Glorious Alpha Two Testers!
Phase I of Alpha Two testing will occur on weekends. Each weekend is scheduled to start on Fridays at 10 AM PT and end on Sundays at 10 PM PT. Find out more here.
Check out Alpha Two Announcements here to see the latest Alpha Two news and update notes.
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Phase I of Alpha Two testing will occur on weekends. Each weekend is scheduled to start on Fridays at 10 AM PT and end on Sundays at 10 PM PT. Find out more here.
Check out Alpha Two Announcements here to see the latest Alpha Two news and update notes.
Our quickest Alpha Two updates are in Discord. Testers with Alpha Two access can chat in Alpha Two channels by connecting your Discord and Intrepid accounts here.
Comments
Ganking some guy gathering moss in the forest that’s not meaningfull pvp its just ruining some guys day. Sure he could have others guard him but no one wants to wait around guarding a guildmate gathering moss when he could go do something more engaging and likely more profitable.
I have seen it with other games the playerbase is just not the same as it was back in the day. When I was playing mmos 15 years ago if someone saw some guy gathering iron north of Britain with his pack llama you left him alone because you might need him to craft for you in the future and if you killed him then you would get nothing for it. Nowadays the playerbase just gets off on killing anyone they can they don’t care if it benefits them or not and the more they believe the other guys is mad the better. People are just sadist these days and you need to design your systems with that in mind.
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The guy who killed that guy with the pack llama always existed. He may be an ass but he brings in more drama and guild/player interaction than literally all of the players complaining about a pk utopia... which this game will never be
Yes there will always be ways to "game" the hardcoded rules preventing pking but if all stays true as it seems intrepid envisions this will not be the all encompassing end of days that people so believe it to be. If equipment is as easy to get and not as completely all important to play er power and that player timing and skill is more highly valued pks will bring many many fun filled wars between anti (bounty hunters) and pks. The game alone including UO had years of content just between order and chaos guilds as a whole, pk and anti. The fun is there
If i can't go out and explore the world without having to worry about the PvP crowd and have to always group up then forget this game. Even in Final Fantasy 11 there was a way around not having to group up for everything.
If there's at least going to be a stealth class that can avoid PvP players and groups and go out and explore on their own or something like this maybe that could work but i don't know if it would work, guess this game isn't right for me which sucks cuz i like a lot about it but if this is the case it would ruin my experience.
What about an Explorer/Adventurer class that is sort of like the Beastmaster in FF11 in (which allowed a person who wanted to go out and solo explore outside of grouping) and would focus on allowing a person who wants to explore and craft a refuge away from the PvP and forced grouping by using stealth and abilities based around this ideology. Could be a way for people like to me to have fun and enjoy the content they desire .
Great game you'll be missing out on here(or so we all hope). Some of the better disincentive penalties for RPK I have seen too. Just a few years ago, I wouldn't touch a game with OWPVP. I have come to enjoy some risk and feeling of danger in my play since then. Feels more satisfying to bring home profit with some risk than with 100% no risk...
It should be pretty rare that you get attacked.
The MMO world is a changing. The best games all seem to include PVP in the package to tie everything together in a way that makes sense.
Great game you’ll be missing out on here(or so we all hope). Some of the better disincentive penalties for RPK I have seen too. Just a few years ago, I wouldn’t touch a game with OWPVP. I have come to enjoy some risk and feeling of danger in my play since then. Feels more satisfying to bring home profit with some risk than with 100% no risk…
It should be pretty rare that you get attacked.
The MMO world is a changing. The best games all seem to include PVP in the package to tie everything together in a way that makes sense.
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I'm not against having PvP just the idea of being forced into it. I'm more of the thinking that everyone should be able to enjoy themselves and have fun an in MMO and that includes PvP players and those who want to solo explore, and those who want to socialize in guilds and crafters, etc.
It's difficult to understand if i could find my place in the game world without being able to play or see much of how the content works.
The thing i like most is just going off by myself and exploring the world, that doesn't mean i won't take part in group content or PvP it's just something i enjoy doing.
It's difficult to understand if i could find my place in the game world without being able to play or see much of how the content works.
The thing i like most is just going off by myself and exploring the world, that doesn't mean i won't take part in group content or PvP it's just something i enjoy doing and in my experience you can't really do that when being forced into PvP with the PvP crowd unless there's a focus on avoiding this built in. I don't need this danger or risk the forced PvP in this context brings. Exploring brings more than enough adventure and fun and it's own risks and reward without the PvP player involved.
Bottom line there is no guarantee that you will not ever have to face PVP when you don't want it. I believe that they are working pretty hard to make it a rare inconvenience instead of a common bother, though.
Bottom line there is no guarantee that you will not ever have to face PVP when you don’t want it. I believe that they are working pretty hard to make it a rare inconvenience instead of a common bother, though.
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Fair enough. I'll probably have to take a wait and see approach then. I think they will end up finding there are quite a few players like myself though and they will miss out on that player base if they're not considered.
Personally i feel an Adventurer/Explorer class based in stealth that perhaps ties into gathering/crafting is the perfect solution and workaround but only the game makers know if that's a realistic idea or not.
I really can't see a reason to complain about the PvP in this game as the designated zones will but major conflict and probably pretty well noticeable. Caravans might be a slight issue if you work in bulk resource transport but that's about it. Hire some guards? Heck I know I'll do mercenary work for gathers and PvEer's . Think of it in terms of this guy could protect me at a slight loss or I can take risk going solo.
Hell, you don't even have to communicate with your mercs just tell em what you want and silently do your work. They get payed and you get protection. If you go alone your odds are still pretty low and the way the game is said to be balanced in the end also means your odds of getting dropped before you can react is really low.
I'm rambling though basically your pretty much in the clear unless you walk into conflict zones and on the off chance u get mugged your penalties are lower than normal.
I’m rambling though basically your pretty much in the clear unless you walk into conflict zones and on the off chance u get mugged your penalties are lower than normal
If I am pve, and die to a person that mugs/kills me, will I lose items or money? I do not mind a death penalty as long as it does not include item loss. There definitely should not be item loss if I am not choosing to be pvp. If anyone has knowledge and access, please provide a link when answering. I truly am on the fence about doing the kickstarter or not and this is an important issue for me. Thank you in advance for any assistance.
Edit: what are the penalties that will be given to a person killing pve'ers?
I think Bringslite is overhyping how comfortable you will be in Ashes.
I'm backing Ashes for their vision of EQNext's PvP conflict, but I don't believe their solutions for PvP combat are adequate.
Their solutions will probably be adequate for Artisans and hardcore PvPers. They probably won't suffice for PvE adventurers and casual PvPers. I expect that there will still be contention regarding the concept of consensual PvP combat.
Corruption is a decent start to curtail random PKers, but the core of the game is PvP conflict - which will incite people to use PvP combat to resolve PvP conflict. People won't attack you for no reason - rather they will attack you due to the negative impact your actions have on the nodes they are trying to level and support. Which is "meaningful PvP combat" - but "meaningful" doesn't necessarily matter when you're not in the mood for PvP combat.
Keep your eyes peeled. Hang out with us in the forums. Share your concerns.
And let's see if we can all come up with solutions that will have all the playstyles playing happily together on the same servers.
Only time will tell if we can actually pull that off. But, we'll have to play the game to know for sure.
(Corruption isn't a harsh penalty if you're using alts created specifically for the purpose of ganking player avatars.)
I have been forced into combat way more times in MMORPGs than I ever have in real life - I've been in one shoving matching in the last 40 years... and that's it. If I encountered combat against my will like I do in MMORGPs, I would move. Just as I typically move from PvP servers to PvE servers. Real life person-to-person interaction is not as hostile as avatar-to-avatar interactions in MMORPGs. Especially not in any of the cities I've lived in in the US (or outside of the US).
@Bannith
Non-combatants who are killed receive the normal death penalties.
Combatants who are killed receive half-normal death penalties.
Which encourages non-combatants to attack back and auto-flag as combatants.
You could attack back once and then let them kill you, I suppose.
Or you could die as a non-combatant - take the normal death penalty - thereby flagging your attacker as corrupted.
https://errantpenman.com/2017/01/11/interview-ashes-of-creation-wants-to-bring-the-virtual-world-to-life/
<em>There are three states that a player can find themselves in: Non-Combatant (Green), Combatant (Purple), and Corrupt (Red). Everyone is a Non-Combatant by default. If a Non-Combatant attacks a Combatant or another non-combatant, then they become a Combatant for a period of time. Similarly, if a Non-Combatant enters a PVP zone (which includes things like Castles, City Sieges and Caravans) they are automatically flagged a Combatant while in the zone, and for a period of time after leaving that zone.
Players can kill Combatants without repercussions, and are encouraged to do so, since dying while a Combatant means you suffer reduced death penalties. Where this changes is when a Combatant kills a Non-Combatant. In this case, the Combatant is Corrupt, and acquires a Corruption Score (which is accrued based on a number of different parameters, including the level differential of their freshly slain victim). This Corruption Score can be worked off with effort through a few mechanics, but the primary means of getting rid of it is through death.
While a player is marked as Corrupt, they may be attacked by both Combatants and Non-Combatants. If a non-combatant attacks a corrupt player, the non-combatant will not flag as a combatant.
A Non-Combatant who dies suffers normal penalties, which includes experience debt, durability loss, as well as dropping a portion of carried raw materials (which can then be looted). A Combatant who dies suffers these same penalties, but at half the Non-Combatant rate. A character who has a Corruption Score on the other hand, suffers penalties at three times the rate of a Non-Combatant, and has a chance to drop *any* carried/equipped items based on their current Corruption Score.</em>
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Your corruption will be worked off, but there's a chance when you die that you drop a piece of gear or important materials.
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Whilst your corruption might be worked off by that method, If you are red when your friend kills you. There is a chance that you will drop a piece of your gear or important materials housed in your inventory.
I would create a bunch of alts as zombies dedicated to gaining as much corruption as possible and seeing how long the zombies survive. Level some alts up to 5 or 6 and then have them kill lowbies until the zombies rot or are hacked to pieces.
Corruption would be a reward; not a penalty.
Are there penalties for combatants who heal corrupted?? Is it impossible to buff or heal corrupted?
I'm just imagining playing a Necromancer with a bunch of guildies acting as my "zombies".
I play "solo" - not in a group. I don't directly attack the lowbies, but I buff and heal my corrupted guildies while they kill the lowbies.
hmmn
:thinking:
1. Corruption will not be worked off with one death. Death is just a means to work it off.
2. The more you grief, the higher the corruption, the greater the risk of losing gear and the worse your combat stats are.
3. You do not spawn where you want but where the game places you. Your friend will not be anywhere near you after respawn.
4. You have a bounty target on your head, so the chance of your friend reaching you first is unlikely IMHO.
2: Again, that's what alts are for.
3: We don't know how near friends might be to the respawn. We don't know if the respawn places are fixed cemeteries or completely random. It may indeed be possible to have friends waiting near cemeteries if the respawn locations are fixed rather than completely random.
4: Doesn't really matter whether a bounty hunter kills you or friends kill you. Either way, corruption score goes down when you're killed.
What we have been told: If you die while flagged as NonCombatant(PVE I suppose) you could drop things in inventory like carried items, gathered materials, etc.. Not equipped items(gear). I did not answer you because finding a link for it would be hard for me. Kinda new here.
For all I know Dygz could be right, but keep in mind that Dygz is disgruntled since there will be no PVE only servers. The penalties for killing non combatants are pretty seriously debilitating. That is why I am saying it should be pretty rare. More rare than in games with weak systems.
I am not disgruntled by Ashes having no PvE servers.
I am happily backing Ashes to help support their development of PvP conflict - even if it turns out that the PvP combat is too hardcore and I don't play the game when it launches.
I been telling y'all since May 6, that I just want the devs to have one PvE server so PvE-Only folk can learn for themselves first-hand how broken the game would be with PvP combat disabled. But, I don't really care if there is a PvE server or not. Those of us who won't play Ashes because the PvP combat is too hardcore and there is no PvE server, simply won't play. And I'll be ecstatic if Ashes is as successful as EVE even I'm not playing it.
Y'all keeping bring up PvE server even when nobody is talking about a PvE server.
I simply don't believe that the any of the solutions the devs have offered are going to be sufficient enough to get most PvE adventurers and casual PvPers willing to play Ashes.
The link for what is lost during PvP combat is easy to find since I've posted it here several times already.
https://errantpenman.com/2017/01/11/interview-ashes-of-creation-wants-to-bring-the-virtual-world-to-life/
<em>A Non-Combatant who dies suffers normal penalties, which includes experience debt, durability loss, as well as dropping a portion of carried raw materials (which can then be looted). A Combatant who dies suffers these same penalties, but at half the Non-Combatant rate. A character who has a Corruption Score on the other hand, suffers penalties at three times the rate of a Non-Combatant, and has a chance to drop *any* carried/equipped items based on their current Corruption Score.</em>
People will be motivated to kill non-combatants because even PvE endeavors can negatively affect rival nodes and PvP combat will be the common method of resolving PvP conflict.
What will be rare is "meaningless PvP combat." But, "meaningful PvP combat" will be prolific.
Which is problematic for people who only like PvP combat sometimes. And who don't wish to participate in PvP combat when they aren't in the mood for it.
TL; DR
@Crystania
If a player character kills you while you're pve , they can loot a portion of your raw materials. You will also suffer normal xp debt. And there will be "durability loss" - which I think is associated with gear decay.
In my opinion you have to look at the bigger picture.
Also I like to imagine a bunch of people complaining about so and so area having constant ganks until some group of people get together to patrol the area and restore order. These people would actually be heros!
~Also it would be cool if the mayor could hire guards to patrol the nodes zone of influence(probably won't happen).~
Then there is the opposite side of the spectrum. Say a rival node wants to get a preemptive strike before their siege begins or just wants to slow down their rivals progression. They in turn send out hit squads to kill gatherers and questers in that zone of influence. ~And to counter my patrol point the rival node could maybe pay some bandits to set up camp and make it harder for normal PvE'ers(Also probably will not happen).~
It could be different for AoC if the right motivations are there and in the right proportions, but that is a very tricky equation. From what is being offered up so far, IMO, there is way more stick than carrot for RPVP. That will be so discouraging that it will be pretty rare. Not nonexistent, just totally NOT WORTH IT and penalizing beyond endurance except for a few oddballs.
That's where my hope is, anyway.