Glorious Alpha Two Testers!
Phase I of Alpha Two testing will occur on weekends. Each weekend is scheduled to start on Fridays at 10 AM PT and end on Sundays at 10 PM PT. Find out more here.
Check out Alpha Two Announcements here to see the latest Alpha Two news and update notes.
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Phase I of Alpha Two testing will occur on weekends. Each weekend is scheduled to start on Fridays at 10 AM PT and end on Sundays at 10 PM PT. Find out more here.
Check out Alpha Two Announcements here to see the latest Alpha Two news and update notes.
Our quickest Alpha Two updates are in Discord. Testers with Alpha Two access can chat in Alpha Two channels by connecting your Discord and Intrepid accounts here.
Comments
That's it. Same costume, same coverage on both. It is not difficult
I think i get what your point is.
It is just ... ... ... ... it gets really conspicuous for Example in some to many ASIA-MMO's, for Example.
That some Armors for female Characters are basically just a Bikini Swimsuit that is mimicking Leather- or Plate-Armor, or some Outfit of a Magician.
lol. " WEIRDO conservative " ... ... ...
Am i conservative when i say i like the Degree of "normal to sexy Armors" and so on - how it was done and handled in Worst of Warcraft ?
With time, more civil-looking - and a few more "hot" looking cosmetic Items were added. For Example the Valentine-Dresses and so on. And while People often give their best to make a so called "SLUT-Mog" -> i never saw any Transmogs with to extremely weird Designs aimed to being sexy as hell.
Because it is still limited.
I admit -> Ashes is currently more limited regarding that, than WoW - right ?
But we don't need Ashes to become a second Asia MMO, Guys.
Please. Anything but that. Let's just get "as sexy" as WoW Armors as a Maximum.
✓ Occasional Roleplayer
✓ Guild is " Balderag's Garde " for now. (German)
let me be clear I was not referring to you specifically when i said this. I was talking about the art team having no regard for what has been considered wildly popular in mmos throughout gaming history. Attractive characters wearing attractive and badass armor. Yes there are also the standard poor hobo sets, but these shouldnt make up a majority of what we are getting. I want both skimpy and practical armors. I dont want just one of these things. The reason people think this is because im currently advocating for the stuff that is not being made by the art team. I would be on the other side of the fence if it was reversed. I dont want the game overrun with slutty mogs either. but just not having them, in any capacity, is stupid.
I mean, look at this.
This headpiece literally shaves my characters hair. it looks, and my character looks awful. I used a preset with no sculpting. So this is something the art team deemed preset worthy face wise. Its not, "oh we will get there eventually" levels, its "oh crap something has gone wrong we need to course correct." imo.
This is a completely different tune than what you were singing the past few pages. So now revealing armors are fine as long as the dude model is also revealing?
Fix this confusion you are creating.
You know, FFXIV has been brought up as an example here multiple times. In fact, FFXIV has just as revealing clothes for guys as they have for gals. Heck, you could buy the "the emperor's new..." set and go completely naked.
There are 2 problems this doesn't address:
Females have different proportions, owing to their female physique. Female hips have to be wider than male to create space for a foetus to develop without killing the mother during pregnancy. Females have breasts for obvious reasons. These are characteristics by which they can be distinguished even from a distance, whereas they don't even exist currently. Pull the boob slider all the way to max, and you get a max-scaled ribcage.
Cosmetics, then, are a different topic, and personally, I believe we should get the option to run around showing zero skin at all, or lots of skin with seductive costumes, and everything in between, and this includes both sexes.
I highly doubt anyone is confused about the body shapes here:
The chest sculpt comes in two parts, one axis (vertical) is the overall scale of the torso, the other axis (horizontal) is for how far out the breasts/pecs reach. When you use the default body slider version, it only move along the diagonal that increases both overall scale and the size of the breasts/pecs concurrently, which is why you should use Sculpt instead.
Min chest scale, min breasts/pecs
Min chest scale, max breasts/pecs
I know.
I see. Makes me wonder if towards Release - > the same Item will leave your Characters Hair present.
Right now we don't have an ingame Feature to change our Characters' Looks after making them, right ?
I would really love to have this right now.
✓ Occasional Roleplayer
✓ Guild is " Balderag's Garde " for now. (German)
I remember back in the day when WOW night elf ladies bounced when they bounced.
I could not imagine wearing a mans suit of armor IRL? The chafing.. egads!
Here is hoping feminity comes to AOC at release, At least to the races that have those obvious differences. Dwarves all have beards, I am down with that.
For one, the female you posted there proved my point: She has no female hips.
With that being said, let me show you what the characters look ingame.
Embarrassing, isn't it? For one, the outfit looks bad, but also, she looks like a dude. And these are screenshots from up close, I said "from afar". I can make out a woman from a large distance in real life: proportions, choice of clothing, movement (women walk differently).
Not even remotely 'embarrassing' that padded leather fits like padded leather, and it still fits the forms differently. Definitely doesn't look 'like a dude'.
Your graphic settings are very low which doesn't help at all with clarity, but one side angle and it's obvious that's a female character model.
Nothing about this is ambiguous:
The only big miss is how small the heads are on all character models, something I have little doubt will be changeable once the full character creator is implemented rather than this barebones placeholder.
I promise I want to have a good faith conversation about this. I just don't think we are seeing the same thing here.
I can extend the olive branch and say that there are people who absolutely look like your screen shot in real life. In that way everything about the models mimic reality.
The models also mimic the harsh reality that countless people go through of uncomfort or outright hate if their own body. It's a serious life defining issue for a lot of people out there.
I would not wish that hardship on anyone in real life. I also don't want anyone to be forced to deal with it in the game.
We are putting hundreds to thousands of hours into these characters. I don't want to hate my characters body the whole time.
The screen shot you just posted has mostly masculine features with breast and a female head slapped on it. If I woke up in that body it would be devastating to me.
A major issue here is that at every step of the way it feels like the game is trying to force me into bodies I would not want. It feels like every slider in the creator ruins something when moved.
Contrast this to black desert, FFXIV, or throne and liberty. Where most options are good.
There is a trend of regressive ideas around character creators in the West and I really don't like. It just creates bodies that people don't want in reality. I don't want that for ashes.
We really do not know that the final character creator that is currently planned will solve these issues. It could be a cope.
I want to keep hammering this feedback hard until they show us something of promise.
This is my personal feedback, shared to help the game thrive in its niche.
Even the girls on his screenshots look terrible, to be totally honest. Not much female about them. And those aren't even screenshots from actual characters in the game, these are models from developer stream race presentations. They might as well not exist.
We really need a proper overhaul, not something half-assed, with BODY sculpting, not just face, and much more. Characters in this game look butt ugly, and you have to zoom in on my character to even have an educated guess which sex she might be.
I don't even know what Caeryl is arguing for. That the characters right now look pretty? That he doesn't want pretty characters? That the lowbie armours look good? That he doesn't want good-looking armours? What's his whole deal, is he whiteknighting, or is he a puritan? It's incredibly difficult to deal with this. Maybe it's just trolling, and he's sitting in front of his keyboard laughing his ass off?
Anyway, my points still stand. Current chars look terrible, we need good-looking armours and the char creator needs a huge update - as do the non-combat animations. No woman runs like Crash Bandicoot.
Both of you are ridiculous and showcase the actual issue. There's zero confusion about these characters being female, and calling them 'ugly' entirely negates whatever 'point' that other poster thought he was being clever about.
You're just upset they're not shunted into being 'hot'. Vhae as well is just a weirdo trying to use 'woke' therapist language to hide that they want the same thing, as if not wanting cartoonish/asian/shitty comic book proportions is 'mean to women' all the while calling normal women 'ugly' and saying they hate their bodies? Absolutely wild opinion there.
Calling these completely normal proportions ugly is what's actually regressive, and saying that it's not 'progressive' enough until you can make them objectified eye candy is so backwards to be laughable.
Obviously the character creator still needs work for flexibility and implementing a variety of sliders, more hair options, tattoos, scale sliders for more areas, but this thread isn't about those technical aspects, it's because you don't find the existing art direction attractive enough, titillating enough, not 'what you dream of at night', to use your own words.
Thankfully I'm taking great solace in the fact that Steven is of the same mind wanting realism over appealing to the eastern mmo crowd.
To quote someone else: This whole thread is basement dwellers whining that they can't make female characters into Barbie dolls
Instead of dealing with my points you are focusing on personal attacks on us and gaslighting us. I want this to keep this conversation civil, but you are making it challenging with this type of rhetoric.
Now I am upset and a weirdo? So now you are authoring my emotions for me and attacking my character instead of my ideas. Inserting things like: " 'woke' therapist language" in an attempt to reframe what I am saying incorrectly.
Also reframing my argument to be specific to women. It never was. Every face and body in this game has issues male or female.
I tried to be good faith in my reply and throw you a bone on this point. Now you are saying my words are regressive and laughable. Another attack on me instead of my ideas.
Another complete mischaracterization of my points on this topic. Throwing in things like "'what you dream of at night'" as a personal attack.
That's the neat part. I actually want realism too. As someone who is not ugly I would like to be represented in game.
This reminds me of the Stellerblade model who inconveniently for some people actually has a incredible body in real life. The problem I have here is that it's very disrespectful to the amount of handwork and dedication it takes to achieve a body people like hers. Male or Female it is very hard work.
More personal attacks and strawman's.
Just to restate my issues so you can focus on them if you want to try again:
-I think its way too hard to make anything that looks remotely good.
-I am worried some of the design choices that lead to ugly characters may be on purpose.
-I am optimistic things will be fixed in the future.
-I know some of the options I have picked in the character creator look different in game currently.
My goal is to put out my feedback and potentially have good civil conversations.
This is my personal feedback, shared to help the game thrive in its niche.
Here we go. Finally mask-off.
Now any doubts of what this is really about are removed and we get to the core of the problem - which I really don't want to discuss.
I'm not living in the USA and am trying to keep American politics out of my life as good as possible, and here it pops up again, rearing its ugly head.
At this point, a moderator can close here. Before this gets worse.
so characters all are ugly , females look nothing like females, armors are either bad or mediocre and there is almost 0 difference between the male and female ones and the models of females looking like shorter skinner dudes makes it worse .
its terrible how the base and little options that exist in the CC are like that prob means the future is grim otherwise they would of made sure the basic options in the game look good at least if the CC is not finished but nope.
here in hopes i am wrong but ...yea we can cope . anyway there will be no point of selling cosmetics if this is what they are going with and most of the people who play the game will make sure to let them know considering a majority of all the existing big and smaller MMOs end game is good looking characters and fashion.
the few who think this is fine or not a big deal doesnt look at concord and the few other games that did horribly for the past few years cuz they think it looks fine if not good when in reality the very first thing people memed is how horrible the characters in them looked which stopped a lot of people from even having the thought of trying those games ... well not like they were good games anyway and the ones that were somewhat decent didnt have the chance to succeeded cuz of that either meanwhile even games that were meh or nothing unique or even all that good like Once Human for example were a huge success and we all know why lol.
Ashes is already a niche game style in a niche genre.
Concord was a fairly popular game style in a popular genre.
If Concords characters were even remotely a factor in the most minor way. I don't imagine that is a problem Ashes can afford to have.
More than anything about Ashes I don't want the design pillars to change.
Ensuring the characters look good is a very strong move intrepid can make to keep the game sellable without adjusting the design pillars.
This is my personal feedback, shared to help the game thrive in its niche.
+1 laugh to the funniest jester here xD
There's nothing political about not wanting the ridiculous style of BDO or Tera anywhere near an MMO
It's not impossible to make even the current armour sets look okay (and even if not, it's lowbie gear, so whatever).
Here's every male elven mage on my server:
Left: My Bard in the char creator. Right: My Bard in game.
looks like something else
u can go realistic route and make things beautiful but western game devs hate anything that looks good ffs
its so good you can make whatever u want in it
Good stuff.
More evidence that Ashes needs to do better. IMO.
This is my personal feedback, shared to help the game thrive in its niche.
if they wanted that they'd of started by making the base of the models good looking , they bragged about the CC for it to turn like this , yes its no where near complete but all they been doing is making ugly ass stuff for the past 2 or so years.
like base your models using good looking people/actors whatever then mixing and matching them will make great characters no matter what and they can leave the ugly stuff for people who want that , all 2 of them...
when i played TnL beta one of the models in the limited CC for males was literally Henry cavil and like 99% of the people i saw were using that face mind you the rest of the options looked great too.
even tho that game is ..ugh they had good CC ,world and characters
The same complaints we're having here. It's obvious that it's not just a handful of users who's thinking the character models are terrible and need a rework.
I would love to see something good in Ashes.
This is my personal feedback, shared to help the game thrive in its niche.