Glorious Alpha Two Testers!
Phase I of Alpha Two testing will occur on weekends. Each weekend is scheduled to start on Fridays at 10 AM PT and end on Sundays at 10 PM PT. Find out more here.
Check out Alpha Two Announcements here to see the latest Alpha Two news and update notes.
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Phase I of Alpha Two testing will occur on weekends. Each weekend is scheduled to start on Fridays at 10 AM PT and end on Sundays at 10 PM PT. Find out more here.
Check out Alpha Two Announcements here to see the latest Alpha Two news and update notes.
Our quickest Alpha Two updates are in Discord. Testers with Alpha Two access can chat in Alpha Two channels by connecting your Discord and Intrepid accounts here.
Comments
Well, we've already got wind, with some potential for wind direction...
But I don't feel most people will be willing to play with controllers or VR-controlled fans for the Touch one...
Well you still have sight and hearing in game so are you insinuating that your sense of smell is the equivalency of a map marker?
Touch and balance also help with orientation.
Mini-maps provide more info than the primary map. New World had a compass that may have visually represented smell.
But, no, I am explicitly stating that in real life the maps I use have a marker for me on the map.
I would like fog-of-war only if there was a convenient in-game way to share your map with anyone (or any group). If that's not on the table, then I would recommend a traditional map that, once explored, updates with the world.
Edit: Inversely, if someone has explored part of the map and wants to keep it secret, I'm cool with that.
As for the map live updating or not... it depends on the depth of updating.
Since I'm assuming the nodes will effect the layout of the map a little bit. should it be a different copy of the map as the node changes? Then what about your effort previously exploring a different tier. There then would need to be some sort of reward structure for exploring an area in each tier of the node (a professional line i've seen some say). Or the reverse issue, the node updating doesnt change anything significantly so then the map doesnt need to change.
I dont think a fully static map would be a good idea just because then people will just say to use X website instead.
most helpful is things that i liked about maps in games ->
Thus my conclusion is i have no idea what the best way to approach map vs exploration since it depends on what's in the game so there is not enough information for a hard answer.
If you got down here through my long winded answer have a good day
A.) Someone else touched on the idea of Cartography as a skill that people can spec into and use to create better maps. I think that this idea is a very interesting one, albeit I have no idea how it would pan out in actually game play. But I love the idea that people can spec into the skill of mapping.
Further dive into the functionality the skill: Cartography could work well if Cartographers would auto-fill a handful of maps as they explore (the detail and amount of the maps would vary based on cartography skill). These maps can be sold/trade to other players.
B.) Self-Updating/Deteriorating maps would also be a fun way to use mapping. When visiting new places areas will populate with details and upon leaving, areas will gray out indicating that they might not be up-to-date. After a given amount of time (this can be played around with to get something that feels satisfying) the map will unpopulated those things that grayed, maybe 2 weeks or so. This time could also vary based on the notoriety of the map detail specifically. EG. Towns/Cities maybe be populated on the map for twice as long as a Bandit Camp, which might be there twice as long as Elite NPC in a cave, etc.
1) Realistically speaking, having a basic map of the world already exist is reasonable. There have been outposts developed in several different places before the players arrive, so it makes sense that at the very least, the topography has been explored.
2) Basic world maps should not change because geography does not change on a less than geological time scale without serious intervention. Coastlines stay coastlines, rivers follow the path of least resistance, and mountains will probably still be there after a volcanic eruption.
3) Anything more than that should be discovered/recorded by players. If a dungeon pops up, players should find it and update their map. If a village develops somewhere, then players should update their map. This will lead to engagement with the world.
4) Having players set personal markers on their maps could lead to misinformation, especially if they are capable of spreading it. However, automatic updating would mean less social interaction and less personal investment in the world. Having a cartography system somewhere in the middle encourages players to pause and update the map without fear of getting something very wrong.
5) If there is a system in place to help guide a player's cartography, there can be ways to improve the system for the player the same way they would improve any other crafting profession. For example, using better inks, paper, and pens should make a higher quality map given an equal skill level.
6) Maps can be improved with better resolution and more detailed information. Both of these traits can be adjusted by a cartographer's level and skills during the process of making a map. This means the best maps will be made by the best crafters.
7) Higher quality maps mean better information for the people using them. Better information leads to better decision making. For example, which route to take on a caravan. This leads to a demand for high quality maps, which leads to a demand for high tier cartographers, which leads to more people engaging in, or even specializing in, cartography as a system.
8) If people engage in or specialize in a system, then engaging with the system should be worthwhile and have the same amount of depth as any other system where players can specialize, specifically professions in this case.
I'll go further with a difference between range at which you discover land and localizations. This way cartographers could have a upgrade on there localizations range, ect.
If players will make maps throw a profession and sell it to other players or share it knowledge with science guild within the city or something similar.:
-One exempla where map was not part in game unless you found a map piece. Like in DayZ standalone.
The map was hidden unless you had the map item. Players was really confused about their
whereabout, unless you had put ton of playtime in game. You would not really recognize the land or
aria you was in. The standard norm with the players then would just tab out of the game and use a
world map on the website instead and totally side gate the developers intent.
I tend to make the game easier for the overall player base with build in map and to get the feeling of exploring the would you could put in vistas / jump puzels like in gw2 and maybe even some hidden treasure/portal events like in final fantasy and lost ark instead to keep the exploring factor high. But thats just my personal view.
Either way on what path Intrepid Studios takes. I think it will great regardless.
It would be cool to have a map become explored based on where you go but also based on what level of cartography skill you have. Don't make it so that you enter a zone and suddenly know where everything in the zone is, rather, make it so that you enter the 'center' or 'focal point' of the zone to give you access to the zone updating your map. This could be a high vantage point, a town/village, or an npc. Npc's could also give you parts of a map (either bought or gained through conversation).
The cartography skill would change how much detail would be in the map based on what you've seen/zone clearance. You would level this up passively or actively (5 sec skill) through exploration of the world, giving you small basic map markings at first, then becoming more fledged out with subsequent levels. Eventually, your own exploration would be more detailed than a regular map update given to you by the focal points.
I also think it would be really cool to see cities/towns have areas in marketplaces/barracks/libraries to buy maps that are either pre generated or player generated (most up to date). Smaller zones can have just their zone's map available to buy but if you go to the main city of the zone, you could buy all the smaller pieces there. If you go to a city to update the current map and pc's buy that map, you should get some royalties as a the owner. I also think some interesting titles would have to be added to the game based on cartography.
OK. Onto maps automatically updating once explored... I don' think that they should be unless it really is a major event that's happening/happened. For example, if you're in a town that becomes a city with you in it, that should be automatically updated. But if you're outside of the town and it becomes a city, it shouldn't be updated until you receive that information from another town/city or from an npc in the zone. And when you do receive that information, I don' think it should just fill out the city on the map for you, you should still have to go explore it yourself or buy that map in that city. I think small details like that really help drive the sense of a living, breathing, changing world to the player and makes the overall experience better.
As for how this affects the macro of the game with it's changing nodes, I think it complements it. It doesn't give people power by just exploring everything and then always knowing what's happening in the world from then on. It creates an importance on information, which can then be managed in the game with people going around, mapping, and selling maps in hubs or just keeping that information to themselves/their guild. As for other limited time events that are core to the game, you could have those stay relevant on the map of where they are after people have 'explored' the zone, even if the zone has changed since they've been there.
ya
In summary, A interactive map that players require effort to fully explore is preferred rather than a map which is fixed and once explored is permanently available with all the information a player would need.
Tier 1 map: 2-3 major landmarks with the centre of the town / node in the middle
Tier 2 map: 5-6 major landmarks, general areas where certain enemy types might be found, increased range
Tier 3 map: 7-10 major landmarks, height maps, mob locations and gathering locations, increased range
Tier 4 map: 10 major landmarks, height maps, mobs, gathering, increased range
Tier 5 map: all major land marks, and all previous info detailed, and some information on neighbouring nodes
You can obviously choose to not buy the maps and just explore yourself. But I think the town hubs where information is gathered and shared would be the main place that players can go to get information. I also think making map information tied to node progress builds more of a community to work together.
If an area has a low node value it means there's less people adventuring here which is more realistic that the information isn't as accurate and gives more feeling of an adventure and exploring the unknown.
This also means maps can become out of date and need to be re-purchased / re-explored if a node is destroyed and the map information is no longer accurate.
I first stumble over the mapmaking skill in the theorycrafting of 'Chronicles of Elyria'. I think most of the hype for that not so trustworthy MMO was just they had so many great ideas about the game so you actually wanted to see how they would pull that off. I am glad I didnt join that hype train. Anyway sidetracking. If I have to choose between more dynamic maps with unfortunate lag or stationairy maps on a big world then I would choose the later.
If Entrepid can pull this dynamic off it opens up many interesting ideas: Special mapped Caravarns routes or even ambush spots. Big rewards for those living in the wild and discovering. Keep the discussion going.
You know, this sounds really cool ... but how the heck would the sale of points of interest actually be facilitated? It'd be a no mans land - does mini-boss value go up if the surrounding area is less interesting? How about the accessibility of the terrain? Countless other potential modifiers.
It'd be really hard to know what you were paying for - unless the price of information was standardized, somehow. Two ways you could go about that:
#1: Price setting. Standardize note types and highlights - each sells for a set price in a given node, modified by player traffic, node development, world events, etc. Then players can buy those maps or trade them for a specific currency related to discovery and posting of their own stuff.
#2: Profession. Specific professions for sharing maps and creating them for use by other players. Then the player base standardizes stuff in their own way free market style, with healthy regulation.
In any case, having your maps fade over time the longer you go without visiting an area would keep the map discovery thing fresh! Node changes shouldn't appear until you buy info or actually go visit.
I agree with this. No reason to reinvent the wheel if all you're doing is making a shit wheel.
- 2nd monitor support for map. No more having to pull up map constantly in-game which "takes you out of game"
- map that allows me to set my own marks, notes, etc.
- guild map that can be used in conjunction with your own personal map.
- unexplored areas to be hidden and areas that are out of date to have a "fog" that shows prev exploration but indicates changes have occurred
- ability to change color of map via filters? dark mode map ayoooooooo lol
What would a guild map entail?
- notes and marks made by guild leader / leadership of guild.
- this is what provides updates to map such changes on the map as it updates with every guild members movement