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Regarding the Hammer Ability
Krumdark
Member
Small critique.. This ability doesn’t look right when you are using weapons such as daggers or a Greatsword. I don’t know if this is a preset animation that will eventually be changed in the future or what, but I think we need something different and unique to the weapons your using or class you’re playing. A godly smite hammer makes sense if you are wielding a hammer or can summon the gods as a class such as a paladin. A godly smite hammer doesn’t make sense when you wield daggers or greatsword on a warrior like class.
Some Suggestions:
One suggestion is this should be looked at and changed for stabbing and slashing type weapons. Creating a different animation or skill for that specific skill of a random giant crushing hammer to make sense. For example, add a Giant thrusting pointed tip as you charge a lunge then release it in a stabbing motion on stabbing weapons. Adding blue coloration as a detail to the pointed tip when using a stabbing weapon like daggers, rapiers, spears. For slashing weapons, you could maybe do a red effect of a sweep horizontal or vertical either a) multiple crosscuts with a red bleed like coloration effect or b) a singular sweep with a giant slash effect with the same coloration mentioned in point a)
Another suggestion is being based on the class your playing rather than the weapon you’re wielding. Warriors shouldn’t really be calling the wrath of the gods opposed to paladins being able to such a thing. A warrior should be using no form of magic skills and be purely relying on their raw strength and rage to deal damage to their targets. That is why the whirlwind ability, a classic skill, makes sense when wielding a greatsword, while a giant hammer being summoned out of thin air does not make sense for a warrior. For a paladin wielding even a sword a shield though? That makes way more sense .. they are calling for holy divine energy to be manifested and used against enemies.
I will say this, the hammer skill itself is a cool animation and makes sense in the examples listed above. So please devs, I request you look at this in preparation for the games launch. I just want classes and/or weapons to have unique abilities. It adds to the flavor and look of the game, which I see you guys put your heart and soul into the creative side of things as this game has been being developed. Please don’t let this fall to the wayside and be ignored.
Some Suggestions:
One suggestion is this should be looked at and changed for stabbing and slashing type weapons. Creating a different animation or skill for that specific skill of a random giant crushing hammer to make sense. For example, add a Giant thrusting pointed tip as you charge a lunge then release it in a stabbing motion on stabbing weapons. Adding blue coloration as a detail to the pointed tip when using a stabbing weapon like daggers, rapiers, spears. For slashing weapons, you could maybe do a red effect of a sweep horizontal or vertical either a) multiple crosscuts with a red bleed like coloration effect or b) a singular sweep with a giant slash effect with the same coloration mentioned in point a)
Another suggestion is being based on the class your playing rather than the weapon you’re wielding. Warriors shouldn’t really be calling the wrath of the gods opposed to paladins being able to such a thing. A warrior should be using no form of magic skills and be purely relying on their raw strength and rage to deal damage to their targets. That is why the whirlwind ability, a classic skill, makes sense when wielding a greatsword, while a giant hammer being summoned out of thin air does not make sense for a warrior. For a paladin wielding even a sword a shield though? That makes way more sense .. they are calling for holy divine energy to be manifested and used against enemies.
I will say this, the hammer skill itself is a cool animation and makes sense in the examples listed above. So please devs, I request you look at this in preparation for the games launch. I just want classes and/or weapons to have unique abilities. It adds to the flavor and look of the game, which I see you guys put your heart and soul into the creative side of things as this game has been being developed. Please don’t let this fall to the wayside and be ignored.
4
Comments
That it's a weird ethereal hammer is immaterial. Fighters and other 'martial' characters get magical abilities as part of their class kit all the time, at least in games that aren't attempting to go squeeze 'realism' until it's a meaningless word. And if you don't like the more overtly magical-looking abilities for your own fighter character, you can just choose not to invest in them.
To be 'fair' though, 'punch the ground so hard it explodes in a burst of magma would, in nearly any other game, be the 'expected and correct' way to achieve the effect required here.
I don't think it would work in Ashes as EASILY because I think the point is to telegraph the attack more easily, and if you augment it with an element, some might not look as sensible.
But on the other hand, they have the 'easy' option of making an attack like that where the 'function' is 'hit this AoE in front of me' have many different visual indicators, if the animators have time (could even be 'cheap' and borrow from different creatures with similar 'impact' abilities).
I mention this only to say that if you don't like the 'Celestial Hammer' and others do, rather than clashing over it, we might be better served trying to get Intrepid to change the 'base ability', to give "Celestial Hammer" as like, one of the visuals for the Highsword Augment options, and if more people come with the 'I don't like the groundbreaker punch/slam either', find out what THEY want to put under it.
I don't think anyone's seriously going to complain if the Highsword in their party who WANTS the shiny Hammer has it, right?
I dont like it for Fighters. It doesnt suit them.
Fighters need detailed physical combat animations for a variety of melee weapons. You cant have them cast spells because it's easy for the development.
Here we are, talking about surveying, scribing, cartography and so many other deep details for boring work simulators and the Fighter class gets a spin to win that has the same animations even between 2 daggers, a greatsword and most likely all other weapons (spear dualswords, sword/shield) and a magic hammer?
The first video where the fighter featured was titled "melee combat" so I had hope, but in the latest update Steven said "the fighter will tank for us today" so it looks pretty solidified that the hammer is the main fighter ability, just like in AA.
It looks so bad and many people wont slot the ability out of dislike, at a great viability cost.
It has to go.
Me neither.. I think just removing the skill entirely and making an animation that would make sense for the other melee classes or all the weapons would make more sense.
Don’t know if I agree with that. I think it would just look super awkward if a giant manifested rapier were to come out of the the sky and swing down as if it were crushing an enemy. If it manifested into said weapon and did a lunging strike that would be cool though.
Agreed with this. It should be like berserk slashes that cross cut or a slashing like animation of some sort. Maybe with daggers a flurry of stabs or a cool backstab lunging animation.
The problem is, skills are not tied to weapons (mostly). So there are going to be some pretty incongruous actions.
Weapons not being linked to class is one of the best things this mmorpg is doing. It is simply the fighters magic type skill that most likely is going to be augmented to changed effects.
If it stays as a hammer that is also fine with me though as augment system is going to be adding different effects to begin with.
They could at least change it so that the Hammer is the 'Augmented version' and something that Physical Fighters like better is the 'base version' though, if it's bothering people that much.
I'm really curious why they didn't use the 'ground eruption' telegraph for this one. Making it very visible is both 'a consideration for design' and 'a problem for design' at the same time, I guess.
Can we even come up with something that hits the same spot with similar startup but doesn't either 'look silly' or 'fail to communicate who initiated the attack'?
(this is my assumption for why this looks this way, but Mage and Cleric skills that seem to exist have the same 'problem')
It could suite a sub class like fight/cleric, fighter/summoner, but definitely not the base kit thats for sure.
I think it best fighter cleric (High sword) although class name would make more sense being a sword instead of hammer, Fighter/mage could be good to or maybe summoner although i would like to see fighter summoner summon physical weapons to use (kinda like irelia from league)
Remember that Ashes is high magic fantasy - everyone uses magic for some of their Active Skills.
Fighter/Fighter is called Weapon Master - not Blade Master.
I don't know why people are surprised that a Battle Hammer is among the weapons in a Fighter's Essence arsenal. (We should also see some blades in that arsenal, sure.)
That Essence conjuration is not intendedto be associated with the equipped physical weapon.
Agreed, most people just don't like hammer weapons so they are throwing their dislike to the skill.
in relation to divine or cleric type weapons, it should be a mace not a hammer if there is even a comparison (which to me there really isn't)
Doesn’t even have to take the appearance of the weapon you’re using. Could just use stabbing or slashing animations for those respected weapon types.
It’s not a dislike with the skill, it’s a dislike with the animation making sense when dual wielding daggers and greatsword. It looks unnatural. My post says that the hammer animation itself is cool and it should stay, but for paladin like classes and/or crushing weapons. This is not some hate brigade on the skill itself.