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Poll + Bonus Dev Discussion - Multiboxing



  • HildarHildar Member
    I agree, I don't mind if players want to have multiple accounts.. How would this affect someone with 3 or four diferent computers but only one account? For instance, I have two desktop set ups and 2 laptops. if it was only me on the account is that going to trigger any issues with the system itself?

    Bottomline, If someone wants to use multiple accounts I think they have every right to.. as we say 'its my 15 a month' on wow, but if you have multiple accounts but different computers, whats the point of multiboxing anyway? isn't the whole thing being able to make one big network?
  • AndiAndi Member
    Personally, I believe multiboxing shouldn't even be an issue.
    With there not being auto-attacks, and the combat system being partially action, not even key broadcast software will do much good.

    Things like not adding a follow feature will hurt the game elsewhere. In a dungeon and need to go afk because your kid cries? Too bad, now the whole group has to wait for you or leave you behind, because you can't just /follow and take care of your child. This then will have further consequences, like parents not being welcome and/or willing to group.

    That being said, you could stand on your head and scream and kick, and it would still be possible and perfectly doable to multibox. Like already pointed out by others, don't make the life harder for people who play in legit ways, just because people brigade on social media. This never works.

    And to finish this reply:
    Look at WOW, if you'd like to see what happens when devs stray off the path they chose for their game originally, to appease/appeal to their fan base and as many new players as possible.

    You have a strong vision, stick to it.
  • nasenfixxnasenfixx Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    I agree with Intrepid's decision
  • MichaelMichael Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    I do not think Multi Boxing should be allowed. All it does it provide advantages to people that are willing to spend more money on more accounts. No one wants to be forced to have multiple accounts so they can have multiple freeholds for an advantage, or even just to keep up with everyone else doing it.

    Sadly, you will never be able to stop multi boxing completely. But you can make it harder to do. Of course doing it by network will cause people who play in the same household to not be able to be on at the same time. Other games have had success doing it based on hardware, so you can not have more than one instance of the game running on a PC. However, people will still use VM's, people will still use multiple computers.
  • What reasons are there even to allow multiboxing in the first place? If it is a necessary thing(like how people argue alting is in ArcheAge), I feel like the game should be rebalanced such that it shouldn't be needed. If it is just to provide more benefits to a player, I would consider it Pay-2-Win, and thus should be banned.
  • Dont care much for Multiboxing. Just seems odd to want to have 5 iterations of the game running on the same computer playing 5 different characters.
  • CM KalezCM Kalez Member, Intrepid Pack
    I dont mind if people want to pay for multiple accounts if its done maually. i dont care how many accounts people have.

    Just dont let people play on VMs with automated systems
  • FaeFae Member
    I would ideally want to have no multiboxing whatsoever, but obviously that is nearly impossible. If the current stance is what you go with, I would not be too disappointed as long as big abusive issues with it don't surface.
  • HuzzHuzz Member
    I disagree with intrepid calling it multi-boxing if the accounts are not linked at all, and it's not being run by the same player at the same time it's not "multi-boxing" it's just playing 2 accounts. or even 2 people playing 2 accounts. I think the phrase "multi-boxing" is misrepresentative of the idea that it could be multiple players
  • HildarHildar Member
    This is why having box set was good, to have a box set meant you actually had to own that product key, I have multiple people in my house who might want to play too, so I think it's safe to say that so long as noone is using 3rd party mechanics to break the game (macros, ect) I see no issues with it.
  • FelixinaboxFelixinabox Member
    edited July 2020
    WMC51 wrote: »
    Hell, I say make second accounts cheaper so I can let my wife and kids play. 15 for first, 10 for second, 5 for each additional.

    Theyd be your wife and childs' acoounts then. Tsukasa makes a good point
    Tsukasa wrote: »
    Multi-Boxing provide advantages to the game through mechanical AND monetary exploitations.

    You bypass the "1 per account" rule for freeholds through PAYING for another account($15/mo) AND computer(+$1500), then trade the required materials to the alt from your main account to build another freehold against the intended design. Preventing other players from taking the land! This can be repeated multiple times!

    This was only one example.

    Check out my thread below for more:
    Here's How Multi-Boxing Can Be Exploited

    Edit: The same exact system was implemented in Archeage Unchained and it failed. People DID use another computers and take great advantage of it. Regardless of how impactful the advantage will be in AoC, it is still considered Pay to Win/Convenience.

  • NagashNagash Member, Leader of Men, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    nick10281 wrote: »
    as much as i agree with households with multiple players i just cant accept the high risk of solo players with 5 accounts and junky PCs botting, farming, and swaying votes in the cities. the last one is the biggest to me. oh and pocket healers from archeage. hated those in PvP.
    @Nagash im best necro.

    who are you again? :D

    Nice to see you again nick

    The dead do not squabble as this land’s rulers do. The dead have no desires, petty jealousies or ambitions. A world of the dead is a world at peace
  • i believe people will abuse claiming land with multiple accounts via the freehold system and also use their multiple accounts to hog gather areas? I'm sure these would both be some of the big issues multi-boxing would cause. The problem is how the hell do you restrict multi-boxing enough to stop or mitigate these issues to the max while not hindering family or friends playing from the same house/building? A middle ground will need to be found, I think its more important to protect the game's economy rather than trying to please everyone.
  • SptzSptz Member
    edited July 2020
    Me and my wife share the same connection to play games, so multiboxing is needed for us to play together.

    The only caveat is someone making a healer alt that follows their main character on their main account, and using a notebook or something similar, heal their character when needed, effectively bypassing the whole social requirements for grouping without using macros.

    Of course, this is completely negated if the game does not have an auto follow feature.

    Edit: Maybe some feature where you can explicitly set the ports the game client will use to connect to the server, while restricting multiboxing in the same machine (don't allow multiple game processes to run simultaneously) may allow multiboxing to be prohibited while still allowing people in the same household to play at the same time with some minor hoops added with port forwarding shenanigans, but still...?
  • I can understand why multiboxing would be allowed but im very worried about the economy aspect. imo im fine with the leveling aspect because it doesn't hurt anyone but when you have 5 accounts mining ores or collecting stuff all together at the same time with the multi use resource nodes then I think thats very pay to win right? You can get 5x the stuff for the same time invested as a regular player that only has 1 account! Maybe im just not understanding something and those concerns arnt valid but thats just where I stand atm.
  • DoomerDoomer Member
    edited July 2020
    For my part, I live with my loved one and we are both gamers.
    We are very hyped for this game, and so are many others. Not allowing multiple computers in a same house to run Ashes of Creation would probably ruin the game for many players.
    I think though that these multiple accounts should be used by different persons, on different computers.
    Allowing multiboxing with macros and such on a same computer is like asking for bots to farm endlessly and sell currency.

  • BobbyBickBobbyBick Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    As long as you are able to multibox it becomes a game of who has the ability and who doesn't. I just want to be able to play 1 character and not feel like I am playing under a handicap compared to someone who is running 3+. Even if they are just tradeskill boxes it seems to undermine the system you have designed where crafters are reliant upon eachother, why rely on someone else when I can just box that class?
  • I disagree with multiboxing in the way of one individual using say 5x accounts to effectively boost their main account. I hope that this doesn't conflict with multiple people in one household/internet connection being able to play though.
  • tugowar wrote: »

    If someone can play 3 computers manually with 3 different monitors all the power to them, I would love to see someone do that :D.
  • Mickjay67Mickjay67 Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    Tsukasa wrote: »
    Multi-Boxing provide advantages to the game through mechanical AND monetary exploitations.

    You bypass the "1 per account" rule for freeholds through PAYING for another account($15/mo) AND computer(+$1500), then trade the required materials to the alt from your main account to build another freehold against the intended design. Preventing other players from taking the land! This can be repeated multiple times!

    This was only one example.

    Check out my thread below for more:
    Here's How Multi-Boxing Can Be Exploited

    Edit: The same exact system was implemented in Archeage Unchained and it failed. People DID use another computers and take great advantage of it. Regardless of how impactful the advantage is, it is still considered Pay to Win/Convenience.

    I agree with your points, however can you answer this part of the post: "How do you prevent false positives on enforcement for families and friends who play from the same home?" I can't think of anyway that isn't a single account per IP which would mess with families, people who live in apartments, college dorms, or other shared IP scenarios.
  • CevvinCevvin Member
    Is it possible to use 2FA with an attached phone number to reduce the number of accounts? I'm fine with the stance Intrepid has on the topic. Especially with GM's in the world, I expect that will help reduce the number of people multiboxing as well.
  • SonicSonic Member, Leader of Men, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    What's stopping someone from having extra accounts for extra freeholds?
  • ItzBootsItzBoots Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    edited July 2020
    The thing with Multi-Clienting is that you don't need a second computer. If you have a beefy Main PC you can just use a program like VLC. Granite it will hinder your main gaming experience, but you would be just paying the subscription costs, I think Multi-Clienting is a lot more feasible then some people realize. Just My Point of View. #LongHairDontCare
  • Knork3Knork3 Member
    Yeah i will have 2 accounts in my household too. From my EVE-Online XP i can only say, that multiboxing can be a benefit. Although EVE benefits this playstyle more than most other MMOs IMHO, due to its design. I am not sure if i would appreciate multiboxing in AoC. Seems to me, that a multitude of professions is needed for big projects anyway (more than 2?) then it would not bother me much, since it does not affect the Massive-Aspect of the MMO. If i could achieve a full production-chain myself for high-tier-goods, i would consider it a flaw. I go into this topic only from an economy-stance though. No idea about how this would affect combat etc.
  • LeouchLeouch Member
    Hakurai wrote: »
    I think that if you try and restrict it anymore than the current stance, you risk causing issues for family play, for people who sign up with multiple family members in the same house.
    I will be playing with my bro. So restricting it would be "bad".

    Not sure you can call it multiboxing when you play on 3 chars on 3 pcs
  • This form of multiboxing did not work for AAUC. People can also use virtual machines to bypass the one computer for multiboxing like AAUC. I think it would be best to not allow it. If it is allowed, heavy restrictions and wrathful punishments need to be the only answer.
  • Your current stance on the situation is definitely the correct stance to take. Anything beyond this in either direction starts to become too loose or tight.
  • JamationJamation Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    I think it was explained well in the AMA. I agree that there should be no multi boxing from the same computer, but considering there isn't a great way to determine whether a second computer is a friend/family member, or just another account, it makes sense to allow it for multiple computers. Sure a person could abuse certain features with only two computers, but that could be monitored on a case by case basis as I doubt it'll be a big thing.

    If there were to be any more restrictions I'd only suggest considering limiting a freehold to one household as that will be the system most likely to be exploited early on through multiple accounts. And everyone in a household could discuss and come to a compromise.
  • Accounts that plan on Multiboxxing should register as such. Linking accounts together makes them a known quantity. Not disclosing the plan to multibox should be against ToS

    Multi Boxed accounts should not be following each other out an about in the world to gain the advantage of double the hauling of mats, or an edge in PVP. They POSSIBLY should also be tied to the same node citizenship if they plan to multibox on the same server.
  • WiccaSlothWiccaSloth Member, Intrepid Pack
    I'm a current multiboxer myself. and the game i play allows it from the same PC. I also live with 2 roommates who also game on PCs on the same internet. if it's gonna require multiple machines to box i think people just won't do it. some still may but the majority won't. hell i bet only 10% of the over all community has ever multiboxed before. maybe less. it's easy to look at it's face and see exploitation. but there's also a lot more work involved in multiboxing 2, 3, or 6 characters. you have to spec them, gear them, and have a decent way to move them around in-game without a 3rd party software. but i think the point i'm at right now is; i have no idea how this will play with 1 character yet... i don't wanna imagine trying to do a mixed hybrid combat with 8 characters (AoC group size). Games like Everquest that are purely tab target and simple are easy and fun to multibox in. games with more complexity like this might not even be a good environment to multibox in.
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