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Feedback: We love the open sea PvP change - now, what about open PvP zones for World Bosses?
Liniker
Member, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
High risk, high reward, the open sea change was one of the best possible changes Intrepid made, now, we know that on the open seas we will have unique NPCs and rewards, but the best gear and materials that are legendary tier only drop from legendary world bosses,
because of that, I would love to see the area around the legendary world bosses being open pvp zones as well, so people can't abuse the corruption system and rely on that to try to do the legendary world bosses without the risk of being killed by other Guilds
the corruption system is amazing but it should be used only for it's intended purpose: deter ganking and PKing in the open world where there is nothing to gain, I feel like Legendary World bosses fall under the same ruleset as the open seas, and because of that I would love to see this change.
I feel like similar to the open seas, this would help to protect the PvErs in the game, by alleviating the need for gankers to PK random people, since now they have the oceans and they would also have the open world bosses areas to PK, and this would make the content even more challenging, and reducing the number of people that have access to Legendary gear, making it actually Legendary and not the "endgame" set that every guild can obtain.
because of that, I would love to see the area around the legendary world bosses being open pvp zones as well, so people can't abuse the corruption system and rely on that to try to do the legendary world bosses without the risk of being killed by other Guilds
the corruption system is amazing but it should be used only for it's intended purpose: deter ganking and PKing in the open world where there is nothing to gain, I feel like Legendary World bosses fall under the same ruleset as the open seas, and because of that I would love to see this change.
I feel like similar to the open seas, this would help to protect the PvErs in the game, by alleviating the need for gankers to PK random people, since now they have the oceans and they would also have the open world bosses areas to PK, and this would make the content even more challenging, and reducing the number of people that have access to Legendary gear, making it actually Legendary and not the "endgame" set that every guild can obtain.
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Comments
You enable people to attack a group of raiders without any corruption. Just a total wiped out and theft of the raid.
In the sea you have to spend a shit ton of resources for a battleship. That is the drawback and the reason to hesitate about the whole endevaour. What will make people think twice about backstabbing a raiding group and take their rb?
What a terrible idea...
I think some people need to go play a survival game or some crap like ESOs cyrodiil. Mmos are not for you.
@George_Black where the fuck you getting your info from? who told you people would hesitate to fight on the open seas because of having to spend resources?
what a stupid comment...
Thanks for telling me that! I've been playing MMORPGs for almost 20 years, but now because of some random dude called George Black, I realized MMOs are not for me! thx m8
The point of battlegrounds is to encourage more people to take part in the conflict, and world bosses are all about conflict.
Let people who are crafters to have their place in the game too.
At least let the gear be rare and materials more frequent.
As a crafter I don't care who kills the boss really.
but you need to remember that crafters don't gather the legendary mats, that is the job of master gatherers, crafters use the mats after they get gathered and processed
That's fine. Then master gatherers will be in the middle of the action too.
I thought the unprocessed things are called resources and after are processed are called materials.
I don't know how anyone can tell if there is something to gain or not.
If I run between nodes as a high skilled crafter, they cannot tell if I am loaded with Tier 4 materials or not, right? They have to attack me and see what drops. That is part of the game but I will not take often the risk to do that run, if I can pay others to do the job for me.
So seems like you're constantly flaming and insulting people in this forum. Maybe forums and mmos are not for you? Always thought you need at least minimum social skills for that
Open Seas are reduced risk in order to encourage a higher occurrence of PvP.
Higher occurrence of PvP means higher resource sink from the game.
If higher resource sink is needed, could also be random storms or random powerful bosses which will be strong enough to guarantee death.
The danger should come from the boss itself and the challenge should come from winning the dps race against other partys.
No, the danger should come from both PvE and PvP. PvX game, remember? You can't just push the PvP part away whenever you feel like it.
Imagine gatekeeping an internet fantasy game.
PvP around big bosses will happen naturally. Either through guild war system, or people will naturally flag in order to take-out opponents and kill the boss.
Albion Online handles this just fine. You can be in the middle of a world boss fight only to be ganked by a team three times your's size. This ensures that the boss remains challenging and loot rewarding even when all of its mechanics are discovered and meta'd to death. It's also where skill comes in. You have no idea how many times gankers dove my PvE group only for us to wipe them and take all their loot, making essentially 4x the money from our trip.
Disabling PvP in a PvX game is something I can't understand. There are plenty of games with mind-numbing raids in them already, where there is zero risk. Without the randomness element of PKers, keeping you on the edge of your seat, ready to fight to the death, all PvE content inevitably becomes a slog. The real fun comes in once you get over your 'gear fear', or in AoC's case, resource fear. Die. Lose your stuff. Murder other people. Take their stuff. Get better at the game. Now that's a gameplay loop.
Sorry @Dygz .. but Steven is the one making the game, and he says it's high risk, plus, I think he knows the game he is making better and has more experience in game design than you, so you can stop saying that in every single post you can find because you are wrong.
It is high risk and theres nothing to say about it. Open PvP with no corruption means higher PVP occurrence which translates to higher chances of dying which translates to More Risk due to the death penalties being. Even if your (not confirmed) scenario with 50% of the penalties is real, the risk is still higher
Now, can you find me a quote where it says we will take Reduced penalties on the open sea?
you can't, because that's just your assumption. Steven only said we would be flagged for PvP, and that does not mean everyone will be combatant or purple, we were also flagged for PvP during castle sieges in A1 and that had nothing to do with the green-purple-red flagging system, the rule set can be different, we don't know. Even with you creating scenarios and assumptions to validate your dislike for the change, you are still incorrect.
agree!
Yes you can, its called corruption, remember?
you can always "get good" and learn how to protect your healers... spawn locations will not be near the boss so people won't be dying and coming back - also, there are death penalties that are severe, even tho there is no corruption system, so it will not be a gank fest, it's an objective-based event
and this will already happen in the open seas, there are world bosses in the open sea and there is no corruption
It certainly reduces the risk of losing gatherables by half.
Steven saying it's auto-flag Combatant makes it auto-flag Combatant.
Again, no.
Higher occurence of engaging in PvP does not inherently increase the chance of dying from PvP combat.
It does reduce the death penalties by at least half. No Corruption means there is no risk of 4x death penalties and no risk of dropping gear.
We also still need to see what effect auto-flagging means for player characters that are Corrupt.
It did. For Sieges and Caravans, death penalties are turned off. So... in that case, it's even less risk than half death penalties.
That's what incentizes people to engage in PvP combat. Steven said that there is no Corruption in the Open Seas because it's international water. Which implies there's no one there to punish murderers with Corruption.
What Steven means is that the Open Waters are more dangerous in terms of higher chance to engage in PvP combat. But, the death penalties are reduced, so that's reduced risk.
I had to look a bit on wiki and I am still not sure
First I see no mention of PvP and the corruption system related to World bosses.
This page has only a "PvE difficulty" section https://ashesofcreation.wiki/World_bosses
So I assumed that there is only PVE allowed.
I also see
On the dedicated PvP page https://ashesofcreation.wiki/PvP
I see "Hunting grounds" as a possible place to PvP
There are many reasons to engage in open world PvP in Ashes of Creation.[7] Scarce resources.[7] Hunting grounds.[7] Caravans.[7] Sieges.[7] Guild wars.[7]https://ashesofcreation.wiki/Hunting_grounds
Hunting grounds refer to killing monsters or NPCs in the open-world.[2][3] This also refers to contesting resources.[4]While NPCs theoretically includes the world boss too, I feel that bosses are mentioned explicitly when needed.Raids are mentioned only on the PvE page: https://ashesofcreation.wiki/PvE
Going further into the Raid page I see nothing about PvP, I see
https://ashesofcreation.wiki/Raids
Can it be that PvE players are actually safe from being attacked by other players?
If not, then as @Morg7x7 said, chances are 0% to defeat them.
What happens if I cast a spell toward the boss and a player from another team gets in-between?
I get flagged? And the other team can kill me?
I have the strange feeling that
- either everybody knows Raids to allow PvP and the wiki is not complete
- or everybody assumes Raids to allow PvP while it was never the case
I don't play RPGs to murder people and take their stuff - I play RPGs to experience similar stories as what I read in heroic fantasy novels. While some killing is common, murdering and stealing people's stuff typically is not a thing in those stories.
So, murdering people and stealing their stuff is not fun to me.
But, it is fun for lots of gamers.
And it's cool to have games that cater to those gamers.
Looks like Ashes will join that list. Which is great... if it gain sustain enough of a population to keep the servers going.
Which seems likely since EvE is popular enough.
On one of the links I posted above is written
Ashes of Creation is a PvX game. Players will naturally encounter both PvP and PvE elements.[20][21][22] It is unlikely that a player could purely focus on just PvP or just PvE.[22]
The quote sends back to 2017.
Wars keep the ffa nature of pvp around a boss w/o including literally the whole server in the action (though they kinda do cause you'd be flagged, but still). This would obviously require the guild wars to be forced (so that the target of the declaration can't just deny it) and the cost for the war would have to be appropriate. But if the boss is worth it - you pay the higher price to dec the contesting guild.