Craftable Arrows in Ashes of Creation: Empowering Artisans and Players

Hey everyone,

I wanted to share my perspective on why keeping arrows craftable in Ashes of Creation is so important. Arrows are crucial for ranged combat, and while magic arrows may seem tempting, traditional arrow-making offers unique opportunities for collaboration and specialization among our Artisan classes.

Here's why I believe it's crucial:

Artisan Collaboration: Arrow crafting showcases the interconnectedness of our Artisan classes. By involving multiple professions, we create a vibrant ecosystem where players can collaborate, trade, and specialize.

Economic Diversity: Craftable arrows contribute to a diverse economy, providing steady income for woodworkers, enchanters, and related professions. This ensures a healthy flow of resources and goods within our game world.

Player Agency and Customization: Crafting allows us to tailor our combat experience to our preferences and playstyle. Whether it's elemental arrows, poison-tipped projectiles, or traditional shafts, we have the freedom to experiment and innovate.

Here are some creative concepts for arrow crafting:

Woodworkers and Fletchers: Crafting arrow shafts from various woods, each with unique properties. Fletchers add feathers for stability and flight trajectory.
Enchanters and Runesmiths: Infusing arrows with magical runes for elemental effects or increased damage.
Alchemy and Poisoners: Creating poison arrows with toxins and venoms for debilitating status effects.
Additionally, for those of us embracing the hybrid Archetypes of Ranger and Mage, I propose the concept of infinite magic arrows. By combining magic with marksmanship, we can conjure arrows infused with unlimited magical energy, offering unparalleled versatility and power in ranged combat.

If you agree with these ideas, leaving a like would be greatly appreciated—it helps support the cause. I'd also love to hear your thoughts and feedback, so feel free to share your opinions in the comments.

Thanks for listening!

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Comments

Babayugah

No.

Artisan Collab - it already exists.
Economic Diversity - it already exists
Player Agency - it already exists with the 30-40 abilities & then augmentation.

The only benefit it adds is to every other class that doesn't have ammunition upkeep. Ammunition is a horrible idea for Ashes. Thankfully, Steven already has agreed that it adds zero value to the game and won't exist. So, again...

No.

Ludullu

I prefer the current design. Mainly because having a craftable required resource for one archetype would lead to balancing changes for other archetypes (which could include inventory bloat).

https://ashesofcreation.wiki/Bows
Bows will not require ammo. Instead the developers are considering per-use consumables/buffs that can be applied to weapons.[9]

We are thinking about unique buffs that can be applied to your weapons that are on a per-instance basis of the attack; so, for example, you might have a quiver that you can activate on a cooldown, and that quiver might apply some type of rider effect on the basic weapon attack that you have equipped. Or, you might have some type of alchemical consumable that applies it to your melee weapon. Those I think are interesting because they add an element of horizontal gameplay, depending on the adversary you're facing or the challenge you're up against.[9] – Steven Sharif

Otr

Kalnazzar wrote: »

If you agree with these ideas, leaving a like would be greatly appreciated—it helps support the cause. I'd also love to hear your thoughts and feedback, so feel free to share your opinions in the comments.

Thanks for listening!

I heard nothing but I left a like for the algorithm.
I can play the game with craftable arrows too. Will shift the game away from what players are traditionally used to but actually there are games where you carry arrows or bullets. And here we carry potions too.
Anyway is a matter of taste and Steven decided so. I don't care much if he adds arrows or removes potions and food or if he makes them drop on death.

Vysione

No.

Depraved

pls no T_T

Nerror

I am not a fan of craftable arrows. Even in an optional system.

Azherae

I do not care about craftable arrows, despite my main game having them and a strong reason for them (mostly reasons you listed).

I might start to care more if the Ranger design balance becomes too difficult without them, or if the economic design has the usual hole that they fill.

But I'd say not to 'want them' in a game where the devs are already set on a path of designing around not having them. We should trust that they know what they're doing until we see otherwise.

I admit that I enjoy the gameplay that you described in the OP which they provide, but most don't, so that would be a net negative for the game unless the other two things I mentioned are dragged down without them.

Noaani

Having one DPS class that is reliant on consumables for their damage output isn't a good idea unless you make all classes equally reliant on consumables.

Kilion

That would mean anyone using bow and arrow will be shorter on money than ranged sorcerers, shorter on storage space than other players and potentially weaker than anyone not playing with the additional risk of running out of ammo.

But I am not entirely against the idea. I would suggest to maybe implement "buffing" items that are not limited by number but by time. I'd imagine this to be like a 24h toggle-on / toggle off ability, that adds a small spin to the regular ranged damage; like +1% crit chance with regular ranged attacks, a small (2-3% tops) damage boost of a certain damage type for regular ranged attacks or a slighty improved homing to increase the chance of hitting a mobile enemy (again very slightly).

That way anyone using ranged weapons will not become useless when they cannot afford ammo and since a similar buff item system could be used for other weapons (e.g. weapon oils for swords, daggers and spears), it could add the warrior-artisan synergy you are looking with less impact on indivdual players but on a broader basis to make a difference when it comes to group play.

But disadvantaging solely players who want to use bows and arrows would be devastating for the variety of weapons used, of that I am quite sure.

Apok

Just cause someone doesn't like something doesn't mean it's bad, I sometimes hate grinding XP so should we just let people start at max level?

Consumables are a driving force behind any economy, look at all your retail stores now days, why do you think all these stores sell food now and prioritize the sales of food

Having stuff like Food,Medicine and Ammo will help create a stable economy and keep money flowing. if not all lower level and newer players will flood the market with basic materials in an effort to make money.

This usually leads to over saturated markets and people gaming the system by buying low and selling high and eventually hording materials to inflate prices. players need diversity in what they craft and without that you get everyone going for the same thing.

Flanker

Hard no. Why one specific class must pay for every LMB click they make while others don't?

Apok

Flanker wrote: »

Hard no. Why one specific class must pay for every LMB click they make while others don't?

are you gonna pay for your tanks potions then?

also it's unfair that bow users get ranged physical attacks, all melee dps should be able to range by throwing their weapons at the enemy and it just return to them

Kalnazzar

Flanker wrote: »

Hard no. Why one specific class must pay for every LMB click they make while others don't?

Being a true badass means being prepared, not sitting around expecting everything to be handed to you on a silver platter. Every class, every player, should damn well know the value of preparation. Whether it's stocking up on potions, fixing your gear, or yeah, making sure you've got enough arrows for a scrap.

If you ain't willing to put in the sweat to make sure you're ready for whatever hell comes your way, then maybe you oughta rethink your career choice.

A legit ranger doesn't whine about running out of arrows; they adapt, they think on their feet. They've got a backup plan 'cause they know that's what it takes to stay alive. And if you think that's too much effort, well, maybe adventuring just ain't your thing.

Sure, some folks want everything served up on a silver platter. They wanna rush through life, never pausing to appreciate the journey or the obstacles along the way. But not me. I'm here to soak up every damn moment, to revel in the thrill of the hunt, to grind for materials and craft my gear with pride. Let's get real here IRL: if you're expecting your gun to magically shoot infinite bullets in a battle/war or your crossbow to fire endless bolts, you're in for a rude awakening, my friend.

Kalnazzar

Apok wrote: »

Just cause someone doesn't like something doesn't mean it's bad, I sometimes hate grinding XP so should we just let people start at max level?

Consumables are a driving force behind any economy, look at all your retail stores now days, why do you think all these stores sell food now and prioritize the sales of food

Having stuff like Food,Medicine and Ammo will help create a stable economy and keep money flowing. if not all lower level and newer players will flood the market with basic materials in an effort to make money.

This usually leads to over saturated markets and people gaming the system by buying low and selling high and eventually hording materials to inflate prices. players need diversity in what they craft and without that you get everyone going for the same thing.

This right here is what I am saying it's got a lot of depth it brings into a world based on a player economy.

Apok

Kalnazzar wrote: »

This right here is what I am saying it's got a lot of depth it brings into a world based on a player economy.

Oh yeah about bringing depth to the world I forgot to mention a good design on physical ranged users, would to allow more than just physical damage. Take BG3 for example, you have arrows to target specific enemy types as well as elemental arrows

with arrows being a thing you could branch out your character building more. Like for example, Ranged main with mage sub that has a focus on ice magic, combined with ice arrows for your autos and normal ranged skills to turn to ice damage, and ice damage modifiers on gear to create a specific style of bow mage

edit: also I'm in favor of having consumables for melees and casters, but don't water down the systems by giving everyone ammo requirements. maybe for melee users there's attack speed pots for melee only that last 30 seconds but have a 2 minute cd.

With this melee users won't have to use them while doing small things like farming items, and bow users can just use dirt cheap arrows that anyone can make. Or give bow users a basic skill to make their own arrows on the fly with some basic materials you can grab from almost anywhere (stuff like sticks and stones)

Kalnazzar

Apok wrote: »

Kalnazzar wrote: »

This right here is what I am saying it's got a lot of depth it brings into a world based on a player economy.

Oh yeah about bringing depth to the world I forgot to mention a good design on physical ranged users, would to allow more than just physical damage. Take BG3 for example, you have arrows to target specific enemy types as well as elemental arrows

with arrows being a thing you could branch out your character building more. Like for example, Ranged main with mage sub that has a focus on ice magic, combined with ice arrows for your autos and normal ranged skills to turn to ice damage, and ice damage modifiers on gear to create a specific style of bow mage

edit: also I'm in favor of having consumables for melees and casters, but don't water down the systems by giving everyone ammo requirements. maybe for melee users there's attack speed pots for melee only that last 30 seconds but have a 2 minute cd.

With this melee users won't have to use them while doing small things like farming items, and bow users can just use dirt cheap arrows that anyone can make. Or give bow users a basic skill to make their own arrows on the fly with some basic materials you can grab from almost anywhere (stuff like sticks and stones)

I've been contemplating a consumable item that bestows a temporary buff, providing hunters with a limited time to utilize arrows from a specific bundle type, such as Iron Arrows from the "Iron Arrow Bundle." It could serve as a pragmatic compromise, meeting my requirements by offering a realistic crafting option using authentic materials, while also being viable for sale.

Furthermore, we could introduce poison variations or unique magical types to add variety and depth to the selection.

Crafting these bundles would involve several steps. For instance, woodworkers could fashion the arrow shafts, selecting trees with optimal magic adaptability for specific elemental affinities. Enchanters could then enhance the arrows' magical properties by inscribing runes or other symbols, fortifying the wood and optimizing its magical performance.

This approach not only adds realism but also imbues quivers with practical functionality beyond mere decoration. we could utilize the quiver to store these stacking consumables. With a substantial duration and a moderate price point—not excessively high, but enough to facilitate sales—crafters would find joy in crafting and vending these items.

Zehlan

The only game that i have played that had something like this MMO wise was Dark age of Camelot but they incorporated it into a much more indepth system of damage types with armour having strengths and vulnerablity to them making switching arrows to what armour being worn important otherwise having to craft arrows for no gain would be annoying and worthless! Really if you wanna go back to the age of old school sandbox then why not make casters buy reagents to cast spells like UO did too!

Kalnazzar

Zehlan wrote: »

The only game that i have played that had something like this MMO wise was Dark age of Camelot but they incorporated it into a much more indepth system of damage types with armour having strengths and vulnerablity to them making switching arrows to what armour being worn important otherwise having to craft arrows for no gain would be annoying and worthless! Really if you wanna go back to the age of old school sandbox then why not make casters buy reagents to cast spells like UO did too!

I completely agree. Having specialized [Arrow Bundles] or arrows tailored for specific tasks adds a layer of depth to the game that I find intriguing. It reminds me of the intricacies of older MMOs like Dark Age of Camelot, where understanding damage types and armor vulnerabilities was crucial. Crafting arrows that are effective against heavy armor or exploit armor weak points could definitely enhance gameplay and make the choice of ammunition more strategic.

And you bring up a great point about the old-school approach to spellcasting, like in the early days of Runescape where you had to farm runes for casting magic. Requiring casters to acquire reagents to cast spells adds a level of resource management and immersion that I think would enrich the gaming experience. It's all about bringing back those elements of sandbox gameplay that made older MMOs so engaging and rewarding.

Aszkalon

I remember a Time in WoW Vanilla,

before even the first Expansion Burning Crusade came out, even.

Rogues needed some Materials or they couldn't use all Abilities. Because some of them, needed Materials. And that counted for Poisons, too.

And Hunters needed to " MAKE " Ammunition, didn't they ? So i bet it sucked Donkeyballs for them as well to have endlessly toil for Stuff, only so that they had all their natural Abilities at their Disposal.

I played a Nightelf Rogue all my WoW-Life until Cata, lol.

I remember when i never used Poison in both PvE or PvP. Why ? Because it was just to much of a hassle to farm the Stuff for it. Well okay - i "DID" used it a bin Alterac Valley. I wanted to do maximum Damage for my Faction.

But that was it. And i must agree with everyone else here, who doesn't want that for Example "Arrows" for Hunters have to get crafted,

it just sucks. It is a pain in the butt - especially when other Classes don't have to spend countless Minutes every Month to Year, only so they can use their Abilities.

Flanker

Kalnazzar wrote: »

Being a true badass means being prepared, not sitting around expecting everything to be handed to you on a silver platter. Every class, every player, should damn well know the value of preparation. Whether it's stocking up on potions, fixing your gear, or yeah, making sure you've got enough arrows for a scrap.

If you ain't willing to put in the sweat to make sure you're ready for whatever hell comes your way, then maybe you oughta rethink your career choice.

A legit ranger doesn't whine about running out of arrows; they adapt, they think on their feet. They've got a backup plan 'cause they know that's what it takes to stay alive. And if you think that's too much effort, well, maybe adventuring just ain't your thing.

Sure, some folks want everything served up on a silver platter. They wanna rush through life, never pausing to appreciate the journey or the obstacles along the way. But not me. I'm here to soak up every damn moment, to revel in the thrill of the hunt, to grind for materials and craft my gear with pride. Let's get real here IRL: if you're expecting your gun to magically shoot infinite bullets in a battle/war or your crossbow to fire endless bolts, you're in for a rude awakening, my friend.

Meaning no offence, but can you stop using AI generated replies in this thread?

Apok wrote: »

are you gonna pay for your tanks potions then?

also it's unfair that bow users get ranged physical attacks, all melee dps should be able to range by throwing their weapons at the enemy and it just return to them

1. He pays for his consumables, I pay for mine. Same as any other party member.
2. This is false equivalence fallacy which means your argument makes no sense by definition. And what you said simply makes no sense.

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