DPS meters and wanting everyone to be tracked on a website is the first step to toxic mentality / gameplay.
No one is talking about having everyone tracked on a website. No one is asking for that.
At this point, I have to restate my claim that you do not know what a combat tracker is or does.
So you are assuming what I'm saying is a tracker tracks you on a website, because if you are assuming that you are giving me HEAVY flashbacks to another thread. Removing logic form my point for weird reasons.
DPS meters and wanting everyone to be tracked on a website is the first step to toxic mentality / gameplay.
No one is talking about having everyone tracked on a website. No one is asking for that.
At this point, I have to restate my claim that you do not know what a combat tracker is or does.
You realize he is linking wow logs while you make this statement, right?
Yeah, as an example of combat analysis.
Why did you reply to one post using two posts?
So you are assuming what I'm saying is a tracker tracks you on a website, because if you are assuming that you are giving me HEAVY flashbacks to another thread. Removing logic form my point for weird reasons.
No, I'm saying you probably saw a link to WoWlogs and didnt bother looking at the context.
I mean, you have a long history of not reading before you reply - or at least not understanding. You let your pre-formed opinions dictate how you absorb information, and anything that contradicts that gets ignored, or twisted in to something that supports your pre-formed opinions.
DPS meters and wanting everyone to be tracked on a website is the first step to toxic mentality / gameplay.
No one is talking about having everyone tracked on a website. No one is asking for that.
At this point, I have to restate my claim that you do not know what a combat tracker is or does.
You realize he is linking wow logs while you make this statement, right?
Yeah, as an example of combat analysis.
Why did you reply to one post using two posts?
So you are assuming what I'm saying is a tracker tracks you on a website, because if you are assuming that you are giving me HEAVY flashbacks to another thread. Removing logic form my point for weird reasons.
No, I'm saying you probably saw a link to WoWlogs and didnt bother looking at the context.
I mean, you have a long history of not reading before you reply - or at least not understanding. You let your pre-formed opinions dictate how you absorb information, and anything that contradicts that gets ignored, or twisted in to something that supports your pre-formed opinions.
Is there a point with you asking me why I have two post here, and does it matter or change anything?
Asmongold literarily shows this content on stream....Why are you basing points in a discussion off assumptions that don't add anything to the conversation.
I understand things perfectly well, Also understand you don't look at things from other people's perspectives, and then you make some weird assumptions which again have nothing to do with the actual conversation at hand.
Both your post here are literarily to sleight me in an underhanded insult
1. Saying I don't read post / accept the view point you have since you deem it more logical even if it's not something I agree with.
2. Questioning why I'm posting twice when you literarily don't know what I have going on where there was 0 reason to even bring that into question.
How you design a game will have an impact on how players play the game, this is reason why I think many big companies should have an impact on ones spiritual growth. Competition leads to toxicism in gaming as we can see how gaming era changed from 90s to 2020s. WoWs downfall is creating theme park MMOs that forces player to play for reward, giving more conveniences made people more spoiled and making game overly competitive.
Also I want to give my opinion to theme park progression vs sandbox is that theme park MMOs create impatience thus is another failure of devs creating game for players, because I see games as books, writers should be careful what they write the same way devs should be careful as what he is creating (if he wants the good for community at least in his game)
Many ''bad'' things are connected to being wise in gaming such as not having competitive modes like dmg meters, the same way one that is poor and gets wise... Both are hard and bad, but have good results.
How you design a game will have an impact on how players play the game, this is reason why I think many big companies should have an impact on ones spiritual growth. Competition leads to toxicism in gaming as we can see how gaming era changed from 90s to 2020s. WoWs downfall is creating theme park MMOs that forces player to play for reward, giving more conveniences made people more spoiled and making game overly competitive.
Also I want to give my opinion to theme park progression vs sandbox is that theme park MMOs create impatience thus is another failure of devs creating game for players, because I see games as books, writers should be careful what they write the same way devs should be careful as what he is creating (if he wants the good for community at least in his game)
Many ''bad'' things are connected to being wise in gaming such as not having competitive modes like dmg meters, the same way one that is poor and gets wise... Both are hard and bad, but have good results.
Alternately, you could assume that before, the audiences for the games weren't the sort of spoiled people you are talking about, and the playerbase was smaller.
Then WoW created and added to a game where convenience was common and the optimal strategy was to care about others less, allowed a lot more spoiled people to enjoy the game, and the playerbase got larger and changed demographically.
I've never personally met anyone who started 'nice' and turned 'spoiled' due to game mechanics, though I'm sure they exist.
There are definitely people who claim they are not, until you learn more about them.
Since this thread is practically the 'off topic forum' sometimes, have fun.
I've never personally met anyone who started 'nice' and turned 'spoiled' due to game mechanics, though I'm sure they exist.
I have - sort of.
In most games, I have alts in MMO's that my guild doesn't know about (for various reasons). More than once I have joined a group run by a guild member in games with automatic group forming systems, only to see that these people that are usually quite nice people are actually just the same as everyone else running a group in this automated grouping system.
So, to me, it isn't so much about nice people turning spoiled, it is more about people behaving as their situation dictates. if the situation is that players are disposable, then players are disposable.
DPS meters shouldn't exist as AoC seems like it'll harbor the ability for players to really personalize their build for their playstyle that they want, and with something like a DPS meter there would eventually be a meta and the toxicity would start flooding in. DPS meters always harbor toxicity.
omg, one more guy ho cry that "DPS meters bring toxic in game"....
Dps\Hps meters give you much more power to scale your build so its MUST be 1000000% in mmo.
Another question is whether the information from these meters would be public or not. In terms of the head of Intrepid Studios being a fan of Lineage2 (there is no game more toxic than Lineage. And let's close the subject of toxicity I beg you, in mmo should not play people who can be offended if they are told that they are trash.) i'm sure that most things in the game associated with the character will be conditionally non-public as well as in Lineage, so the report / statistic of the battle will probably not be public.
For me personally, as I have written many times in this thread. Battle report tools must be in mmo game, without them the life of a leader of the group/clan/raid becomes hell, as it is very difficult to understand in more detail where and who makes mistakes, or does not perform their task at all, the most basic tool dps / hps meter can help improve the build, and in case someone in the group clearly become ballast, help him sort out this problem
You don't need a dps meter to improve your build game has a combat log. It should be clear if someone is not doing anything constantly, and if someone is not preforming to your liking its simply because you want to kick them and don't believe they can improve on their own without you yelling at them.
Only reason you want a dps meter is so you can stat pad for no reason in a game that isnt designed for a dps meter.
I don't understand your term "game that isnt designed for a dps meter", what is this bullshit?
the game can't be made for the dps meter... do you even understand what a "metric" is?
Metrics in any form can be applied to any numerical source (and not only numerical, but we are talking about them at the moment). So what the hell are you talking about?
Often dps/hps meters are just based on the combat log, so if there is a combat log it is very easy to make a simple dps meter.
As for the fact that dps counters are often used to show off to others, that has its place, and that is often what is used, but if one is truly better than others and trying harder than others, then why not, I personally don't care.
Personally for me it is important that the game would have an api, or advanced combat log, for example WoW (https://www.warcraftlogs.com), go and see if you never faced with what should look like an analysis of combat, and I need it in order to improve my team, who heals whom, to see who hits whom and when, in order to understand what targets my DD focus, etc.
AoC is not world of warcraft, game is not based on instanced dungeons it is open world.
You can use combat log and test your damage there and find out what you have that is effective or not.
You might not care but it just shows how pointless DPs meters are, and makes people care more about numbers than understanding what is actually going on. You literarily do not need it nor is it a necessity, the combat log will do that plenty for you in viewing your damage.
No one wants you viewing their logs, it is not important you literarily just want that to flex when half of it is pointless be it rng, people stacking, or people just ignoring mechanics to push numbers while their team dies.
I'd really temper what u expect out of a PvX mmorpg compared to WoW that is focused on instanced dungeons where you can't be pvped in...
Man, WoW have pvp arenas and bgs, i personaly last time played wow play at arena and i need thear dps meter (details addon), bc i need to see рow much damage each of my skills did, and from what sources and how much damage I received.
for exemple
And stop saying that no one needs it. Just because you don't need it doesn't mean others don't need it.
And your argument that there is no temporary dungeons, bullshit, it does not matter where you get the report in the open world or in a temporary dungeon, you get the report after the last battle, even if you fought a bug near the city
Asmongold literarily shows this content on stream....
He literally doesn't.
Again, if this is what you think top end PvE in an MMORPG is, you simply do not know what top end content in an MMORPG is.
I'm not sure how I can be more clear on this matter.
Again you are being disrespectful in order for you to continue to say slights like
1. You do not know end game content
You clearly saw and wrote your post and saw mine talking about logs and the site, what are you getting being dishonest on a forum with my post talking about logs?
This is why I'm saying I'm getting flash backs from the other thread, you are removing logic from post and trying to change the narrative.
This is why you keep having issues with tons of people on forums as people can tell simply from your messages. There is not a wanting to understand them its what you think or creating that narrative since you don't give them respect or care what they are saying, you are more concerned with your own thoughts.
DPS meters shouldn't exist as AoC seems like it'll harbor the ability for players to really personalize their build for their playstyle that they want, and with something like a DPS meter there would eventually be a meta and the toxicity would start flooding in. DPS meters always harbor toxicity.
omg, one more guy ho cry that "DPS meters bring toxic in game"....
Dps\Hps meters give you much more power to scale your build so its MUST be 1000000% in mmo.
Another question is whether the information from these meters would be public or not. In terms of the head of Intrepid Studios being a fan of Lineage2 (there is no game more toxic than Lineage. And let's close the subject of toxicity I beg you, in mmo should not play people who can be offended if they are told that they are trash.) i'm sure that most things in the game associated with the character will be conditionally non-public as well as in Lineage, so the report / statistic of the battle will probably not be public.
For me personally, as I have written many times in this thread. Battle report tools must be in mmo game, without them the life of a leader of the group/clan/raid becomes hell, as it is very difficult to understand in more detail where and who makes mistakes, or does not perform their task at all, the most basic tool dps / hps meter can help improve the build, and in case someone in the group clearly become ballast, help him sort out this problem
You don't need a dps meter to improve your build game has a combat log. It should be clear if someone is not doing anything constantly, and if someone is not preforming to your liking its simply because you want to kick them and don't believe they can improve on their own without you yelling at them.
Only reason you want a dps meter is so you can stat pad for no reason in a game that isnt designed for a dps meter.
I don't understand your term "game that isnt designed for a dps meter", what is this bullshit?
the game can't be made for the dps meter... do you even understand what a "metric" is?
Metrics in any form can be applied to any numerical source (and not only numerical, but we are talking about them at the moment). So what the hell are you talking about?
Often dps/hps meters are just based on the combat log, so if there is a combat log it is very easy to make a simple dps meter.
As for the fact that dps counters are often used to show off to others, that has its place, and that is often what is used, but if one is truly better than others and trying harder than others, then why not, I personally don't care.
Personally for me it is important that the game would have an api, or advanced combat log, for example WoW (https://www.warcraftlogs.com), go and see if you never faced with what should look like an analysis of combat, and I need it in order to improve my team, who heals whom, to see who hits whom and when, in order to understand what targets my DD focus, etc.
AoC is not world of warcraft, game is not based on instanced dungeons it is open world.
You can use combat log and test your damage there and find out what you have that is effective or not.
You might not care but it just shows how pointless DPs meters are, and makes people care more about numbers than understanding what is actually going on. You literarily do not need it nor is it a necessity, the combat log will do that plenty for you in viewing your damage.
No one wants you viewing their logs, it is not important you literarily just want that to flex when half of it is pointless be it rng, people stacking, or people just ignoring mechanics to push numbers while their team dies.
I'd really temper what u expect out of a PvX mmorpg compared to WoW that is focused on instanced dungeons where you can't be pvped in...
Man, WoW have pvp arenas and bgs, i personaly last time played wow play at arena and i need thear dps meter (details addon), bc i need to see рow much damage each of my skills did, and from what sources and how much damage I received.
for exemple
And stop saying that no one needs it. Just because you don't need it doesn't mean others don't need it.
And your argument that there is no temporary dungeons, bullshit, it does not matter where you get the report in the open world or in a temporary dungeon, you get the report after the last battle, even if you fought a bug near the city
Nothing should be connected as far as it should go only thing that you should be viewing things is with your combat log. Which means no scanning other players, nor uploading things to websites to view players as well and making that easier.
If you want to know your damage, spend time being social talking to people and working on your build. You will get the same results in understanding your damage with some effort. Those charts mean nothing for the very reason people will min max for themselves than actually worry about what they need to do with the content at hand to be successful. You could be doing 30% less damage and clearing content faster you don't need a dps meter to simply know your damage.
Not to mention again like i stated before the toxic elements that come with it and people thinking the DPS is more important than clearly content correctly, or simply being toxic to others.
DPS meters shouldn't exist as AoC seems like it'll harbor the ability for players to really personalize their build for their playstyle that they want, and with something like a DPS meter there would eventually be a meta and the toxicity would start flooding in. DPS meters always harbor toxicity.
omg, one more guy ho cry that "DPS meters bring toxic in game"....
Dps\Hps meters give you much more power to scale your build so its MUST be 1000000% in mmo.
Another question is whether the information from these meters would be public or not. In terms of the head of Intrepid Studios being a fan of Lineage2 (there is no game more toxic than Lineage. And let's close the subject of toxicity I beg you, in mmo should not play people who can be offended if they are told that they are trash.) i'm sure that most things in the game associated with the character will be conditionally non-public as well as in Lineage, so the report / statistic of the battle will probably not be public.
For me personally, as I have written many times in this thread. Battle report tools must be in mmo game, without them the life of a leader of the group/clan/raid becomes hell, as it is very difficult to understand in more detail where and who makes mistakes, or does not perform their task at all, the most basic tool dps / hps meter can help improve the build, and in case someone in the group clearly become ballast, help him sort out this problem
You don't need a dps meter to improve your build game has a combat log. It should be clear if someone is not doing anything constantly, and if someone is not preforming to your liking its simply because you want to kick them and don't believe they can improve on their own without you yelling at them.
Only reason you want a dps meter is so you can stat pad for no reason in a game that isnt designed for a dps meter.
I don't understand your term "game that isnt designed for a dps meter", what is this bullshit?
the game can't be made for the dps meter... do you even understand what a "metric" is?
Metrics in any form can be applied to any numerical source (and not only numerical, but we are talking about them at the moment). So what the hell are you talking about?
Often dps/hps meters are just based on the combat log, so if there is a combat log it is very easy to make a simple dps meter.
As for the fact that dps counters are often used to show off to others, that has its place, and that is often what is used, but if one is truly better than others and trying harder than others, then why not, I personally don't care.
Personally for me it is important that the game would have an api, or advanced combat log, for example WoW (https://www.warcraftlogs.com), go and see if you never faced with what should look like an analysis of combat, and I need it in order to improve my team, who heals whom, to see who hits whom and when, in order to understand what targets my DD focus, etc.
AoC is not world of warcraft, game is not based on instanced dungeons it is open world.
You can use combat log and test your damage there and find out what you have that is effective or not.
You might not care but it just shows how pointless DPs meters are, and makes people care more about numbers than understanding what is actually going on. You literarily do not need it nor is it a necessity, the combat log will do that plenty for you in viewing your damage.
No one wants you viewing their logs, it is not important you literarily just want that to flex when half of it is pointless be it rng, people stacking, or people just ignoring mechanics to push numbers while their team dies.
I'd really temper what u expect out of a PvX mmorpg compared to WoW that is focused on instanced dungeons where you can't be pvped in...
Man, WoW have pvp arenas and bgs, i personaly last time played wow play at arena and i need thear dps meter (details addon), bc i need to see рow much damage each of my skills did, and from what sources and how much damage I received.
for exemple
And stop saying that no one needs it. Just because you don't need it doesn't mean others don't need it.
And your argument that there is no temporary dungeons, bullshit, it does not matter where you get the report in the open world or in a temporary dungeon, you get the report after the last battle, even if you fought a bug near the city
Nothing should be connected as far as it should go only thing that you should be viewing things is with your combat log. Which means no scanning other players, nor uploading things to websites to view players as well and making that easier.
If you want to know your damage, spend time being social talking to people and working on your build. You will get the same results in understanding your damage with some effort. Those charts mean nothing for the very reason people will min max for themselves than actually worry about what they need to do with the content at hand to be successful. You could be doing 30% less damage and clearing content faster you don't need a dps meter to simply know your damage.
Not to mention again like i stated before the toxic elements that come with it and people thinking the DPS is more important than clearly content correctly, or simply being toxic to others.
Ok, I think we no longer need to have a dialogue with each other, because I see that you do not really know what you are talking about, and have too little experience in mmo and/or played at too low a level (this is my subjective opinion, I do not know you but that's how I see it).
"Nothing should be connected as far as it should go only thing that you should be viewing things is with your combat log. Which means no scanning other players, nor uploading things to websites to view players as well and making that easier."
What makes you think it SHOULD be like that? That's not for you to decide. Just because you feel like it doesn't mean it has to be.
DPS meters shouldn't exist as AoC seems like it'll harbor the ability for players to really personalize their build for their playstyle that they want, and with something like a DPS meter there would eventually be a meta and the toxicity would start flooding in. DPS meters always harbor toxicity.
omg, one more guy ho cry that "DPS meters bring toxic in game"....
Dps\Hps meters give you much more power to scale your build so its MUST be 1000000% in mmo.
Another question is whether the information from these meters would be public or not. In terms of the head of Intrepid Studios being a fan of Lineage2 (there is no game more toxic than Lineage. And let's close the subject of toxicity I beg you, in mmo should not play people who can be offended if they are told that they are trash.) i'm sure that most things in the game associated with the character will be conditionally non-public as well as in Lineage, so the report / statistic of the battle will probably not be public.
For me personally, as I have written many times in this thread. Battle report tools must be in mmo game, without them the life of a leader of the group/clan/raid becomes hell, as it is very difficult to understand in more detail where and who makes mistakes, or does not perform their task at all, the most basic tool dps / hps meter can help improve the build, and in case someone in the group clearly become ballast, help him sort out this problem
You don't need a dps meter to improve your build game has a combat log. It should be clear if someone is not doing anything constantly, and if someone is not preforming to your liking its simply because you want to kick them and don't believe they can improve on their own without you yelling at them.
Only reason you want a dps meter is so you can stat pad for no reason in a game that isnt designed for a dps meter.
I don't understand your term "game that isnt designed for a dps meter", what is this bullshit?
the game can't be made for the dps meter... do you even understand what a "metric" is?
Metrics in any form can be applied to any numerical source (and not only numerical, but we are talking about them at the moment). So what the hell are you talking about?
Often dps/hps meters are just based on the combat log, so if there is a combat log it is very easy to make a simple dps meter.
As for the fact that dps counters are often used to show off to others, that has its place, and that is often what is used, but if one is truly better than others and trying harder than others, then why not, I personally don't care.
Personally for me it is important that the game would have an api, or advanced combat log, for example WoW (https://www.warcraftlogs.com), go and see if you never faced with what should look like an analysis of combat, and I need it in order to improve my team, who heals whom, to see who hits whom and when, in order to understand what targets my DD focus, etc.
AoC is not world of warcraft, game is not based on instanced dungeons it is open world.
You can use combat log and test your damage there and find out what you have that is effective or not.
You might not care but it just shows how pointless DPs meters are, and makes people care more about numbers than understanding what is actually going on. You literarily do not need it nor is it a necessity, the combat log will do that plenty for you in viewing your damage.
No one wants you viewing their logs, it is not important you literarily just want that to flex when half of it is pointless be it rng, people stacking, or people just ignoring mechanics to push numbers while their team dies.
I'd really temper what u expect out of a PvX mmorpg compared to WoW that is focused on instanced dungeons where you can't be pvped in...
Man, WoW have pvp arenas and bgs, i personaly last time played wow play at arena and i need thear dps meter (details addon), bc i need to see рow much damage each of my skills did, and from what sources and how much damage I received.
for exemple
And stop saying that no one needs it. Just because you don't need it doesn't mean others don't need it.
And your argument that there is no temporary dungeons, bullshit, it does not matter where you get the report in the open world or in a temporary dungeon, you get the report after the last battle, even if you fought a bug near the city
Nothing should be connected as far as it should go only thing that you should be viewing things is with your combat log. Which means no scanning other players, nor uploading things to websites to view players as well and making that easier.
If you want to know your damage, spend time being social talking to people and working on your build. You will get the same results in understanding your damage with some effort. Those charts mean nothing for the very reason people will min max for themselves than actually worry about what they need to do with the content at hand to be successful. You could be doing 30% less damage and clearing content faster you don't need a dps meter to simply know your damage.
Not to mention again like i stated before the toxic elements that come with it and people thinking the DPS is more important than clearly content correctly, or simply being toxic to others.
Ok, I think we no longer need to have a dialogue with each other, because I see that you do not really know what you are talking about, and have too little experience in mmo and/or played at too low a level (this is my subjective opinion, I do not know you but that's how I see it).
"Nothing should be connected as far as it should go only thing that you should be viewing things is with your combat log. Which means no scanning other players, nor uploading things to websites to view players as well and making that easier."
What makes you think it SHOULD be like that? That's not for you to decide. Just because you feel like it doesn't mean it has to be.
A lot of damn people don't want you reading their information on a website is what. Majority of people on here are completely against that....
This is why I'm saying I'm getting flash backs from the other thread, you are removing logic from post and trying to change the narrative.
I'm the one removing logic and trying to change the narrative?
You're the one posting that you understand top end PvE because you have watched a streamer that streams mid tier PvE at best.
That makes you either an idiot or dishonest (going with dishonest, but not entirely sure), and is absolutely an attempt to alter not just the narrative, but the paradigm of what top end content is.
You need to stop and realize that everything you think you know about PvE in MMO's is actually taking place one level below what you thought. There is an entire other level above all of what you know (all of what you have seen others participate in) that you just straight up aren't even aware of existing.
It's kind of like if you were talking about top end PvP as being castle sieges, but in was talking about it as being Runescapes wilderness, but thinking that was the pinnacle of MMO PvP because insaw it on a stream.
You're the one posting that you understand top end PvE because you have watched a streamer that streams mid tier PvE at best.
Mid Tier of a PvE lot of people are watching the world first race when it began to be streamed 4 years ago (began with legion) . . . And on a game where you literally spam the tries until you win the fight (they do anything else to get stuff in heroic mod mostly before... going back to the progress). Which is the most played high end PvE (WoW/FFXIV being this way, so does LA with abrelshud) But not the kind of high end we will have on ashes. (maybe i mistake but... no "spam try" avaible for ashes)
making it even more sad to speak "high end PvE" based on what was shown on asmongold stream...
(and watching stream does not relate the full reality of what imply to do high end. )
How can you properly lead a difficult raid as a group leader or guild leader if you cannot see where your shortcomings are coming from... Is it a heal issue, a damage issue, a cleansing issue? Do you not have enough healers or enough dps?
These are all things that are essential for a proper MMORPG.
Yes, your going to have your sweaties, but your going to have your sweaties in every game you play.
Many people thoroughly enjoy getting everything you can dps wise out of your character or maximizing your healing throughput, etc.
Otherwise your going to have a guessing game and failing on multiple bosses multiple times in random pug groups because you don't know whos slacking or not paying attention. Which is going to cause you to get pissed off, and not queue or join pug groups because the experience sucks.
It's 100% OK for people to judge you based on your performance.
All you have to do is not tie gearscore or saved metrics that other people can see.
Say you suck at damage one raid and get kicked out. Well now you use that as a learning experience for next time. Join another raid and have practiced on a training dummy your rotation for next time.
As long as group leaders can't see that you've never done the raid before, etc, then your fine. Self improvement is a must in an MMORPG, especially one that wants a robust raiding scene.
This is why I'm saying I'm getting flash backs from the other thread, you are removing logic from post and trying to change the narrative.
I'm the one removing logic and trying to change the narrative?
You're the one posting that you understand top end PvE because you have watched a streamer that streams mid tier PvE at best.
That makes you either an idiot or dishonest (going with dishonest, but not entirely sure), and is absolutely an attempt to alter not just the narrative, but the paradigm of what top end content is.
You need to stop and realize that everything you think you know about PvE in MMO's is actually taking place one level below what you thought. There is an entire other level above all of what you know (all of what you have seen others participate in) that you just straight up aren't even aware of existing.
It's kind of like if you were talking about top end PvP as being castle sieges, but in was talking about it as being Runescapes wilderness, but thinking that was the pinnacle of MMO PvP because insaw it on a stream.
I can repeat my points you are adding things not said in a conversation and trying to use it as fact.
1. You gain nothing from lying about me saying I was talking about any clips of end game
2. The conversation was about the website that was referenced which is pretty clear as that was what my comment directly talked about.
3. No one mentioned anything about end game pve the talk is about dps meters and the site.
You again are being dishonest about the conversation and continuing to insult on the forums which is a common pattern for you against people that don't agree with you. Leading to toxic comments in relation to you.
You're the one posting that you understand top end PvE because you have watched a streamer that streams mid tier PvE at best.
Mid Tier of a PvE lot of people are watching the world first race when it began to be streamed 4 years ago (began with legion) . . . And on a game where you literally spam the tries until you win the fight (they do anything else to get stuff in heroic mod mostly before... going back to the progress). Which is the most played high end PvE (WoW/FFXIV being this way, so does LA with abrelshud) But not the kind of high end we will have on ashes. (maybe i mistake but... no "spam try" avaible for ashes)
making it even more sad to speak "high end PvE" based on what was shown on asmongold stream...
(and watching stream does not relate the full reality of what imply to do high end. )
Who is talking about asmongold showing end game raiding in this post, if you're saying it's me talking about end game raiding, please reference a quote.
If you are using a reference of me talking about asmongold with wow tracker site as it was referenced to me, then I'm wondering if you are talking to someone else talking about pve end game raiding and who.
1. You gain nothing from lying about me saying I was talking about any clips of end game
2. The conversation was about the website that was referenced which is pretty clear as that was what my comment directly talked about.
3. No one mentioned anything about end game pve the talk is about dps meters and the site.
Point 1, I didn't say you were talking about clips of end game content, I said you were talking about clips of mid-tier content that you mistook for end game content.
Asmongold literarily shows this content on stream....Why are you basing points in a discussion off assumptions that don't add anything to the conversation.
This was your justification for why you know end game content. Because Asmon shows it on Stream. Except he doesn't - you just think that what he shows on stream is end game.
Point 2, the conversation is not about that website, you are just trying to make it about that website. WoWlog was only linked as an example of a combat tracker, not as an example of what people here are asking for. In 183 pages of this thread, no one has said they want WoWlogs style trackers, people are asking for either local trackers (ACT) or have Intrepid set up trackers in game.
You are just trying to turn the conversation to WoWlogs because someone mentioned it, and you know there will be a number of people that are all for one or the other of the options actually desired, but who would be against WoWlogs (I am included in this group, I do not want to see WoWlogs style trackers in Ashes). Basically, someone mentioned a thing, and now you are trying to say that the thing is what the discussion is about purely because that suits your argument better.
And you want to call me dishonest.
Point 3, end game PvE has been a consistent throughout this thread, as the discussion has often been based on the notion that a combat tracker is not needed at all for low end content, nor even mid tier content. It is top end content where a combat tracker is at it's most useful (in regards to it's content based functionality). The notion of top end PvE content is more salient and more present in this thread that WoWlogs - the site you are erroneously trying to say the discussion is about.
The only reason I insult you is because you deserve it. Stop posting stupid things like "this 183 page discussion is about the thing that was first mentioned at the end of the last page", and maybe - just maybe - it would stop.
That said, there are a lot of things you do and say that are "like" the above, so there is a lot you would need to change.
I just want a way to know If I did better this time than last time.
Even like a smiley or frowney face.
Doesn't need to be a number. This could apply for anything healing, cc, player saves, dispells, etc.
ff14 bans them but people wtill use them. I think you should do the same and heavily discourage them while providing another system that does a similar thing.
1. You gain nothing from lying about me saying I was talking about any clips of end game
2. The conversation was about the website that was referenced which is pretty clear as that was what my comment directly talked about.
3. No one mentioned anything about end game pve the talk is about dps meters and the site.
Point 1, I didn't say you were talking about clips of end game content, I said you were talking about clips of mid-tier content that you mistook for end game content.
Asmongold literarily shows this content on stream....Why are you basing points in a discussion off assumptions that don't add anything to the conversation.
This was your justification for why you know end game content. Because Asmon shows it on Stream. Except he doesn't - you just think that what he shows on stream is end game.
Point 2, the conversation is not about that website, you are just trying to make it about that website. WoWlog was only linked as an example of a combat tracker, not as an example of what people here are asking for. In 183 pages of this thread, no one has said they want WoWlogs style trackers, people are asking for either local trackers (ACT) or have Intrepid set up trackers in game.
You are just trying to turn the conversation to WoWlogs because someone mentioned it, and you know there will be a number of people that are all for one or the other of the options actually desired, but who would be against WoWlogs (I am included in this group, I do not want to see WoWlogs style trackers in Ashes). Basically, someone mentioned a thing, and now you are trying to say that the thing is what the discussion is about purely because that suits your argument better.
And you want to call me dishonest.
Point 3, end game PvE has been a consistent throughout this thread, as the discussion has often been based on the notion that a combat tracker is not needed at all for low end content, nor even mid tier content. It is top end content where a combat tracker is at it's most useful (in regards to it's content based functionality). The notion of top end PvE content is more salient and more present in this thread that WoWlogs - the site you are erroneously trying to say the discussion is about.
The only reason I insult you is because you deserve it. Stop posting stupid things like "this 183 page discussion is about the thing that was first mentioned at the end of the last page", and maybe - just maybe - it would stop.
That said, there are a lot of things you do and say that are "like" the above, so there is a lot you would need to change.
You jump in a discussion im having with someone else and quote me and you talk about wowlogs in it why are you continuing to lie again on the forums. You are fully aware of the discussion at with him and you talking about wow logs. And nothing of me mentioning PvE content, end, mid or low tier in any of my comments as clearly the topic was wowlogs.
1. you did this i order to try to insult me as i have stated before
You are being quoted and the discussion is about wowlogs you are talking about logs, I honestly could careless what you think about WoW content. I NEVER TALKED ABOUT PVE RAID CONTENT IN A VIDEO.
You are assuming weird things, changing the topic and trying to put words in my mouth as well as again doing your pattern of insults.
The only reason I insult you is because you deserve it. Stop posting stupid things like "this 183 page discussion is about the thing that was first mentioned at the end of the last page", and maybe - just maybe - it would stop.
That said, there are a lot of things you do and say that are "like" the above, so there is a lot you would need to change.
I deserve to be insulted for having different opinions than you from you are putting words in my mouth on something that is currently not being talked about as we are talking about wow logs.
You are being quoted and the discussion is about wowlogs
See, to you it is about WoWlogs the site, to the person you are discussing with, it is about combat logs in general, WoWlogs just happens to be the one they are using now and so is what they are using as an example.
The only person that thinks the discussion you two are having is specifically about WoWlogs rather than combat logs in general is you. That is why I pointed that out to you.
The only reason I insult you is because you deserve it. Stop posting stupid things like "this 183 page discussion is about the thing that was first mentioned at the end of the last page", and maybe - just maybe - it would stop.
That said, there are a lot of things you do and say that are "like" the above, so there is a lot you would need to change.
I deserve to be insulted for having different opinions than you from you.
NiKr has different opinions to me on almost every topic, yet you dont see me insulting him (not even the mild jabs that dont actually count as insults that are all you get).
The reason you get those small jabs is because of the way you argue, not because of the opinions you have. It's the same reason I used to always have jabs at Dygz - his discussion style was unconductive to actually having a discussion.
So is yours. You cant make claims like "Asmon literally shows this content on stream" and then also say
If someone misunderstood what you meant when you talked about the content Asmon showed in his videos, dont cry like a 12 year old about it (the all caps above is crying like a 12 year old). Rather, grow up and simply accept that you were not clear in what you originally said, and clarify your statement.
Just keep in mind, if your clarification doesnt make sense - if it seems like you are trying to alter what you said - you will be called out for it.
You are being quoted and the discussion is about wowlogs
See, to you it is about WoWlogs the site, to the person you are discussing with, it is about combat logs in general, WoWlogs just happens to be the one they are using now and so is what they are using as an example.
The only person that thinks the discussion you two are having is specifically about WoWlogs rather than combat logs in general is you. That is why I pointed that out to you.
The only reason I insult you is because you deserve it. Stop posting stupid things like "this 183 page discussion is about the thing that was first mentioned at the end of the last page", and maybe - just maybe - it would stop.
That said, there are a lot of things you do and say that are "like" the above, so there is a lot you would need to change.
I deserve to be insulted for having different opinions than you from you.
NiKr has different opinions to me on almost every topic, yet you dont see me insulting him (not even the mild jabs that dont actually count as insults that are all you get).
The reason you get those small jabs is because of the way you argue, not because of the opinions you have. It's the same reason I used to always have jabs at Dygz - his discussion style was unconductive to actually having a discussion.
So is yours. You cant make claims like "Asmon literally shows this content on stream" and then also say
If someone misunderstood what you meant when you talked about the content Asmon showed in his videos, dont cry like a 12 year old about it (the all caps above is crying like a 12 year old). Rather, grow up and simply accept that you were not clear in what you originally said, and clarify your statement.
Just keep in mind, if your clarification doesnt make sense - if it seems like you are trying to alter what you said - you will be called out for it.
You just love to keep just going with the insults I see, It is in all caps so you can read it. If you can't understand the conversation going on you shouldn't chime in on it unless you are well of aware of what is being discussed.
You were perfectly aware we are talking about the wow log site as it was linked, there was 0 mention of any eng game anything and you went on to assume so you could attempt to insult as usual.
This is exactly why you can't quote nor listen to the discussion at hand. You are being called out for making up dialogue and attempting to put it in my mouth to insult.
My post was clear as was the conversation there is 0 reason for me to start talking about end game raiding when we are literarily talking about DPs meters.
Every Post I see from you is literarily trying to insult me on a topic that we were not even talking about in this forum post. Perhaps if you stopped trying to argue with everyone and getting different threads mixed up and listened you would understand what people are talking about better.
Next time read the post and stay on topic, rather than attempting to use every post to sling insults and passive aggressive comments, you are an adult act like one.
You just love to keep just going with the insults I see
There were no insults (nor even any jabs) in the post you quoted.
I am perfectly aware you wanted to talk about the WoWlogs site, as it was linked, I am also aware that the person that linked it was using it as a general example rather than a specific example, which is why I specifically said no one is asking for that kind of thing in Ashes.
You could perhaps note that I never stopped you from talking about it with the poster that bought it up, nor would I be able to if I wanted. All I am able to do is what I did - point out that it is not what is being asked for by anyone in this thread.
If you want to make the representation that it is, then I will again remind you (and those reading) that it is not what is being asked for.
In the same way I can not stop you from discussing WoWlogs with the poster that bought it up (who seems somewhat uninterested in getting in to a discussion with you), you can not stop me from pointing the above out.
As to your comments about not talking about top end PvE raiding - the entire thread is about combat trackers, with is a subsection of top end PvE raiding as a topic in and of itself. That is like trying to say you are talking about PvP in a game, but are not interested at all about talking about the classes in that game. The two are intrinsically intertwined, you can not have a discussion about one without the other.
However, if you insist you are not talking about top end PvE content, what exactly is it you are talking about here?
Comments
At this point, I have to restate my claim that you do not know what a combat tracker is or does.
You realize he is linking wow logs while you make this statement, right?
So you are assuming what I'm saying is a tracker tracks you on a website, because if you are assuming that you are giving me HEAVY flashbacks to another thread. Removing logic form my point for weird reasons.
Yeah, as an example of combat analysis.
Why did you reply to one post using two posts?
No, I'm saying you probably saw a link to WoWlogs and didnt bother looking at the context.
I mean, you have a long history of not reading before you reply - or at least not understanding. You let your pre-formed opinions dictate how you absorb information, and anything that contradicts that gets ignored, or twisted in to something that supports your pre-formed opinions.
Is there a point with you asking me why I have two post here, and does it matter or change anything?
Asmongold literarily shows this content on stream....Why are you basing points in a discussion off assumptions that don't add anything to the conversation.
I understand things perfectly well, Also understand you don't look at things from other people's perspectives, and then you make some weird assumptions which again have nothing to do with the actual conversation at hand.
Both your post here are literarily to sleight me in an underhanded insult
1. Saying I don't read post / accept the view point you have since you deem it more logical even if it's not something I agree with.
2. Questioning why I'm posting twice when you literarily don't know what I have going on where there was 0 reason to even bring that into question.
Also I want to give my opinion to theme park progression vs sandbox is that theme park MMOs create impatience thus is another failure of devs creating game for players, because I see games as books, writers should be careful what they write the same way devs should be careful as what he is creating (if he wants the good for community at least in his game)
Many ''bad'' things are connected to being wise in gaming such as not having competitive modes like dmg meters, the same way one that is poor and gets wise... Both are hard and bad, but have good results.
Alternately, you could assume that before, the audiences for the games weren't the sort of spoiled people you are talking about, and the playerbase was smaller.
Then WoW created and added to a game where convenience was common and the optimal strategy was to care about others less, allowed a lot more spoiled people to enjoy the game, and the playerbase got larger and changed demographically.
I've never personally met anyone who started 'nice' and turned 'spoiled' due to game mechanics, though I'm sure they exist.
There are definitely people who claim they are not, until you learn more about them.
Since this thread is practically the 'off topic forum' sometimes, have fun.
He literally doesn't.
Again, if this is what you think top end PvE in an MMORPG is, you simply do not know what top end content in an MMORPG is.
I'm not sure how I can be more clear on this matter.
A true prophet would post it on the first page
In most games, I have alts in MMO's that my guild doesn't know about (for various reasons). More than once I have joined a group run by a guild member in games with automatic group forming systems, only to see that these people that are usually quite nice people are actually just the same as everyone else running a group in this automated grouping system.
So, to me, it isn't so much about nice people turning spoiled, it is more about people behaving as their situation dictates. if the situation is that players are disposable, then players are disposable.
Man, WoW have pvp arenas and bgs, i personaly last time played wow play at arena and i need thear dps meter (details addon), bc i need to see рow much damage each of my skills did, and from what sources and how much damage I received.
for exemple
And stop saying that no one needs it. Just because you don't need it doesn't mean others don't need it.
And your argument that there is no temporary dungeons, bullshit, it does not matter where you get the report in the open world or in a temporary dungeon, you get the report after the last battle, even if you fought a bug near the city
Again you are being disrespectful in order for you to continue to say slights like
1. You do not know end game content
You clearly saw and wrote your post and saw mine talking about logs and the site, what are you getting being dishonest on a forum with my post talking about logs?
This is why I'm saying I'm getting flash backs from the other thread, you are removing logic from post and trying to change the narrative.
This is why you keep having issues with tons of people on forums as people can tell simply from your messages. There is not a wanting to understand them its what you think or creating that narrative since you don't give them respect or care what they are saying, you are more concerned with your own thoughts.
Nothing should be connected as far as it should go only thing that you should be viewing things is with your combat log. Which means no scanning other players, nor uploading things to websites to view players as well and making that easier.
If you want to know your damage, spend time being social talking to people and working on your build. You will get the same results in understanding your damage with some effort. Those charts mean nothing for the very reason people will min max for themselves than actually worry about what they need to do with the content at hand to be successful. You could be doing 30% less damage and clearing content faster you don't need a dps meter to simply know your damage.
Not to mention again like i stated before the toxic elements that come with it and people thinking the DPS is more important than clearly content correctly, or simply being toxic to others.
Ok, I think we no longer need to have a dialogue with each other, because I see that you do not really know what you are talking about, and have too little experience in mmo and/or played at too low a level (this is my subjective opinion, I do not know you but that's how I see it).
"Nothing should be connected as far as it should go only thing that you should be viewing things is with your combat log. Which means no scanning other players, nor uploading things to websites to view players as well and making that easier."
What makes you think it SHOULD be like that? That's not for you to decide. Just because you feel like it doesn't mean it has to be.
A lot of damn people don't want you reading their information on a website is what. Majority of people on here are completely against that....
Also, The devs stance...
You're the one posting that you understand top end PvE because you have watched a streamer that streams mid tier PvE at best.
That makes you either an idiot or dishonest (going with dishonest, but not entirely sure), and is absolutely an attempt to alter not just the narrative, but the paradigm of what top end content is.
You need to stop and realize that everything you think you know about PvE in MMO's is actually taking place one level below what you thought. There is an entire other level above all of what you know (all of what you have seen others participate in) that you just straight up aren't even aware of existing.
It's kind of like if you were talking about top end PvP as being castle sieges, but in was talking about it as being Runescapes wilderness, but thinking that was the pinnacle of MMO PvP because insaw it on a stream.
Mid Tier of a PvE lot of people are watching the world first race when it began to be streamed 4 years ago (began with legion) . . . And on a game where you literally spam the tries until you win the fight (they do anything else to get stuff in heroic mod mostly before... going back to the progress). Which is the most played high end PvE (WoW/FFXIV being this way, so does LA with abrelshud) But not the kind of high end we will have on ashes. (maybe i mistake but... no "spam try" avaible for ashes)
making it even more sad to speak "high end PvE" based on what was shown on asmongold stream...
(and watching stream does not relate the full reality of what imply to do high end. )
How can you properly lead a difficult raid as a group leader or guild leader if you cannot see where your shortcomings are coming from... Is it a heal issue, a damage issue, a cleansing issue? Do you not have enough healers or enough dps?
These are all things that are essential for a proper MMORPG.
Yes, your going to have your sweaties, but your going to have your sweaties in every game you play.
Many people thoroughly enjoy getting everything you can dps wise out of your character or maximizing your healing throughput, etc.
Otherwise your going to have a guessing game and failing on multiple bosses multiple times in random pug groups because you don't know whos slacking or not paying attention. Which is going to cause you to get pissed off, and not queue or join pug groups because the experience sucks.
It's 100% OK for people to judge you based on your performance.
All you have to do is not tie gearscore or saved metrics that other people can see.
Say you suck at damage one raid and get kicked out. Well now you use that as a learning experience for next time. Join another raid and have practiced on a training dummy your rotation for next time.
As long as group leaders can't see that you've never done the raid before, etc, then your fine. Self improvement is a must in an MMORPG, especially one that wants a robust raiding scene.
I can repeat my points you are adding things not said in a conversation and trying to use it as fact.
1. You gain nothing from lying about me saying I was talking about any clips of end game
2. The conversation was about the website that was referenced which is pretty clear as that was what my comment directly talked about.
3. No one mentioned anything about end game pve the talk is about dps meters and the site.
You again are being dishonest about the conversation and continuing to insult on the forums which is a common pattern for you against people that don't agree with you. Leading to toxic comments in relation to you.
Who is talking about asmongold showing end game raiding in this post, if you're saying it's me talking about end game raiding, please reference a quote.
If you are using a reference of me talking about asmongold with wow tracker site as it was referenced to me, then I'm wondering if you are talking to someone else talking about pve end game raiding and who.
However, I will quote you. This was your justification for why you know end game content. Because Asmon shows it on Stream. Except he doesn't - you just think that what he shows on stream is end game.
Point 2, the conversation is not about that website, you are just trying to make it about that website. WoWlog was only linked as an example of a combat tracker, not as an example of what people here are asking for. In 183 pages of this thread, no one has said they want WoWlogs style trackers, people are asking for either local trackers (ACT) or have Intrepid set up trackers in game.
You are just trying to turn the conversation to WoWlogs because someone mentioned it, and you know there will be a number of people that are all for one or the other of the options actually desired, but who would be against WoWlogs (I am included in this group, I do not want to see WoWlogs style trackers in Ashes). Basically, someone mentioned a thing, and now you are trying to say that the thing is what the discussion is about purely because that suits your argument better.
And you want to call me dishonest.
Point 3, end game PvE has been a consistent throughout this thread, as the discussion has often been based on the notion that a combat tracker is not needed at all for low end content, nor even mid tier content. It is top end content where a combat tracker is at it's most useful (in regards to it's content based functionality). The notion of top end PvE content is more salient and more present in this thread that WoWlogs - the site you are erroneously trying to say the discussion is about.
The only reason I insult you is because you deserve it. Stop posting stupid things like "this 183 page discussion is about the thing that was first mentioned at the end of the last page", and maybe - just maybe - it would stop.
That said, there are a lot of things you do and say that are "like" the above, so there is a lot you would need to change.
Even like a smiley or frowney face.
Doesn't need to be a number. This could apply for anything healing, cc, player saves, dispells, etc.
ff14 bans them but people wtill use them. I think you should do the same and heavily discourage them while providing another system that does a similar thing.
You jump in a discussion im having with someone else and quote me and you talk about wowlogs in it why are you continuing to lie again on the forums. You are fully aware of the discussion at with him and you talking about wow logs. And nothing of me mentioning PvE content, end, mid or low tier in any of my comments as clearly the topic was wowlogs.
1. you did this i order to try to insult me as i have stated before
You are being quoted and the discussion is about wowlogs you are talking about logs, I honestly could careless what you think about WoW content. I NEVER TALKED ABOUT PVE RAID CONTENT IN A VIDEO.
You are assuming weird things, changing the topic and trying to put words in my mouth as well as again doing your pattern of insults.
I deserve to be insulted for having different opinions than you from you are putting words in my mouth on something that is currently not being talked about as we are talking about wow logs.
What kind of world do you live in....
See, to you it is about WoWlogs the site, to the person you are discussing with, it is about combat logs in general, WoWlogs just happens to be the one they are using now and so is what they are using as an example.
The only person that thinks the discussion you two are having is specifically about WoWlogs rather than combat logs in general is you. That is why I pointed that out to you.
NiKr has different opinions to me on almost every topic, yet you dont see me insulting him (not even the mild jabs that dont actually count as insults that are all you get).
The reason you get those small jabs is because of the way you argue, not because of the opinions you have. It's the same reason I used to always have jabs at Dygz - his discussion style was unconductive to actually having a discussion.
So is yours. You cant make claims like "Asmon literally shows this content on stream" and then also say If someone misunderstood what you meant when you talked about the content Asmon showed in his videos, dont cry like a 12 year old about it (the all caps above is crying like a 12 year old). Rather, grow up and simply accept that you were not clear in what you originally said, and clarify your statement.
Just keep in mind, if your clarification doesnt make sense - if it seems like you are trying to alter what you said - you will be called out for it.
You just love to keep just going with the insults I see, It is in all caps so you can read it. If you can't understand the conversation going on you shouldn't chime in on it unless you are well of aware of what is being discussed.
You were perfectly aware we are talking about the wow log site as it was linked, there was 0 mention of any eng game anything and you went on to assume so you could attempt to insult as usual.
This is exactly why you can't quote nor listen to the discussion at hand. You are being called out for making up dialogue and attempting to put it in my mouth to insult.
My post was clear as was the conversation there is 0 reason for me to start talking about end game raiding when we are literarily talking about DPs meters.
Every Post I see from you is literarily trying to insult me on a topic that we were not even talking about in this forum post. Perhaps if you stopped trying to argue with everyone and getting different threads mixed up and listened you would understand what people are talking about better.
Next time read the post and stay on topic, rather than attempting to use every post to sling insults and passive aggressive comments, you are an adult act like one.
I am perfectly aware you wanted to talk about the WoWlogs site, as it was linked, I am also aware that the person that linked it was using it as a general example rather than a specific example, which is why I specifically said no one is asking for that kind of thing in Ashes.
You could perhaps note that I never stopped you from talking about it with the poster that bought it up, nor would I be able to if I wanted. All I am able to do is what I did - point out that it is not what is being asked for by anyone in this thread.
If you want to make the representation that it is, then I will again remind you (and those reading) that it is not what is being asked for.
In the same way I can not stop you from discussing WoWlogs with the poster that bought it up (who seems somewhat uninterested in getting in to a discussion with you), you can not stop me from pointing the above out.
As to your comments about not talking about top end PvE raiding - the entire thread is about combat trackers, with is a subsection of top end PvE raiding as a topic in and of itself. That is like trying to say you are talking about PvP in a game, but are not interested at all about talking about the classes in that game. The two are intrinsically intertwined, you can not have a discussion about one without the other.
However, if you insist you are not talking about top end PvE content, what exactly is it you are talking about here? If I have misunderstood you, all you need to do to rectify that is clarify what you mean.