Female Representation Pitfalls (AKA "The Chainmail Bikini")

ArchivedUser

Demonneo said:

Sexy armor without being naked xD

oh no oh no oh no

ArchivedUser

Eragale said:

This one below ... not sure if its Part-Leather. But seems like Armor

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This last one .. ... well ... its not full armor. But the Helmet made me like it . Plus she might be wearing a Chain Mail underneath

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Those sets look great. The one at the bottom gives off a mercenary company look.

ArchivedUser

ArchivedUser

nagash said:

The first one ^^

ArchivedUser

HK83 said:

Looking at the development staff, I noticed there aren't any females present.  This leads me to wonder if the in-game female models are going to be a rehash of games past, specifically in the department of clothing.

You know what I'm talking about:  A female fighter with an armor class to take on the world who visually looks like she's wearing a mid-drift top and hot-pants.  It's kind of contrived and I don't always want my females 'pretty' from a roleplaying perspective.  Sometimes you don't want to play Xena as much as you want Brienne of Tarth.

I guess this all leads to the question:  What ARE your thoughts or plans on the topic of 'realistic' armor options?

Dont worry im sure it will be tasteful

ArchivedUser

I'm a woman and I want to say that we need options for both.

I do like wearing skimpy stuff. Just as it is frustrating to some to see chainmail bikinis it's just as frustrating to be told you can't wear them.

Men in chainmail speedos wouldn't hurt the equality part too and who doesn't like a tribal look especially with the islander dwarves!!!

ArchivedUser

Valentines said:

I'm a woman and I want to say that we need options for both.

I do like wearing skimpy stuff. Just as it is frustrating to some to see chainmail bikinis it's just as frustrating to be told you can't wear them.

Men in chainmail speedos wouldn't hurt the equality part too and who doesn't like a tribal look especially with the islander dwarves!!!

You mean like this

ArchivedUser

NightshadeRaven said:

Valentines said:

I'm a woman and I want to say that we need options for both.

I do like wearing skimpy stuff. Just as it is frustrating to some to see chainmail bikinis it's just as frustrating to be told you can't wear them.

Men in chainmail speedos wouldn't hurt the equality part too and who doesn't like a tribal look especially with the islander dwarves!!!

You mean like this

or like this 

ArchivedUser

or, you know....like this

ArchivedUser

Santy182 said:

or, you know....like this

Oh wow they are stunning what game are the from ^^

ArchivedUser

Well my feeling is armor is armor.  If you make your armor to expose midriff, then it's a vulnerable spot, so your chain bikini should only be maybe half as good as full chain shirt.

I once saw a set of ladies armor at Scarborough faire, which was form fitting pliant leather under armor, with a plate skirt, bustier, shoulder's and forearms.  Dang sexy looking too.  So it can be done.

That being said, I certainly think there should be some ability to customize clothing.  For tavern settings, or a merchant, even for a strumpet if someone wants to RP one.

Armor is there to try and keep you from getting scarred for life, or dead.  Clothing is there so you can um...show off your scars... XD

ArchivedUser

dmgavin said:

I once saw a set of ladies armor at Scarborough faire, which was form fitting pliant leather under armor, with a plate skirt, bustier, shoulder's and forearms.  Dang sexy looking too.  So it can be done.

Armor can certainly be both functional and feminine, some good examples have been posted in this thread of what that might look like.

So far the concept art has made gear look ornate and fantastical, yet also plausible and functional.  I would wager that IS would make female armor aesthetically pleasing without going chainmail bikini or leather tube top.

ArchivedUser

The existence of magic makes all arguments for realistic armor moot. As long as we can conjure balls of fire and projectiles of Ice who is to say we can not make our Chain mail bikini more protective.

If someone is wearing full plate armor and i am a mage they are effectively wearing a portable oven  for my Fireballs.  It someone is a mage he should be able to conjure a full bdy shield to make that plate bikini protect the full body.

ArchivedUser

Xontian said:

If someone is wearing full plate armor and i am a mage they are effectively wearing a portable oven  for my Fireballs.  It someone is a mage he should be able to conjure a full bdy shield to make that plate bikini protect the full body.

A mage could not produce enough heat to cook someone in full plate. Your mana would just run out very quickly.

ArchivedUser

Xontian said:

The existence of magic makes all arguments for realistic armor moot. As long as we can conjure balls of fire and projectiles of Ice who is to say we can not make our Chain mail bikini more protective.

If someone is wearing full plate armor and i am a mage they are effectively wearing a portable oven  for my Fireballs.  It someone is a mage he should be able to conjure a full bdy shield to make that plate bikini protect the full body.

this could be cool, make it a spell something like turn all of your worn cloth armor pieces into plate armor. It could be something like a sustained spell that constantly drains your mana and doubles the cast time of every other spell while you're focusing on sustaining your armor.

ArchivedUser

Santy182 said:

Xontian said:

The existence of magic makes all arguments for realistic armor moot. As long as we can conjure balls of fire and projectiles of Ice who is to say we can not make our Chain mail bikini more protective.

If someone is wearing full plate armor and i am a mage they are effectively wearing a portable oven  for my Fireballs.  It someone is a mage he should be able to conjure a full bdy shield to make that plate bikini protect the full body.

this could be cool, make it a spell something like turn all of your worn cloth armor pieces into plate armor. It could be something like a sustained spell that constantly drains your mana and doubles the cast time of every other spell while you're focusing on sustaining your armor.

So something like rock armour or armour of frost?

ArchivedUser

not sure how those work, but not like a buff you cast once and that's it, I was thinking more along the lines of a mage having to actually cast and maintain the spell to put the magic on his clothes.

ArchivedUser

Santy182 said:

not sure how those work, but not like a buff you cast once and that's it, I was thinking more along the lines of a mage having to actually cast and maintain the spell to put the magic on his clothes.

like this

ArchivedUser

awesome! but without the aesthetic changes =P

just an invisible magical barrier

ArchivedUser

Santy182 said:

awesome! but without the aesthetic changes =P

just an invisible magical barrier

that would be quite impressive 

ArchivedUser

Xontian said:

The existence of magic makes all arguments for realistic armor moot. As long as we can conjure balls of fire and projectiles of Ice who is to say we can not make our Chain mail bikini more protective.

It’s not moot if I don’t want to look ridiculous.

ArchivedUser

Atama said:

Xontian said:

The existence of magic makes all arguments for realistic armor moot. As long as we can conjure balls of fire and projectiles of Ice who is to say we can not make our Chain mail bikini more protective.

It’s not moot if I don’t want to look ridiculous.

blame the halflings 

ArchivedUser

nagash said:

Atama said:

Xontian said:

The existence of magic makes all arguments for realistic armor moot. As long as we can conjure balls of fire and projectiles of Ice who is to say we can not make our Chain mail bikini more protective.

It’s not moot if I don’t want to look ridiculous.

blame the halflings 

You can make a very stylish hat out of a halfling so there’s that at least.  

ArchivedUser

Atama said:

It’s not moot if I don’t want to look ridiculous.

Well, no one is forcing you to wear a chain bikini if you don't want to.

I'll likely avoid the chain bikinis myself, but I do tend to like to alternate between sexy and conservative armour based on the personalities I give my characters.

ArchivedUser

dmgavin said:

I once saw a set of ladies armor at Scarborough faire, which was form fitting pliant leather under armor, with a plate skirt, bustier, shoulder's and forearms.  Dang sexy looking too.  So it can be done.

I don't suppose you have a picture of that?  It sounds great. 

ArchivedUser

I decided a little while back to ask Steven about this topic after never managing to get an answer through the live streams. To my surprise, I actually received an answer on Discord:

For me, this answer sounds great, as I really love elegant clothing for my characters. Very happy that they are including different styles of gear, and not going for only "full body armour" or "revealing".

ArchivedUser

Nelirya said:

I decided a little while back to ask Steven about this topic after never managing to get an answer through the live streams. To my surprise, I actually received an answer on Discord:

For me, this answer sounds great, as I really love elegant clothing for my characters. Very happy that they are including different styles of gear, and not going for only "full body armour" or "revealing".

Thats very good news

ArchivedUser

Nefelia said:

Atama said:

It’s not moot if I don’t want to look ridiculous.

Well, no one is forcing you to wear a chain bikini if you don't want to.

I don’t think you paid attention to what I was responding to.  And thank you for not including that part when you quoted me so that you could take my words out of context.

What I was responding to was:

“The existence of magic makes all arguments for realistic armor moot. As long as we can conjure balls of fire and projectiles of Ice who is to say we can not make our Chain mail bikini more protective.”

That person argued that we don’t need realistic armor since we have magic.  My retort was that I want to wear realistic armor because unrealistic armor looks ridiculous.

If there is no realistic armor, then yes, they are forcing me to wear a chainmail bikini.

Again, please do not take words out of context.

ArchivedUser

I didn't say you couldn't or shouldn't wear realistic armor. You should wear whatever takes your fancy and so should everyone else. My argument was that totally realistic armor is not necessary if we can fortify ourselves as magic users.
The extra mana cost to make you cloth armor behave as mail may or may not be worth it. But that is a decision everyone will have to make for themselves.
That was really my point that everyone should be able to wear what they want and live with the consequences of those decisions. Maybe wearing full plate as a mage would hinder your ability to cast therefore you just might want to use the mana on a spell that makes the cloth protect you better. I think everyone in this game will be relying on some form of magic or at least magic like properties so i dont really see this as an issue.

ArchivedUser

Ultimately in order to get the most bang for the buck on the cosmetic pieces, there is no reason the glamour slot is going to be restricted to only mages.  That would mess up the look options for a large chunk of the playerbase needlessly.

When enough different styles available, it all becomes a matter of player choice and how they would like to dress their character.  If there are enough armor styles available and a person would rather their fighter’s armor look like a maid outfit, isn’t that their own decision? Do they really need to be punished for doing so?