Hey Intrepid, you need to either accept that I am giving money away in an attempt to influence this games development, or specifically refuse to name a charity for me to give that money to so that you look like the kinds of people that would deny charity.
You offered to make a bet with me, I turned it down because I am not stupid. So you then essentially made it with Intrepid without them agreeing to it.
Then as a part of the bet, you decide to make it about whether more people that actually care one way or another would prefer to have it changed or not - which was never a part of the discussion.
So no, I'm not a sore loser, I just didn't lose anything here. Rather, you seem to have decided to make the discussion about something else, and are now trying to force Intrepids hand.
You offered to make a bet with me, I turned it down because I am not stupid. So you then essentially made it with Intrepid without them agreeing to it.
I did no such thing Noaani. I made a bet with whoever wanted to prove me wrong, and it's not really a bet since win or lose it's me who's losing money .
You offered to make a bet with me, I turned it down because I am not stupid. So you then essentially made it with Intrepid without them agreeing to it.
I did no such thing Noaani. I made a bet with whoever wanted to prove me wrong.
No, you were specific in Intrepid naming a charity, and if they do so they are complicit in your attempt (failed attempt) to purchase game development decisions.
The bet here is your €1,000 vs Intrepids integrity.
What was that Children's Hospital they raised money for a few months back?
Easy to look it up on the livestream.
I would suggest that if Intrepid don't reply to this thread within 24 hours, the €1,000 should go there, as there is no implication at all of Intrepid condoning an attempted purchase of development decisions.
@Noaani would you have any moral objections if I were to donate 10000 in full to a charity of their choice regardless of whether they change the name or not?
To be fair, I do want to influence their decisions (obviously), but I want to do it by bringing it to their attention that, amongst people that care at all, folks that want the name to be changed are in fact a majority (vocal or otherwise). What they do with that information is up to them.
@Noaani would you have any moral objections if I were to donate 10000 in full to a charity of their choice regardless of whether they change the name or not?
It isn't about my moral objection, it is about anyone that comes along and reads this thread afterwards. Regardless of what happens from this point, so far in this thread you have attempted to purchase a change in design for this game.
That is a fact that can't be changed now. All that can be done is making sure people know it didn't work (which is why the name absolutely can't ever be changed now).
Intrepid naming a charity at all at this point is tantamount to condoning that action. It isn't about the money, it is about integrity - though only Intrepids, at this point.
The best thing you can do for Intrepid is to drop the whole thing. If you want to come out of this with a shred of dignity, my suggestion would be to donate it to the charity that Steven has already shown support for.
I think it's awkward for Intrepid to name a charity in a contentious discussion happening between its customers.
Instead, since I'm a customer too, I'd like to recommend a charity by which you can fulfill your word (if you're ok with that?)
Recently, Intrepid partnered with ExtraLife for a 24hr stream - so it makes sense that this would be the charity to donate to.
You could do that now as a one off, or you could pledge it to the next (?) ExtraLife stream that they do.
Let's leave decision making to the team.
I'm 100% confident that Toast and the mods team have seen this thread and have acknowledged that lots of people feel this way about the Tank name. The poll, though small, has a clear winner - but I think it's healthiest if we give full power to the devs to make decisions with all that they know.
We don't make decisions, so that statement is like saying the "Sun is hot.".
We are presenting a different perspective.
A developer's perspective is different, and can be so focused on either the big picture or the minutiae that some aspects never even occur to them.
(Besides, the community doesn't need your seal of approval to have an opinion and share it with the dev team.)
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CypherMember, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
It’s completely unreal that this (still) is one of the most popular threads. People are going to argue until a statement is made one way or another so let’s hope one is made during the next livestream. Then we could finally put this thread to rest.
I am not a native English speaker, so I don't think I really understand this discussion in depth.
However, no matter how much we argue about the sun, the sun is the sun and will continue to float in the sky.
I'm not saying it's wrong to argue about the sun, but if you think it's an extension of the debate to do something sterile like which charity the sun will donate to, please change your mind.
The debate has been parallel for the past few days.
Then the Sun will have to answer for itself.
If you want to give a constructive opinion to the Sun, don't argue with anyone, just write "for or against the name change" and "objective reasons for it" in bullet points.
I think everyone here thinks it's sterile to argue endlessly with each other on this topic.
We don't make decisions, so that statement is like saying the "Sun is hot.".
Good example, this thread is like arguing whether or not the Sun should actually be called Sol. The correct answer is who cares. It's not a big deal. There are way more important aspects of the game to focus on than an archetype name based on extremely common mmorpg lingo.
The real problem with a class being named 'Tank' is that it is outside of accepted Fantasy lore.
It describes the player's perspective, rather than Verra's.
If this is your issue, there is a really easy way to make the situation more palatable to you.
Accept that it is within accepted fantasy lore.
I mean, what you accept or not is 100% your choice. If you are not accepting it, that is your decision. However, you can't use your decision as an argument in saying it is fine or not.
Honestly if anyone stops themselves from playing this game (assuming nothing else is wrong with it) just on account of the name Tank for one of 8 archetypes.....
Honestly if anyone stops themselves from playing this game (assuming nothing else is wrong with it) just on account of the name Tank for one of 8 archetypes.....
The real problem with a class being named 'Tank' is that it is outside of accepted Fantasy lore.
It describes the player's perspective, rather than Verra's.
If this is your issue, there is a really easy way to make the situation more palatable to you.
Accept that it is within accepted fantasy lore.
I mean, what you accept or not is 100% your choice. If you are not accepting it, that is your decision. However, you can't use your decision as an argument in saying it is fine or not.
Do you read novels?
With novels, and some games, there is a willing suspension of disbelief. When silly things are said or done that do not belong within the fictional world, that suspension can be broken.
It's extremely annoying and shows a lack of skill on the part of the writer.
Should some of the tavern drinks be called Cola, and HillDew?
WoW was infested with pop references. They offered a quick and cheap chuckle, and nothing more.
I'm telling you to wait for Intrepid Studios' decision.
And if the name doesn't change, and you don't like it, use some tool to display the name of your choice every time you see the word "Tank" in the screen.
I don't speak English, so I have to translate every sentence in the game as I play.
If you can't even be bothered to do that, then shut up.
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akabearMember, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
edited February 2021
How about leave it as is and allow titles to be modded so those that want different nomenclature on their own screen can adjust as they see fit.
And if that is not a go`er, then perhaps some AoC branded post stick notes to hand write the name of choice and stick on your own monitors where the objected titles predominantly show.
Comments
Not cool.
Pretty sure its a win. Since they won't change the tank name now. Thank you boo.
You offered to make a bet with me, I turned it down because I am not stupid. So you then essentially made it with Intrepid without them agreeing to it.
Then as a part of the bet, you decide to make it about whether more people that actually care one way or another would prefer to have it changed or not - which was never a part of the discussion.
So no, I'm not a sore loser, I just didn't lose anything here. Rather, you seem to have decided to make the discussion about something else, and are now trying to force Intrepids hand.
So again I say.
Not cool man.
Not cool.
I did no such thing Noaani. I made a bet with whoever wanted to prove me wrong, and it's not really a bet since win or lose it's me who's losing money
No, you were specific in Intrepid naming a charity, and if they do so they are complicit in your attempt (failed attempt) to purchase game development decisions.
The bet here is your €1,000 vs Intrepids integrity.
There is an acknowledgement of your attempt to purchase design decisions for the game.
I would suggest that if Intrepid don't reply to this thread within 24 hours, the €1,000 should go there, as there is no implication at all of Intrepid condoning an attempted purchase of development decisions.
https://www.extra-life.org/
To be fair, I do want to influence their decisions (obviously), but I want to do it by bringing it to their attention that, amongst people that care at all, folks that want the name to be changed are in fact a majority (vocal or otherwise). What they do with that information is up to them.
That is a fact that can't be changed now. All that can be done is making sure people know it didn't work (which is why the name absolutely can't ever be changed now).
Intrepid naming a charity at all at this point is tantamount to condoning that action. It isn't about the money, it is about integrity - though only Intrepids, at this point.
The best thing you can do for Intrepid is to drop the whole thing. If you want to come out of this with a shred of dignity, my suggestion would be to donate it to the charity that Steven has already shown support for.
But hey, you do you.
Thanks buddy, I will.
Instead, since I'm a customer too, I'd like to recommend a charity by which you can fulfill your word (if you're ok with that?)
Recently, Intrepid partnered with ExtraLife for a 24hr stream - so it makes sense that this would be the charity to donate to.
You could do that now as a one off, or you could pledge it to the next (?) ExtraLife stream that they do.
Let's leave decision making to the team.
I'm 100% confident that Toast and the mods team have seen this thread and have acknowledged that lots of people feel this way about the Tank name. The poll, though small, has a clear winner - but I think it's healthiest if we give full power to the devs to make decisions with all that they know.
100%
It's still super early in California, so I'm going to wait a bit on this.
Go drunk @Warth you're home... hic!
It describes the player's perspective, rather than Verra's.
We don't make decisions, so that statement is like saying the "Sun is hot.".
We are presenting a different perspective.
A developer's perspective is different, and can be so focused on either the big picture or the minutiae that some aspects never even occur to them.
(Besides, the community doesn't need your seal of approval to have an opinion and share it with the dev team.)
However, no matter how much we argue about the sun, the sun is the sun and will continue to float in the sky.
I'm not saying it's wrong to argue about the sun, but if you think it's an extension of the debate to do something sterile like which charity the sun will donate to, please change your mind.
The debate has been parallel for the past few days.
Then the Sun will have to answer for itself.
If you want to give a constructive opinion to the Sun, don't argue with anyone, just write "for or against the name change" and "objective reasons for it" in bullet points.
I think everyone here thinks it's sterile to argue endlessly with each other on this topic.
Good example, this thread is like arguing whether or not the Sun should actually be called Sol. The correct answer is who cares. It's not a big deal. There are way more important aspects of the game to focus on than an archetype name based on extremely common mmorpg lingo.
Is that how you read it? I'm only trying to curb the outrage building up in this thread.
The poll is done. Let's not rub salt in wounds.
If this is your issue, there is a really easy way to make the situation more palatable to you.
Accept that it is within accepted fantasy lore.
I mean, what you accept or not is 100% your choice. If you are not accepting it, that is your decision. However, you can't use your decision as an argument in saying it is fine or not.
Well you know what I mean.
Do you read novels?
With novels, and some games, there is a willing suspension of disbelief. When silly things are said or done that do not belong within the fictional world, that suspension can be broken.
It's extremely annoying and shows a lack of skill on the part of the writer.
Should some of the tavern drinks be called Cola, and HillDew?
WoW was infested with pop references. They offered a quick and cheap chuckle, and nothing more.
I'm telling you to wait for Intrepid Studios' decision.
And if the name doesn't change, and you don't like it, use some tool to display the name of your choice every time you see the word "Tank" in the screen.
I don't speak English, so I have to translate every sentence in the game as I play.
If you can't even be bothered to do that, then shut up.
And if that is not a go`er, then perhaps some AoC branded post stick notes to hand write the name of choice and stick on your own monitors where the objected titles predominantly show.
Problem solved, next topic!