with only 1% of people having it.
If you want one so bad then you have the option to work hard and lead a guild that can acquire a castle or take one over. Earn the privilege or aren't you man/woman enough?
Harsh
I see what @Gothix is trying to say and agree in many ways. Only the most popular will get the 'special' rewards. And the most popular are not necessarily the most civilised. Take any dictator in history for instance.
I would prefer such things are given to the leaders of civilisation. Not special interest groups, nor guilds, nor tyrants and dictators. Maybe even one type for leaders of civilisation and one type for leaders of destruction. A corrupt dragon if you like.
It's not about being accessible to anyone. It's about everyone having the same chance at it, and this is not how it is.
It is predetermined who will have dragons and this will be guild leaders as they will own the castles. And this is lame.
If anyone had same chance at getting a dragon I'd be more than fine with only 1% of people having it.
If you want one so bad then you have the option to work hard and lead a guild that can acquire a castle or take one over. Earn the privilege or aren't you man/woman enough?
Harsh
I see what @Gothix is trying to say and agree in many ways. Only the most popular will get the 'special' rewards. And the most popular are not necessarily the most civilised. Take any dictator in history for instance.
I would prefer such things are given to the leaders of civilisation. Not special interest groups, nor guilds, nor tyrants and dictators. Maybe even one type for leaders of civilisation and one type for leaders of destruction. A corrupt dragon if you like.
Rune. I have to agree about tyrants and dictators etc. But you talk about the most popular getting "special awards". It is not going to be easy to acquire a castle and if a guild does it's not going to be easy to keep it. It's going to take dedication and a lot of work. Mainly it's going to take good leadership to bring and keep people working for the cause. Not everyone is up to such a job.
Why shouldn't a player be rewarded for such devotion and hard work? He/she is going to have to work even harder to maintain and keep that castle. Does this create competition? Sure it does but that's a main part of this game that and meaningful conflict. Also remember castle sieges are guild events.
Personally I could care less. The point I am trying to make is that I feel such a leader deserves some kind of reward.
Those of us who are deemed as the common men/women will have our own person rewards. We will have what we work for.
Don't forget. if they lose that castle they also lose the dragon.
It's not about being accessible to anyone. It's about everyone having the same chance at it, and this is not how it is.
It is predetermined who will have dragons and this will be guild leaders as they will own the castles. And this is lame.
If anyone had same chance at getting a dragon I'd be more than fine with only 1% of people having it.
If you want one so bad then you have the option to work hard and lead a guild that can acquire a castle or take one over. Earn the privilege or aren't you man/woman enough?
Harsh
I see what @Gothix is trying to say and agree in many ways. Only the most popular will get the 'special' rewards. And the most popular are not necessarily the most civilised. Take any dictator in history for instance.
I would prefer such things are given to the leaders of civilisation. Not special interest groups, nor guilds, nor tyrants and dictators. Maybe even one type for leaders of civilisation and one type for leaders of destruction. A corrupt dragon if you like.
Rune. I have to agree about tyrants and dictators etc. But you talk about the most popular getting "special awards". It is not going to be easy to acquire a castle and if a guild does it's not going to be easy to keep it. It's going to take dedication and a lot of work. Mainly it's going to take good leadership to bring and keep people working for the cause. Not everyone is up to such a job.
Why shouldn't a player be rewarded for such devotion and hard work? He/she is going to have to work even harder to maintain and keep that castle. Does this create competition? Sure it does but that's a main part of this game that and meaningful conflict. Also remember castle sieges are guild events.
Personally I could care less. The point I am trying to make is that I feel such a leader deserves some kind of reward.
Those of us who are deemed as the common men/women will have our own person rewards. We will have what we work for.
Don't forget. if they lose that castle they also lose the dragon.
Should you be rewarded for building a nation upon slavery ? No matter how much blood you spilt and effort you put in along the way ?
Perhaps the game should be realistic and gritty and a free for all in a dog eat dog world, where only the strong and barbaric survive the brutality. Perhaps the game should just lets thugs run around doing their thing at leisure to anyone at anytime. Perhaps its not for the game to judge and let what will be ....be.
OK I will sit back and watch this MMO burn like every other.
Oh come on Rune, Slavery? Really? People have a choice to belong to and follow a guild leader. Slaves had no choice. This IS a game. Not RL. Think we both need some coffee or tea this morning.
It's not about being accessible to anyone. It's about everyone having the same chance at it, and this is not how it is.
It is predetermined who will have dragons and this will be guild leaders as they will own the castles. And this is lame.
If anyone had same chance at getting a dragon I'd be more than fine with only 1% of people having it.
You have the chance to be a guildleader and getting it if you put in the time, it's effort = reward, you have the exact same accessability. I don't get why it's such a big deal that you won't get to experience one part of the game, it's just like raiding, some people won't get to experience that because they don't have the time to do it. Should we then make raiding available for people who can only play half an hour at a time? hell no!
Also; the playing field is leveled! There is no risk that we will have empty guilds with only guildleader as guess what; most people are OK with not having a flying mount! There are literally dozens of other MMOs you can go play if you want a game where everyone gets to experience absolutely everything the game has, why don't you go play one of the themepark MMOs that exist already instead?
Putting in the time shouldn't be all you have to do to get to experience everything either imo, that just makes it a grindfest; "oh look that guy has a flying mount, imagine all the hours he must've put in for that!", also it takes away the epic feeling if some random guy is running around with it rather than a guildleader or high ranking person in a guild. In any case all of this is moot as they already said that they were going to have dragon eggs drop off dragon etc, so being a guildleader isn't the only way to get your hands on a flying mount.
It's not about being accessible to anyone. It's about everyone having the same chance at it, and this is not how it is.
It is predetermined who will have dragons and this will be guild leaders as they will own the castles. And this is lame.
If anyone had same chance at getting a dragon I'd be more than fine with only 1% of people having it.
I see what Gothix is saying.. i'm afraid i have to pretty much completely disagree..
Everyone does have the same chance at getting the dragon.
But that chance is not based on RNG, nor should it be.
RNG is nice for little loot surprises of course, but in the game, as in life, there should also be rewards that are based upon effort and success, not just upon random chance.
(If you think that all the rewards in a game should be based on random chance, I would direct you to Project Entropia, but be warned, in a casino the house always wins)
Making a guild is something that anyone can do. A lot of people will try to form a guild and a lot of people will be unsuccessful. A lot of people will be successful at forming a guild and yet may never get a dragon.
It sounds a wee bit like RNG, right? But it isn't the same thing.
I figure if you can band a bunch of people together behind your leadership, keep that clan together, demonstrate in game that you are a leader worth following by leading that guild to glory, or whatever... why should a person who puts in all the effort to achieve that not have their shot at a dragon?
If getting a dragon is something that you can only do by being the leader of a very successful guild, than getting to the point of eligibility for a dragon is still something anyone can do, but a lot of people won't, because it involves more risk and investment than they care to tolerate.
Everything we've learned about Ashes so far indicates that it is game based not so much on RNG, but rather on risk vs reward mechanics.
If you go out gathering, you risk getting ganked.. but if you gather successfully, without running into trouble, it could be worthwhile.
minor risk/investment-> minor reward
If you pk some gatherer, you risk being bounty hunted, perhaps dropping equips, and your stats will be impacted, but killing them might be worth it if they drop a lot of gather materials, for example, because you save all the time that would have been required to gather them yourself.
low to medium risk/investment -> low to medium reward
If you use a caravan to ship a lot of goods, you could get ambushed and lose everything, but the reward for success could be worth a lot to you or to your guild.
high risk/investment -> high reward.
You spend all your time creating a guild and lead that guild to victory after victory trying to claim a castle. Your guild might get beaten to smithereens.. or splinter, or be betrayed from within, or fall apart over an argument, or just not have what it takes to hold a castle. But if you are successful at all that? Why here's your dragon m'am. Try not to fly it over an army of ice zombies.
highest risk/investment -> highest reward
If you see someone like that with a dragon, and you automatically think "I don't want to risk/invest the same amount of time/effort that she did, so that makes it not fair".. then you grew up in a different world than I did.
@xephita Nothing on large mobs loot distribution confirmed as of yet. Look for it once they actually decide on which loot systems to implement.
Thanks, I have a lot going on at the moment and not really keeping up with much news, I know I could google but instead of sorting through loads of results rather do it as part of a discussion.
So far the devs do seem to be leaning towards the 'more inclusive' side of things in the way they talk about game mechanics, so a more public event style participation based loot system is what I'm predicting. Who knows though.
Oh come on Rune, Slavery? Really? People have a choice to belong to and follow a guild leader. Slaves had no choice. This IS a game. Not RL. Think we both need some coffee or tea this morning.
You are right my dear. Bad day. Sorry everyone.
My point is there is some kind of selection process for climbing to the top of a node. There is no such process in a guild. The guild leader is the guild leader.
My 2nd point on the civilisation side is a serious point concerning this guild leader selection. Its not some kind of democracy with any kind of leadership selection process....not even trial by combat.
The dog eat dog world does not exist because of the corruption system. Thats what makes it civilised. If you want a dog eat dog world then remove it. Do you still want the dog eat dog world now ? You want a full on PvP survival game ? I think most people want to keep the corruption precisely because they want a civilised ingame world and not the law of the jungle.
Comments
oh lawd jesus its a fyah!~
As far as flying in general is concerned there should be none IMO. For all reasons stated. I play the quit WOW after finishing the current content because of group finder and flying. There is no one left in the open world any more. Being on a PvP server was a challenge to go due dungeons. Now just que for it or fly to the raid door. Most times there isn't anybody even in the zones gets boring fast.
This being said, there are gliding mounts which are psudo-flying mounts that will be available commonly to players.
https://forums.ashesofcreation.com/discussion/35368/to-fly-or-not-to-fly-who-gets-a-dragon/p1
Good to hear it though.
I see what @Gothix is trying to say and agree in many ways.
Only the most popular will get the 'special' rewards.
And the most popular are not necessarily the most civilised.
Take any dictator in history for instance.
I would prefer such things are given to the leaders of civilisation.
Not special interest groups, nor guilds, nor tyrants and dictators.
Maybe even one type for leaders of civilisation and one type for leaders of destruction. A corrupt dragon if you like.
Why shouldn't a player be rewarded for such devotion and hard work? He/she is going to have to work even harder to maintain and keep that castle. Does this create competition? Sure it does but that's a main part of this game that and meaningful conflict.
Also remember castle sieges are guild events.
Personally I could care less. The point I am trying to make is that I feel such a leader deserves some kind of reward.
Those of us who are deemed as the common men/women will have our own person rewards. We will have what we work for.
Don't forget. if they lose that castle they also lose the dragon.
No matter how much blood you spilt and effort you put in along the way ?
Perhaps the game should be realistic and gritty and a free for all in a dog eat dog world, where only the strong and barbaric survive the brutality. Perhaps the game should just lets thugs run around doing their thing at leisure to anyone at anytime. Perhaps its not for the game to judge and let what will be ....be.
OK I will sit back and watch this MMO burn like every other.
This IS a game. Not RL. Think we both need some coffee or tea this morning.
You have the chance to be a guildleader and getting it if you put in the time, it's effort = reward, you have the exact same accessability. I don't get why it's such a big deal that you won't get to experience one part of the game, it's just like raiding, some people won't get to experience that because they don't have the time to do it. Should we then make raiding available for people who can only play half an hour at a time? hell no!
Also; the playing field is leveled! There is no risk that we will have empty guilds with only guildleader as guess what; most people are OK with not having a flying mount! There are literally dozens of other MMOs you can go play if you want a game where everyone gets to experience absolutely everything the game has, why don't you go play one of the themepark MMOs that exist already instead?
Putting in the time shouldn't be all you have to do to get to experience everything either imo, that just makes it a grindfest; "oh look that guy has a flying mount, imagine all the hours he must've put in for that!", also it takes away the epic feeling if some random guy is running around with it rather than a guildleader or high ranking person in a guild. In any case all of this is moot as they already said that they were going to have dragon eggs drop off dragon etc, so being a guildleader isn't the only way to get your hands on a flying mount.
Feels bad man
Everyone does have the same chance at getting the dragon.
But that chance is not based on RNG, nor should it be.
RNG is nice for little loot surprises of course, but in the game, as in life, there should also be rewards that are based upon effort and success, not just upon random chance.
(If you think that all the rewards in a game should be based on random chance, I would direct you to Project Entropia, but be warned, in a casino the house always wins)
Making a guild is something that anyone can do.
A lot of people will try to form a guild and a lot of people will be unsuccessful.
A lot of people will be successful at forming a guild and yet may never get a dragon.
It sounds a wee bit like RNG, right? But it isn't the same thing.
I figure if you can band a bunch of people together behind your leadership, keep that clan together, demonstrate in game that you are a leader worth following by leading that guild to glory, or whatever... why should a person who puts in all the effort to achieve that not have their shot at a dragon?
If getting a dragon is something that you can only do by being the leader of a very successful guild, than getting to the point of eligibility for a dragon is still something anyone can do, but a lot of people won't, because it involves more risk and investment than they care to tolerate.
Everything we've learned about Ashes so far indicates that it is game based not so much on RNG, but rather on risk vs reward mechanics.
If you go out gathering, you risk getting ganked.. but if you gather successfully, without running into trouble, it could be worthwhile.
minor risk/investment-> minor reward
If you pk some gatherer, you risk being bounty hunted, perhaps dropping equips, and your stats will be impacted, but killing them might be worth it if they drop a lot of gather materials, for example, because you save all the time that would have been required to gather them yourself.
low to medium risk/investment -> low to medium reward
If you use a caravan to ship a lot of goods, you could get ambushed and lose everything, but the reward for success could be worth a lot to you or to your guild.
high risk/investment -> high reward.
You spend all your time creating a guild and lead that guild to victory after victory trying to claim a castle. Your guild might get beaten to smithereens.. or splinter, or be betrayed from within, or fall apart over an argument, or just not have what it takes to hold a castle. But if you are successful at all that? Why here's your dragon m'am. Try not to fly it over an army of ice zombies.
highest risk/investment -> highest reward
If you see someone like that with a dragon, and you automatically think "I don't want to risk/invest the same amount of time/effort that she did, so that makes it not fair".. then you grew up in a different world than I did.
So far the devs do seem to be leaning towards the 'more inclusive' side of things in the way they talk about game mechanics, so a more public event style participation based loot system is what I'm predicting. Who knows though.
My point is there is some kind of selection process for climbing to the top of a node. There is no such process in a guild. The guild leader is the guild leader.
My 2nd point on the civilisation side is a serious point concerning this guild leader selection. Its not some kind of democracy with any kind of leadership selection process....not even trial by combat.
The dog eat dog world does not exist because of the corruption system. Thats what makes it civilised. If you want a dog eat dog world then remove it. Do you still want the dog eat dog world now ? You want a full on PvP survival game ? I think most people want to keep the corruption precisely because they want a civilised ingame world and not the law of the jungle.
That the main reason i am here anyway.
/shrugs