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Phase I of Alpha Two testing will occur on weekends. Each weekend is scheduled to start on Fridays at 10 AM PT and end on Sundays at 10 PM PT. Find out more here.
Check out Alpha Two Announcements here to see the latest Alpha Two news and update notes.
Our quickest Alpha Two updates are in Discord. Testers with Alpha Two access can chat in Alpha Two channels by connecting your Discord and Intrepid accounts here.
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I suggest Steelseries Rival 500
Hopefully there won't be a need for MMO mouses or worse..clicking on abilities
I feel like I would just use a bunch of abilites on accident
Ill just stay with my not-overprized-at-all gaming mouses, they only have around 4 diffrent buttons
i woud like to use tab targeting .
or woud you like me to try and keep my mouse cursor on your toon while you are jumping around and dodging ?
tab targeting olso allows me to chat while in combat whith party members or my guild or watever .
i like to play MMOs in longer runs like 4-5 hours at a time .
and i might be old fashion but i like to chat whith text instead of talking into a microphone .
AoE heals, dropping a regeneration spell, a spell that hits an enemy and everyone that hits it gets healed, and so on. Other MMOs have figured out a variety of healing methods other than “target ally, press heal spell button”.
Though I will say that healing is probably the strongest case for tab target skills.
And if I’m in a fight and you’re chatting in text I don’t want you as my healer. Come on now...
We shall see how healing will work with action in castle sieges
A true competitive gamer wouldn't bind 1-7.
Unless you're Shaquille O'neal, you would need to move your entire hand away from your resting hand position to access six and seven, and potentially displace at least one of your other fingers on 5.
This means you lose access to having your fingers aligned with other keys, makes combination key presses more difficult, you lose speed in having to move your hand, you lose some precision, and are prone to fat fingering (like with those MMO mouses someone else mentioned), while also slowing down your keypresses, which can cause you to float past global cool down frequently.
Also you gave an example of exactly 30. Often that's not enough.
Let me give you an example of a Frost mage in WoW, 2019.
1. Frost Nova
2. Blink
3. Polymorph
4. Conjure
5. Ice Block
6. Slow Fall
7. Counterspell
8. Time Warp
9. Spellsteal
10. Frostbolt
11. Ice Lance
12. Summon: Water Elemental
13. Flurry
14. Ice Floes
15. Cone of Cold
16. Icy Veins
17. Blizzard
18. Ice Barrier
19. Invisbility
20. Cold Snap
21. Frost Armor
22. Frozen Orb
23. Ray of Frost
24. Mirror Image
25. Ice Nova
26. Ring of Frost
27. Frost Bomb
28. Glacial Spike
29. Gladiator's Medallion
30. Temporal Shield
31. Ice Form
32. Trinket 1
33. Trinket 2
34. Miscellaneous armor active abilities (however many)
35. Miscellaneous consumables (pots and stuff)
36. Wand Attack
37. Target enemy 1 (These are very important for spellsteal, target focus, counterspell, etc)
38. Target enemy 2
39. Target enemy 3
40. Target enemy 4
41. Target enemy 5
42. Target Self (Icy Nova, other ally target abilities)
43. Target ally 2
44. Target ally 3
45. Target ally 4
46. Target ally 5
47. Target enemy cycle (traditional tab target)
48. Even more stuff I can't think of off the top of my head.
I've considered it, but I can't imagine how many times I'd accidentally key press something wrong. My brother used to use one but switched back to traditional keyboard and a 7 button mouse, which I have also used. Pro players doing things like Starcraft 2 use it, so I suspect it's sound - I'm quite accustomed to tons of keybinds at this point, with lots of modifiers.
Some of my gaming buddies despise it with a passion, though.
I like the way Albion handles it too, but even Albion is a bit simplistic :P - I'd very much enjoy an action combat game. Albion only keeps me around because of the great PvP opportunities.
Action based combat healer done right.
Here is a video of a priest healing in Tera in one of the hardest dungeons in the game. This is my favorite type of combat, fast and fun!
A lot of equipment are based on personal opinions and experience and I can totally understand that someone does not like MMO mouse and its small buttons. In a bad situation you can easily press wrong buttons because of that. Even so, I have found MMO mouse as a QoL thing and especially in PvE situations. When I played Albion, I did not bind those attack buttons on mouse, because it was more effectice to use/spam Q,W,E on keyboard. So I think it also depends of the game where the MMO mouse really shines.
I am able to reach any key bind up to 8, using any single modifier (and also using ctrl + shift), while still having full control of my character. rather than attempting to keep your three primary fingers on a, w, and d like players in a lot of other games do, a, s, d and f like people that do a lot of typing but don't think about gaming that much do, I simply keep my middle finger on the movement keys, and every other finger is free to float to where ever it is needed.
So, I use 1 - 8 and I have a mouse with 12 programmable keys. This gives me access to 20 unmodified keys to bind. Then add the three modifiers and it gives me another 60, for 80 binds in total. Then if I need more I have multi-modifier binds, though only ctrl + shift is really easily accessible. This gives me 100 potential binds that I have access to should I need that many.
Now, if I were to only use the binds on my mouse, it would free up my hand to be better able to use the other two multi-modifier binds (alt + ctrl and alt + shift). This means that if all I use are the 12 programmable
buttons on my mouse, I still have 84 easily accessible binds.
Since almost all tab target MMO's have a casting queue (Archeage is the only one I know of that doesn't, though there may be more), this means that players usually have a full second in which to activate their next ability - 0.5 second cast time of the current ability, and 0.5 seconds from the GCD.
While there are some situations in which there is less time than that, these are all predictable situations where you will know what you will want to cast in less than a second - an in these situations setting up your keybinds in a logical manner for your build and the situations you will find yourself in is another of those skills that defines a tab target gamer.
Way to hectic and spammy
And its a small group compared to a raid.
I rather spend my combat actually using my skills to avoid damage than running around dodging 99% of the time.
Fun for me is executing a good strategy with a raid that uses their skills and rotations at perfect synchro rather than dodging and spamming 1-3 skills and mostly left mousebutton until enemy dies.
0dbea148-8cb8-4711-ba90-eb0864e93b5f
It's no surprise the most popular MMORPGs of the day are still using a tab-target system. World of Warcraft's Classic release numbers alone is proof that action combat is not as mandatory as some believe.
I actually agree with both of you here.
Getting out of the way of an attack is dodging, this isn't really something to debate.
That said, I would personally rather use skills in terms of character abilities. To me, an RPG, whether MMO or not, is all about what I build in to my character rather than what I - as a player - are or are not capable of.
In an MMORPG, I would rather have a button on my hotbar called "dodge" that I can use when I think appropriate instead of having to move the character - that is something I personally consider more appropriate for FPS type games.
Obviously Ashes should have both, and that's cool.
I prefer a skill aswell, and just move out of puddles with a sprintskill or teleportskill.
0dbea148-8cb8-4711-ba90-eb0864e93b5f
This has been a discussion since they announced the mixed idea.
I for one love how action combat works in Black desert. I can't stand the action combat they have in apoc..
I also think that tab targeting can be done really good. When I heard they went for a mixed between the two, I thought it would be more like: A mage in wow, there you have to aim your blink and time your frost nova. Those are spells that ain't tab target.
Probably the worst example of tab target combat out there.
Wouldnt that be kind of broken tho. If combat keeps the same pace as it has in Apoc, 3 seconds is a lot of time. I thought he meant things like "get iFrames for 0.5 seconds" at a 6 seconds cooldown or "counter every dodgable attack for 1 second" at a 2 second cooldown for tanks
In BnS I learned that the Boss should idealy always point into only one direction midgame, so that everyone else in the group can DPS in peace and only dodge AoEs. Maintool for this were a few skills that had iFrames for 2 seconds at best (and the ones with longest iFrames had 45sec cooldown) and a counter skill with I believe 0.7 block (doesnt counter undodgable attacks) and 1 sec cooldown
Reading through the comments I get the feeling that most of the "pro tab target" people here have about as much clue of AC as AC people have about TT. Dont take that Tera priest gameplay as a prime example of how AC works
All AC games I know of have some sort of block or counter skill altough all of them need proper timing
Super-jump is supposed to be class-based in the MMORPG. I would expect that to have some upgrades.
Most likely, we will have the choices of character-based dodge, player-based dodge, both or even neither - depending on how each player likes to play.
I remember, when my guild and i were raiding, and our tank paladin tabs his targets, and suddenly throws his shield behind himself into another mob group xD
BDO can do that because they dont have dungeons or raids. Other games have to think about such things like landing heals
Not really. Same can be done with action. Only this time you'll need to aim the abilities instead of pressing the same buttons in order
Usually the healer has to remove debuffs as well. Healer also have to position himself to avoid damage. These problems are greater in a raid. Healers do not pressing same buttons in order. They always react to the situation.
I can't imagine that you can hit your target in proper accuracy when 24 people running around you who can block LOS of others. As a DPS if you miss the boss any time, no problem, you have another shoot. If a healer miss the low health target he does not have another chance, the party member dies. Additionally the players will try to avoid getting hit by the enemy, what inadvertently means the player try to avoid getting hit by healing.
This can be avoided by different healing method, like AOE healing, or dropping healing bubbles or less/slower damage from the boss.
Actually it is really hard to find better.