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The problem with having “Tank” as a class name

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Comments

  • JubilumJubilum Member, Pioneer, Kickstarter
    Cripsus wrote: »
    @jubilum

    You would think something as simple as this would be pointless, but imagine if they named everything in the game without much thought. People take notice and it bothers them subconsciously. If they named all the cities, npc, territories, and bosses all really lame names people would take note and it would bother them. “Tank” just seems like a lack of effort, an error with consistency, or disregard for true fantasy immersion. It’s like the first boss we encountered was just named “Dragon”.

    My point is that language is constantly evolving. The are many words with different definitions. There are words we use daily that originally meant something completely different. I would not be surprised that in the near future Websters dictionary adds a definition to the word "tank" as the big guy in a video game that stands up front facing down the enemy encouraging them to hit him instead of his teammates behind him. A great day when we, the gamers of the world, have forced a new definition for a word. Who would of thought that could happen 25 years ago.
  • daxiongmao87daxiongmao87 Member
    Jexz wrote: »
    In the first mmo's when you needed a meat shield people would shout looking for "Tank" not looking for Protector or Defender. I think that validates Tank as a solid archetype nomenclature

    Protector and Defender can be substituted with Guardian

    I think you misunderstand. We aren't talking about replacing the 'tank' role in the role Trinity, we are talking about renaming the tank archetype.

    To counter your example, in old MMOs when people were looking for DPS (or DD), they didn't shout "Looking for Ranger," or "Looking for Fighter.". They shouted "Looking for DPS," YET there is no class called "DPS.".

    The term "tank" is a general descriptor for a role, not a class. You will have more than one type of tank, so why name a class of the tank role, tank? Seems redundant and silly and inconsistent with the other naming conventions
  • YuyukoyayYuyukoyay Member
    Well at least they can say there is only 1 tank now.
    zZJyoEK.gif

    U.S. East
  • ShoximityShoximity Member, Warrior of Old, Kickstarter, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    jubilum wrote: »
    Cripsus wrote: »
    @jubilum

    You would think something as simple as this would be pointless, but imagine if they named everything in the game without much thought. People take notice and it bothers them subconsciously. If they named all the cities, npc, territories, and bosses all really lame names people would take note and it would bother them. “Tank” just seems like a lack of effort, an error with consistency, or disregard for true fantasy immersion. It’s like the first boss we encountered was just named “Dragon”.

    My point is that language is constantly evolving. The are many words with different definitions. There are words we use daily that originally meant something completely different. I would not be surprised that in the near future Websters dictionary adds a definition to the word "tank" as the big guy in a video game that stands up front facing down the enemy encouraging them to hit him instead of his teammates behind him. A great day when we, the gamers of the world, have forced a new definition for a word. Who would of thought that could happen 25 years ago.


    I wouldn’t call a dog a cat. Why should I use a name for a military vehicle to call a fantasy character in video game? We use the phrase “x is built like a tank” meaning it/they can take a lot of damage or is strong and sturdy. It makes sense because we know what a tank is, but do Verra citizens know what a tank is? How did they get the vocab lol. Logically, tank makes sense, but it’s still not cohesive and it’s not immersive for a fantasy game.
  • GodsThesisGodsThesis Member
    edited August 2020
    Cripsus wrote: »
    @GodsThesis

    We don’t know how the class as a whole will be referred to. When looking for party members it may be “looking for tank”. Could mean any of the subclasses or it could be that another class takes “tank” as it’s secondary and can legitimately still tank without it being its main role. Just an example, but it could get annoying and confusing. Also, people just learning the game may have a preconceived notion that “Tanks” will only ever tank. That may be the intended case, but what if it turns out that tank + a certain sub class is a better option for healing, dps, or utility?

    Yeah man, I get what you are saying about the confusion that it can cause: class vs actual role, playstyle, etc. I too can agree that it could also be called defender or protector. Though I am pretty indifferent if it happens or not because I think it won't make a difference in the long run. But that's just me.

    And if it doesn't fit the intended design, it should be appropriately balanced.
  • XolzecXolzec Member
    Imagine quests with references to archetype/class names. If an NPC in a tavern says to me something like "I heard there's a cleric from <random place> sitting in the corner table", it sound pretty legit. Compare that to "I heard there's a tank from <random place> sitting in the corner table". This to me sounds awful. It just doesn't fit a fantasy themed game (other than on the meta level).

    I'm not a fan of many of the other class names either but "tank" is the worst offender by a huge margin.
  • BeekeeperBeekeeper Member
    It does feel weird, yes. If the cleric was called "healer", it would feel strange too, even if that's ultimately what the cleric is about.
  • MrScrewtapeMrScrewtape Member
    I love the name "tank" makes me feel powerful.
  • CaerylCaeryl Member, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    Leave TankTank alone you bully, it’s not his fault his name sucks
    Cripsus wrote: »
    I don’t know about you @/mcstackerson, but I’ve never seen a class in my fantasy RPG games that rolls around and shoots artillery shells in my party of fighters, wizards, and healers.

    God I wish
  • daxiongmao87daxiongmao87 Member
    screwtape wrote: »
    I love the name "tank" makes me feel powerful.

    Let's switch it to "M1 Abrams".
  • YuyukoyayYuyukoyay Member
    Well they will prob use the class names instead of archetype names in quests. The way they structured it is you aren't even an adventurer until 25 when you get your class. That's the kind of vibe I get from the class system in relation to the world.
    zZJyoEK.gif

    U.S. East
  • ShoximityShoximity Member, Warrior of Old, Kickstarter, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    @Yuyukoyay

    You will likely choose 1 of the 8 Archetypes when you are creating your character. If “Tank” is one of them, forevermore that archetype will be referenced on every single wiki, site, YouTube video, etc. So, even if they avoid using it in game, Tank will be very much be referenced somewhere. I think it looks tacky and would be annoying to reference a particular archetype as “tank”. Wish they would consider changing it.
  • YuyukoyayYuyukoyay Member
    I mean they may not. They may use terms we would to refer to part time jobs as people without a class. They may only use the archetypes to refer to things only we can see in our godly positions, but the people in the world refer to them as that guard. That mercenary. That hunter. That old lunatic playing the banjo.
    zZJyoEK.gif

    U.S. East
  • ShoelidShoelid Member, Alpha One, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    I think having "Tank" as an archetype name is similar to having the Cleric archetype be named "Healer". It gets the job done and is perfectly descriptive, but doesn't inherently lend itself to roleplay immersion. It also seems a little out of place when compared to all the other names.

    Personally, I would have named it something like Guardian. However, if Tank is what they want to stick to, then I have no doubt they'll do the work they need to in order to make work great.
  • MarcetMarcet Member
    I agree!! A class should not be called TANK.

    I vote for PROTECTOR.
  • YuyukoyayYuyukoyay Member
    Can't it be an actual good name though like Knight or Phalanx. Not one you'd find in a korean mmo.
    zZJyoEK.gif

    U.S. East
  • BeekeeperBeekeeper Member
    edited August 2020
    Yuyukoyay wrote: »
    Can't it be an actual good name though like Knight or Phalanx. Not one you'd find in a korean mmo.

    Knight would be awesome, but that's already Tank/Fighter. Phalanx would sound good for a skill name, since that's a formation in battle.
  • daxiongmao87daxiongmao87 Member
    Champion
    Partisan
    Chevalier
    Brute
    Defender
    Protector
    Bulwark
    Liberator
    Shield
    Barbarian?
  • YuyukoyayYuyukoyay Member
    It can also refer to the units that engage in phalanx formations. Champion, Noble, and Cavalier.
    zZJyoEK.gif

    U.S. East
  • BeekeeperBeekeeper Member
    I think Defender would make for the most uncomplicated change. It describes what it does without getting into meta jargon.
  • YuyukoyayYuyukoyay Member
    Doesn't sound cool though. Like Tank rawr I'm gonn roll you over.
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    U.S. East
  • daxiongmao87daxiongmao87 Member
    Juggernaut
  • BeeperBeeper Member, Alpha Two
    I vote we change the name of the Mage archetype to 'Howitzer.'

    USArmy_M114_howitzer.jpg
  • BaSkA_9x2BaSkA_9x2 Member, Alpha Two
    I also agree Tank is a bad name for the archetype, unless it has a cannon and is made of steel. I would prefer if it was Guardian, Warden, Protector or forgive me for I will sin: Warrior. It would be cool to make a poll about this imho!
    🎶Galo é Galo o resto é bosta🎶
  • DeJokeDeJoke Member
    Cripsus wrote: »
    Yea, the problem is that tank is used at all to begin with. The definition of “tank”is a military vehicle. We only know the slang meaning of the word as gamers because it’s what we use to define a specific role. They should use warrior or some other Base class name. Tank shouldn’t even be on the list.

    As an avid gamer. When I hear tank I don't think about the vehicle. I think about the meat shield taunter in a raid.

    Tank wasn't even first used for the vehicle. It was used as a container. eg. A water tank. If I google tank now, all I get is TankJuice and I've never used them.

    A tank is what it is. And when you're level 25 you won't be just a tank anymore. Heck, I wouldn't have worried if all the first tier classes were as follows:

    healer
    big two-hander weapon
    dagger user
    magi
    bow and arrow man
    musical man
    tank
    and well, I can't think of something for the summoner, as it is what it is, like the tank.

    As you don't get your true name until you've chosen a sub/second class.
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  • WiplasherWiplasher Member, Phoenix Initiative, Royalty, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    How the actually heck is this still being discussed? How is it a forum post? I don't understand...

    THE TITLE ISN'T EVEN ACCURATE

    I have never once gotten a tank in an mmo confused with an armored vehicle. I have also never gotten a tank that is an armored vehicle confused with the damage soaking agro getting archetype. Find me one person that in conversation got the two confused and i'll change my opinion.

    Tank is an archetype not a class. Yeah if it was a class I'd say come on we can come up with a cooler name. But it isn't a class so who cares? It is a generic term used to describe a group of classes.
  • ShoximityShoximity Member, Warrior of Old, Kickstarter, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    wiplasher4 wrote: »
    How the actually heck is this still being discussed? How is it a forum post? I don't understand...

    THE TITLE ISN'T EVEN ACCURATE

    I have never once gotten a tank in an mmo confused with an armored vehicle. I have also never gotten a tank that is an armored vehicle confused with the damage soaking agro getting archetype. Find me one person that in conversation got the two confused and i'll change my opinion.

    Tank is an archetype not a class. Yeah if it was a class I'd say come on we can come up with a cooler name. But it isn't a class so who cares? It is a generic term used to describe a group of classes.

    LOL. No one said they are confused. If you didn't pick up the tongue in cheek, sarcasm, and fact that "Tank" is a lame name to call anything as a formal class, archetype, or w/e... then you are missing the point.
  • WiplasherWiplasher Member, Phoenix Initiative, Royalty, Alpha Two, Early Alpha Two
    Cripsus wrote: »
    wiplasher4 wrote: »
    How the actually heck is this still being discussed? How is it a forum post? I don't understand...

    THE TITLE ISN'T EVEN ACCURATE

    I have never once gotten a tank in an mmo confused with an armored vehicle. I have also never gotten a tank that is an armored vehicle confused with the damage soaking agro getting archetype. Find me one person that in conversation got the two confused and i'll change my opinion.

    Tank is an archetype not a class. Yeah if it was a class I'd say come on we can come up with a cooler name. But it isn't a class so who cares? It is a generic term used to describe a group of classes.

    LOL. No one said they are confused. If you didn't pick up the tongue in cheek, sarcasm, and fact that "Tank" is a lame name to call anything as a formal class, archetype, or w/e... then you are missing the point.

    Oh I think it is very boring. But its a generic term we have been using for over a decade in games. We would need to come up with a generic term that classes could fall under. Tank simply fits the best and no one gets confused.

    If its not broken don't fix it I think works best here.
  • JexzJexz Member
    edited August 2020
    I like Hank the tank or Murtle the Turtle more than
    Bender the Defender or Hector the protector so I hope it stays or that we get a turtle archetype.
  • WMC51WMC51 Member
    I would probably go with defender instead
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