Just because you see someone in the world does not mean you will trade with them. It does not mean that you will allow the workers at your stall to sell to people you have blocked.
Blocking them does not prevent you from seeing them and does not prevent them from seeing your stall. It just prevents them from buying your stuff.
And, that is excellent RP.
If you were RPing with someone, I am very skeptical that you would block/ignore them.
Saying that this is excellent RP is a little crazy.
If I had more time, I would write a shorter post.
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ThexBlackxKnightMember, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
Blocking people from trade is dumb , much better to take the gold of the people you don't like. You can call me whatever you want , I still got your money.
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DygzMember, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
Part of roleplaying is having workers that will not sell to people on your block list.
Also, shunning specific characters would be RP.
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DygzMember, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
Blocking people from trade is dumb , much better to take the gold of the people you don't like. You can call me whatever you want , I still got your money.
Not if I shun you and refuse to sell to you.
You can call me whatever you want. You won't have my money.
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ThexBlackxKnightMember, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
Blocking people from trade is dumb , much better to take the gold of the people you don't like. You can call me whatever you want , I still got your money.
Not if I shun you and refuse to sell to you.
You can call me whatever you want. You won't have my money.
Not really talking about the people that don't want to do business with me. If you hate me fine , still want to drop 2k gold into my wallet for this item fine, not going to turn that down and Ill be richer and other person will be poorer for it.
Part of roleplaying is having workers that will not sell to people on your block list.
Also, shunning specific characters would be RP.
Having an RP only feature that serves to do nothing other than pissing off other players is not a good thing to add to a game.
Add RP stuff it is fairly easy and doesn't affect the general population in any negative way, sure. As soon as it starts seeing other players having to log out, log in to another character, buy the item, set the item in a location that the first character has access to, log out of the alt, log back in to the main and pick up aaid item, then the feature being discussed should not be discussed in RP terms at all.
Having an RP only feature that serves to do nothing other than pissing off other players is not a good thing to add to a game.
Add RP stuff it is fairly easy and doesn't affect the general population in any negative way, sure. As soon as it starts seeing other players having to log out, log in to another character, buy the item, set the item in a location that the first character has access to, log out of the alt, log back in to the main and pick up aaid item, then the feature being discussed should not be discussed in RP terms at all.
We mentioned this as well before.
The system in this can very easy encompass and work on an account wide range.
If i as a player spam you with messages, i follow you around while you RP and annoy you, i interrupt your events, i harass you and being a generally disruptive person, you should have the option to remedy this.
Use the /ignore if you just don´t want to see any of my messages, and if you feel this is enough.
If you feel i have created so much annoyance, it should be your right to place a /blacklist or /ban on me.
/ignore = Removes messages and option to communicate
/ban /blacklist = Bans player and account alts from all sorts of communication AND trade.
In any general trade house, i would not see your items while browsing, and if i were in your store or stall, i would simple get a notification that i have been blacklisted from your business.
The system is not advanced, it´s nothing new, and it certainly is not only there for p***ing off players. The system would be in place to ensure a player has the level of tools to moderate it´s surroundings, and remove toxic or unwanted behaviour.
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DygzMember, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
If a player wants to have an alt that is friendly with me buy an item from my stall, I'm fine with that.
That is good RP.
My characters should have animosity with other characters; not with the player.
I'm OK with nudging another player into using an alt.
Especially since I plan on having a Corrupted Zombie Alt.
Having an RP only feature that serves to do nothing other than pissing off other players is not a good thing to add to a game.
Add RP stuff it is fairly easy and doesn't affect the general population in any negative way, sure. As soon as it starts seeing other players having to log out, log in to another character, buy the item, set the item in a location that the first character has access to, log out of the alt, log back in to the main and pick up aaid item, then the feature being discussed should not be discussed in RP terms at all.
We mentioned this as well before.
The system in this can very easy encompass and work on an account wide range.
If i as a player spam you with messages, i follow you around while you RP and annoy you, i interrupt your events, i harass you and being a generally disruptive person, you should have the option to remedy this.
Use the /ignore if you just don´t want to see any of my messages, and if you feel this is enough.
If you feel i have created so much annoyance, it should be your right to place a /blacklist or /ban on me.
/ignore = Removes messages and option to communicate
/ban /blacklist = Bans player and account alts from all sorts of communication AND trade.
In any general trade house, i would not see your items while browsing, and if i were in your store or stall, i would simple get a notification that i have been blacklisted from your business.
The system is not advanced, it´s nothing new, and it certainly is not only there for p***ing off players. The system would be in place to ensure a player has the level of tools to moderate it´s surroundings, and remove toxic or unwanted behaviour.
Place rival guild on blacklist.
Ask new recruits to purchase item from your store.
Those not able to are spies.
It is not rocket science to see how *ANY* system that affects an entire account (even achievements) can be used to determine spies.
@Noaani So then, do not harass, ruin RP, troll etc a player and don´t end up on that list.
If someone puts you on that list anyway....is that not the players right, as in any game?
As for the spy problem, sure..that can be a problem...but why should that specific problem then count, if the harassed players enjoyment of the game should not?
Also, why would a spy be that fantastically interested in a characters store? I would venture a guess, a spy can do monumental harm in information-gathering in other ways, but you seem to be stuck at just one. Infiltrate among the soldiers or politicians i feel would be a better choice, than to browse a dagger selection.
Noaani So then, do not harass, ruin RP, troll etc a player and don´t end up on that list.
Did you even read the post? I even made it short so that it wasn't too much to ask for people to do so before replying.
I am not talking about using the blacklist as you are talking about using it. I am talking about using it as a tool to identify spies coming in to your guild.
I have no real desire to prevent anyone buying anything I am selling. If I am selling it, it is because it is of no real use to me or my guild, and anyone that has use for it is welcome to it.
Thus, my blacklist is empty.
Now, if we are recruiting some people, and I place the name of every member of any rival guilds we have on my blacklist and tell that new recruit to purchase an item off my store, if that recruit is unable to do so, then I am able to say with 100% certainty that the player has a character in a rival guild.
As such, they are likely a spy.
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DygzMember, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
edited June 2021
Again...this seems like the same mechanics as Permissions for a Freehold.
Seems like we should be able to set a whitelist, a blacklist or open to public for our stalls.
I don't understand why that is controversial.
Again...this seems like the same mechanics as Permissions for a Freehold.
Seems like we should be able to set a whitelist, a blacklist or open to public for our stalls.
I don't understand why that is controversial.
The controversy is because if this is account wide, it destroys espionage - and if it is not account wide, it is simply an ineffective annoyance.
Noaani So then, do not harass, ruin RP, troll etc a player and don´t end up on that list.
Did you even read the post? I even made it short so that it wasn't too much to ask for people to do so before replying.
I am not talking about using the blacklist as you are talking about using it. I am talking about using it as a tool to identify spies coming in to your guild.
I have no real desire to prevent anyone buying anything I am selling. If I am selling it, it is because it is of no real use to me or my guild, and anyone that has use for it is welcome to it.
Thus, my blacklist is empty.
Now, if we are recruiting some people, and I place the name of every member of any rival guilds we have on my blacklist and tell that new recruit to purchase an item off my store, if that recruit is unable to do so, then I am able to say with 100% certainty that the player has a character in a rival guild.
As such, they are likely a spy.
That sounds like a very thin example tbh..but If that would be the case, then for sure the system should be tweaked. A system should work overall for all, and let´s say that example of yours are the tipping scale of it all, then the system should be tweaked, no doubt.
It should not be fully ignored, because that´s just to give in to the player base that want to be disruptive and toxic.
As for your comment to Dygz " The controversy is because if this is account wide, it destroys espionage - and if it is not account wide, it is simply an ineffective annoyance.
I don't understand why you don't understand this. "
Can you please explain what sort of espionage you are planning, that has the necessity for you to buy items from someone? I really don´t see the thread in that example.
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DygzMember, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
Noanni is the only person on my ignore list.
That way, I'm not tempted to respond to their absurdities and it cuts down on pages of meaningless banter.
Blocks should be by character; not by account.
I don't know why it would matter if a spy is trying to buy my stuff. If a spy wants to buy my stuff they can.
I would imagine the guilds I don't want buying my stuff, we would be at war with and probably wouldn't be able to buy stuff from my stall anyway.
Can you please explain what sort of espionage you are planning, that has the necessity for you to buy items from someone? I really don´t see the thread in that example.
You are still not getting it.
The point if making a new recruit buy an item is to prove they dont have a character in a rival guild. Nothing more, nothing less.
If they have a character in a rival guild, I have all characters of that rival guild on my blacklist, and that blacklist was account wide, then ONLY people with characters in rival guilds are unable to buy from me.
If a new recruit is given the test of buying a specific item off me and is unable, they have a character in that rival guild.
What this means is that all inter-guild espionage is almost entirely killed off, as you can always see if a recruit is an alt of someone from another guild.
At this point I think it'd just be easier to entirely ignore Dygz's opinions on dwarves if not most everything.
One of the best things that has happened to me know these forums is that I pissed Dygz off enough for him to ignore me.
This is far better than me ignoring him, as it means I can still read his opinions on the game and be amused by several aspects of them. It also means that in a thread on a topic I care about, I can point out why his comments are incorrect (which they usually are) and not need to worry about getting in to a pointless debate with him when he inevitably contradicts himself and then tries to say that he didn't say the exact words he said earlier.
No @Noaani , it really does not sound like something " literally every guild " would do. You speak for your own guild perhaps, but no...i do not think this is " literally every guilds " top prio.
I do get it, but you are dead focused on this single example. It will not fall or stand on just " this " one. Also, i have a really hard time seeing roleplayers getting into this. I would see it as not abuse in the full meaning of the word, but a bit of grey market system check to see if anyone was blacklisted. By that action, you yourself are ruining the espionage, because for some reason, you play a secret shopper game-host.
Why not just let anyone join the guild as intended and NOT force them to go shopping, so you can get info from the games internal systems check, and use that to scratch RP and espionage gameplay?
You are creating a problem that does not exist, because you do not like a system that can assist the players being harassed or forced. The system IS fully for making sure a single player or a less ´confronting player or guild does not become
* Harassed and forced to hang around their abusers
* Targeted and forced to sell to rivals for low sums, unless they will keep getting ganked
* Threatened and or blackmailed into submission and free workforce for the abusers
And please do me a favor, do not say these things do not happen in online games. Such a comment would be very disrespectful and a blatant lie in the face of players being abused daily.
It sounds like what literally every guild that is concerned with being spied on would do.
The sets 'every guild' and 'every guild concerned with being spied on' are very different sets.
You seem to think this is a single example. It is not.
Intrepid have said they want espionage to be a thing in Ashes - so any system that makes it trivial to detect obviously cant be a part of the game.
As to the rest it your post - as I said earlier I am not proposing anything.
Yes, players of online games can be dicks and can harass other players. Yes, an ignore feature that works on the whole account is one way to lessen that (not prevent it, to be clear). However, there are other things publishers can do, and since Intrepid want espionage in this game, they have to look at those other avenues.
As to the three examples you gave, the proposal to allow players to have a blacklist of players they dont sell to isnt going to stop any of that. If a player or guild were the kind of people that would do any of the things you listed, they dont need the marketplace at all,they can force that player to trade directly with them - in fact,I would argue that this would be how they would prefer to go about it. If I were forcing you to sell to me at a low rate, I wouldn't be doing that via the in game marketplace where anyone could buy it at that price.
It sounds like what literally every guild that is concerned with being spied on would do.
The sets 'every guild' and 'every guild concerned with being spied on' are very different sets.
You seem to think this is a single example. It is not.
Intrepid have said they want espionage to be a thing in Ashes - so any system that makes it trivial to detect obviously cant be a part of the game.
As to the rest it your post - as I said earlier I am not proposing anything.
Yes, players of online games can be dicks and can harass other players. Yes, an ignore feature that works on the whole account is one way to lessen that (not prevent it, to be clear). However, there are other things publishers can do, and since Intrepid want espionage in this game, they have to look at those other avenues.
As to the three examples you gave, the proposal to allow players to have a blacklist of players they dont sell to isnt going to stop any of that. If a player or guild were the kind of people that would do any of the things you listed, they dont need the marketplace at all,they can force that player to trade directly with them - in fact,I would argue that this would be how they would prefer to go about it. If I were forcing you to sell to me at a low rate, I wouldn't be doing that via the in game marketplace where anyone could buy it at that price.
Personally, i feel you have a very odd way of looking at this espionage deal. You said before that "" If a new recruit is given the test of buying a specific item off me and is unable, they have a character in that rival guild.
What this means is that all inter-guild espionage is almost entirely killed off, as you can always see if a recruit is an alt of someone from another guild.""
Is that really a valid way to find that out? You would be using off game elements / information to benefit in game. Explanation: You know a ban / block system exists in the game, so instead of letting it work out organically in game, you would prefer to set up a strange " So my scouts and spies, before you get this mission, off to that vendor and buy stuff " test.
You create a non existing problem, to promote a Ney vote for a possible system that could ensure safety and the enjoyment of targeted players ahead.
You sound very keen on having this system of shielding not being implemented.
Part from the possibility of a spy not being able to spy properly for some reason, What else?
A system does not simply stand or fall on one single consequence, so elaborate how this would ruin the espionage part of Ashes.
Since you are clearly this invested in seeing this system not being used, i would assume you have several examples of the reason to vote it away.
Since you are clearly this invested in seeing this system not being used, i would assume you have several examples of the reason to vote it away.
Why do I need several examples?
Intrepid have said they want espionage to be a key aspect of how players play this game (it is more important to Steven than RP, from what I can tell), and the suggestion of an account wide blacklist will prevent people from being able to spy on rival guilds.
As such, if Intrepid want to keep espionage in the game, they can't have that account wide blacklist. The two ideals are not compatible, Intrepid needs to pick one or the other, and have made it clear they want espionage.
Then @Noaani i thank you for voicing your concern. I will consider how i could offer any options on alterations to lessen your spy vetting process if i feel it becomes of such a level of problem as you say.
But since you are not really elaborating on anything else, and i personally don´t see this as even half as problematic as you do, i thank you for the input. I feel the thread is becoming a bit stale with just back and forth on this singe subject, and i´m not here for that. You can always open a separate thread and voice how a system as this would ruin spy crafts and voice your own suggestions however.
Onward.
When it comes to reporting harassments in game, will the report box be a generic one, or does it include a selection set where we can add screenshots, timestamps, zones etc?
Also, will these reports be just in game, or will it cross over to the support part of your log in screen online?
But since you are not really elaborating on anything else, and i personally don´t see this as even half as problematic as you do, i thank you for the input.
What is there to elaborate on?
Intrepid want espionage in Ashes.
In order to spy on my guild, you need a character in my guild.
If you join my guild with a character, I can see if you have a character in a guild I have identified as being a rival guild that may want to spy on my guild - using that blacklist.
If I can see you are from a rival guild, you won't be let in to my guild as that is a clear sign you are a sphy.
But since you are not really elaborating on anything else, and i personally don´t see this as even half as problematic as you do, i thank you for the input.
What is there to elaborate on?
Intrepid want espionage in Ashes.
In order to spy on my guild, you need a character in my guild.
If you join my guild with a character, I can see if you have a character in a guild I have identified as being a rival guild that may want to spy on my guild - using that blacklist.
If I can see you are from a rival guild, you won't be let in to my guild as that is a clear sign you are a sphy.
Again, what about that needs elaboration?
Last time now @Noaani and i hope you can respect my wish on my own thread NOT becoming just the two of us back and forth.
You are using an off game way to vett your spies, and i see that as just as off-putting as using a Youtube video guide of how to kill the boss or how to find this and that collectable.
I am focusing on a system to prevent harassment, off gamle blackmail and scammers. All in an ingame and player driven system.
I have heard your spy issue, and that´s the only one you present. I thank you for the final time for your input, and i am stating that if you wish, please open a new thread and counter this all you want to your hearts content. Not in here, because this is more than this single part you are stuck on.
So, thank you for your one contribution, i have it noted.
It isn't off game, it would be a part of the game if it were added. Ashes is not a forced RP game (no games are), which is the only way this comment could ever make sense.
If Intrepid adds a feature to the game, it is fair to use it how ever players see fit. Why wouldn't that be the case?
I agree that the most block/ignore should do is stop the person's messages from reaching you.
Let's say it did also work as stopping them from purchasing your items, I can see why it can be both wanted and unwanted, since you can easily prevent individuals who've done nothing wrong from purchasing your things. But that just means less customers for you and taking longer to sell something, it's not absolutely terrible as it's similar to simply reserving your items for sale to those you know.
But I agree with what @Zeshio said, and overall it just creates an unnecessary system that can be abused/monopolised and cause other unnecessary issues or levels of toxicity. Also what are the chances that the toxic player will find you in a city and want to buy what you're selling from you when they might be able to get it from other sellers that they haven't been annoying? I understand not wanting to sell to them but it's likely not going to be as much of an issue you think it might be.
I definitely don't think it should be an account wide ban, considering the espionage comments as well, would you be able to view the list of names you've blocked? In that case, blocking on person will allow you to see all the alts they own because they'd be blocked too right? That would be a bit messy, it's easier to just block the account bothering you and leave it as that. If they come harassing you on your alt, then at that point block them too, it's quick and easy to do so.
I agree that the most block/ignore should do is stop the person's messages from reaching you.
Let's say it did also work as stopping them from purchasing your items, I can see why it can be both wanted and unwanted, since you can easily prevent individuals who've done nothing wrong from purchasing your things. But that just means less customers for you and taking longer to sell something, it's not absolutely terrible as it's similar to simply reserving your items for sale to those you know.
But I agree with what @Zeshio said, and overall it just creates an unnecessary system that can be abused/monopolised and cause other unnecessary issues or levels of toxicity. Also what are the chances that the toxic player will find you in a city and want to buy what you're selling from you when they might be able to get it from other sellers that they haven't been annoying? I understand not wanting to sell to them but it's likely not going to be as much of an issue you think it might be.
I definitely don't think it should be an account wide ban, considering the espionage comments as well, would you be able to view the list of names you've blocked? In that case, blocking on person will allow you to see all the alts they own because they'd be blocked too right? That would be a bit messy, it's easier to just block the account bothering you and leave it as that. If they come harassing you on your alt, then at that point block them too, it's quick and easy to do so.
I was recently told about the escrow system, and i did not know of this at all. That system alone reduces the issues by a lot, as if a person is blocked, that person cannot converse with you, so in the end, this will do wonders alone.
I was recently told about the escrow system, and i did not know of this at all. That system alone reduces the issues by a lot, as if a person is blocked, that person cannot converse with you, so in the end, this will do wonders alone.
Is this your way of saying that I was right when I said there were other ways of dealing with the issues you were trying to deal with, and that an account wide blacklist is indeed not the right system for Ashes?
Not that the escrow system will prevent the types of harassment that you were talking about - although neither would a blacklist.
I was recently told about the escrow system, and i did not know of this at all. That system alone reduces the issues by a lot, as if a person is blocked, that person cannot converse with you, so in the end, this will do wonders alone.
Is this your way of saying that I was right when I said there were other ways of dealing with the issues you were trying to deal with, and that an account wide blacklist is indeed not the right system for Ashes?
Not that the escrow system will prevent the types of harassment that you were talking about - although neither would a blacklist.
No, and at this point bud, it´s getting a bit much. As i said..i had never heard about that system before, and no one mentioned it to me either, including you. This system will help with some, since you cannot trade with me if you are blocked.
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If you were RPing with someone, I am very skeptical that you would block/ignore them.
Saying that this is excellent RP is a little crazy.
If I had more time, I would write a shorter post.
Also, shunning specific characters would be RP.
You can call me whatever you want. You won't have my money.
Not really talking about the people that don't want to do business with me. If you hate me fine , still want to drop 2k gold into my wallet for this item fine, not going to turn that down and Ill be richer and other person will be poorer for it.
Having an RP only feature that serves to do nothing other than pissing off other players is not a good thing to add to a game.
Add RP stuff it is fairly easy and doesn't affect the general population in any negative way, sure. As soon as it starts seeing other players having to log out, log in to another character, buy the item, set the item in a location that the first character has access to, log out of the alt, log back in to the main and pick up aaid item, then the feature being discussed should not be discussed in RP terms at all.
We mentioned this as well before.
The system in this can very easy encompass and work on an account wide range.
If i as a player spam you with messages, i follow you around while you RP and annoy you, i interrupt your events, i harass you and being a generally disruptive person, you should have the option to remedy this.
Use the /ignore if you just don´t want to see any of my messages, and if you feel this is enough.
If you feel i have created so much annoyance, it should be your right to place a /blacklist or /ban on me.
/ignore = Removes messages and option to communicate
/ban /blacklist = Bans player and account alts from all sorts of communication AND trade.
In any general trade house, i would not see your items while browsing, and if i were in your store or stall, i would simple get a notification that i have been blacklisted from your business.
The system is not advanced, it´s nothing new, and it certainly is not only there for p***ing off players. The system would be in place to ensure a player has the level of tools to moderate it´s surroundings, and remove toxic or unwanted behaviour.
That is good RP.
My characters should have animosity with other characters; not with the player.
I'm OK with nudging another player into using an alt.
Especially since I plan on having a Corrupted Zombie Alt.
Ask new recruits to purchase item from your store.
Those not able to are spies.
It is not rocket science to see how *ANY* system that affects an entire account (even achievements) can be used to determine spies.
If someone puts you on that list anyway....is that not the players right, as in any game?
As for the spy problem, sure..that can be a problem...but why should that specific problem then count, if the harassed players enjoyment of the game should not?
Also, why would a spy be that fantastically interested in a characters store? I would venture a guess, a spy can do monumental harm in information-gathering in other ways, but you seem to be stuck at just one. Infiltrate among the soldiers or politicians i feel would be a better choice, than to browse a dagger selection.
I am not talking about using the blacklist as you are talking about using it. I am talking about using it as a tool to identify spies coming in to your guild.
I have no real desire to prevent anyone buying anything I am selling. If I am selling it, it is because it is of no real use to me or my guild, and anyone that has use for it is welcome to it.
Thus, my blacklist is empty.
Now, if we are recruiting some people, and I place the name of every member of any rival guilds we have on my blacklist and tell that new recruit to purchase an item off my store, if that recruit is unable to do so, then I am able to say with 100% certainty that the player has a character in a rival guild.
As such, they are likely a spy.
Seems like we should be able to set a whitelist, a blacklist or open to public for our stalls.
I don't understand why that is controversial.
The controversy is because if this is account wide, it destroys espionage - and if it is not account wide, it is simply an ineffective annoyance.
I don't understand why you don't understand this.
That sounds like a very thin example tbh..but If that would be the case, then for sure the system should be tweaked. A system should work overall for all, and let´s say that example of yours are the tipping scale of it all, then the system should be tweaked, no doubt.
It should not be fully ignored, because that´s just to give in to the player base that want to be disruptive and toxic.
As for your comment to Dygz " The controversy is because if this is account wide, it destroys espionage - and if it is not account wide, it is simply an ineffective annoyance.
I don't understand why you don't understand this. "
Can you please explain what sort of espionage you are planning, that has the necessity for you to buy items from someone? I really don´t see the thread in that example.
That way, I'm not tempted to respond to their absurdities and it cuts down on pages of meaningless banter.
Blocks should be by character; not by account.
I don't know why it would matter if a spy is trying to buy my stuff. If a spy wants to buy my stuff they can.
I would imagine the guilds I don't want buying my stuff, we would be at war with and probably wouldn't be able to buy stuff from my stall anyway.
It sounds like what literally every guild that is concerned with being spied on would do. Nothing 'thin' about that. You are still not getting it.
The point if making a new recruit buy an item is to prove they dont have a character in a rival guild. Nothing more, nothing less.
If they have a character in a rival guild, I have all characters of that rival guild on my blacklist, and that blacklist was account wide, then ONLY people with characters in rival guilds are unable to buy from me.
If a new recruit is given the test of buying a specific item off me and is unable, they have a character in that rival guild.
What this means is that all inter-guild espionage is almost entirely killed off, as you can always see if a recruit is an alt of someone from another guild.
I do get it, but you are dead focused on this single example. It will not fall or stand on just " this " one. Also, i have a really hard time seeing roleplayers getting into this. I would see it as not abuse in the full meaning of the word, but a bit of grey market system check to see if anyone was blacklisted. By that action, you yourself are ruining the espionage, because for some reason, you play a secret shopper game-host.
Why not just let anyone join the guild as intended and NOT force them to go shopping, so you can get info from the games internal systems check, and use that to scratch RP and espionage gameplay?
You are creating a problem that does not exist, because you do not like a system that can assist the players being harassed or forced. The system IS fully for making sure a single player or a less ´confronting player or guild does not become
* Harassed and forced to hang around their abusers
* Targeted and forced to sell to rivals for low sums, unless they will keep getting ganked
* Threatened and or blackmailed into submission and free workforce for the abusers
And please do me a favor, do not say these things do not happen in online games. Such a comment would be very disrespectful and a blatant lie in the face of players being abused daily.
I didnt say literally every guild would do it, I said literally every guild that was concerned about being spied on would do it.
Here is the quote for you.
The sets 'every guild' and 'every guild concerned with being spied on' are very different sets.
You seem to think this is a single example. It is not.
Intrepid have said they want espionage to be a thing in Ashes - so any system that makes it trivial to detect obviously cant be a part of the game.
As to the rest it your post - as I said earlier I am not proposing anything.
Yes, players of online games can be dicks and can harass other players. Yes, an ignore feature that works on the whole account is one way to lessen that (not prevent it, to be clear). However, there are other things publishers can do, and since Intrepid want espionage in this game, they have to look at those other avenues.
As to the three examples you gave, the proposal to allow players to have a blacklist of players they dont sell to isnt going to stop any of that. If a player or guild were the kind of people that would do any of the things you listed, they dont need the marketplace at all,they can force that player to trade directly with them - in fact,I would argue that this would be how they would prefer to go about it. If I were forcing you to sell to me at a low rate, I wouldn't be doing that via the in game marketplace where anyone could buy it at that price.
Personally, i feel you have a very odd way of looking at this espionage deal. You said before that "" If a new recruit is given the test of buying a specific item off me and is unable, they have a character in that rival guild.
What this means is that all inter-guild espionage is almost entirely killed off, as you can always see if a recruit is an alt of someone from another guild.""
Is that really a valid way to find that out? You would be using off game elements / information to benefit in game. Explanation: You know a ban / block system exists in the game, so instead of letting it work out organically in game, you would prefer to set up a strange " So my scouts and spies, before you get this mission, off to that vendor and buy stuff " test.
You create a non existing problem, to promote a Ney vote for a possible system that could ensure safety and the enjoyment of targeted players ahead.
You sound very keen on having this system of shielding not being implemented.
Part from the possibility of a spy not being able to spy properly for some reason, What else?
A system does not simply stand or fall on one single consequence, so elaborate how this would ruin the espionage part of Ashes.
Since you are clearly this invested in seeing this system not being used, i would assume you have several examples of the reason to vote it away.
I have done this twice already. If I know you are a player that has a character in a rival guild, I know you are likely a spy.
If we have easy ways to detect spies like this, espionage isn't possible as a key aspect of spying on others is them not knowing you are doing it.
Why do I need several examples?
Intrepid have said they want espionage to be a key aspect of how players play this game (it is more important to Steven than RP, from what I can tell), and the suggestion of an account wide blacklist will prevent people from being able to spy on rival guilds.
As such, if Intrepid want to keep espionage in the game, they can't have that account wide blacklist. The two ideals are not compatible, Intrepid needs to pick one or the other, and have made it clear they want espionage.
But since you are not really elaborating on anything else, and i personally don´t see this as even half as problematic as you do, i thank you for the input. I feel the thread is becoming a bit stale with just back and forth on this singe subject, and i´m not here for that. You can always open a separate thread and voice how a system as this would ruin spy crafts and voice your own suggestions however.
Onward.
When it comes to reporting harassments in game, will the report box be a generic one, or does it include a selection set where we can add screenshots, timestamps, zones etc?
Also, will these reports be just in game, or will it cross over to the support part of your log in screen online?
Intrepid want espionage in Ashes.
In order to spy on my guild, you need a character in my guild.
If you join my guild with a character, I can see if you have a character in a guild I have identified as being a rival guild that may want to spy on my guild - using that blacklist.
If I can see you are from a rival guild, you won't be let in to my guild as that is a clear sign you are a sphy.
Again, what about that needs elaboration?
Last time now @Noaani and i hope you can respect my wish on my own thread NOT becoming just the two of us back and forth.
You are using an off game way to vett your spies, and i see that as just as off-putting as using a Youtube video guide of how to kill the boss or how to find this and that collectable.
I am focusing on a system to prevent harassment, off gamle blackmail and scammers. All in an ingame and player driven system.
I have heard your spy issue, and that´s the only one you present. I thank you for the final time for your input, and i am stating that if you wish, please open a new thread and counter this all you want to your hearts content. Not in here, because this is more than this single part you are stuck on.
So, thank you for your one contribution, i have it noted.
If Intrepid adds a feature to the game, it is fair to use it how ever players see fit. Why wouldn't that be the case? Preventing harassment is good, but scamming is a part of the game.
Your proposal for a marketplace blacklist will have no impact on harassment, however.
Let's say it did also work as stopping them from purchasing your items, I can see why it can be both wanted and unwanted, since you can easily prevent individuals who've done nothing wrong from purchasing your things. But that just means less customers for you and taking longer to sell something, it's not absolutely terrible as it's similar to simply reserving your items for sale to those you know.
But I agree with what @Zeshio said, and overall it just creates an unnecessary system that can be abused/monopolised and cause other unnecessary issues or levels of toxicity. Also what are the chances that the toxic player will find you in a city and want to buy what you're selling from you when they might be able to get it from other sellers that they haven't been annoying? I understand not wanting to sell to them but it's likely not going to be as much of an issue you think it might be.
I definitely don't think it should be an account wide ban, considering the espionage comments as well, would you be able to view the list of names you've blocked? In that case, blocking on person will allow you to see all the alts they own because they'd be blocked too right? That would be a bit messy, it's easier to just block the account bothering you and leave it as that. If they come harassing you on your alt, then at that point block them too, it's quick and easy to do so.
I was recently told about the escrow system, and i did not know of this at all. That system alone reduces the issues by a lot, as if a person is blocked, that person cannot converse with you, so in the end, this will do wonders alone.
Not that the escrow system will prevent the types of harassment that you were talking about - although neither would a blacklist.
No, and at this point bud, it´s getting a bit much. As i said..i had never heard about that system before, and no one mentioned it to me either, including you. This system will help with some, since you cannot trade with me if you are blocked.