One of the things I like about the current shop is that, when I see a character using a skin with the specific colors used with the items in the current shop, I will understand that it's someone who was around before launch, so we have something more in common than with other players. It may be very likely that I know the player even if I don't recognize the character.
And that fosters in-game socialization.
I think that's reaching a bit far to find a positive. But, i have less of a problem with the kick starter cosmetics and then the cash shop in the future. Limited time cosmetics for supporting the game at it's earliest makes sense to me, but again they have soooo many cosmetic packages now that it's kind of ruined the charm already and we aren't even at launch.
2 nuances to be made:
1. The fact that they are indeed limited time cosmetics, means that not everyone is buying them, and that others will wait to find something they genuinely like.
With that you're not necessarily flooding your server with people who have them. Especially considering that, let's be honest, we people in the forums/website/cash shop will be a vast minority in the game's population at launch.
Those you'll see with them, you'll know they were long time fans and that they are cosmetics. Nothing is going to necessarily make it an angering or game ruining experience.
shop! Also that's usually an attitude people who don't actually like playing the game have.
Well those aren't mutually exclusive.
Fashion wars can be accomplished through fun gameplay.
In fact, it's more rewarding and more impressive when it is.
It's the entire reason for this thread. Cosmetics gained through effort is valuable, and that value is diminished by instant paid-for cosmetics.
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NagashMember, Leader of Men, Kickstarter, Alpha One
Would you at least agree that a special title or even nameplate or nameplate border could accomplish the same thing while not detracting from the visual fidelity/immersive fidelity of the game?
That would also be fine, too.
But, since I am fashion over function - the more fashion available, the better.
Everyone knows end game in MMOs is the fashion game
Also that's usually an attitude people who don't actually like playing the game have.
Can you in any way prove that? or are you just talking out of your ass
The dead do not squabble as this land’s rulers do. The dead have no desires, petty jealousies or ambitions. A world of the dead is a world at peace
One of the things I like about the current shop is that, when I see a character using a skin with the specific colors used with the items in the current shop, I will understand that it's someone who was around before launch, so we have something more in common than with other players. It may be very likely that I know the player even if I don't recognize the character.
And that fosters in-game socialization.
I think that's reaching a bit far to find a positive. But, i have less of a problem with the kick starter cosmetics and then the cash shop in the future. Limited time cosmetics for supporting the game at it's earliest makes sense to me, but again they have soooo many cosmetic packages now that it's kind of ruined the charm already and we aren't even at launch.
2 nuances to be made:
1. The fact that they are indeed limited time cosmetics, means that not everyone is buying them, and that others will wait to find something they genuinely like.
With that you're not necessarily flooding your server with people who have them. Especially considering that, let's be honest, we people in the forums/website/cash shop will be a vast minority in the game's population at launch.
Those you'll see with them, you'll know they were long time fans and that they are cosmetics. Nothing is going to necessarily make it an angering or game ruining experience.
2. It ruined the charm * for you *
No, not for me. For every one, and especially, every one.
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DygzMember, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
I think that's reaching a bit far to find a positive. But, i have less of a problem with the kick starter cosmetics and then the cash shop in the future. Limited time cosmetics for supporting the game at it's earliest makes sense to me, but again they have soooo many cosmetic packages now that it's kind of ruined the charm already and we aren't even at launch.
It's not a reach at all for me. Cosmetic shops are a positive to me.
I'd have to reach to find a negative.
I think that's reaching a bit far to find a positive. But, i have less of a problem with the kick starter cosmetics and then the cash shop in the future. Limited time cosmetics for supporting the game at it's earliest makes sense to me, but again they have soooo many cosmetic packages now that it's kind of ruined the charm already and we aren't even at launch.
It's not a reach at all for me. Cosmetic shops are a positive to me.
I'd have to reach to find a negative.
From the same guy who claims PvP never happens in DnD ._.
One of the things I like about the current shop is that, when I see a character using a skin with the specific colors used with the items in the current shop, I will understand that it's someone who was around before launch, so we have something more in common than with other players. It may be very likely that I know the player even if I don't recognize the character.
And that fosters in-game socialization.
I think that's reaching a bit far to find a positive. But, i have less of a problem with the kick starter cosmetics and then the cash shop in the future. Limited time cosmetics for supporting the game at it's earliest makes sense to me, but again they have soooo many cosmetic packages now that it's kind of ruined the charm already and we aren't even at launch.
2 nuances to be made:
1. The fact that they are indeed limited time cosmetics, means that not everyone is buying them, and that others will wait to find something they genuinely like.
With that you're not necessarily flooding your server with people who have them. Especially considering that, let's be honest, we people in the forums/website/cash shop will be a vast minority in the game's population at launch.
Those you'll see with them, you'll know they were long time fans and that they are cosmetics. Nothing is going to necessarily make it an angering or game ruining experience.
2. It ruined the charm * for you *
No, not for me. For every one, and especially, every one.
Clearly as a number of people disagree with you on these forums (not counting the future millions of other players not on these forums) it clearly isn't everybody.
The issue with implying: "everybody thinks like me" is that it takes a single person disagreeing with you to render your entire argument false and facetious.
And we have more than one of those.
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NagashMember, Leader of Men, Kickstarter, Alpha One
One of the things I like about the current shop is that, when I see a character using a skin with the specific colors used with the items in the current shop, I will understand that it's someone who was around before launch, so we have something more in common than with other players. It may be very likely that I know the player even if I don't recognize the character.
And that fosters in-game socialization.
I think that's reaching a bit far to find a positive. But, i have less of a problem with the kick starter cosmetics and then the cash shop in the future. Limited time cosmetics for supporting the game at it's earliest makes sense to me, but again they have soooo many cosmetic packages now that it's kind of ruined the charm already and we aren't even at launch.
2 nuances to be made:
1. The fact that they are indeed limited time cosmetics, means that not everyone is buying them, and that others will wait to find something they genuinely like.
With that you're not necessarily flooding your server with people who have them. Especially considering that, let's be honest, we people in the forums/website/cash shop will be a vast minority in the game's population at launch.
Those you'll see with them, you'll know they were long time fans and that they are cosmetics. Nothing is going to necessarily make it an angering or game ruining experience.
2. It ruined the charm * for you *
No, not for me. For every one, and especially, every one.
Your words do not speak for everyone so get of your high horse
The dead do not squabble as this land’s rulers do. The dead have no desires, petty jealousies or ambitions. A world of the dead is a world at peace
I just got done watching one of Asmongold's newest videos where he argues with/rants to Blizzard worshippers about why the new cash shop for Classic WoW is a mistake and a disappointment.
I know that many of us who peruse these forums in addition to myself feel the same way he does. We know even though it's "just cosmetics" it still interferes with the value of the game and things in it. I was personally extremely disheartened when I heard Steven confirm a cosmetic cash shop. I already think these monthly cosmetics are abhorrent enough as it is.
It's also disappointing because Steven says the cash shop is to help with funding more content and expansions, however we already have a monthly subscription fee.
On top of that, I already have little interest in animal husbandry and mount breeding because you can apparently just replace any mount (of the same tier) with a cosmetic skin.
What's the point in a breeding system if you can just magically make any end result into something preset?
Since visuals are a big deal (I know some people who would say "it's just cosmetics" would say otherwise) that mount creature essentially just becomes whatever creature the skin is for all intents and purposes.
No one who comes across you is going to know what special mount you have underneath, they'll just see the skin, and a skin that devalues the rest of the visuals of all other mounts.
I want to hope that it's not going to be as big of a deal as I'm making it out to be, but the road to hell is paved with good intentions, as they say.
Edit: Fixed title
The first thing you did wrong was watch a streamer play a computer game. This guy is a clown.
No one is going to come across me and realize that I have some special mount because I put on a skin I bought? Your issue with this is what? I don't want you to see the base skin if I applied the cosmetic......I want you to see the cosmetic.
The game is free to download with a monthly subscription. The skins are there as an additional way for them to profit. They are making one of the BEST MMOS to ever have been released in the history of digital gaming. Give them a break and let them create additional income. Do you get mad at McDonalds when they charge you for extra bbq sauce? Expansion pass costs? DLC addons? controller or console skins? gas prices? charge for a bag at the grocery store? Every business needs to come up with a way to increase revenue and the cosmetic shop for AoC is no different. At least you get to buy it if you want to....or don't.....you're not forced.
Do you really think that a monthly subscription fee is all they will need to fund additional expansions and content? Where are you numbers to support how much they will be making and how much it will cost to fund future development?
Don't do animal husbandry. It's definitely not your thing.
@Noaani "I mean, if I am playing a game and I am not aware that I am playing a game, I would argue that the game in question fails at being a good game. Being VERY aware that I am playing a game is a pre-requisite for me to consider a game to be a good game."
Imagine someone quitting gaming because the games that come out are not as immersive as real life. When I load up Call of Duty I expect to feel every bullet, smell the sweat off every soldier and blow up in real life when I blow up in game to a grenade. @Ironhammer is wanting VR from the year 3021.
The first thing you did wrong was watch a streamer play a computer game. This guy is a clown.
I'm sorry, you lost me there.
It's easy to discredit an entire argument using ad hominem. Doesn't make your argument good.
I too think Asmongold can be a clown at times, but he's not an unintelligent man. He knows MMO's and the MMO community. For you to say otherwise is laughable and arguably says more that you have some bias against him, possibly even unaware that you do.
No one is going to come across me and realize that I have some special mount because I put on a skin I bought? Your issue with this is what? I don't want you to see the base skin if I applied the cosmetic......I want you to see the cosmetic.
Yes, people will realize you have a special skin, because cosmetic skins from cash shops are always identifiable.
I don't want to see the cosmetic. I want to see the animal that was bred/tamed. I want to see how a player travelled to a distant land, tamed herd of emu and brought them back to the snowy mountains to breed a superior emu to use or sell.
That Emu should stay an Emu so that everyone knows it is from that distant land and how it has value because of it. I DO NOT want someone to just put a Corgi skin on it that they bought for $20 which holds none of that story behind it.
Do you get mad at McDonalds when they charge you for extra bbq sauce? Expansion pass costs? DLC addons? controller or console skins? gas prices? charge for a bag at the grocery store?
Yes I do get mad when I get charged extra for condiments. I DO get mad when I have to pay for endless DLC's. I enjoy No Man's Sky because it is a game born of passion and has free dlc (I however do know that this is not feasable for the majority of games). Did you not get mad when Bethesda sold that first Horse Armor DLC?
Do you not get mad at Nintendo for selling overpriced joycons at $70?
If you're NOT getting mad at bloated/increased prices, or even disgruntled, then you must be constantly swindled.
Every business needs to come up with a way to increase revenue and the cosmetic shop for AoC is no different. At least you get to buy it if you want to....or don't.....you're not forced.
You're right, they do. If $15 a month isn't enough and a cash cosmetic shop is an absolute necessity then yes, as I've stated in these replies it is a necessary evil. However we don't know if it IS necessary of if it's a blatant cash grab.
And no. Again as I've stated before, "You don't like it don't buy it" is an ignorant argument to make. The fact that the shop and it's content exists and people are purchasing and using the cosmetics directly affects the visual and immersive fidelity of the game.
Ashes of Creation is supposed to be a game about social interaction and meaningful experiences in a world inhabited by many. What meaningful experience is there behind entering your credit card numbers?
Imagine someone quitting gaming because the games that come out are not as immersive as real life. When I load up Call of Duty I expect to feel every bullet, smell the sweat off every soldier and blow up in real life when I blow up in game to a grenade
Imagine trying to discredit the valid feelings of players who care about immersion by downplaying the concept entirely. I'm sure you take all the immersive mechanics devs put into every game for granted. Including sound design, controller rumble, etc.
Have you ever played a game where the guns felt good to shoot? Guess what, that's a level of immersion buddy.
Get out of here with your weak arguments and condescending tone.
Edit: All that being said, let me restate that I don't think Intrepid is an exception to the inevitable cash grab studio rule, but by keeping that low expectation I plan to be pleasantly surprised if they have the resolve to maintain their integrity.
The first thing you did wrong was watch a streamer play a computer game. This guy is a clown.
Yes, people will realize you have a special skin, because cosmetic skins from cash shops are always identifiable.
I don't want to see the cosmetic. I want to see the animal that was bred/tamed. I want to see how a player travelled to a distant land, tamed herd of emu and brought them back to the snowy mountains to breed a superior emu to use or sell.
That Emu should stay an Emu so that everyone knows it is from that distant land and how it has value because of it. I DO NOT want someone to just put a Corgi skin on it that they bought for $20 which holds none of that story behind it.
There seems to be a misunderstanding here.
You can't put a corgi skin on a non dog base mount. You can't use a giant turtle skin, on a non turtle mount etc.
To take the Emu example: most of the cosmetic flavor will be in the look of said Emu. For instance, it may be red or yellow instead of its natural base color.
The rest of the cosmetic applies to the saddle, saddlebags, reins etc. and how they look.
You don't have to worry about someone applying the skin of something completely unrelated to the base mount.
The first thing you did wrong was watch a streamer play a computer game. This guy is a clown.
Yes, people will realize you have a special skin, because cosmetic skins from cash shops are always identifiable.
I don't want to see the cosmetic. I want to see the animal that was bred/tamed. I want to see how a player travelled to a distant land, tamed herd of emu and brought them back to the snowy mountains to breed a superior emu to use or sell.
That Emu should stay an Emu so that everyone knows it is from that distant land and how it has value because of it. I DO NOT want someone to just put a Corgi skin on it that they bought for $20 which holds none of that story behind it.
There seems to be a misunderstanding here.
You can't put a corgi skin on a non dog base mount. You can't use a giant turtle skin, on a non turtle mount etc.
To take the Emu example: most of the cosmetic flavor will be in the look of said Emu. For instance, it may be red or yellow instead of its natural base color.
The rest of the cosmetic applies to the saddle, saddlebags, reins etc. and how they look.
You don't have to worry about someone applying the skin of something completely unrelated to the base mount.
The corgi was a bit of exaggeration to make a point lol
Do you have a source for this? I've been following the project closely for a while and have not seen or heard anything other than the only restriction will be the tier of mount. (Though they are understandably tight-lipped about things). Not that I don't believe you, I just want to see if there's a livestream I missed somehow or something.
If it's very minor things like palette swaps that's not as big of a deal yes.
Though I would also argue that if palette swaps are a breedable thing they would also add to the backstory of the Emu.
Saddlebags and stuff is also pretty minor. If you can only obtain them through the cash shop that'd be something I'd be ok with, similar to what I said about GW2 mounts in the first page of this thread.
The first thing you did wrong was watch a streamer play a computer game. This guy is a clown.
Yes, people will realize you have a special skin, because cosmetic skins from cash shops are always identifiable.
I don't want to see the cosmetic. I want to see the animal that was bred/tamed. I want to see how a player travelled to a distant land, tamed herd of emu and brought them back to the snowy mountains to breed a superior emu to use or sell.
That Emu should stay an Emu so that everyone knows it is from that distant land and how it has value because of it. I DO NOT want someone to just put a Corgi skin on it that they bought for $20 which holds none of that story behind it.
There seems to be a misunderstanding here.
You can't put a corgi skin on a non dog base mount. You can't use a giant turtle skin, on a non turtle mount etc.
To take the Emu example: most of the cosmetic flavor will be in the look of said Emu. For instance, it may be red or yellow instead of its natural base color.
The rest of the cosmetic applies to the saddle, saddlebags, reins etc. and how they look.
You don't have to worry about someone applying the skin of something completely unrelated to the base mount.
The corgi was a bit of exaggeration to make a point lol
Do you have a source for this? I've been following the project closely for a while and have not seen or heard anything other than the only restriction will be the tier of mount. (Though they are understandably tight-lipped about things). Not that I don't believe you, I just want to see if there's a livestream I missed somehow or something.
If it's very minor things like palette swaps that's not as big of a deal yes.
Though I would also argue that if palette swaps are a breedable thing they would also add to the backstory of the Emu.
Saddlebags and stuff is also pretty minor. If you can only obtain them through the cash shop that'd be something I'd be ok with, similar to what I said about GW2 mounts in the first page of this thread.
Sure thing! Here:
Skins are only be able to be applied to things that have already been earned, crafted or found within Ashes of Creation.
Mount skins require a specific type of mount to have been achieved in-game.
The first thing you did wrong was watch a streamer play a computer game. This guy is a clown.
Yes, people will realize you have a special skin, because cosmetic skins from cash shops are always identifiable.
I don't want to see the cosmetic. I want to see the animal that was bred/tamed. I want to see how a player travelled to a distant land, tamed herd of emu and brought them back to the snowy mountains to breed a superior emu to use or sell.
That Emu should stay an Emu so that everyone knows it is from that distant land and how it has value because of it. I DO NOT want someone to just put a Corgi skin on it that they bought for $20 which holds none of that story behind it.
There seems to be a misunderstanding here.
You can't put a corgi skin on a non dog base mount. You can't use a giant turtle skin, on a non turtle mount etc.
To take the Emu example: most of the cosmetic flavor will be in the look of said Emu. For instance, it may be red or yellow instead of its natural base color.
The rest of the cosmetic applies to the saddle, saddlebags, reins etc. and how they look.
You don't have to worry about someone applying the skin of something completely unrelated to the base mount.
The corgi was a bit of exaggeration to make a point lol
Do you have a source for this? I've been following the project closely for a while and have not seen or heard anything other than the only restriction will be the tier of mount. (Though they are understandably tight-lipped about things). Not that I don't believe you, I just want to see if there's a livestream I missed somehow or something.
If it's very minor things like palette swaps that's not as big of a deal yes.
Though I would also argue that if palette swaps are a breedable thing they would also add to the backstory of the Emu.
Saddlebags and stuff is also pretty minor. If you can only obtain them through the cash shop that'd be something I'd be ok with, similar to what I said about GW2 mounts in the first page of this thread.
Sure thing! Here:
Skins are only be able to be applied to things that have already been earned, crafted or found within Ashes of Creation.
Mount skins require a specific type of mount to have been achieved in-game.
If they have retracted that statement, the Wiki hasn't updated it, and then it's my bad.
Oh yea I do remember them saying that, I just also remember Steven saying once that it was tier based, though that might have been older or him mispeaking
If it works like you say it is a loooot better than I had thought.
But even with that, I hope it doesn't become that slippery slope
I'm confused, doesn't the video explain the problem with the in-game shop mounts is their uniqueness that isn't matched by A ) other in-game achievable mounts and B ) anything that exists in the game period?
My impression, which a quick trip to the wiki confirmed, is that cosmetics from the AoC shop will fit neither of those problems. There will be in-game achievable mounts that are comparable (and even grander) and these assets are being used for in-game content like NPCs, pets and mounts. So I'm confused, is this just a "literally any effort to sell anything other than the game itself is greedy and bad" or did I miss another argument from the video that also does apply to AoC?
"Different variants of store purchased cosmetic creatures (Pets and Mounts) may exist in the wild"
"There will be variants of the monthly cosmetics for NPCs and Mobs"
Also keep in mind the game that Asmon is playing. In vanilla, any mount was hard to come by for a while as the cost to afford one + training was a lot. So seeing any mount was uncommon (not the case for a vast majority of MMOs these days). Secondly, you were race locked to a few mount variants unless you put in substantial effort which would slightly increase your available mount pool. More "unique" mounts were added gradually and slowly over years. If a game comes out with many many mount variants to begin with, there will never be a "ashes of al'ar in a sea of gryphons" since there will never have been a situation where we had a sea of gryphons, we would already have a lot of variants from the get go. Plus, we already have the fact that flying mounts will be incredibly rare and hard to come by, so we already have that super-unique chase if you want it.
@Dreoh hahahaha. My arguments are weak but you are telling me how to play my game? Sorry buddy but you are not going to see my emu. It's amazing even speaking about the strength of an argument when you have already LOST that argument. The cosmetic shop is not going anywhere and the current system is very accommodating compared to other mmos. Intrepid has done a great job of creating exactly what makes sense for a game to have longevity over others.
Imagine a world where a consumer gets to tell a business....you don't get to sell those things because you don't NEED the income. You get more than enough income to give me what I want from that monthly subscription fee. Talk about a weak and pathetic argument. This has to be one of the worst comments I have read on these forums.
It's perfectly acceptable to discredit feelings when those feelings are just plain dumb and over the top. The cosmetics that you can buy ARE the visual and immersive fidelity of the game. Think of it like that and you won't have a brain aneurism whenever you see my toad mount.
I get that, but you also can't let past experiences scar you to the point where you are concerned about the future of the cash shop of a game we know very little about, that is years from coming out by a studio who has bent themselves backwards claiming/promising the cash shop will forever stay cosmetic. Sure stay cautious, continue to prefer AoC wouldn't have a cash shop until your concerns are put to ease but no need to let it disappoint you or ruin your future enjoyment of, again I cannot stress this enough, a game that we still know very very little about and is a long time from release. And especially no reason to demand they change plans already and scrap the cosmetic only cash shop (just look at PoE for a positive example, and AoC has promised no pay for convenience either which they also consider P2W, so even better than PoE). Stay excited my friend.
@Dreoh hahahaha. My arguments are weak but you are telling me how to play my game? Sorry buddy but you are not going to see my emu. It's amazing even speaking about the strength of an argument when you have already LOST that argument. The cosmetic shop is not going anywhere and the current system is very accommodating compared to other mmos. Intrepid has done a great job of creating exactly what makes sense for a game to have longevity over others.
Imagine a world where a consumer gets to tell a business....you don't get to sell those things because you don't NEED the income. You get more than enough income to give me what I want from that monthly subscription fee. Talk about a weak and pathetic argument. This has to be one of the worst comments I have read on these forums.
It's perfectly acceptable to discredit feelings when those feelings are just plain dumb and over the top. The cosmetics that you can buy ARE the visual and immersive fidelity of the game. Think of it like that and you won't have a brain aneurism whenever you see my toad mount.
You're right, I'm discrediting your feelings right now.
@Dreoh hahahaha. My arguments are weak but you are telling me how to play my game? Sorry buddy but you are not going to see my emu. It's amazing even speaking about the strength of an argument when you have already LOST that argument. The cosmetic shop is not going anywhere and the current system is very accommodating compared to other mmos. Intrepid has done a great job of creating exactly what makes sense for a game to have longevity over others.
Imagine a world where a consumer gets to tell a business....you don't get to sell those things because you don't NEED the income. You get more than enough income to give me what I want from that monthly subscription fee. Talk about a weak and pathetic argument. This has to be one of the worst comments I have read on these forums.
It's perfectly acceptable to discredit feelings when those feelings are just plain dumb and over the top. The cosmetics that you can buy ARE the visual and immersive fidelity of the game. Think of it like that and you won't have a brain aneurism whenever you see my toad mount.
You're right, I'm discrediting your feelings right now.
As long as the cash shop skins are NOT COMPLETELY UNIQUE to the point where you can't find anything similar to them in game, then I can be content with it. It's when cash shop items stand out in uniqueness to in-game achievable is what I cannot support.
And that is exactly WoW's issue. Nothing in the shop is remotely achievable in game. And it's one reason in a laundry list of reasons for why I quit the game.
I really hope Intrepid only offer color/dye options and nothing else that makes them stand out from in-game achievables. This goes for ALL types of skins; mounts/gear/caravans/freeholds etc
Comments
2 nuances to be made:
1. The fact that they are indeed limited time cosmetics, means that not everyone is buying them, and that others will wait to find something they genuinely like.
With that you're not necessarily flooding your server with people who have them. Especially considering that, let's be honest, we people in the forums/website/cash shop will be a vast minority in the game's population at launch.
Those you'll see with them, you'll know they were long time fans and that they are cosmetics. Nothing is going to necessarily make it an angering or game ruining experience.
2. It ruined the charm * for you *
Well those aren't mutually exclusive.
Fashion wars can be accomplished through fun gameplay.
In fact, it's more rewarding and more impressive when it is.
It's the entire reason for this thread. Cosmetics gained through effort is valuable, and that value is diminished by instant paid-for cosmetics.
Can you in any way prove that? or are you just talking out of your ass
No, not for me. For every one, and especially, every one.
I'd have to reach to find a negative.
From the same guy who claims PvP never happens in DnD ._.
Clearly as a number of people disagree with you on these forums (not counting the future millions of other players not on these forums) it clearly isn't everybody.
The issue with implying: "everybody thinks like me" is that it takes a single person disagreeing with you to render your entire argument false and facetious.
And we have more than one of those.
Your words do not speak for everyone so get of your high horse
Post the quote link where I stated that, please.
Mostly only Sith sometimes deal in absolutes
But the dark side is fun
I wouldn't be waiting for that quote if I were you.
Our new friend here doesn't seem to be one to back himself up at all.
Must be nice to have some company there huh?
well our new friend seems to be a fool
I'm happy to back myself when the person I am in a discussion with is a reasonable person with some decent points.
Anyone that thinks I don't back myself is clearly missing one of those two things.
That is a more polite four letter word than I would use.
The first thing you did wrong was watch a streamer play a computer game. This guy is a clown.
No one is going to come across me and realize that I have some special mount because I put on a skin I bought? Your issue with this is what? I don't want you to see the base skin if I applied the cosmetic......I want you to see the cosmetic.
The game is free to download with a monthly subscription. The skins are there as an additional way for them to profit. They are making one of the BEST MMOS to ever have been released in the history of digital gaming. Give them a break and let them create additional income. Do you get mad at McDonalds when they charge you for extra bbq sauce? Expansion pass costs? DLC addons? controller or console skins? gas prices? charge for a bag at the grocery store? Every business needs to come up with a way to increase revenue and the cosmetic shop for AoC is no different. At least you get to buy it if you want to....or don't.....you're not forced.
Do you really think that a monthly subscription fee is all they will need to fund additional expansions and content? Where are you numbers to support how much they will be making and how much it will cost to fund future development?
Don't do animal husbandry. It's definitely not your thing.
@Noaani "I mean, if I am playing a game and I am not aware that I am playing a game, I would argue that the game in question fails at being a good game. Being VERY aware that I am playing a game is a pre-requisite for me to consider a game to be a good game."
Imagine someone quitting gaming because the games that come out are not as immersive as real life. When I load up Call of Duty I expect to feel every bullet, smell the sweat off every soldier and blow up in real life when I blow up in game to a grenade. @Ironhammer is wanting VR from the year 3021.
I'm sorry, you lost me there.
It's easy to discredit an entire argument using ad hominem. Doesn't make your argument good.
I too think Asmongold can be a clown at times, but he's not an unintelligent man. He knows MMO's and the MMO community. For you to say otherwise is laughable and arguably says more that you have some bias against him, possibly even unaware that you do.
Yes, people will realize you have a special skin, because cosmetic skins from cash shops are always identifiable.
I don't want to see the cosmetic. I want to see the animal that was bred/tamed. I want to see how a player travelled to a distant land, tamed herd of emu and brought them back to the snowy mountains to breed a superior emu to use or sell.
That Emu should stay an Emu so that everyone knows it is from that distant land and how it has value because of it. I DO NOT want someone to just put a Corgi skin on it that they bought for $20 which holds none of that story behind it.
Yes I do get mad when I get charged extra for condiments. I DO get mad when I have to pay for endless DLC's. I enjoy No Man's Sky because it is a game born of passion and has free dlc (I however do know that this is not feasable for the majority of games). Did you not get mad when Bethesda sold that first Horse Armor DLC?
Do you not get mad at Nintendo for selling overpriced joycons at $70?
If you're NOT getting mad at bloated/increased prices, or even disgruntled, then you must be constantly swindled.
You're right, they do. If $15 a month isn't enough and a cash cosmetic shop is an absolute necessity then yes, as I've stated in these replies it is a necessary evil. However we don't know if it IS necessary of if it's a blatant cash grab.
And no. Again as I've stated before, "You don't like it don't buy it" is an ignorant argument to make. The fact that the shop and it's content exists and people are purchasing and using the cosmetics directly affects the visual and immersive fidelity of the game.
Ashes of Creation is supposed to be a game about social interaction and meaningful experiences in a world inhabited by many. What meaningful experience is there behind entering your credit card numbers?
Imagine trying to discredit the valid feelings of players who care about immersion by downplaying the concept entirely. I'm sure you take all the immersive mechanics devs put into every game for granted. Including sound design, controller rumble, etc.
Have you ever played a game where the guns felt good to shoot? Guess what, that's a level of immersion buddy.
Get out of here with your weak arguments and condescending tone.
Edit: All that being said, let me restate that I don't think Intrepid is an exception to the inevitable cash grab studio rule, but by keeping that low expectation I plan to be pleasantly surprised if they have the resolve to maintain their integrity.
There seems to be a misunderstanding here.
You can't put a corgi skin on a non dog base mount. You can't use a giant turtle skin, on a non turtle mount etc.
To take the Emu example: most of the cosmetic flavor will be in the look of said Emu. For instance, it may be red or yellow instead of its natural base color.
The rest of the cosmetic applies to the saddle, saddlebags, reins etc. and how they look.
You don't have to worry about someone applying the skin of something completely unrelated to the base mount.
The corgi was a bit of exaggeration to make a point lol
Do you have a source for this? I've been following the project closely for a while and have not seen or heard anything other than the only restriction will be the tier of mount. (Though they are understandably tight-lipped about things). Not that I don't believe you, I just want to see if there's a livestream I missed somehow or something.
If it's very minor things like palette swaps that's not as big of a deal yes.
Though I would also argue that if palette swaps are a breedable thing they would also add to the backstory of the Emu.
Saddlebags and stuff is also pretty minor. If you can only obtain them through the cash shop that'd be something I'd be ok with, similar to what I said about GW2 mounts in the first page of this thread.
Sure thing! Here:
Skins are only be able to be applied to things that have already been earned, crafted or found within Ashes of Creation.
Mount skins require a specific type of mount to have been achieved in-game.
https://ashesofcreation.wiki/Skins
They reference this:
If they have retracted that statement, the Wiki hasn't updated it, and then it's my bad.
Oh yea I do remember them saying that, I just also remember Steven saying once that it was tier based, though that might have been older or him mispeaking
If it works like you say it is a loooot better than I had thought.
But even with that, I hope it doesn't become that slippery slope
My impression, which a quick trip to the wiki confirmed, is that cosmetics from the AoC shop will fit neither of those problems. There will be in-game achievable mounts that are comparable (and even grander) and these assets are being used for in-game content like NPCs, pets and mounts. So I'm confused, is this just a "literally any effort to sell anything other than the game itself is greedy and bad" or did I miss another argument from the video that also does apply to AoC?
"Different variants of store purchased cosmetic creatures (Pets and Mounts) may exist in the wild"
"There will be variants of the monthly cosmetics for NPCs and Mobs"
Also keep in mind the game that Asmon is playing. In vanilla, any mount was hard to come by for a while as the cost to afford one + training was a lot. So seeing any mount was uncommon (not the case for a vast majority of MMOs these days). Secondly, you were race locked to a few mount variants unless you put in substantial effort which would slightly increase your available mount pool. More "unique" mounts were added gradually and slowly over years. If a game comes out with many many mount variants to begin with, there will never be a "ashes of al'ar in a sea of gryphons" since there will never have been a situation where we had a sea of gryphons, we would already have a lot of variants from the get go. Plus, we already have the fact that flying mounts will be incredibly rare and hard to come by, so we already have that super-unique chase if you want it.
It might not look too bad now, however numerous games of various genres have shown in the past that this is indeed a slippery slope, even when they start with the best intentions. In fact, I will be pleasantly surprised if after few years Interpid will still keep to their promise of having "cosmetics achievable in-game ... be on-par ... [or] even more elaborate than shop items" and/or won't regress to tacky unimmersive designs.
Imagine a world where a consumer gets to tell a business....you don't get to sell those things because you don't NEED the income. You get more than enough income to give me what I want from that monthly subscription fee. Talk about a weak and pathetic argument. This has to be one of the worst comments I have read on these forums.
It's perfectly acceptable to discredit feelings when those feelings are just plain dumb and over the top. The cosmetics that you can buy ARE the visual and immersive fidelity of the game. Think of it like that and you won't have a brain aneurism whenever you see my toad mount.
I get that, but you also can't let past experiences scar you to the point where you are concerned about the future of the cash shop of a game we know very little about, that is years from coming out by a studio who has bent themselves backwards claiming/promising the cash shop will forever stay cosmetic. Sure stay cautious, continue to prefer AoC wouldn't have a cash shop until your concerns are put to ease but no need to let it disappoint you or ruin your future enjoyment of, again I cannot stress this enough, a game that we still know very very little about and is a long time from release. And especially no reason to demand they change plans already and scrap the cosmetic only cash shop (just look at PoE for a positive example, and AoC has promised no pay for convenience either which they also consider P2W, so even better than PoE). Stay excited my friend.
You're right, I'm discrediting your feelings right now.
Your forum avatar is very fitting.
And that is exactly WoW's issue. Nothing in the shop is remotely achievable in game. And it's one reason in a laundry list of reasons for why I quit the game.
I really hope Intrepid only offer color/dye options and nothing else that makes them stand out from in-game achievables. This goes for ALL types of skins; mounts/gear/caravans/freeholds etc
I will not support anything more.