DygzMember, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
It is amusing that some white knights would be outraged back in 2019 when people would compare Ashes development to Star Citizen development.
"They are nothing alike! Ashes will release Before 2020!!"
It is amusing that some white knights would be outraged back in 2019 when people would compare Ashes development to Star Citizen development.
"They are nothing alike! Ashes will release Before 2020!!"
There are many shades of grey.
Star Citizen is black.
IMO the backers of 2017-2019 have a solid reason to be disappointed, anyone after that... as harsh as it sounds I think since 2020 there was enough of a track record there for people to know/suspect that Intrepid is developing something good, but is not very strong in delivering in the projected time frame and the expected amount of content.
This can be frustrating - yes.
This is something Intrepid needs to improve on in the process of open development - for sure!
But I also think that people who buy into these unfinished products could benefit from adopting a calmer/"colder" mindset, maybe akin to that of the clichee coldblooded investor, see through the hype and look at the facts, reliability in delivering promises etc.
IMO the backers of 2017-2019 have a solid reason to be disappointed, anyone after that... as harsh as it sounds I think since 2020 there was enough of a track record there for people to know/suspect that Intrepid is developing something good, but is not very strong in delivering in the projected time frame and the expected amount of content.
This can be frustrating - yes.
This is something Intrepid needs to improve on in the process of open development - for sure!
But I also think that people who buy into these unfinished products could benefit from adopting a calmer/"colder" mindset, maybe akin to that of the clichee coldblooded investor, see through the hype and look at the facts, reliability in delivering promises etc.
I would like to be exempted! lol
(Alpha-1 testers had an experience that also somewhat indicated that the team was capable of delivering on their promises, but it turned out to be another mostly-discarded vertical slice, with the problem that I can't name a single non-asset thing from A1 that survives to now)
No foul on Intrepid side, they did tell us 'yeah basically everything in here can be changed'... sort of... eventually.
I completely agree with you. It’s important to voice concerns, but constantly dwelling on the negative can create an atmosphere that’s counterproductive to the success we all want for Ashes of Creation. Constructive criticism is crucial, but it should be balanced with hope and positivity, especially in a community that’s excited about what this game can/has become. We all want Ashes to succeed, and keeping discussions forward-thinking and solution-oriented will help us get there.
Let’s focus on supporting the development and building a community that reflects the game’s potential.
It is amusing that some white knights would be outraged back in 2019 when people would compare Ashes development to Star Citizen development.
"They are nothing alike! Ashes will release Before 2020!!"
There are many shades of grey.
Star Citizen is black.
Star Citizen is sparkling white compared to Duke Nukem Forever.
I wouldn't be posting here if I wanted the game to fail. I have better things to do with my time than troll a forum for something I don't like or have no interest in.
3
Ayeveegaming1Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
IMO the backers of 2017-2019 have a solid reason to be disappointed, anyone after that... as harsh as it sounds I think since 2020 there was enough of a track record there for people to know/suspect that Intrepid is developing something good, but is not very strong in delivering in the projected time frame and the expected amount of content.
This can be frustrating - yes.
This is something Intrepid needs to improve on in the process of open development - for sure!
But I also think that people who buy into these unfinished products could benefit from adopting a calmer/"colder" mindset, maybe akin to that of the clichee coldblooded investor, see through the hype and look at the facts, reliability in delivering promises etc.
Bought my pack assuming 10 years of development was ahead of us. Have another 7 years before I start getting disappointed, not at Intrepid, but with myself in terms of estimating. But yeah, I really don’t think you can go with a crowd funding project with this kind of scope and not think of Star Citizen.
I think it is going to be a very team oriented game at the faction/node level , so each server will have 6-10 teams with 300-500 people in each. It is going to be very difficult for one person to really stand out as a winner. You are going to need a lot of people to step up in order for your node to be The Power. You are not going to be able to zerg it. That is going to be hard for some people.
If a forum post / social media post / video can derail this project then i am gonna call early "GG". This you have to believe or else it fails is "The Secret" nonsense.
Don’t know about whether people want it to succeed or fail, but if I were the rich guy developing this game I wouldn’t have the patience to deal with people. I’d have refunded everyone but those who’ve earned the opportunity to test and shut down the showcases, open Alphas, etc. and build the game until it’s finished without all of the noise and drama. Juice just doesn’t seem to be worth the squeeze. Perhaps the goal was to develop the game with a community, but to me so far that appears to be their biggest mistake.
I probably would have developed and published a few smaller scale yet similar games before AoC due to the scope of this project. At least those other projects would either generate the necessary revenue to build AoC without having to go too deep into your own pocket, or signal you aren’t ready for a large project. But I get it why Steven wanted to do this. He wanted to build a game he wanted to play. Most developers aren’t doing that anymore.
For the development team I would be much more selective about who tests the game, and I’d make sure the testers intended to simulate A-holes are paid employees. Can’t afford to develop a game with amateur A-holes. And by A-hole I more or less mean a sub team that plays devil’s advocate on the project and is in charge of testing to break the game so that it’s built to be more bulletproof.
The entire project would be under NDA until release. Build it first, then market it. No early access. No Alpha/Beta keys. No cosmetics. Nothing. Just a game when it’s ready and worth standing on its own to generate revenue without any of the perceived monetization gimmicks. Merchandise like hats, t-shirts, collectible models, art books, etc would be the only other thing I’d sell, and I’d make them available as long as they are popular instead of a limited release to prevent the claims of FOMO.
I thought about finishing reading and writing a similar message, but I see you have already done it and even better my friend.
The only thing I think is that Steven has done so far, Ashes has already created and deleted many of the developments at least twice. The game shown in 2017 and 2021 was very different visually. In my opinion, now there is a third type of visual.
So they got their hands on developing the game. Yes, it was without content and only visuals, and you most likely meant to make a game with content before making Ashes, but at least something.
the divine Master of your native Language was almost clobbered and defeated by a strangely charming Monkey God. . - you might want to take a Look at if if you haven't already.
I ask this because by reading some of these threads makes me think you all want it to fail.
Can you not see the negativity you are generating ?
Say your piece and move on, or am I to assume you guys want to tank Ashes.
Lots of people still have hope, and I think you guys just want to ruin it for everyone because your feelings are out of control.
I think You are addressing mostly the People who feel now down and betrayed since the Reveals of the Dates for the different Phases of Alpha Two,
- ( and of Course the few, usual Trolls here and there, ) -
We were told that Alpha Two starts in Quarter Three of this Year for ... ... ... ... over Eight Months ? Nine Months ? But the first, gentle and fickle Tests start in late October or early November depending how One looks at it,
and the "thiccer"(lol) part People are so hyped for, comes only first around the Winter Solstice.
For me who dreams of one Day being a Summoner in the World of Verra -> it kinda starts in Quarter Two in 2025. but that is not tragic at all - as i view Necromancer as kinda Main-Characters anyway. Muahahahaha. .
Welp. No Choice complaining,
no use mourning and lamenting,
" it is as it is " - and nothing that struck us in the last Week changes what we must do.
Give Sir Steven and his mighty Crew the Support as Testers when they want it - > how they want it -> and as long as they want it.
If it's simply Weekend-Connection Drama for the first Weekends between early November and December 20th, then so be it. I am willing to blow my Internet Connection to shreds if it means giving dear Intrepid enough Data to bring Ashes of Creation out even half a Day sooner. .
✓ Occasional Roleplayer
✓ Kinda starting to look for a Guild right now. (German)
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH.
I love it how you quite sometimes from time to time write about exactly what i think inside my Head.
Meh ! People decided to be more and more thin-skinned for themselves in the last handful of Years and there is absolutely nothing we can do about it, i think. This is probably the whole Problem and Drama.
Take my Like.
✓ Occasional Roleplayer
✓ Kinda starting to look for a Guild right now. (German)
the divine Master of your native Language was almost clobbered and defeated by a strangely charming Monkey God. . - you might want to take a Look at if if you haven't already.
I ask this because by reading some of these threads makes me think you all want it to fail.
Can you not see the negativity you are generating ?
Say your piece and move on, or am I to assume you guys want to tank Ashes.
Lots of people still have hope, and I think you guys just want to ruin it for everyone because your feelings are out of control.
I think You are addressing mostly the People who feel now down and betrayed since the Reveals of the Dates for the different Phases of Alpha Two,
- ( and of Course the few, usual Trolls here and there, ) -
We were told that Alpha Two starts in Quarter Three of this Year for ... ... ... ... over Eight Months ? Nine Months ? But the first, gentle and fickle Tests start in late October or early November depending how One looks at it,
and the "thiccer"(lol) part People are so hyped for, comes only first around the Winter Solstice.
For me who dreams of one Day being a Summoner in the World of Verra -> it kinda starts in Quarter Two in 2025. but that is not tragic at all - as i view Necromancer as kinda Main-Characters anyway. Muahahahaha. .
Welp. No Choice complaing,
no use mourning and lamenting,
" it is as it is " - and nothing that struck us in the last Week changes what we must do.
Give Sir Steven and his mighty Crew the Support as Testers when they want it - > how they want it -> and as long as they want it.
If it's simply Weekend-Connection Drama for the first Weekends between early November and December 20th, then so be it. I am willing to blow my Internet Connection to shreds if it means giving dear Intrepid enough Data to bring Ashes of Creation out even half a Day sooner. .
I too want to be a necromancer!!! Welcome brother. We might find ourselves on the same field of battle, I hope to call you brother. I know my signature days rogue, but I made that some years ago haha.
I too want to be a necromancer!!! Welcome brother. We might find ourselves on the same field of battle, I hope to call you brother. I know my signature days rogue, but I made that some years ago haha.
Ahoi Ravicus. 🫡 .
We still have to wait up to Quarter Two of 2025 to be able to test our beloved Archetype of Summoner, but it will be worth the wait i am sure.
Stay healthy and safe and never forget - where most People see only dead folks lying around - we see possibly Friends or useful future Servants who might help us on our travels.
Dead People are just Allies we haven't met sooner. (lol) - and with a bit of "late healing" and magical convincing i am sure they will lend us a willing, helping, dead and cold hand to get our Stuff done in the World of Verra.
✓ Occasional Roleplayer
✓ Kinda starting to look for a Guild right now. (German)
Are you for Ashes succeeding or failing. I ask this because by reading some of these threads makes me think you all want it to fail. Can you not see the negativity you are generating? Its understandable if you have questions. But to beat to death, over and over, on these forums, on reddit, on Reactions from content creators. Can you not see the negativity you are generating? Say your piece and move on, or am I to assume you guys want to tank Ashes. Lots of people still have hope, and I think you guys just want to ruin it for everyone because your feelings are out of control.
I do not expect people to recognize when they are the chaff and not the wheat. Good thing Intrepid has a sifter.
0
Ayeveegaming1Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
I too want to be a necromancer!!! Welcome brother. We might find ourselves on the same field of battle, I hope to call you brother. I know my signature days rogue, but I made that some years ago haha.
Ahoi Ravicus. 🫡 .
We still have to wait up to Quarter Two of 2025 to be able to test our beloved Archetype of Summoner, but it will be worth the wait i am sure.
Stay healthy and safe and never forget - where most People see only dead folks lying around - we see possibly Friends or useful future Servants who might help us on our travels.
Dead People are just Allies we haven't met sooner. (lol) - and with a bit of "late healing" and magical convincing i am sure they will lend us a willing, helping, dead and cold hand to get our Stuff done in the World of Verra.
I enjoy participating in Alpha testing so I think I am going to optimistically buy in for A2. The keys are a decent value now I think. I have a ton of fun testing Star Citizen and have spent way more money on that. I hope a similar sort of culture can be fostered here. I especially like Star Citizen's Issue Council for tracking bugs.
I've been following the project since 2017. Of course I want it to succeed.
This "game" has become different than what I expected it would be, and the closer we get to launch, I think less and less it will be what I imagined it would be.
Maybe that's my fault, maybe Steven's vision changed, maybe it's just the implementation of certain systems that's a problem, I have no idea.
I'm still hopeful, I want the game to be good.
Now we can talk about what exactly does "succeed" mean. Whether it's going to be a flop, whether it will live up to hype, whether it will be one of the most popular MMOs... I think we all might have a different answer. I just want the game to be good, enjoyable, and to have a decent population so it can sustain itself.
I think during Alpha 2, more precisely in about years time, I will have a clear a clear vision of whether the game will be for me or not. There's a few thing I'm waiting to see how they're implemented, and one thing they've yet to showcase, which is the key part of the game for me, which will either make me not want to play the game, or make me want to play it even more.
I think they've made many mistakes, not just recently but throughout the years.
The thing that worries me, is that it might be the case that they do not have many things actually thought out and planned how they would work. I still think they're making it up as they go, and then when they make it into a somewhat functioning state, they showcase it to us.
What would really help is them saying, we are aiming to do this, and we want it to work like this. If they are unable to do it for some reason, that's cool, but at least we know what they wanted to do - and they are doing that with some stuff. But I just think the general audience is simply not familiar with what the game will be all about, and how it will function, which is also why many people are not happy with the direction the game's going in.
Are you for Ashes succeeding or failing. I ask this because by reading some of these threads makes me think you all want it to fail. Can you not see the negativity you are generating? Its understandable if you have questions. But to beat to death, over and over, on these forums, on reddit, on Reactions from content creators. Can you not see the negativity you are generating? Say your piece and move on, or am I to assume you guys want to tank Ashes. Lots of people still have hope, and I think you guys just want to ruin it for everyone because your feelings are out of control.
I appreciate your passion for Ashes and your concern about the atmosphere in the community. However, I'd like to offer a perspective that considers the role of criticism in the development and success of any project, especially something as complex as a video game.
1. Negativity vs. Apathy: It’s important to recognize that negativity, while sometimes uncomfortable, is often a sign of engagement. When people care enough to critique or voice concerns, it’s because they are invested in the outcome. Apathy, on the other hand, would be a much more worrying sign, as it indicates a lack of interest or belief in the project. In the context of game development, negative feedback often stems from a desire to see the game succeed and from a belief that there is potential worth salvaging.
2. Constructive Criticism: There’s a significant difference between destructive criticism and constructive feedback. While the former seeks to tear down without offering solutions, the latter is crucial for the iterative process of game development. Constructive criticism highlights areas where improvements are needed and often comes with suggestions for how to address those issues. This type of feedback can guide developers to make changes that align the game more closely with community expectations, thereby increasing its chances of success.
3. The Role of Community Feedback: Communities are a vital part of the ecosystem for any online game, especially one as ambitious as Ashes. Developers often rely on community feedback to identify issues that they may not have anticipated or that require prioritization. The forums, Reddit discussions, and content creator reactions all provide valuable data points that can help the development team refine and improve the game.
4. Balancing Passion with Perspective: It’s natural for discussions to become heated, especially when people are passionate about a project. However, it’s important to balance that passion with perspective. Constructive criticism should be encouraged, but it’s also beneficial to acknowledge what is going well and to support the development team where appropriate. A balanced approach ensures that the feedback is both actionable and motivational for the developers.
5. Fostering a Positive Yet Critical Community: The best outcomes often arise from a community that is both supportive and critical. Being critical does not mean being negative for the sake of negativity, but rather holding the project to high standards because you believe in its potential. Encouraging diverse opinions and a robust dialogue around the game can lead to a better final product, as it ensures that a wide range of perspectives are considered.
Are you for Ashes succeeding or failing. I ask this because by reading some of these threads makes me think you all want it to fail. Can you not see the negativity you are generating? Its understandable if you have questions. But to beat to death, over and over, on these forums, on reddit, on Reactions from content creators. Can you not see the negativity you are generating? Say your piece and move on, or am I to assume you guys want to tank Ashes. Lots of people still have hope, and I think you guys just want to ruin it for everyone because your feelings are out of control.
Typical fanboi post, its the critics that actually get games changed for the better, well most of the time, fanbois like you are a cancer for any game. you just lap up everything the developers put out, and ask for more please.
You need to be asking questions and pushing, 90% of the time players know far better than Devs what works!!
I've been following the project since 2017. Of course I want it to succeed.
This "game" has become different than what I expected it would be, and the closer we get to launch, I think less and less it will be what I imagined it would be.
Maybe that's my fault, maybe Steven's vision changed, maybe it's just the implementation of certain systems that's a problem, I have no idea.
I'm still hopeful, I want the game to be good.
Now we can talk about what exactly does "succeed" mean. Whether it's going to be a flop, whether it will live up to hype, whether it will be one of the most popular MMOs... I think we all might have a different answer. I just want the game to be good, enjoyable, and to have a decent population so it can sustain itself.
I think during Alpha 2, more precisely in about years time, I will have a clear a clear vision of whether the game will be for me or not. There's a few thing I'm waiting to see how they're implemented, and one thing they've yet to showcase, which is the key part of the game for me, which will either make me not want to play the game, or make me want to play it even more.
I think they've made many mistakes, not just recently but throughout the years.
The thing that worries me, is that they do not have many things actually thought out and planned how they would work. I still think they're making it up as they go, and then when they make it into a somewhat functioning state, they showcase it to us.
What would really help is them saying, we are aiming to do this, and we want it to work like this. If they are unable to do it for some reason, that's cool, but at least we know what they wanted to do - and they are doing that with some stuff. But I just think the general audience is simply not familiar with what the game will be all about, and how it will function, which is also why many people are not happy with the direction the game's going in.
Since I wrote this one in hurry, let me actually add more to it:
When I said it may seem that they are making it up as they go, it could be true, but it could also be due to poor communication.
So far the game is going in a direction that still interests me, some things haven't turned out the way I expected (wanted) them to - Freeholds and player housing, mainly, with a few other things, but a lot of stuff have been in line with what I expected, somewhat.
Another issue is that players read something, somewhere, or hear about it during live streams, and a few years later, after hearing nothing about it, we get something that's not entirely the same as what they "promised". Things change, everything is subject to change as they keep repeating, so that's why players are giving feedback, and why they're being negative about something they don't like. Since this is an open-development game, it's only logical to conclude that they will take in players feedback about stuff they showcase. It's a totally normal thing.
If you actually want to filter out useless feedback, I think it would be helpful to also be clear about how you want the game to look like, what's the gameplay going to look like, rather than talking about systems in isolation. That is, if the devs know the answer to it, and I'm pretty sure they do, it just hasn't been communicated properly.
This also loops back to my first point, where it seems that they make stuff up as they go. It looks that way, because we just get showcases that are mostly shown in isolation, it's like "hey look what we added", then another stream, "hey, look what else we added". Obviously they want to not spoil the game too much, but that's all going out of the window when Alpha 2 drops.
By filtering out such feedback, you might just get people who are on board with the project, who understand what you're going for, and who want to play that sort of a game, rather than players who think they're getting something they're not.
These players will be able to help out the most, and give better feedback.
The key pattern we see here is communication.
It just needs to improve, maybe we actually get a stream that just explains the vision for the game, how it's going to play, what we are going to do, what's the gameplay going to look like, how do systems tie into that, and how they will work, etc. etc. - it's hard to keep a track of all of that, when you do one stream a month, where you showcase everything in isolation.
I just don't get this post, or rather I don't get why you posted it on Ashes forums. Obviously people here want the game to be good and to succeed. Now if you had asked that question on MMORPG subreddit, or in Asmongold's comment section, then I'd get it, and you might get different answers.
1
QuarantineMember, Leader of Men, Kickstarter, Alpha One
Ya, I'm really not trying to argue or disagree with you. All of htis has been stated repeatedly. My point is the image and the reputation for the game. I just hope people understand how it looks to people that are just hearing about the game.
But here's the fun question though. Would this "image and reputation" be better if Intrepid did better after all the feedback, instead of just kneejerking reactions every time?
We all want the game and the devs to succeed, otherwise we wouldn't be here (at least the oldtimers). But saying that "the feedback has been given, you should stop", to me, sounds like "I've hit that person, it's known, stop telling everyone what I did or I'll get a bad rep". Shouldn't have hit a person if you're scared of bad rep.
Reputation is everything.
0
Ayeveegaming1Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
I completely agree with you. It’s important to voice concerns, but constantly dwelling on the negative can create an atmosphere that’s counterproductive to the success we all want for Ashes of Creation. Constructive criticism is crucial, but it should be balanced with hope and positivity, especially in a community that’s excited about what this game can/has become. We all want Ashes to succeed, and keeping discussions forward-thinking and solution-oriented will help us get there.
Let’s focus on supporting the development and building a community that reflects the game’s potential.
Thank you. This is exactly what I am talking about. I appreciate your post.
I think the anti-fan may have a greater time investment than the fan. Seems to be the nature of the internet. The more serious position is indifference, which we won’t see posted. The indifferent gamer will just go do something else.
Now there are many who are providing criticism, but not in a way that’s actionable, and a bit hyperbolic. Intrepid needs something concrete they can implement to that doesn’t destroy their vision. Oddly enough the entire Alpha 2 key order thing was Intrepid trying to please the community. Sometimes that’s a no win position. So everyone providing feedback has to take it into consideration. Perhaps we help Intrepid more by using these forums to hammer out these various positions into what most in the community can agree upon. Oh, there will still be disagreement on some subjects and Intrepid will need to make decisions that will alienate some to half of the community, there after making that community smaller.
And then there are those who just want to see the world burn.
Hopefully your beta issue is/will be addressed soon.
Nah, I'm too small of a niche to care about in this context. There's maybe a few dozen people out there with giveaway A2 keys and ONLY B2 bundles. If even dozens It's a very very precise combination of things.
If you can't get it, I have extra beta keys from Kickstart and I could gift you one.
Hey just a shot in the dark but if you still have that code I'd really like it. I missed the last package window by a week and now keys are two weeks later entry
We had hype and momentum going into A2 showcase, now its everyone spitting fire, raging against the machine.
And I wish that hype continued. But we at first got delayed from the inital promise. Then we got a staggered release of the A2. With a staggered high pricepoint. Which led to the drama. Which led to a huge overcorrection. Which led to initial backer drama. Which has now led TO YET ANOTHER OVERCORRECTION.
And none of that came directly from complainers, because complainers could only react to what Intrepid was doing.
I'm still hyped for A2. I'll still be there on day one sitting in a queue waiting for the broken servers to come back up. I'll still shower Intrepid with a ton of feedback on anything they ask me to test.
But I cannot agree with telling people to stop giving feedback about Intrepid's fuckups, especially when there's been several of them in a row, especially when quite a few of them relate directly to people's money (both already-spent and about-to-be-spent ones).
As Crow said, this will blowover soon, just as all previous "dramas" have. People have goldfish brains. And with all the hype surrounding Ashes, the more followers the game has - the more goldfish brains.
We had hype and momentum going into A2 showcase, now its everyone spitting fire, raging against the machine.
And I wish that hype continued. But we at first got delayed from the inital promise. Then we got a staggered release of the A2. With a staggered high pricepoint. Which led to the drama. Which led to a huge overcorrection. Which led to initial backer drama. Which has now led TO YET ANOTHER OVERCORRECTION.
And none of that came directly from complainers, because complainers could only react to what Intrepid was doing.
I'm still hyped for A2. I'll still be there on day one sitting in a queue waiting for the broken servers to come back up. I'll still shower Intrepid with a ton of feedback on anything they ask me to test.
But I cannot agree with telling people to stop giving feedback about Intrepid's fuckups, especially when there's been several of them in a row, especially when quite a few of them relate directly to people's money (both already-spent and about-to-be-spent ones).
As Crow said, this will blowover soon, just as all previous "dramas" have. People have goldfish brains. And with all the hype surrounding Ashes, the more followers the game has - the more goldfish brains.
I’m very curious what that outline of fuck ups is. I thought I’ve been following close but I guess not.
Comments
"They are nothing alike! Ashes will release Before 2020!!"
There are many shades of grey.
Star Citizen is black.
This can be frustrating - yes.
This is something Intrepid needs to improve on in the process of open development - for sure!
But I also think that people who buy into these unfinished products could benefit from adopting a calmer/"colder" mindset, maybe akin to that of the clichee coldblooded investor, see through the hype and look at the facts, reliability in delivering promises etc.
I would like to be exempted! lol
(Alpha-1 testers had an experience that also somewhat indicated that the team was capable of delivering on their promises, but it turned out to be another mostly-discarded vertical slice, with the problem that I can't name a single non-asset thing from A1 that survives to now)
No foul on Intrepid side, they did tell us 'yeah basically everything in here can be changed'... sort of... eventually.
Let’s focus on supporting the development and building a community that reflects the game’s potential.
Star Citizen is sparkling white compared to Duke Nukem Forever.
well stated.
dev time duke nukem 14 years ....
dev time sc 12 years now ... and still aplha .... so you will get from sparkling white to black in two years lol
I thought about finishing reading and writing a similar message, but I see you have already done it and even better my friend.
The only thing I think is that Steven has done so far, Ashes has already created and deleted many of the developments at least twice. The game shown in 2017 and 2021 was very different visually. In my opinion, now there is a third type of visual.
So they got their hands on developing the game. Yes, it was without content and only visuals, and you most likely meant to make a game with content before making Ashes, but at least something.
Azherae,
the divine Master of your native Language was almost clobbered and defeated by a strangely charming Monkey God.
This is the absolutely strangest and yet most forward Question i think i can remember in many Years of Video-Gaming regarding a coming Game.
Why of Course - i want it to succeed. For Years i dreamed of an interactive Game World which has the four Seasons.
I think You are addressing mostly the People who feel now down and betrayed since the Reveals of the Dates for the different Phases of Alpha Two,
- ( and of Course the few, usual Trolls here and there, ) -
We were told that Alpha Two starts in Quarter Three of this Year for ... ... ... ... over Eight Months ? Nine Months ? But the first, gentle and fickle Tests start in late October or early November depending how One looks at it,
and the "thiccer"(lol) part People are so hyped for, comes only first around the Winter Solstice.
For me who dreams of one Day being a Summoner in the World of Verra -> it kinda starts in Quarter Two in 2025.
Welp. No Choice complaining,
no use mourning and lamenting,
" it is as it is " - and nothing that struck us in the last Week changes what we must do.
Give Sir Steven and his mighty Crew the Support as Testers when they want it - > how they want it -> and as long as they want it.
If it's simply Weekend-Connection Drama for the first Weekends between early November and December 20th, then so be it. I am willing to blow my Internet Connection to shreds if it means giving dear Intrepid enough Data to bring Ashes of Creation out even half a Day sooner.
✓ Occasional Roleplayer
✓ Kinda starting to look for a Guild right now. (German)
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH.
I love it how you quite sometimes from time to time write about exactly what i think inside my Head.
Meh ! People decided to be more and more thin-skinned for themselves in the last handful of Years and there is absolutely nothing we can do about it, i think. This is probably the whole Problem and Drama.
Take my Like.
✓ Occasional Roleplayer
✓ Kinda starting to look for a Guild right now. (German)
I too want to be a necromancer!!! Welcome brother. We might find ourselves on the same field of battle, I hope to call you brother. I know my signature days rogue, but I made that some years ago haha.
Ahoi Ravicus. 🫡 .
We still have to wait up to Quarter Two of 2025 to be able to test our beloved Archetype of Summoner, but it will be worth the wait i am sure.
Stay healthy and safe and never forget - where most People see only dead folks lying around - we see possibly Friends or useful future Servants who might help us on our travels.
Dead People are just Allies we haven't met sooner. (lol) - and with a bit of "late healing" and magical convincing i am sure they will lend us a willing, helping, dead and cold hand to get our Stuff done in the World of Verra.
✓ Occasional Roleplayer
✓ Kinda starting to look for a Guild right now. (German)
I do not expect people to recognize when they are the chaff and not the wheat. Good thing Intrepid has a sifter.
This "game" has become different than what I expected it would be, and the closer we get to launch, I think less and less it will be what I imagined it would be.
Maybe that's my fault, maybe Steven's vision changed, maybe it's just the implementation of certain systems that's a problem, I have no idea.
I'm still hopeful, I want the game to be good.
Now we can talk about what exactly does "succeed" mean. Whether it's going to be a flop, whether it will live up to hype, whether it will be one of the most popular MMOs... I think we all might have a different answer. I just want the game to be good, enjoyable, and to have a decent population so it can sustain itself.
I think during Alpha 2, more precisely in about years time, I will have a clear a clear vision of whether the game will be for me or not. There's a few thing I'm waiting to see how they're implemented, and one thing they've yet to showcase, which is the key part of the game for me, which will either make me not want to play the game, or make me want to play it even more.
I think they've made many mistakes, not just recently but throughout the years.
The thing that worries me, is that it might be the case that they do not have many things actually thought out and planned how they would work. I still think they're making it up as they go, and then when they make it into a somewhat functioning state, they showcase it to us.
What would really help is them saying, we are aiming to do this, and we want it to work like this. If they are unable to do it for some reason, that's cool, but at least we know what they wanted to do - and they are doing that with some stuff. But I just think the general audience is simply not familiar with what the game will be all about, and how it will function, which is also why many people are not happy with the direction the game's going in.
I appreciate your passion for Ashes and your concern about the atmosphere in the community. However, I'd like to offer a perspective that considers the role of criticism in the development and success of any project, especially something as complex as a video game.
1. Negativity vs. Apathy: It’s important to recognize that negativity, while sometimes uncomfortable, is often a sign of engagement. When people care enough to critique or voice concerns, it’s because they are invested in the outcome. Apathy, on the other hand, would be a much more worrying sign, as it indicates a lack of interest or belief in the project. In the context of game development, negative feedback often stems from a desire to see the game succeed and from a belief that there is potential worth salvaging.
2. Constructive Criticism: There’s a significant difference between destructive criticism and constructive feedback. While the former seeks to tear down without offering solutions, the latter is crucial for the iterative process of game development. Constructive criticism highlights areas where improvements are needed and often comes with suggestions for how to address those issues. This type of feedback can guide developers to make changes that align the game more closely with community expectations, thereby increasing its chances of success.
3. The Role of Community Feedback: Communities are a vital part of the ecosystem for any online game, especially one as ambitious as Ashes. Developers often rely on community feedback to identify issues that they may not have anticipated or that require prioritization. The forums, Reddit discussions, and content creator reactions all provide valuable data points that can help the development team refine and improve the game.
4. Balancing Passion with Perspective: It’s natural for discussions to become heated, especially when people are passionate about a project. However, it’s important to balance that passion with perspective. Constructive criticism should be encouraged, but it’s also beneficial to acknowledge what is going well and to support the development team where appropriate. A balanced approach ensures that the feedback is both actionable and motivational for the developers.
5. Fostering a Positive Yet Critical Community: The best outcomes often arise from a community that is both supportive and critical. Being critical does not mean being negative for the sake of negativity, but rather holding the project to high standards because you believe in its potential. Encouraging diverse opinions and a robust dialogue around the game can lead to a better final product, as it ensures that a wide range of perspectives are considered.
Typical fanboi post, its the critics that actually get games changed for the better, well most of the time, fanbois like you are a cancer for any game. you just lap up everything the developers put out, and ask for more please.
You need to be asking questions and pushing, 90% of the time players know far better than Devs what works!!
Since I wrote this one in hurry, let me actually add more to it:
When I said it may seem that they are making it up as they go, it could be true, but it could also be due to poor communication.
So far the game is going in a direction that still interests me, some things haven't turned out the way I expected (wanted) them to - Freeholds and player housing, mainly, with a few other things, but a lot of stuff have been in line with what I expected, somewhat.
Another issue is that players read something, somewhere, or hear about it during live streams, and a few years later, after hearing nothing about it, we get something that's not entirely the same as what they "promised". Things change, everything is subject to change as they keep repeating, so that's why players are giving feedback, and why they're being negative about something they don't like. Since this is an open-development game, it's only logical to conclude that they will take in players feedback about stuff they showcase. It's a totally normal thing.
If you actually want to filter out useless feedback, I think it would be helpful to also be clear about how you want the game to look like, what's the gameplay going to look like, rather than talking about systems in isolation. That is, if the devs know the answer to it, and I'm pretty sure they do, it just hasn't been communicated properly.
This also loops back to my first point, where it seems that they make stuff up as they go. It looks that way, because we just get showcases that are mostly shown in isolation, it's like "hey look what we added", then another stream, "hey, look what else we added". Obviously they want to not spoil the game too much, but that's all going out of the window when Alpha 2 drops.
By filtering out such feedback, you might just get people who are on board with the project, who understand what you're going for, and who want to play that sort of a game, rather than players who think they're getting something they're not.
These players will be able to help out the most, and give better feedback.
The key pattern we see here is communication.
It just needs to improve, maybe we actually get a stream that just explains the vision for the game, how it's going to play, what we are going to do, what's the gameplay going to look like, how do systems tie into that, and how they will work, etc. etc. - it's hard to keep a track of all of that, when you do one stream a month, where you showcase everything in isolation.
I just don't get this post, or rather I don't get why you posted it on Ashes forums. Obviously people here want the game to be good and to succeed. Now if you had asked that question on MMORPG subreddit, or in Asmongold's comment section, then I'd get it, and you might get different answers.
Reputation is everything.
Thank you. This is exactly what I am talking about. I appreciate your post.
Now there are many who are providing criticism, but not in a way that’s actionable, and a bit hyperbolic. Intrepid needs something concrete they can implement to that doesn’t destroy their vision. Oddly enough the entire Alpha 2 key order thing was Intrepid trying to please the community. Sometimes that’s a no win position. So everyone providing feedback has to take it into consideration. Perhaps we help Intrepid more by using these forums to hammer out these various positions into what most in the community can agree upon. Oh, there will still be disagreement on some subjects and Intrepid will need to make decisions that will alienate some to half of the community, there after making that community smaller.
And then there are those who just want to see the world burn.
Hey just a shot in the dark but if you still have that code I'd really like it. I missed the last package window by a week and now keys are two weeks later entry
I’m very curious what that outline of fuck ups is. I thought I’ve been following close but I guess not.