I think you guys need to play OG BDO and understand the levels of gambling and desire to push to make gains as you gamble hundreds of hours of your time.
Could just buy the top enchanted gear like in BDO lol.
I'm talking about before you made enough money to buy it or it even being listed.
Why would anyone buy something before they had the money or even enchant anything before you had the money? Seems like a fool's folly to be bankrupt and then have your item(s) destroyed.
I think you guys need to play OG BDO and understand the levels of gambling and desire to push to make gains as you gamble hundreds of hours of your time.
Again, there's no gamble if you are willingly prepare yourself to spend those hours to assure that you don't fall below a certain threshold.
And the "desire to push" only exists if the game tells you "you gonna lose in 1 hit if you don't OE to a certain point". And iirc that's exactly what BDO tells its players.
Well ya that is part of it you need to be stronger plus all the other toxic elements around enhancing i don't want to write a paragraph explaining how it affects people.
If you spend 4 months of time getting materials and get nothing for it and lose everything or only have what you started with do to rng. You are still gambling
I'm talking about before you made enough money to buy it or it even being listed.
If you don't have enough money to cover your loss - you shouldn't be OEing your stuff in the first place. Again, do stupid things expect stupid results.
Obviously there'll be lucky people out there, but this would be no different from you killing a few mobs and immediately getting the required mats to fix your gear piece, if the system was based on faster gear decay rather than destruction.
If you spend 4 months of time getting materials and get nothing for it and lose everything or only have what you started with do to rng. You are still gambling
In a system based on decay you'd be doing literally the same though. You'd OE your stuff, you'd fail at some point and would have to go refarm stuff for repairs, to come back to your initial state.
overenchanting in l2 isnt the same as in bdo. theres no preparation or anything, other than get more weapons and more scrolls. chance doesnt increase with each failure. if you gonna blow 10 weapons to enchant one, you might as well just buy an already enchanted weapon. it would be cheaper ;3
But either of those options IS the preparation. This is how you OE safely. My friends and I have always OEd our stuff this way.
oeing 10 am in a x100 isnt the same on a x1 xD
but i guess that is the preparation. a lot of people risk it and get lucky for a few ++ tho
my comment was in relation to bdo where u break 39845745 pieces of gear with multiple characters to +1 ur main gear
overenchanting in l2 isnt the same as in bdo. theres no preparation or anything, other than get more weapons and more scrolls. chance doesnt increase with each failure. if you gonna blow 10 weapons to enchant one, you might as well just buy an already enchanted weapon. it would be cheaper ;3
But either of those options IS the preparation. This is how you OE safely. My friends and I have always OEd our stuff this way.
oeing 10 am in a x100 isnt the same on a x1 xD
but i guess that is the preparation. a lot of people risk it and get lucky for a few ++ tho
my comment was in relation to bdo where u break 39845745 pieces of gear with multiple characters to +1 ur main gear
my comment was in relation to bdo where u break 39845745 pieces of gear with multiple characters to +1 ur main gear
Yes, both games have their own methods of "preparing" for an OE. They differ in mechanics, but both of them require a ton of time from you, which was my point.
Stupid people will not spend that time, fail the OE and then complain that they fell prey to gambling. Slightly smarter people will simply say "I need to spend twice the time to make sure that I don't go down in power if I fail".
If you spend 4 months of time getting materials and get nothing for it and lose everything or only have what you started with do to rng. You are still gambling
In a system based on decay you'd be doing literally the same though. You'd OE your stuff, you'd fail at some point and would have to go refarm stuff for repairs, to come back to your initial state.
Or do you suggest a non-failstate system?
The point is I'm saying it is gambling and had bad effects, it doesn't matter of safe, lost or not. It is effective a system created around gambling, and gives people a easy out to quit a game.
Archeages enchantment worked similar to L2 in that you had a safe period, then a very much unsafe period. There were somewhat expensive ways to increase the safe range a small amount, but they were expensive.
The general rule from Archeage was similar to EVE's "don't fly what you can't afford to lose" adage, where people would simply state to not regrade what you can't afford to lose.
Since the game put out a serverwide message of every successful high level regrade, it wasn't uncommon to see people attempting literally hundreds at a time in order to try (and still usually fail) to get a high end item.
The point is I'm saying it is gambling and had bad effects, it doesn't matter of safe, lost or not. It is effective a system created around gambling, and gives people a easy out to quit a game.
I feel like people who'd leave the game over failing an OE at their own fault would've already left the game by the time they would even get a chance to experience OEing gear.
In other words, this would probably be the smallest filter of players in the game, while pretty much the entirety of the rest of the game is the big filter.
If you spend 4 months of time getting materials and get nothing for it and lose everything or only have what you started with do to rng. You are still gambling
In a system based on decay you'd be doing literally the same though. You'd OE your stuff, you'd fail at some point and would have to go refarm stuff for repairs, to come back to your initial state.
Or do you suggest a non-failstate system?
The point is I'm saying it is gambling and had bad effects, it doesn't matter of safe, lost or not. It is effective a system created around gambling, and gives people a easy out to quit a game.
Even a crafting system where different strengths can be produced is gambling then. I don't think you can remove gambling at all. Taking a caravan out is gambling, taking a ship out is gambling, going to arena is gambling. Anything can be called gambling by those who don't like a practice.
Taking a caravan out is gambling, taking a ship out is gambling, going to arena is gambling.
And all of those are a much worse form of "gambling" because their failstates depend on other players, rather than the victim themselves (well, partly at least). Which is why I think that the game has a ton of player filters that would weed out any weak-willed players even before anyone gets to OEing gear.
The point is I'm saying it is gambling and had bad effects, it doesn't matter of safe, lost or not. It is effective a system created around gambling, and gives people a easy out to quit a game.
I feel like people who'd leave the game over failing an OE at their own fault would've already left the game by the time they would even get a chance to experience OEing gear.
In other words, this would probably be the smallest filter of players in the game, while pretty much the entirety of the rest of the game is the big filter.
What i find interesting is you seem heavy for wanting casual players to stay and fighting for that, but than some of your points are extremally hardcore.
I feel you are severally underestimating the effect this has on a game. Even more so when people feel it is gambling and they are wasting insane amounts of their time and long term effects.
If you spend 4 months of time getting materials and get nothing for it and lose everything or only have what you started with do to rng. You are still gambling
In a system based on decay you'd be doing literally the same though. You'd OE your stuff, you'd fail at some point and would have to go refarm stuff for repairs, to come back to your initial state.
Or do you suggest a non-failstate system?
The point is I'm saying it is gambling and had bad effects, it doesn't matter of safe, lost or not. It is effective a system created around gambling, and gives people a easy out to quit a game.
Even a crafting system where different strengths can be produced is gambling then. I don't think you can remove gambling at all. Taking a caravan out is gambling, taking a ship out is gambling, going to arena is gambling. Anything can be called gambling by those who don't like a practice.
There is a difference between crafting and enhancing seeing multiple things blow up. People won't look at creating the same as destroying.
Those examples don't equal the same. Arena you are fighting with your own skill set and group, caravan is your own effort and skill, same with ships. We can't be pretending that is the same as again spending 1-6 months farming and farming and watching it disappear do to extreme low rng numbers. Than being gated out of content do to that level of rng.
I'd have to say you have lost the plot not understanding what I'm talking about for anyone who is thinking it is the same or a worse form by queing arena.....
What i find interesting is you seem heavy for wanting casual players to stay and fighting for that, but than some of your points are extremally hardcore.
I don't expect casuals to ever touch OEing. I want casuals to enjoy the game to their own small extent. If they can't do that for their own reasons or the overall hardcoreness of the game - that's a separate issue.
I feel you are severally underestimating the effect this has on a game. Even more so when people feel it is gambling and they are wasting insane amounts of their time and long term effects.
Any failure at max lvls of progress will set you back a lot of time. Preparing for an epic boss for several weeks, but then failing to even win the pvp for it will have wasted your preparation time. Doing the same for a monthly siege will waste even more of your time. Using top quality gear in hardcore pve or pvp where there's a high chance of dying will lead to the very expensive decay of said gear, which will bring with it very expensive repairs.
To me, playing the game itself means "wasting" a ton of time. Failing an OE is simply one side of that "waste". Of course some people won't be able to live with that loss, but, as I said, majority of such people will get filtered out even before they get their hands on an OE scroll.
han being gated out of content do to that level of rng.
Again, this is the issue, not the OE itself. This is why I keep saying that AoC's gear scaling should be tight. OE should only be there for those insane people that have the time, the will and the means to go for it, but it shouldn't give them the overwhelming power to just kill anything they see.
What i find interesting is you seem heavy for wanting casual players to stay and fighting for that, but than some of your points are extremally hardcore.
I don't expect casuals to ever touch OEing. I want casuals to enjoy the game to their own small extent. If they can't do that for their own reasons or the overall hardcoreness of the game - that's a separate issue.
I feel you are severally underestimating the effect this has on a game. Even more so when people feel it is gambling and they are wasting insane amounts of their time and long term effects.
Any failure at max lvls of progress will set you back a lot of time. Preparing for an epic boss for several weeks, but then failing to even win the pvp for it will have wasted your preparation time. Doing the same for a monthly siege will waste even more of your time. Using top quality gear in hardcore pve or pvp where there's a high chance of dying will lead to the very expensive decay of said gear, which will bring with it very expensive repairs.
To me, playing the game itself means "wasting" a ton of time. Failing an OE is simply one side of that "waste". Of course some people won't be able to live with that loss, but, as I said, majority of such people will get filtered out even before they get their hands on an OE scroll.
You aren't getting it, that is not the same. If you are playing a game doing the actions you want and the content you want that is good. Sometimes you will win sometimes you will lose, but it is your own actions and ability you can grow and improve.
That is not the same as a random number dictating if you progress or not.
Any player should have access to any form of enhancing that should not be set to only certain hardcore players. Which only makes the gap worse and level of content they can do. It shouldn't be that if you aren't hardcore you can't do it because amount of time you waste you won't ever be able to make it up.
Which that all leads to people doing what you say is "Stupid" because they physically can't play the same and get crapped on in pvp. And get int he mind set well ima try and hope for the best until they quit. Leading to exactly what I'm talking about.
How many mmorpg do you need to see this not work and have the population dying off, i thought you wanted it to grow for years to come??? BDO had already been losing all the people they got from the streamer push, Elyon was dead do to garbage gambling, no one liked Lost ark gambling and the walls that gated friends from doing content.
If you spend 4 months of time getting materials and get nothing for it and lose everything or only have what you started with do to rng. You are still gambling
In a system based on decay you'd be doing literally the same though. You'd OE your stuff, you'd fail at some point and would have to go refarm stuff for repairs, to come back to your initial state.
Or do you suggest a non-failstate system?
The point is I'm saying it is gambling and had bad effects, it doesn't matter of safe, lost or not. It is effective a system created around gambling, and gives people a easy out to quit a game.
Even a crafting system where different strengths can be produced is gambling then. I don't think you can remove gambling at all. Taking a caravan out is gambling, taking a ship out is gambling, going to arena is gambling. Anything can be called gambling by those who don't like a practice.
There is a difference between crafting and enhancing seeing multiple things blow up. People won't look at creating the same as destroying.
Those examples don't equal the same. Arena you are fighting with your own skill set and group, caravan is your own effort and skill, same with ships. We can't be pretending that is the same as again spending 1-6 months farming and farming and watching it disappear do to extreme low rng numbers. Than being gated out of content do to that level of rng.
I'd have to say you have lost the plot not understanding what I'm talking about for anyone who is thinking it is the same or a worse form by queing arena.....
I haven't lost the plot at all. OE has methods to mitigate the risk. Its all risk/reward. Take the risk and receive the reward. The whole game is risk/reward thus the whole game is gambling on risk for the reward.
han being gated out of content do to that level of rng.
Again, this is the issue, not the OE itself. This is why I keep saying that AoC's gear scaling should be tight. OE should only be there for those insane people that have the time, the will and the means to go for it, but it shouldn't give them the overwhelming power to just kill anything they see.
Then what is the power, and what is the effort to OE, cause i only go off BDO for this stuff mainly since it is the most current.
Then what is the power, and what is the effort to OE, cause i only go off BDO for this stuff mainly since it is the most current.
The entire thing is to simply say "I did it". Your +3 over someone else's +1 will get absolutely diluted in the party's +0, because the game is balanced around the party. And if your entire party is at +3 then your overall progression is so far beyond the +1 party that you would've probably had a higher chance at winning either way.
A few super lucky or super rich people at super high OE steps wouldn't have as much impact on the game as they probably do in BDO or LA (dunno about Elyon), because Ashes, imo, shouldn't be built around OEing your stuff as those games were.
In other words, I simply have a completely different philosophy on the entire gameplay setup, so we won't agree on this.
My +9 Kettle O'Fish should win because it has more fish in it than a +7 Kettle O'Fish.
The really important question is, at what point of OE or special enchanting of my personal Legendary do I get to name it ingame?
Overall, OE will always be a thing that people find a way and reason to do, because tiny margins are big margins at top levels. The only thing we can hope is that those who are not close to the top, don't care about the fact that they can't really beat the top, the same way it works in BDO.
Putting 600 hours of play on the line only matters if you don't have another 600 hours after.
Then what is the power, and what is the effort to OE, cause i only go off BDO for this stuff mainly since it is the most current.
The entire thing is to simply say "I did it". Your +3 over someone else's +1 will get absolutely diluted in the party's +0, because the game is balanced around the party. And if your entire party is at +3 then your overall progression is so far beyond the +1 party that you would've probably had a higher chance at winning either way.
A few super lucky or super rich people at super high OE steps wouldn't have as much impact on the game as they probably do in BDO or LA (dunno about Elyon), because Ashes, imo, shouldn't be built around OEing your stuff as those games were.
In other words, I simply have a completely different philosophy on the entire gameplay setup, so we won't agree on this.
It doesn't matter what we agree on like i said before what matters if what the decide to do. And talking and understanding the issues and risk it can have with players should be talked about.
This is why im asking what is the time frame and power you think it will have to i can better understand your perspective over brushing it off saying we wont agree. So i can see it in better context with the overall disccusion of this thread.
This is why im asking what is the time frame and power you think it will have to i can better understand your perspective over brushing it off saying we wont agree. So i can see it in better context with the overall disccusion of this thread.
Timeframe would highly depend on your success at gathering all the things required. It could range from months for an unlucky/weak guild to a single day by a stronger/luckier guild. And when I talk about luck, I'm talking about proper drops per boss kill.
I'd say 3-5 weapon and probably around 10 armor scrolls every 2 weeks for a strong guild should be fine. Ideally those scrolls would also be obtainable through means that go parallel to another few ways of getting them, so that this strong guild is not the only one to acquire the scrolls. If they have enough people to dominate all of those ways - that's just how it is.
Those scrolls would have to be used to get everyone to the safe enchanting limit, which would take weeeeeeeks. And then they might start OEing some of the stronger pieces of gear on their top dps chars. Obviously they could immediately OE their dpsers, but then we'd go back to the stupidity of some people.
Scroll should give 1% stat boost (p/m def and p/m atk that is), so a weapon with 100atk would have 101atk at +1. Multiplied by passives, skills, buffs and party synergies would probably yield a good 20-30 additional points of damage for that one point of atk.
This is in the context of highest lvl of gear. As for how I'd prefer gear to scale, I've said that in some other comment before (though I think my OE values were even higher there).
And if +3 is the safe limit of enchanting, then I'd probably say that +10 should be the upper limit. Though mainly that would depend on how tight the gear scaling is. I'd prefer if a lvl25 weapon at max OE was the same in main stats as base version of the max lvl weapon.
This is why im asking what is the time frame and power you think it will have to i can better understand your perspective over brushing it off saying we wont agree. So i can see it in better context with the overall disccusion of this thread.
Timeframe would highly depend on your success at gathering all the things required. It could range from months for an unlucky/weak guild to a single day by a stronger/luckier guild. And when I talk about luck, I'm talking about proper drops per boss kill.
I'd say 3-5 weapon and probably around 10 armor scrolls every 2 weeks for a strong guild should be fine. Ideally those scrolls would also be obtainable through means that go parallel to another few ways of getting them, so that this strong guild is not the only one to acquire the scrolls. If they have enough people to dominate all of those ways - that's just how it is.
Those scrolls would have to be used to get everyone to the safe enchanting limit, which would take weeeeeeeks. And then they might start OEing some of the stronger pieces of gear on their top dps chars. Obviously they could immediately OE their dpsers, but then we'd go back to the stupidity of some people.
Scroll should give 1% stat boost (p/m def and p/m atk that is), so a weapon with 100atk would have 101atk at +1. Multiplied by passives, skills, buffs and party synergies would probably yield a good 20-30 additional points of damage for that one point of atk.
This is in the context of highest lvl of gear. As for how I'd prefer gear to scale, I've said that in some other comment before (though I think my OE values were even higher there).
And if +3 is the safe limit of enchanting, then I'd probably say that +10 should be the upper limit. Though mainly that would depend on how tight the gear scaling is. I'd prefer if a lvl25 weapon at max OE was the same in main stats as base version of the max lvl weapon.
How many over enchant levels would there be and where does that fit into the 40-50% power?
How many over enchant levels would there be and where does that fit into the 40-50% power?
Like I said, +10 would probably be ok, but could vary depending on how their scale the gear.
50% doesn't change. You can have 2 atk on your character and one would come from the 1atk weapon and the other 1 would come from passives. OEing your gear doesn't change that it will sum up to 50% of your overall power.
Well, at least that's how I suppose they calculate that, because they haven't said shit about how they do it.
How many over enchant levels would there be and where does that fit into the 40-50% power?
Like I said, +10 would probably be ok, but could vary depending on how their scale the gear.
50% doesn't change. You can have 2 atk on your character and one would come from the 1atk weapon and the other 1 would come from passives. OEing your gear doesn't change that it will sum up to 50% of your overall power.
Well, at least that's how I suppose they calculate that, because they haven't said shit about how they do it.
How would I know We have no damn stats, no clue about what the stats will be or how they'll influence your overall dmg. I gave the example, +1 would be 1% (for a 100atk weapon), so +10 would be ~15% if my math is correct.
So it would be smth like 7% of the 50? I think? I'm shit at math.
How would I know We have no damn stats, no clue about what the stats will be or how they'll influence your overall dmg. I gave the example, +1 would be 1% (for a 100atk weapon), so +10 would be ~15% if my math is correct.
So it would be smth like 7% of the 50? I think? I'm shit at math.
Well I'm not wanting you to do the actual math just guess what you think the percent should be cause I'm wondering if it is within the range of 50% or an additional amount.
So if we take the average and say each piece of gear is about 3.3% of your power (some can be higher or lower im just doing a average based on each peice of gear) You will have like 42-43% of your power. With 7% coming from enchanting. So That would be like 2 bonus pieces of gear for maxed enchanted gear? So the over enchant aspect would be so minimal you wouldn't feel it and most likely wouldn't effect the overall fights if people choose to not do it.
Since its seperate places on the wiki
Gear has approximately a 40-50% influence on a players overall power in the game.[8]
Vertical enchantments are a power progression for a crafted item. More damage or mitigations, added effects or bonuses. Vertical enchantments include risks.[47]
My read of OE, is that
At base level the gear makes up 50% of your power. (I'm choosing to interpret that at face value of, you are twice as efficient with gear on, than not on)
At +1 or beyond level, the gear makes up more of your power than 50%.
I dont agree with Nikr here. In his example, of 2atk. 1atk would come from naked character, 1atk from base gear.
But when you +1 that gear... a naked character will still only have 1atk, but the +1 gear will give 1+(whatever_bonus_from_OEing)
So OEing will not remain 50% of your power.
If it was the case that OE gear was still only 50%, then somehow your character passives got stronger simply by OEing gear. And your naked character would perform better, which doesnt make sense to me.
Yes, it would be a theoretical boost to your chances of winning. Instead of getting hit for a 100 you'd maybe get hit by 90 or smth, so at a grander scale you'd lose fewer pvp encounters, because the incoming hp reduction would get you to 10% of hp instead of to 0.
Comments
Why would anyone buy something before they had the money or even enchant anything before you had the money? Seems like a fool's folly to be bankrupt and then have your item(s) destroyed.
Well ya that is part of it you need to be stronger plus all the other toxic elements around enhancing i don't want to write a paragraph explaining how it affects people.
If you spend 4 months of time getting materials and get nothing for it and lose everything or only have what you started with do to rng. You are still gambling
Obviously there'll be lucky people out there, but this would be no different from you killing a few mobs and immediately getting the required mats to fix your gear piece, if the system was based on faster gear decay rather than destruction.
Or do you suggest a non-failstate system?
oeing 10 am in a x100 isnt the same on a x1 xD
but i guess that is the preparation. a lot of people risk it and get lucky for a few ++ tho
my comment was in relation to bdo where u break 39845745 pieces of gear with multiple characters to +1 ur main gear
Glass Cannons only need weapons to +14 OE.
Yes, both games have their own methods of "preparing" for an OE. They differ in mechanics, but both of them require a ton of time from you, which was my point.
Stupid people will not spend that time, fail the OE and then complain that they fell prey to gambling. Slightly smarter people will simply say "I need to spend twice the time to make sure that I don't go down in power if I fail".
The point is I'm saying it is gambling and had bad effects, it doesn't matter of safe, lost or not. It is effective a system created around gambling, and gives people a easy out to quit a game.
The general rule from Archeage was similar to EVE's "don't fly what you can't afford to lose" adage, where people would simply state to not regrade what you can't afford to lose.
Since the game put out a serverwide message of every successful high level regrade, it wasn't uncommon to see people attempting literally hundreds at a time in order to try (and still usually fail) to get a high end item.
In other words, this would probably be the smallest filter of players in the game, while pretty much the entirety of the rest of the game is the big filter.
Even a crafting system where different strengths can be produced is gambling then. I don't think you can remove gambling at all. Taking a caravan out is gambling, taking a ship out is gambling, going to arena is gambling. Anything can be called gambling by those who don't like a practice.
What i find interesting is you seem heavy for wanting casual players to stay and fighting for that, but than some of your points are extremally hardcore.
I feel you are severally underestimating the effect this has on a game. Even more so when people feel it is gambling and they are wasting insane amounts of their time and long term effects.
There is a difference between crafting and enhancing seeing multiple things blow up. People won't look at creating the same as destroying.
Those examples don't equal the same. Arena you are fighting with your own skill set and group, caravan is your own effort and skill, same with ships. We can't be pretending that is the same as again spending 1-6 months farming and farming and watching it disappear do to extreme low rng numbers. Than being gated out of content do to that level of rng.
I'd have to say you have lost the plot not understanding what I'm talking about for anyone who is thinking it is the same or a worse form by queing arena.....
Any failure at max lvls of progress will set you back a lot of time. Preparing for an epic boss for several weeks, but then failing to even win the pvp for it will have wasted your preparation time. Doing the same for a monthly siege will waste even more of your time. Using top quality gear in hardcore pve or pvp where there's a high chance of dying will lead to the very expensive decay of said gear, which will bring with it very expensive repairs.
To me, playing the game itself means "wasting" a ton of time. Failing an OE is simply one side of that "waste". Of course some people won't be able to live with that loss, but, as I said, majority of such people will get filtered out even before they get their hands on an OE scroll.
You aren't getting it, that is not the same. If you are playing a game doing the actions you want and the content you want that is good. Sometimes you will win sometimes you will lose, but it is your own actions and ability you can grow and improve.
That is not the same as a random number dictating if you progress or not.
Any player should have access to any form of enhancing that should not be set to only certain hardcore players. Which only makes the gap worse and level of content they can do. It shouldn't be that if you aren't hardcore you can't do it because amount of time you waste you won't ever be able to make it up.
Which that all leads to people doing what you say is "Stupid" because they physically can't play the same and get crapped on in pvp. And get int he mind set well ima try and hope for the best until they quit. Leading to exactly what I'm talking about.
How many mmorpg do you need to see this not work and have the population dying off, i thought you wanted it to grow for years to come??? BDO had already been losing all the people they got from the streamer push, Elyon was dead do to garbage gambling, no one liked Lost ark gambling and the walls that gated friends from doing content.
I haven't lost the plot at all. OE has methods to mitigate the risk. Its all risk/reward. Take the risk and receive the reward. The whole game is risk/reward thus the whole game is gambling on risk for the reward.
Then what is the power, and what is the effort to OE, cause i only go off BDO for this stuff mainly since it is the most current.
A few super lucky or super rich people at super high OE steps wouldn't have as much impact on the game as they probably do in BDO or LA (dunno about Elyon), because Ashes, imo, shouldn't be built around OEing your stuff as those games were.
In other words, I simply have a completely different philosophy on the entire gameplay setup, so we won't agree on this.
The really important question is, at what point of OE or special enchanting of my personal Legendary do I get to name it ingame?
Overall, OE will always be a thing that people find a way and reason to do, because tiny margins are big margins at top levels. The only thing we can hope is that those who are not close to the top, don't care about the fact that they can't really beat the top, the same way it works in BDO.
Putting 600 hours of play on the line only matters if you don't have another 600 hours after.
It doesn't matter what we agree on like i said before what matters if what the decide to do. And talking and understanding the issues and risk it can have with players should be talked about.
This is why im asking what is the time frame and power you think it will have to i can better understand your perspective over brushing it off saying we wont agree. So i can see it in better context with the overall disccusion of this thread.
I'd say 3-5 weapon and probably around 10 armor scrolls every 2 weeks for a strong guild should be fine. Ideally those scrolls would also be obtainable through means that go parallel to another few ways of getting them, so that this strong guild is not the only one to acquire the scrolls. If they have enough people to dominate all of those ways - that's just how it is.
Those scrolls would have to be used to get everyone to the safe enchanting limit, which would take weeeeeeeks. And then they might start OEing some of the stronger pieces of gear on their top dps chars. Obviously they could immediately OE their dpsers, but then we'd go back to the stupidity of some people.
Scroll should give 1% stat boost (p/m def and p/m atk that is), so a weapon with 100atk would have 101atk at +1. Multiplied by passives, skills, buffs and party synergies would probably yield a good 20-30 additional points of damage for that one point of atk.
This is in the context of highest lvl of gear. As for how I'd prefer gear to scale, I've said that in some other comment before (though I think my OE values were even higher there).
And if +3 is the safe limit of enchanting, then I'd probably say that +10 should be the upper limit. Though mainly that would depend on how tight the gear scaling is. I'd prefer if a lvl25 weapon at max OE was the same in main stats as base version of the max lvl weapon.
How many over enchant levels would there be and where does that fit into the 40-50% power?
50% doesn't change. You can have 2 atk on your character and one would come from the 1atk weapon and the other 1 would come from passives. OEing your gear doesn't change that it will sum up to 50% of your overall power.
Well, at least that's how I suppose they calculate that, because they haven't said shit about how they do it.
Can i get a guess of that 50% power it is?
Is it 10%, 20%, 5%?
So it would be smth like 7% of the 50? I think? I'm shit at math.
Well I'm not wanting you to do the actual math just guess what you think the percent should be cause I'm wondering if it is within the range of 50% or an additional amount.
So if we take the average and say each piece of gear is about 3.3% of your power (some can be higher or lower im just doing a average based on each peice of gear) You will have like 42-43% of your power. With 7% coming from enchanting. So That would be like 2 bonus pieces of gear for maxed enchanted gear? So the over enchant aspect would be so minimal you wouldn't feel it and most likely wouldn't effect the overall fights if people choose to not do it.
Unless I'm mistaken about something?
Gear has approximately a 40-50% influence on a players overall power in the game.[8]
Vertical enchantments are a power progression for a crafted item. More damage or mitigations, added effects or bonuses. Vertical enchantments include risks.[47]
My read of OE, is that
At base level the gear makes up 50% of your power. (I'm choosing to interpret that at face value of, you are twice as efficient with gear on, than not on)
At +1 or beyond level, the gear makes up more of your power than 50%.
I dont agree with Nikr here. In his example, of 2atk. 1atk would come from naked character, 1atk from base gear.
But when you +1 that gear... a naked character will still only have 1atk, but the +1 gear will give 1+(whatever_bonus_from_OEing)
So OEing will not remain 50% of your power.
If it was the case that OE gear was still only 50%, then somehow your character passives got stronger simply by OEing gear. And your naked character would perform better, which doesnt make sense to me.