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[Megathread] Dual Shields and you

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Comments

  • FilozerFilozer Member, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    All classes can use any weapon.
    So I would say add in, bucklers for main hand and offhand, half shields for main and and offhand, and standard shields for main hand.
    The attack rotation with the primary would be, main hand, off hand, main hand
    and then you can interchange the shields for different combos.

    For example a Tank Rogue using a Buckler Main hand and a Dagger offhand would have a three attack primary combo of Buckler>Dagger>Buckler

    For casters using a shield in their main hand but a spell book or wand their offhand , that it uses the Mini shields which would preform kind of like a close range weapon, while still giving casters the ability to use defensive spells that might block attacks.

    Half shields which can come together to make a completed shield.
    800px-vlcsnap-2020-02-29-09h44m57s151.png

    Standard dual shield
    492px-mat-broome-kaelar-tank-concept.png

    Dual Bucklers
    buckler.png

    Summoned magic shield
    Spectral-and-normal.png

    Mini shields for caster, [EG; Tank Wizard]
    minsheilds.png



  • It's interesting but i feel it would be useless unless you are going double tank archetype, or a tank as primary and some support archetype as a secondary. It feels very situational, almost too situational. You might argue for carrying a weapon switch so as to be effective, but then that inventory slot might be used for something better like a consumable of some kind.
  • SkuldSkuld Member, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    edited September 2020
    It's overly unrealistic and unpractical.
    The same with people also spamming about 2H Greatsword Dual wield.
    Why not dual wield castles while we're at it?

    Ideas like that can go to all the Korean over the top mmos where they dual wield canons bigger than themselves but please keep that stuff away from AoC!

    AoC is more focused on realism and immersion it would totally look out of place in the game. A big no no.
  • SkuldSkuld Member, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    No.
  • ArgantisArgantis Member, Braver of Worlds, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    Not my thing at all. I don't care for it and find it to be ridiculous and gimmicky... I could not take the game seriously if this was implemented. While people may want fantastical things in games like this going too far into alien concepts will drive more people away than to the game. Dual weapon tanking is more viable to me than dual shields. Just my opinion but I really, really do not want to see this in the game.
  • VyrakaVyraka Member, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    I agree with Skuld. It doesn't seem realistic.
    Axiom-Guild-Signature-Vyraka.png
  • thaginjaninjathaginjaninja Member, Intrepid Pack, Alpha Two
    CaptnChuck wrote: »
    Just imagine walking around, trying to immerse yourself in the world, and seeing some guy in plate armor fighting a monster with 2 shields. Yea, so much for immersion. On the other hand, it would indeed be pretty funny to see some idiot doing a spin attack with two shields, like a bey-blade.

    So to be fair, I don't have a strong opinion on this topic. It won't matter if you're wielding two shields or two swords. When I face you, that's where your journey ends.

    Wait did you just pull immersion card on double shields when one is already a thing and capt America is perfectly immersive beating people with one shield? why can i not have two shields and use one for blocking while the other is a blunt attack just like any immersive massive hammer or over sized scepter because it’s a fantasy mmorpg. Immersion card on this might be actually the worst counter argument ever
  • thaginjaninjathaginjaninja Member, Intrepid Pack, Alpha Two
    edited September 2020
    Everyone’s argument it’s unrealistic mean while we’re chain grappling people from out of our ass, we’re flinging magical bombs down range, we’re flying on butterfly inbred mounts, tanks are taking hits from giant monsters 5-8x their size....but having more than one shield is unrealistic I swear some people’s narrow minded thought process is so sad
  • NoaaniNoaani Member, Intrepid Pack, Alpha Two
    Everyone’s argument it’s unrealistic mean while we’re chain grappling people from out of our ass, we’re flinging magical bombs down range, we’re flying on butterfly inbred mounts, tanks are taking hits from giant monsters 5-8x their size....but having more than one shield is unrealistic I swear some people’s narrow minded thought process is so sad

    If I come up against someone with two shields in PvP, I'll ignore them. They can't do anything to me other than stop me hitting them, so I just won't hit them - this leaves them effectiveless.

    It's stupid. It is also unrealistic, but it is stupid first.
  • TragnarTragnar Member
    edited September 2020
    CaptnChuck wrote: »
    Just imagine walking around, trying to immerse yourself in the world, and seeing some guy in plate armor fighting a monster with 2 shields. Yea, so much for immersion. On the other hand, it would indeed be pretty funny to see some idiot doing a spin attack with two shields, like a bey-blade.

    So to be fair, I don't have a strong opinion on this topic. It won't matter if you're wielding two shields or two swords. When I face you, that's where your journey ends.

    Wait did you just pull immersion card on double shields when one is already a thing and capt America is perfectly immersive beating people with one shield? why can i not have two shields and use one for blocking while the other is a blunt attack just like any immersive massive hammer or over sized scepter because it’s a fantasy mmorpg. Immersion card on this might be actually the worst counter argument ever

    Captain America has literally almost a superpower to bounce the shield in a way that defies physics. That is hardly applicable for regular people/adventurers/even superheroes for gigantic shields or dual wielding shields. There is no immersion in having things break the physics and laws of that world even if it has magic in it. Even magic should not break its own rules.

    Having fantasy setting is not a free card to have any dumb thing you can think of in the game
    “Ignorance, the root and stem of all evil.”

    ― Plato
  • Noaani wrote: »
    Everyone’s argument it’s unrealistic mean while we’re chain grappling people from out of our ass, we’re flinging magical bombs down range, we’re flying on butterfly inbred mounts, tanks are taking hits from giant monsters 5-8x their size....but having more than one shield is unrealistic I swear some people’s narrow minded thought process is so sad

    If I come up against someone with two shields in PvP, I'll ignore them. They can't do anything to me other than stop me hitting them, so I just won't hit them - this leaves them effectiveless.

    It's stupid. It is also unrealistic, but it is stupid first.

    then they will just kill you, they have lots of CC spells LUL
  • Tragnar wrote: »
    CaptnChuck wrote: »
    Just imagine walking around, trying to immerse yourself in the world, and seeing some guy in plate armor fighting a monster with 2 shields. Yea, so much for immersion. On the other hand, it would indeed be pretty funny to see some idiot doing a spin attack with two shields, like a bey-blade.

    So to be fair, I don't have a strong opinion on this topic. It won't matter if you're wielding two shields or two swords. When I face you, that's where your journey ends.

    Wait did you just pull immersion card on double shields when one is already a thing and capt America is perfectly immersive beating people with one shield? why can i not have two shields and use one for blocking while the other is a blunt attack just like any immersive massive hammer or over sized scepter because it’s a fantasy mmorpg. Immersion card on this might be actually the worst counter argument ever

    Captain America has literally almost a superpower to bounce the shield in a way that defies physics. That is hardly applicable for regular people/adventurers/even superheroes for gigantic shields or dual wielding shields. There is no immersion in having things break the physics and laws of that world even if it has magic in it. Even magic should not break its own rules.

    Having fantasy setting is not a free card to have any dumb thing you can think of in the game

    Who said anything about throwing shields at ppl? That counters whole perspective on dual shields in the first place
  • Everyone’s argument it’s unrealistic mean while we’re chain grappling people from out of our ass, we’re flinging magical bombs down range, we’re flying on butterfly inbred mounts, tanks are taking hits from giant monsters 5-8x their size....but having more than one shield is unrealistic I swear some people’s narrow minded thought process is so sad

    Having a fantasy setting is not a free card to implement any outlandish idea. This game aims to have magical things in it in such a way that it would seem possible for it to exist. Having humans that have no magical properties dual wield shields just because it is a fantasy world is immersion breaking.

    As many people said before you have these things in Asian type of games where the presence of magic makes the creator pick which physics laws they like to follow and which not.

    Having fantasy follow its own rules is only a good thing and if that thing is to create a world with magic that seems probable to our own world, but we just have not found the magic yet is a gigantic immersion pull for people.
    “Ignorance, the root and stem of all evil.”

    ― Plato
  • NoaaniNoaani Member, Intrepid Pack, Alpha Two
    Tragnar wrote: »
    Having fantasy setting is not a free card to have any dumb thing you can think of in the game
    This statement needs more emphasis.
  • NoaaniNoaani Member, Intrepid Pack, Alpha Two
    edited September 2020
    Mommie wrote: »
    Noaani wrote: »
    Everyone’s argument it’s unrealistic mean while we’re chain grappling people from out of our ass, we’re flinging magical bombs down range, we’re flying on butterfly inbred mounts, tanks are taking hits from giant monsters 5-8x their size....but having more than one shield is unrealistic I swear some people’s narrow minded thought process is so sad

    If I come up against someone with two shields in PvP, I'll ignore them. They can't do anything to me other than stop me hitting them, so I just won't hit them - this leaves them effectiveless.

    It's stupid. It is also unrealistic, but it is stupid first.

    then they will just kill you, they have lots of CC spells LUL

    CC doesn't kill.

    That is what swords do.

    If you want to kill people in the game, use a sword.
  • btw afaik any shield attack should create at maximum a concussion or internal bleeding which is in its own a kind of a critical hit and usually takes effect after the whole fight where the victim of such attack slowly dies to it
    “Ignorance, the root and stem of all evil.”

    ― Plato
  • Obviously its a team pvp, team mates will help. Besides cc, we still do dmg with spells.
  • thaginjaninjathaginjaninja Member, Intrepid Pack, Alpha Two
    Tragnar wrote: »
    Everyone’s argument it’s unrealistic mean while we’re chain grappling people from out of our ass, we’re flinging magical bombs down range, we’re flying on butterfly inbred mounts, tanks are taking hits from giant monsters 5-8x their size....but having more than one shield is unrealistic I swear some people’s narrow minded thought process is so sad

    Having a fantasy setting is not a free card to implement any outlandish idea. This game aims to have magical things in it in such a way that it would seem possible for it to exist. Having humans that have no magical properties dual wield shields just because it is a fantasy world is immersion breaking.

    As many people said before you have these things in Asian type of games where the presence of magic makes the creator pick which physics laws they like to follow and which not.

    Having fantasy follow its own rules is only a good thing and if that thing is to create a world with magic that seems probable to our own world, but we just have not found the magic yet is a gigantic immersion pull for people.

    So a shielded tank pulling a chain from its ass with a magic active skill has no magic and is not allowed to use dual shields because physics??? So which is it... no magic or magic physics or no physics. To argue some but not others and then slap them as silly is the dumbest fucking argument ever because it’s your opinion
  • NoaaniNoaani Member, Intrepid Pack, Alpha Two
    Mommie wrote: »
    Obviously its a team pvp, team mates will help. Besides cc, we still do dmg with spells.

    Yeah, it's a team thing, so grab a sword and help out your team mates.

    Having a single shield is only useful if someone is attacking you. If no one is attacking you, a shield is pointless.

    If you pose no threat to an opponent (such as by having a second shield instead of a weapon) no one will bother attacking you, meaning those two shields you have are pointless.
  • Potato BasketPotato Basket Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    Realistically thinking, holding a single shield with two hands can shield better than two shields one in each hand
  • thaginjaninjathaginjaninja Member, Intrepid Pack, Alpha Two
    edited September 2020
    [/quote]

    CC doesn't kill.

    That is what swords do.

    If you want to kill people in the game, use a sword.[/quote]

    So mages should get deleted by this logic and summoners and clerics. Please use actually thought process for counter arguments and not narrow minded hate trains


    Somehow broke my quote on mobile
  • Noaani wrote: »
    Mommie wrote: »
    Obviously its a team pvp, team mates will help. Besides cc, we still do dmg with spells.

    Yeah, it's a team thing, so grab a sword and help out your team mates.

    Having a single shield is only useful if someone is attacking you. If no one is attacking you, a shield is pointless.

    If you pose no threat to an opponent (such as by having a second shield instead of a weapon) no one will bother attacking you, meaning those two shields you have are pointless.

    Idk how u can't understand that tanks will attack you, you have no choice B)
  • NoaaniNoaani Member, Intrepid Pack, Alpha Two
    edited September 2020

    CC doesn't kill.

    That is what swords do.

    If you want to kill people in the game, use a sword.

    So mages should get deleted by this logic and summoners and clerics. Please use actually thought process for counter arguments and not narrow minded hate trains


    Somehow broke my quote on mobile

    Your quote didn't break, you added an additional / to it.

    Obviously, saying swords kill is only one of the many things that can kill you in an MMO.

    You know what is a thing that doesn't kill you? Shields!
  • MommieMommie Member
    edited September 2020
    " Tell me how the grass tastes little man " on youtube
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=agUaHwxcXHY
  • thaginjaninjathaginjaninja Member, Intrepid Pack, Alpha Two
    edited September 2020
    Noaani wrote: »

    CC doesn't kill.

    That is what swords do.

    If you want to kill people in the game, use a sword.

    So mages should get deleted by this logic and summoners and clerics. Please use actually thought process for counter arguments and not narrow minded hate trains


    Somehow broke my quote on mobile [/quote]

    Your quote didn't break, you added an additional / to it.

    Obviously, saying swords kill is only one of the many things that can kill you in an MMO.

    You know what is a thing that doesn't kill you? Shields![/quote]

    first of all i know what i did and i deleted a bunch on mobile select all trying to edit a typo. As for the argument shields don’t kill then please let me take a blunt shield and swing at your dome piece and tell me it won’t kill you let alone any magic infusion. Please you do know blunt is your realistic option So as i said before get out of your narrow minded argument and use actual counter points that don’t invalidate half the game or half your excuses

  • NoaaniNoaani Member, Intrepid Pack, Alpha Two
    Mommie wrote: »
    Noaani wrote: »
    Mommie wrote: »
    Obviously its a team pvp, team mates will help. Besides cc, we still do dmg with spells.

    Yeah, it's a team thing, so grab a sword and help out your team mates.

    Having a single shield is only useful if someone is attacking you. If no one is attacking you, a shield is pointless.

    If you pose no threat to an opponent (such as by having a second shield instead of a weapon) no one will bother attacking you, meaning those two shields you have are pointless.

    Idk how u can't understand that tanks will attack you, you have no choice B)

    Tanks are often ignored in MMO PvP already due to the fact that they pose no real threat. You are wanting to take what little threat they have and reduce it even further.

    Could a tank with two shields summon a shield wall or some such? Perhaps, but so can a tank with one shield, who can also deal at least some damage with that sword they have instead of the second shield.

    If I have a tank trying to hit me with two shields on one side, and literally any other character at all in the game on the other side focusing on me, I am not going to care at all about that tank with their two shields - they pose no threat to me.
  • LyiatLyiat Member, Phoenix Initiative, Royalty, Kickstarter, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    Methinks OP needs to understand what a megathread is.... You don't open a megathread, it's the result of a merger of multiple large threads about the same subject into a single one to clean up clutter on a forum, like the DPS Meter megathread.
  • thaginjaninjathaginjaninja Member, Intrepid Pack, Alpha Two
    Lyiat wrote: »
    Methinks OP needs to understand what a megathread is.... You don't open a megathread, it's the result of a merger of multiple large threads about the same subject into a single one to clean up clutter on a forum, like the DPS Meter megathread.
    So you mean like discord being spammed over and over , a few threads on here having been opened and iirc at least one on reddit...
  • NoaaniNoaani Member, Intrepid Pack, Alpha Two
    edited September 2020
    Lyiat wrote: »
    Methinks OP needs to understand what a megathread is.... You don't open a megathread, it's the result of a merger of multiple large threads about the same subject into a single one to clean up clutter on a forum, like the DPS Meter megathread.

    I know right - the OP is a mod as well, yet they haven't even merged the other thread on this topic in to this one.

    This anoys me almost as much as the idea of someone wielding two shields.
  • Tragnar wrote: »
    Everyone’s argument it’s unrealistic mean while we’re chain grappling people from out of our ass, we’re flinging magical bombs down range, we’re flying on butterfly inbred mounts, tanks are taking hits from giant monsters 5-8x their size....but having more than one shield is unrealistic I swear some people’s narrow minded thought process is so sad

    Having a fantasy setting is not a free card to implement any outlandish idea. This game aims to have magical things in it in such a way that it would seem possible for it to exist. Having humans that have no magical properties dual wield shields just because it is a fantasy world is immersion breaking.

    As many people said before you have these things in Asian type of games where the presence of magic makes the creator pick which physics laws they like to follow and which not.

    Having fantasy follow its own rules is only a good thing and if that thing is to create a world with magic that seems probable to our own world, but we just have not found the magic yet is a gigantic immersion pull for people.

    So a shielded tank pulling a chain from its ass with a magic active skill has no magic and is not allowed to use dual shields because physics??? So which is it... no magic or magic physics or no physics. To argue some but not others and then slap them as silly is the dumbest fucking argument ever because it’s your opinion

    I guess you want me to go dirty into the logic, okay

    First you start with classic medieval world with its principles, strengths and weaknesses. Then you add magic, some healing, some conjuration, some transformation. If you want to have dualwielding tower shields used practically for both aggressive and defensive capibilities then you either need such gigantic strength where the point of having shields becomes nonexistant, because with such strength you have much better options of using just 1tower shield and a far reaching polearm in one hand. Or you can magically imbue your strength to such proportions, or you can create directional magical forces to help you deliver actually damaging (not only concussive) attacks with shield (something like levitation force that dynamically changes the direction based on where you want to move the shield with a damaging force). Or you can create magic that isolates mass from gravitational forces, but in doing that you are reducing the force for effective shield damaging attacks.

    Having shields as damaging weapons makes the same sense as using chicken feathers to tickle your enemies to death.

    You are cherry picking what rules should govern the fantasy world, instead of taking a real world and adding magic to it with its own specific magical rules.
    “Ignorance, the root and stem of all evil.”

    ― Plato
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