I think they turned out great. Like how big they are and their proportions. Happy to see that they are not just lightly bigger humans with tusks and different skin options.
The face looks a little silly to me. Not sure what it is. I think it might be the small nose or that he looks kind of like he is cross eyed in the picture.
I really like the "scales" but it's hard for me to tell if it's supposed to be a tattoo or his natural skin. I think it would be cool if that was their natural skin as it reminds me of elephant/rhino skin.
So as I look at them and taking in the lore about them so far. They use dragons in their symbols and icons. With their eyes, ears, face shape, and scales they could be a bit of an orcish dragonborn which I think is a unique take on an orc race.
For my personal tastes, I'm not a big fan of the scaly-looking skin, and from far away it kind of looks like a rendering error or something in my opinion. Also, the way the arms lead straight into the hands with minimal wrist looks odd to me, I also don't think I'm a huge fan of the long pointed fingernails. For the face, I think the main things bothering me are the scrunched-up nose and the tiny elf-like ears. He looks too...cute? I don't really mind the vertical pupils at all, but wouldn't mind changing that as well. Overall I still REALLY like it and am just so appreciative that you guys show us these things, take our input, and actually implement our desired changes. Thank you guys.
Nose too small, that upper lip area is too big, tusks too small. Wished they looked more like Oni's instead of Gorons/Brutes/gorillas. Idk why people want them to be harry. I liked those red orcs from that earlier artwork. Something about that face, it doesn't look fierce or badass.
Generally the Ren'kai move in a very good direction. I really like that they are tall, buff and bulky.
The eyes are an interesting choice and I think it works very well.
To me it always comes down to options. I dont want something gone, or pushed into one direction. If I have the option for X or Y it is always better than having one or the other.
I can only refer to the picture of this one Ren'kai, so of course this view is very limited and comes down to the options we have in the character creation. So far, I just can say you are moving in the right direction.
So this is more like a customization wish list. Body types
It is weird if they all look like body builders. If someone wants to play a fat Ren'kai or a small, nimble one, that, as an option, is totally fine. Berads
If you chose to go the route of Ren not being able to grow facial hair over their mouth that is ok, mustaches would be nice as an option though.
The example looks great and I really like the wraps. more of those, with a seperate option to chose the colour.
Add in decoration like bones or other material the Ren use as decoration Tusks
Options for broken, repaired, coloured ones. Big, broad, very small. Hair
Oh the possibilities. The hair looks awesome. Give us a lot of option with variations, length, decoration, dread lock style stuff and braided stuff.
Multiple hair colours, if a choice, should not be tied to one another. If there are seperate parts to be coloured dont tie them to each other (as in: part A is red so part B must be orange)
There should be an option for body hair, like chest, arms, forearms, shoulders and even back. As option. Scars, Tattoos, Piercings
Blast us with options. Honestly, there is no "too many options" in this. If someone has an idea that is implementable, put that in. Seperate it as much as possible. Like face tattoos: You choose the first one. Would you like to add another? Y / N. Let us pick as many as possible and choose the placement. It is great to have the following options, but not great to still be limited: fully body tattoo and stuff like a sleeve for one arm but not the other. That is ok. But there should be the option (as mentioned before) to add another tattoo to the body. So that I can choose the sleeve that I want on either side.
If possible go for piercings on the usual body parts, but also on new ones. I would like to see nipple piercings, since there are awesome pictures of orcs with those. Same goes for scars. There can be scars from battle but also decorational scars. and again, let us pick the number and the placement. Skin tone
I like the current approach, are Ren'kai able to have green, red, or bluish skin?
One thing that is weird to me: hairstyles and customization stuff like piercings, tattoos and so on: if one race has those (and those are not strickly race only) than they should be an option for other races too.
Always weird that in WoW there are hair styles, colours, tattoos and piercings, jewlery but only for that one race. Espeacially piercings and tattoos make no sense that way. Just give us the option to create the character we want to.
Another example: Humans in WoW cant have tattoos. What?
SWTOR: No beards for Cyborgs. What? If the race cant grow beards thats ok, but if the race is just an existing race with cyborg options, that makes no sense (as an example, how weird some customization restrictions are)
You guys did a really great job with the races so far. I am really really happy with your approach
I like that it has elements of humanity dwindling....
That said, I think it can get mean in the face. It reminds me of playing a berserker class and I'd love to be able to customise how angry i look!
Love the direction you are going with the Ren'Kai. I think it's awesome that they are considerably taller than the other races and really like how they are built. But I do have to say that the face in the art preview looks a little too... welcoming. I know when I generally think of orcs, I tend to think of them as having angry, scary, and intimidating facial features/expressions. Also, I have questions about the scales on the male Ren'Kai orc model but I am not opposed to it.
I think that overall the model and quality is pretty good. Without knowing the ranges and variety that can be attained with the Character Creator, it's hard to tell whether we will in majority look closer to this, or if there will be alot of diversity within the race. That said, lets go on your points!
Pros - The quality of the model is great (across the board to be fair). I like the details down to the skin texture. The muscle mass looks good.
Cons - I will echo that I think the head could be bigger to be more proportional to the body. I also wonder if we can have a thicker hair model? Not so much a criticism but more in terms of variety.
Customisation Options:
Most of the standard customisation will be expected across the board, think ears, nose, tusks, eye shape, eyebrow customisation. Tusks from more small/modest to larger protruding.
With some of the feedback about the face looking a bit soft, perhaps make the dormant expression a bit more intimidating, but a physical change could be to make the chin/jaw area a bit more square, widen it out.
Then to the body, I think controlling the overall muscle mass is enough, I personally don't feel the desire to have so much limb customisation but if you allow a range of presets that don't morph the character too much then we can have characters that fit in the world without being too out of place.
Tattoos, perhaps a slight deviation in the posture of the orc? I like to think a larger orc might be a bit more hulking but that isn't essential.
I really love the 3D model. I think it has been said before here in this thread but I hope we get some skin tone variation. The skin tones should fit the race but I think what would really fit the ren kai could be green, maybe some red or similar to the Vek maybe blue or purple.
for me the button nose, red eyes and small tusks are a no go.
it falls to much into uncanny valley/baby face territory.
here i made a small changes via photoshop, its not perfect but side by side its way more "orc-ish":
i also made a green-skinned version, to further get away from uncanny valley.
I'm seriously not getting the uncanny valley vibe from these guys at all. They look great and pretty unique as orcs go. I definitely don't want another Warcraft or Warhammer orc. I want an Ashes of Creation orc. Given how these guys have the whole samurai and dragon thing going for them, there isn't anything about this I would change, honestly. I would expect them to have refinement and intelligence in Ashes and not want to beat everything to death with a stick in front of a campfire. These character models certainly have that.
The biggest comment I see people wanting here is body hair, and that's fine as an option, though I personally feel it's not needed. The slit pupils are cool and I wouldn't change that. This is a more unique take on orcs than I've seen lately in the fantasy genre and it's well done. When people not playing the game see these guys, they're going to know what game they're from and not confuse them with other titles.
Intrepid have said that reds and greens will be skin color choices also.
Keep going guys, it's turning out great.
I may not be playing a Ren'Kai but never has a race design made me consider wanting to play an Orc before either. This shape reminds me a lot of the Mortal Kombat 11 design of Shao Kahn with the scales, reptilian features, which feelsl like hints from where they themselves may have evolved from. I'd love to see the options of appearance like you did with the Vek to show the range they could be customized to appease people. I know it's already been said there will be a variety of skin tons including more fantasy.
I am genuinely very excited to see where this race continues developing and more and more hope when the races I am waiting for are revealed I'll be as joyous.
Its great to see old concepts that every MMO uses taken a new direction.
Personally between various Orc designs I've seen in games the Ren'kai have a noble yet powerful appearance. Honestly Orcs are NOT supposed to be pretty, and in terms of sliders for them, being able to pick a generic body shape between Lean, Bulky, and Fat would be amazing then have individual sliders to refine the body like in ESO would be great to have. Then the standard narrow, round, and square head types as a base along side different sliders to refine what you want.
I'm really liking the direction being taken. It almost looks like they're descendants of dragons, which with the Eastern cultural background, makes a lot of sense. I'd like to see more of that incorporated. I love that they're not the same as WoW, Warhammer, or D&D orcs. It makes them unique, which is amazing.
I think I'd be a fan of bigger glutes as well as more body hair, but this is so far my favorite race in game! I'm very excited to see more of it as well as hopefully Tulnar soon.
I'm not sure what to think about these guys. I'm concerned if the suggestions of body hair are followed they will just look like big foot (Harry and the Henderson's style)...which I'm pretty sure is not the intent. Orcs are not furry. That being said the weird diamond texture over the shoulders looks reptilian or even like a baked ham from the netting to me which also is not very Orc in my opinion. I would just like to see that gone. Maybe go with some kind of customizable war paint instead (or is that what this is supposed to be? ).
What do you like about the current art direction of this race?
Mostly all. Generally, the concept remembers me WoW orcs.
Is there anything you dislike about the art direction for this race, and why?
The eyes. I have nothing against vertical pupil, but It’s felt more reptilian.
What are your thoughts on what was shown during the livestream for the Ren’Kai race?
They are nice. What is that weird thing on they skin? (I now know it’s scales) Ears look like pretty orcish. The beard is realistic.
Are there any specific Character Creator customizations you would like to see for the Ren’Kai race?
Tusk sliders and a possibility of different tusks. Sliders to have slimmer or bulky Ren’Kai. A choice of abdomen muscles (6-pack or else). Same for scales (a lot, some on back, shoulders etc.). A large choice of tattoos. The choice to choose green, brown, black skin color. I would like to have body hairs and the possibility to choose to have it on stomach, chest, legs, back.
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AtamaMember, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
I think I'd be a fan of bigger glutes as well as more body hair, but this is so far my favorite race in game! I'm very excited to see more of it as well as hopefully Tulnar soon.
Ren'Kai is also the race I plan to play in Ashes and they look really good! Agree though with previous comments, I feel as well that something about the face of this particular example looks a bit odd but I can't explain what it is: Maybe the comparison of nose and cheeks and mouth, I don't know, but I think you'll offer some customization anyway on them, so I think we can create our best version of them anyway I prefer if you also add a lot of beard, tusk and ear options for them if possible (you mentioned that Dwarfs have a big collection of beards already). For me a beard just belongs to an "orc" or Ren'Kai as well as to a Dünir.
But great work so far, love the outcome of the races already!
I've wanted to play Ren'Kai from the beginning because I want to play a warrior class. I am female and want to play female. I was disappointed in FFXIV's "female" version of their "Galka" big woman, she looked grotesque. I ended up playing one of their "highlander" Hume females instead. I like that she was stronger "stat" wise, but was still able to come across as beautiful. If you're hume races are not going to be able to be "muscular" then I think the Ren'Kai should fill this roll. The sliders, in my opinion, need to be extreme on both ends (really pansy looking Ren'kai). From Just a NORMAL human with "muscles" to men on steroids and beastly looking and beyond. As a female, I would NEVER ever choose to play a woman that looks like she is on steroids or was beastly looking; so you Absolutely MUST include a lower end spectrum of Female Ren'kai that almost look like humans, but if you took their clothes off, you would notice she is far more muscular.
I DO NOT WANT HUGE BULKY THIGHS! I want muscles obtainable by women who are NOT on steroids, and a lean BMI but you should really really allow for a higher curvy BMI too! I also don't like being enormously taller than everyone else. As a female I should be smaller than males. Please create HUGE "Sexual Dimorphism" IN REN'KAI. The females should be smaller. If you only focus on making huge bulky women, NO REAL WOMAN WILL PLAY THE RACE AND IT WILL BE THE LEAST PLAYED OF ALL RACES. Males only choose to play Female characters when they are SEXY or CUTE.
I see the Ren'Kai have red eyes. I would only play them if I was able to choose Blue eyes and I like that you have a skin tone close to that of a human but the females should be allowed to be PINK, of various variations, from pastel rose, to SALMON (orange + pink is my favourite), to hot magenta and neon pink and to LILAC and Lavender to indigo and violet purple. And the Kai'Vek females should allow colors like teal, aquamarine, MINT Green, Seafoam, baby blue and midnight blue.
I have a new idea, that since you are able to work with textures, you should make a race with "flocked" fuzzy skin (some dolls are made this way like Calico Critters and Slyvian family animal dolls). I think this would work best for a "cute little doll" but since you aren't going that way with your miniature pygmys, you could try it on the Ren'kai. But I see that you are going with "snake" like scales. Since others mentioned body hair, I think "flocked" fur would work really well for the females. Please research this texture, when done right it is very fine and soft and fuzzy and short.
I ALWAYS perceived the GALKA of the FFXI game, as "BIG TEDDY BEARS". They were always played by the NICEST guys, the soft sweethearts who are usually fat IRL and humble and caring. I think "flocked teddy bear" and softer looks should be an option on your scale from "evil" Ren'kai. I understand that Samurai/ninja/Tank/warrior are the point to the Ren'kai but they don't need to be "evil" looking. The ARMOUR can do that.
Also, I do NOT want tusks, but if you're firm on making TUSKS a requirement for the race, please allow us to change their color from PEARLY WHITE, OPAL, to GOLD to silver, to Bronze to BLACK not just nasty yellow! Also you need to provide a huge variation in size and shape of tusks and don't have them linked/requiring an undershot jaw. I'd like my character's face to look pretty normal like a human but the tusks would just be extra.
FFXI 75 cap 2003-2010. Diabolos Server. Amaeru/Amaera. 9 jobs to 75: WHM BLM RDM THF WAR DRK DRG BRD. SAM60 SMN60 PLD60. NIN37 MNK 37. Gilgamesh: Truther DNC75. Wish I got to play BLU!
Comments
So as I look at them and taking in the lore about them so far. They use dragons in their symbols and icons. With their eyes, ears, face shape, and scales they could be a bit of an orcish dragonborn which I think is a unique take on an orc race.
Big tusks
Body hair
Option for gauged ears and septum piercings
Tattoos
Greenskin
That's pretty much the only addons or adjustments I'd like to see. I really think you guys knocked it out of the park with this design.
The detail from UE5 is mind boggling. It really adds just so much depth and intricacy to each race in AoC.
This race just looks incredibly sturdy and tough. The dogged endurance shows off of the lines. Cannot wait to see more.
The eyes are an interesting choice and I think it works very well.
To me it always comes down to options. I dont want something gone, or pushed into one direction. If I have the option for X or Y it is always better than having one or the other.
I can only refer to the picture of this one Ren'kai, so of course this view is very limited and comes down to the options we have in the character creation. So far, I just can say you are moving in the right direction.
So this is more like a customization wish list.
Body types
It is weird if they all look like body builders. If someone wants to play a fat Ren'kai or a small, nimble one, that, as an option, is totally fine.
Berads
If you chose to go the route of Ren not being able to grow facial hair over their mouth that is ok, mustaches would be nice as an option though.
The example looks great and I really like the wraps. more of those, with a seperate option to chose the colour.
Add in decoration like bones or other material the Ren use as decoration
Tusks
Options for broken, repaired, coloured ones. Big, broad, very small.
Hair
Oh the possibilities. The hair looks awesome. Give us a lot of option with variations, length, decoration, dread lock style stuff and braided stuff.
Multiple hair colours, if a choice, should not be tied to one another. If there are seperate parts to be coloured dont tie them to each other (as in: part A is red so part B must be orange)
There should be an option for body hair, like chest, arms, forearms, shoulders and even back. As option.
Scars, Tattoos, Piercings
Blast us with options. Honestly, there is no "too many options" in this. If someone has an idea that is implementable, put that in. Seperate it as much as possible. Like face tattoos: You choose the first one. Would you like to add another? Y / N. Let us pick as many as possible and choose the placement. It is great to have the following options, but not great to still be limited: fully body tattoo and stuff like a sleeve for one arm but not the other. That is ok. But there should be the option (as mentioned before) to add another tattoo to the body. So that I can choose the sleeve that I want on either side.
If possible go for piercings on the usual body parts, but also on new ones. I would like to see nipple piercings, since there are awesome pictures of orcs with those. Same goes for scars. There can be scars from battle but also decorational scars. and again, let us pick the number and the placement.
Skin tone
I like the current approach, are Ren'kai able to have green, red, or bluish skin?
One thing that is weird to me: hairstyles and customization stuff like piercings, tattoos and so on: if one race has those (and those are not strickly race only) than they should be an option for other races too.
Always weird that in WoW there are hair styles, colours, tattoos and piercings, jewlery but only for that one race. Espeacially piercings and tattoos make no sense that way. Just give us the option to create the character we want to.
Another example: Humans in WoW cant have tattoos. What?
SWTOR: No beards for Cyborgs. What? If the race cant grow beards thats ok, but if the race is just an existing race with cyborg options, that makes no sense (as an example, how weird some customization restrictions are)
You guys did a really great job with the races so far. I am really really happy with your approach
They look great
Edit: After reading the Vek thread, I'd also like to suggest that the Ren'Kai colouring be less human-coloured.
That said, I think it can get mean in the face. It reminds me of playing a berserker class and I'd love to be able to customise how angry i look!
Great job so far!
https://ashesofcreation.wiki/Races#Ren.27Kai
For them to always have to appear angry and threatening rather contradicts the 'Tranquility' bit.
Pros - The quality of the model is great (across the board to be fair). I like the details down to the skin texture. The muscle mass looks good.
Cons - I will echo that I think the head could be bigger to be more proportional to the body. I also wonder if we can have a thicker hair model? Not so much a criticism but more in terms of variety.
Customisation Options:
Most of the standard customisation will be expected across the board, think ears, nose, tusks, eye shape, eyebrow customisation. Tusks from more small/modest to larger protruding.
With some of the feedback about the face looking a bit soft, perhaps make the dormant expression a bit more intimidating, but a physical change could be to make the chin/jaw area a bit more square, widen it out.
Then to the body, I think controlling the overall muscle mass is enough, I personally don't feel the desire to have so much limb customisation but if you allow a range of presets that don't morph the character too much then we can have characters that fit in the world without being too out of place.
Tattoos, perhaps a slight deviation in the posture of the orc? I like to think a larger orc might be a bit more hulking but that isn't essential.
it falls to much into uncanny valley/baby face territory.
here i made a small changes via photoshop, its not perfect but side by side its way more "orc-ish":
i also made a green-skinned version, to further get away from uncanny valley.
The biggest comment I see people wanting here is body hair, and that's fine as an option, though I personally feel it's not needed. The slit pupils are cool and I wouldn't change that. This is a more unique take on orcs than I've seen lately in the fantasy genre and it's well done. When people not playing the game see these guys, they're going to know what game they're from and not confuse them with other titles.
Intrepid have said that reds and greens will be skin color choices also.
Keep going guys, it's turning out great.
I am genuinely very excited to see where this race continues developing and more and more hope when the races I am waiting for are revealed I'll be as joyous.
Its great to see old concepts that every MMO uses taken a new direction.
Mostly all. Generally, the concept remembers me WoW orcs.
Is there anything you dislike about the art direction for this race, and why?
The eyes. I have nothing against vertical pupil, but It’s felt more reptilian.
What are your thoughts on what was shown during the livestream for the Ren’Kai race?
They are nice. What is that weird thing on they skin? (I now know it’s scales) Ears look like pretty orcish. The beard is realistic.
Are there any specific Character Creator customizations you would like to see for the Ren’Kai race?
Tusk sliders and a possibility of different tusks. Sliders to have slimmer or bulky Ren’Kai. A choice of abdomen muscles (6-pack or else). Same for scales (a lot, some on back, shoulders etc.). A large choice of tattoos. The choice to choose green, brown, black skin color. I would like to have body hairs and the possibility to choose to have it on stomach, chest, legs, back.
You like big butts and you cannot lie?
But great work so far, love the outcome of the races already!
I DO NOT WANT HUGE BULKY THIGHS! I want muscles obtainable by women who are NOT on steroids, and a lean BMI but you should really really allow for a higher curvy BMI too! I also don't like being enormously taller than everyone else. As a female I should be smaller than males. Please create HUGE "Sexual Dimorphism" IN REN'KAI. The females should be smaller. If you only focus on making huge bulky women, NO REAL WOMAN WILL PLAY THE RACE AND IT WILL BE THE LEAST PLAYED OF ALL RACES. Males only choose to play Female characters when they are SEXY or CUTE.
I see the Ren'Kai have red eyes. I would only play them if I was able to choose Blue eyes and I like that you have a skin tone close to that of a human but the females should be allowed to be PINK, of various variations, from pastel rose, to SALMON (orange + pink is my favourite), to hot magenta and neon pink and to LILAC and Lavender to indigo and violet purple. And the Kai'Vek females should allow colors like teal, aquamarine, MINT Green, Seafoam, baby blue and midnight blue.
I have a new idea, that since you are able to work with textures, you should make a race with "flocked" fuzzy skin (some dolls are made this way like Calico Critters and Slyvian family animal dolls). I think this would work best for a "cute little doll" but since you aren't going that way with your miniature pygmys, you could try it on the Ren'kai. But I see that you are going with "snake" like scales. Since others mentioned body hair, I think "flocked" fur would work really well for the females. Please research this texture, when done right it is very fine and soft and fuzzy and short.
I ALWAYS perceived the GALKA of the FFXI game, as "BIG TEDDY BEARS". They were always played by the NICEST guys, the soft sweethearts who are usually fat IRL and humble and caring. I think "flocked teddy bear" and softer looks should be an option on your scale from "evil" Ren'kai. I understand that Samurai/ninja/Tank/warrior are the point to the Ren'kai but they don't need to be "evil" looking. The ARMOUR can do that.
Also, I do NOT want tusks, but if you're firm on making TUSKS a requirement for the race, please allow us to change their color from PEARLY WHITE, OPAL, to GOLD to silver, to Bronze to BLACK not just nasty yellow! Also you need to provide a huge variation in size and shape of tusks and don't have them linked/requiring an undershot jaw. I'd like my character's face to look pretty normal like a human but the tusks would just be extra.