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Corruption system in relation to auto-flagging in open sea

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Comments

  • mcstackersonmcstackerson Member, Phoenix Initiative, Royalty, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    Azherae wrote: »
    Azherae wrote: »
    Azherae wrote: »
    So I ask you, if you assume that this will cause a loss of interest in some part of the population and that number will not be 'regained' by pulling in more than it loses, is it still worth it?

    I don't think anyone is in the position to make this call.

    There was going to be a lot of awkwardness with ships and the corruption system so this probably will make it a better experience for players who are interested in that kind of content. It also could make the game better for people who don't want to pvp since more pvp minded players will move towards the ocean, which people could avoid.

    There is also the question of what other features already existed in the game to push away the same group of people who don't like this change. How many of those people are going to be turned off by getting their caravans raided, being attacked at farming spots, or having their node raised?

    I believe your argument here is close to 'saying that Dygz and I are rare'?

    Dygz has specific interest in at least two of those things and I have interest in three.

    I am 'in the group of people who don't like this change but were explicitly looking forward to all those other things'. Am I correct in my understanding?

    I see no reason for complexity with ships, because the Corruption system only works based on kills right now anyway, and if Naval Content is anything like ArcheAge according to my research, the ship goes down LAST. I don't understand what you are seeing. Corruption is for KILLS, not attacks. Where is the awkwardness?

    I wasn't meaning to separate you out like that but i can see how you got that idea.

    My first paragraph boils down to a better experience for people who like this content possibly and indirect positive affect on players who don't like pvp because of where pvpers will now be.

    The second paragraph which i guess is where you got your first statement was asking how many of the players in "you and dygz" group are already turned off by other pvp features of the game. You are in a group of people who don't like the open pvp on the sea but are fine with being attacked while farming, having your caravans raided, being war dec'ed, and having your node raised by a siege.

    Archeage's ocean is also a prominent war zone so people can always attack each other. We don't know how prominent boarding will be. I kind of hope it's not that easy so ship v ship is different then zerg v zerg.

    To me, the main source of awkwardness I was thinking is from none combat activities on the ship like repairing and driving. Are players engaging in those activities safe unless people want to get corrupted? I already see some awkwardness in large scale fights where people need to attack each other to become combatant. Normally you want to engage hard on a group but with corruption, you are going to want to be careful you don't kill someone before they have had a chance to fight back.

    I believe I was singling myself out in an abstract way, which I shouldn't have done due to our communication issues.

    So in your case I'll just ask the other question.

    "If Corruption is complex in Open Seas, is it also too complex in coastal ship battles?"

    I'm not saying too complex but i think we will see some awkwardness i mentioned. You will have a mix of none-combatants and combatants going at it and managing how people are flagged could become part of the strategy, which i'm thinking could be awkward.
    smallerLizard.jpg
  • AzheraeAzherae Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    Azherae wrote: »
    Azherae wrote: »
    Azherae wrote: »
    So I ask you, if you assume that this will cause a loss of interest in some part of the population and that number will not be 'regained' by pulling in more than it loses, is it still worth it?

    I don't think anyone is in the position to make this call.

    There was going to be a lot of awkwardness with ships and the corruption system so this probably will make it a better experience for players who are interested in that kind of content. It also could make the game better for people who don't want to pvp since more pvp minded players will move towards the ocean, which people could avoid.

    There is also the question of what other features already existed in the game to push away the same group of people who don't like this change. How many of those people are going to be turned off by getting their caravans raided, being attacked at farming spots, or having their node raised?

    I believe your argument here is close to 'saying that Dygz and I are rare'?

    Dygz has specific interest in at least two of those things and I have interest in three.

    I am 'in the group of people who don't like this change but were explicitly looking forward to all those other things'. Am I correct in my understanding?

    I see no reason for complexity with ships, because the Corruption system only works based on kills right now anyway, and if Naval Content is anything like ArcheAge according to my research, the ship goes down LAST. I don't understand what you are seeing. Corruption is for KILLS, not attacks. Where is the awkwardness?

    I wasn't meaning to separate you out like that but i can see how you got that idea.

    My first paragraph boils down to a better experience for people who like this content possibly and indirect positive affect on players who don't like pvp because of where pvpers will now be.

    The second paragraph which i guess is where you got your first statement was asking how many of the players in "you and dygz" group are already turned off by other pvp features of the game. You are in a group of people who don't like the open pvp on the sea but are fine with being attacked while farming, having your caravans raided, being war dec'ed, and having your node raised by a siege.

    Archeage's ocean is also a prominent war zone so people can always attack each other. We don't know how prominent boarding will be. I kind of hope it's not that easy so ship v ship is different then zerg v zerg.

    To me, the main source of awkwardness I was thinking is from none combat activities on the ship like repairing and driving. Are players engaging in those activities safe unless people want to get corrupted? I already see some awkwardness in large scale fights where people need to attack each other to become combatant. Normally you want to engage hard on a group but with corruption, you are going to want to be careful you don't kill someone before they have had a chance to fight back.

    I believe I was singling myself out in an abstract way, which I shouldn't have done due to our communication issues.

    So in your case I'll just ask the other question.

    "If Corruption is complex in Open Seas, is it also too complex in coastal ship battles?"

    I'm not saying too complex but i think we will see some awkwardness i mentioned. You will have a mix of none-combatants and combatants going at it and managing how people are flagged could become part of the strategy, which i'm thinking could be awkward.

    I'm going to switch to a mode of communicating with you that I hope will be more effective, and hope that you don't find it offensive (I doubt you will, but it may seem annoying, possibly condescending)

    You think in very concrete ways, in my opinion, and sometimes your opinions are formed based on underlying perspectives that I can't see because you are very economical with your words.

    I will mirror this. From this point on, all my posts to you will start with either 'Please explain' or 'Please clarify'. This will allow me to force myself to reframe my perspectives and questions into a form that I feel will be more effective communication. Sometimes this may be asking you to repeat stuff you've already said, more specifically.

    So, for this one.

    "Please explain if you are still of the opinion that the reason for the change is technical."
    Sorry, my native language is Erlang.
    
  • XiraelAcaronXiraelAcaron Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    edited August 29
    Dolyem wrote: »
    [ I ask you, if you assume that this will cause a loss of interest in some part of the population and that
    Dolyem wrote: »
    Dolyem wrote: »

    For technical problems technical solutions can be found. They should be discussed. If this was the reason for the change this solution sounds lazy to me.

    I'd assume that they implemented it, and once they tested perhaps made a judgement call saying that having to flag for this content was bad gameplay

    Then they should tell us that. And I already have a first idea of the top of my head of how you can make corruption work with ships. We can discuss it if you like, but it would turn this discussion in a totally different direction.

    Go for it, it's more info for devs

    OK, its simple. But please remember its a first shot. I did not think about every last aspect. The main ocean content is done by ships, yes? Then why not have ship owners have a ship corruption status that applies to every ship that is summoned by them and is independent from the players corruption state (or from the other occupants). So you summon a ship and the ship gets corruption (or however you want to call it. Lorewise it is of course total crap) and reduces corruption if it does normal naval gameplay or is sunk. Basically the same as on land, only for ships. You still have auto-flagging zones around caravans/merchant ships/world bosses etc. As a drawback fot going back, red ships cannot go to harbors to be repaired or improved until purple.
    Of course, if the reason was to increase the risk on the ocean that will not help. You have to think about something other there.

    Interesting take, how would that negatively affect the players on the ship then? And if it got too corrupted, wouldn't it be as simple as making another?

    It would not affect the players on the ship. I have no problem with that. If they leave the ship they go back to their normal corruption state. I have no problem with distinguishing the two states. What happend on the ocean stays on the ocean.
    The owners ship corruption status would apply to all ships that they summon. You could use another players ship next time, but summoning is only possible at harbors so that is very inconvenient. Also at some point you have a whole lot of red ships that you have to get to purple somehow. Also they would only be able to be sold in a purple state.
  • mcstackersonmcstackerson Member, Phoenix Initiative, Royalty, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    Azherae wrote: »
    "Please explain if you are still of the opinion that the reason for the change is technical."

    Sorry, i don't think it's purely technical, just thought it might have played a role. I also think it was made because the kind of content that was planned for the sea and to support the pirate playstyle.
    smallerLizard.jpg
  • DygzDygz Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    The second paragraph which i guess is where you got your first statement was asking how many of the players in "you and dygz" group are already turned off by other pvp features of the game. You are in a group of people who don't like the open pvp on the sea but are fine with being attacked while farming, having your caravans raided, being war dec'ed, and having your node raised by a siege.
    I'm not sure what you mean by "turned off by other pvp featurs in the game".
    I'm OK with being attacked on the Open Sea as long as I am flagged as a Non-Combatant and the PKer is punished by Corruption if I choose not to fight back.


    Archeage's ocean is also a prominent war zone so people can always attack each other.
    Right. So, I don't understand your push back when I said Ashes now seems much like that.
  • XiraelAcaronXiraelAcaron Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    The only problem I see is that you cannot log out on the open see, I believe. If you spawn again in an harbor if you log out/disconnect, it would not be possible to spawn the ship then without guard ships attacking it. So maybe the state only becoms active when you cross into the open sea.
  • DygzDygz Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    edited August 29
    (Haha! I was wondering if they would merge these! 335 new posts!)
  • VaknarVaknar Moderator, Member, Staff
    edited August 29
    Hiya everyone!

    I merged two threads on the same topic: (Auto-flagging in open sea) together!

    I also wanted to mention a comment that Steven made following the livestream, which can be found here

    Steven discussed this topic and brings forward a few notes to remember about different game features and elements to our design direction. I highly encourage everyone to read it! ^_^

    Carry on and keep up the awesome discussions!

    P.S. Please be sure to be well unto one another. I know we're all very passionate about not only the game, but this topic. But remember - we're all here because we love MMORPGs and want to see the game succeed, and we all have that in common :heart:
    community_management.gif
  • VaknarVaknar Moderator, Member, Staff
    I'll also drop Steven's comment from our VOD of the livestream on YouTube here:

    Steven Sharif:

    Happy Saturday my glorious friends, this livestream was a bit longer than expected but there was a lot to cover. I wanted to make sure to encourage everyone to comment your thoughts here on the YouTubes, as well as on our forums and Reddit with what was discussed, I'm sure I sound like a broken record, but the feedback is very important. Lastly, I would like to point out that while the open seas will be open-PvP zones, there are still alternate methods of traveling between the two continents, including flight paths between coastal nodes, airships between metropolises-ai and also a scientific node's vassal network's teleportation options (should that network extend across the seas or to nodes on islands), although none of these methods will allow the transit of materials or gatherables. Additionally, there will be healthy amounts of sea content within the coastlines of the continents that does not fall into the "open sea" area. It is important that the open seas represent the rewards and opportunity that cross-continental trade provides, but also the riches of treasure that the seas offer, all come with risk and danger... Ashes will always double down on the core philosophy of risk vs reward. Hope you enjoy much love to you all. <3
    community_management.gif
  • AzheraeAzherae Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    Azherae wrote: »
    "Please explain if you are still of the opinion that the reason for the change is technical."

    Sorry, i don't think it's purely technical, just thought it might have played a role. I also think it was made because the kind of content that was planned for the sea and to support the pirate playstyle.

    Please clarify if you expect Coastal content to not include things like meaningful/complex PvE encounters, in contrast to the Open Sea where it might be necessary to change the flagging system due to such encounters.
    Sorry, my native language is Erlang.
    
  • DolyemDolyem Member
    Dolyem wrote: »
    [ I ask you, if you assume that this will cause a loss of interest in some part of the population and that
    Dolyem wrote: »
    Dolyem wrote: »

    For technical problems technical solutions can be found. They should be discussed. If this was the reason for the change this solution sounds lazy to me.

    I'd assume that they implemented it, and once they tested perhaps made a judgement call saying that having to flag for this content was bad gameplay

    Then they should tell us that. And I already have a first idea of the top of my head of how you can make corruption work with ships. We can discuss it if you like, but it would turn this discussion in a totally different direction.

    Go for it, it's more info for devs

    OK, its simple. But please remember its a first shot. I did not think about every last aspect. The main ocean content is done by ships, yes? Then why not have ship owners have a ship corruption status that applies to every ship that is summoned by them and is independent from the players corruption state (or from the other occupants). So you summon a ship and the ship gets corruption (or however you want to call it. Lorewise it is of course total crap) and reduces corruption if it does normal naval gameplay or is sunk. Basically the same as on land, only for ships. You still have auto-flagging zones around caravans/merchant ships/world bosses etc. As a drawback fot going back, red ships cannot go to harbors to be repaired or improved until purple.
    Of course, if the reason was to increase the risk on the ocean that will not help. You have to think about something other there.

    Interesting take, how would that negatively affect the players on the ship then? And if it got too corrupted, wouldn't it be as simple as making another?

    It would not affect the players on the ship. I have no problem with that. If they leave the ship they go back to their normal corruption state. I have no problem with distinguishing the two states. What happend on the ocean stays on the ocean.
    The owners ship corruption status would apply to all ships that they summon. You could use another players ship next time, but summoning is only possible at harbors so that is very inconvenient. Also at some point you have a whole lot of red ships that you have to get to purple somehow. Also they would only be able to be sold in a purple state.

    At that point I'd have 1 player designated as a corrupt ship and have another player follow without engaging as the designated green ship. Problem arises? Abandon ship and hop on the green one, sail away without dying unless the other already damaged ship decides to engage. I try to think up exploits for everything so don't take it as me saying you're wrong, this is just how I would avoid it
    GJjUGHx.gif
  • mcstackersonmcstackerson Member, Phoenix Initiative, Royalty, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    Dygz wrote: »
    Archeage's ocean is also a prominent war zone so people can always attack each other.
    Right. So, I don't understand your push back when I said Ashes now seems much like that.

    The peace and war zones disables and enables pvp, which is a lot different the ashes where pvp is enabled everywhere but is now not punished on the ocean.
    smallerLizard.jpg
  • George_BlackGeorge_Black Member, Intrepid Pack
    This makes it easier to keep tracking Dygzs attention seeking posts. Thanks
  • Rip. @Dolyem lost out on the OP thread jousting match. You'll get em next time buddy!
    5000x1000px_Sathrago_Commission_RavenJuu.jpg
    Commissioned at https://fiverr.com/ravenjuu
  • AzheraeAzherae Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    Vaknar wrote: »
    Hiya everyone!

    I merged two threads on the same topic: (Auto-flagging in open sea) together!

    I also wanted to mention a comment that Steven made following the livestream, which can be found here

    Steven discussed this topic and brings forward a few notes to remember about different game features and elements to our design direction. I highly encourage everyone to read it! ^_^

    Carry on and keep up the awesome discussions!

    P.S. Please be sure to be well unto one another. I know we're all very passionate about not only the game, but this topic. But remember - we're all here because we love MMORPGs and want to see the game succeed, and we all have that in common :heart:

    I am very concerned that these two specific topics have been merged together for multiple reasons. I do not wish for this to be undone, but I do wish to ask, if another topic was made even more explicitly regarding the reasoning for the change, if that would also be merged.
    Sorry, my native language is Erlang.
    
  • DolyemDolyem Member
    Vaknar wrote: »
    Hiya everyone!

    I merged two threads on the same topic: (Auto-flagging in open sea) together!

    I also wanted to mention a comment that Steven made following the livestream, which can be found here

    Steven discussed this topic and brings forward a few notes to remember about different game features and elements to our design direction. I highly encourage everyone to read it! ^_^

    Carry on and keep up the awesome discussions!

    P.S. Please be sure to be well unto one another. I know we're all very passionate about not only the game, but this topic. But remember - we're all here because we love MMORPGs and want to see the game succeed, and we all have that in common :heart:

    I feel cheated, I posted my discussion first 🤣🤣🤣🤣 I kid
    GJjUGHx.gif
  • NaughtyBruteNaughtyBrute Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    Dolyem wrote: »
    Vaknar wrote: »
    Hiya everyone!

    I merged two threads on the same topic: (Auto-flagging in open sea) together!

    I also wanted to mention a comment that Steven made following the livestream, which can be found here

    Steven discussed this topic and brings forward a few notes to remember about different game features and elements to our design direction. I highly encourage everyone to read it! ^_^

    Carry on and keep up the awesome discussions!

    P.S. Please be sure to be well unto one another. I know we're all very passionate about not only the game, but this topic. But remember - we're all here because we love MMORPGs and want to see the game succeed, and we all have that in common :heart:

    I feel cheated, I posted my discussion first 🤣🤣🤣🤣 I kid

    And I indented mine to be about the reasoning for the change, not if the change is good or not.. we were both cheated :)
  • DygzDygz Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    The peace and war zones disables and enables pvp, which is a lot different the ashes where pvp is enabled everywhere but is now not punished on the ocean.
    That is different, yes. It's a non sequitur though.
  • DolyemDolyem Member
    Dolyem wrote: »
    Vaknar wrote: »
    Hiya everyone!

    I merged two threads on the same topic: (Auto-flagging in open sea) together!

    I also wanted to mention a comment that Steven made following the livestream, which can be found here

    Steven discussed this topic and brings forward a few notes to remember about different game features and elements to our design direction. I highly encourage everyone to read it! ^_^

    Carry on and keep up the awesome discussions!

    P.S. Please be sure to be well unto one another. I know we're all very passionate about not only the game, but this topic. But remember - we're all here because we love MMORPGs and want to see the game succeed, and we all have that in common :heart:

    I feel cheated, I posted my discussion first 🤣🤣🤣🤣 I kid

    And I indented mine to be about the reasoning for the change, not if the change is good or not.. we were both cheated :)

    Curse these efficient and on-the-spot moderators! Hahaha @Vaknar doing his job too well
    GJjUGHx.gif
  • Azherae wrote: »
    Vaknar wrote: »
    Hiya everyone!

    I merged two threads on the same topic: (Auto-flagging in open sea) together!

    I also wanted to mention a comment that Steven made following the livestream, which can be found here

    Steven discussed this topic and brings forward a few notes to remember about different game features and elements to our design direction. I highly encourage everyone to read it! ^_^

    Carry on and keep up the awesome discussions!

    P.S. Please be sure to be well unto one another. I know we're all very passionate about not only the game, but this topic. But remember - we're all here because we love MMORPGs and want to see the game succeed, and we all have that in common :heart:

    I am very concerned that these two specific topics have been merged together for multiple reasons. I do not wish for this to be undone, but I do wish to ask, if another topic was made even more explicitly regarding the reasoning for the change, if that would also be merged.

    They need to be merged now i dont need to look between two threads it was kind of annoying to keep up with the info. We don't need like 5 different threads running on the same topic.
  • XiraelAcaronXiraelAcaron Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    Dolyem wrote: »
    Dolyem wrote: »
    [ I ask you, if you assume that this will cause a loss of interest in some part of the population and that
    Dolyem wrote: »
    Dolyem wrote: »

    For technical problems technical solutions can be found. They should be discussed. If this was the reason for the change this solution sounds lazy to me.

    I'd assume that they implemented it, and once they tested perhaps made a judgement call saying that having to flag for this content was bad gameplay

    Then they should tell us that. And I already have a first idea of the top of my head of how you can make corruption work with ships. We can discuss it if you like, but it would turn this discussion in a totally different direction.

    Go for it, it's more info for devs

    OK, its simple. But please remember its a first shot. I did not think about every last aspect. The main ocean content is done by ships, yes? Then why not have ship owners have a ship corruption status that applies to every ship that is summoned by them and is independent from the players corruption state (or from the other occupants). So you summon a ship and the ship gets corruption (or however you want to call it. Lorewise it is of course total crap) and reduces corruption if it does normal naval gameplay or is sunk. Basically the same as on land, only for ships. You still have auto-flagging zones around caravans/merchant ships/world bosses etc. As a drawback fot going back, red ships cannot go to harbors to be repaired or improved until purple.
    Of course, if the reason was to increase the risk on the ocean that will not help. You have to think about something other there.

    Interesting take, how would that negatively affect the players on the ship then? And if it got too corrupted, wouldn't it be as simple as making another?

    It would not affect the players on the ship. I have no problem with that. If they leave the ship they go back to their normal corruption state. I have no problem with distinguishing the two states. What happend on the ocean stays on the ocean.
    The owners ship corruption status would apply to all ships that they summon. You could use another players ship next time, but summoning is only possible at harbors so that is very inconvenient. Also at some point you have a whole lot of red ships that you have to get to purple somehow. Also they would only be able to be sold in a purple state.

    At that point I'd have 1 player designated as a corrupt ship and have another player follow without engaging as the designated green ship. Problem arises? Abandon ship and hop on the green one, sail away without dying unless the other already damaged ship decides to engage. I try to think up exploits for everything so don't take it as me saying you're wrong, this is just how I would avoid it

    I am not sure what the scenario is. Do you want to avoid attacks and use the designated green ship as a get-away or do you want to use the red one to PK and the green one is for what? What is the goal in the latter secenario?

    In the first scenario, you can do that. You still loose the red ship you abondon. Its a high price to avoid a player death. I would think the ship death would be a higher priority to avoid.
  • George_BlackGeorge_Black Member, Intrepid Pack
    edited August 29
    Ignore azhrae...
  • DolyemDolyem Member
    Mag7spy wrote: »
    Azherae wrote: »
    Vaknar wrote: »
    Hiya everyone!

    I merged two threads on the same topic: (Auto-flagging in open sea) together!

    I also wanted to mention a comment that Steven made following the livestream, which can be found here

    Steven discussed this topic and brings forward a few notes to remember about different game features and elements to our design direction. I highly encourage everyone to read it! ^_^

    Carry on and keep up the awesome discussions!

    P.S. Please be sure to be well unto one another. I know we're all very passionate about not only the game, but this topic. But remember - we're all here because we love MMORPGs and want to see the game succeed, and we all have that in common :heart:

    I am very concerned that these two specific topics have been merged together for multiple reasons. I do not wish for this to be undone, but I do wish to ask, if another topic was made even more explicitly regarding the reasoning for the change, if that would also be merged.

    They need to be merged now i dont need to look between two threads it was kind of annoying to keep up with the info. We don't need like 5 different threads running on the same topic.

    Mine was a bit broader than this one but it's whatever to me. We are generally talking about the same topics
    GJjUGHx.gif
  • DolyemDolyem Member
    Dolyem wrote: »
    Dolyem wrote: »
    [ I ask you, if you assume that this will cause a loss of interest in some part of the population and that
    Dolyem wrote: »
    Dolyem wrote: »

    For technical problems technical solutions can be found. They should be discussed. If this was the reason for the change this solution sounds lazy to me.

    I'd assume that they implemented it, and once they tested perhaps made a judgement call saying that having to flag for this content was bad gameplay

    Then they should tell us that. And I already have a first idea of the top of my head of how you can make corruption work with ships. We can discuss it if you like, but it would turn this discussion in a totally different direction.

    Go for it, it's more info for devs

    OK, its simple. But please remember its a first shot. I did not think about every last aspect. The main ocean content is done by ships, yes? Then why not have ship owners have a ship corruption status that applies to every ship that is summoned by them and is independent from the players corruption state (or from the other occupants). So you summon a ship and the ship gets corruption (or however you want to call it. Lorewise it is of course total crap) and reduces corruption if it does normal naval gameplay or is sunk. Basically the same as on land, only for ships. You still have auto-flagging zones around caravans/merchant ships/world bosses etc. As a drawback fot going back, red ships cannot go to harbors to be repaired or improved until purple.
    Of course, if the reason was to increase the risk on the ocean that will not help. You have to think about something other there.

    Interesting take, how would that negatively affect the players on the ship then? And if it got too corrupted, wouldn't it be as simple as making another?

    It would not affect the players on the ship. I have no problem with that. If they leave the ship they go back to their normal corruption state. I have no problem with distinguishing the two states. What happend on the ocean stays on the ocean.
    The owners ship corruption status would apply to all ships that they summon. You could use another players ship next time, but summoning is only possible at harbors so that is very inconvenient. Also at some point you have a whole lot of red ships that you have to get to purple somehow. Also they would only be able to be sold in a purple state.

    At that point I'd have 1 player designated as a corrupt ship and have another player follow without engaging as the designated green ship. Problem arises? Abandon ship and hop on the green one, sail away without dying unless the other already damaged ship decides to engage. I try to think up exploits for everything so don't take it as me saying you're wrong, this is just how I would avoid it

    I am not sure what the scenario is. Do you want to avoid attacks and use the designated green ship as a get-away or do you want to use the red one to PK and the green one is for what? What is the goal in the latter secenario?

    In the first scenario, you can do that. You still loose the red ship you abondon. Its a high price to avoid a player death. I would think the ship death would be a higher priority to avoid.

    Use the red ship to kill other ships, once you're about to lose you disengage and go to the green ship as not to die and lose materials to the enemy.
    GJjUGHx.gif
  • AzheraeAzherae Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    Dolyem wrote: »
    Mag7spy wrote: »
    Azherae wrote: »
    Vaknar wrote: »
    Hiya everyone!

    I merged two threads on the same topic: (Auto-flagging in open sea) together!

    I also wanted to mention a comment that Steven made following the livestream, which can be found here

    Steven discussed this topic and brings forward a few notes to remember about different game features and elements to our design direction. I highly encourage everyone to read it! ^_^

    Carry on and keep up the awesome discussions!

    P.S. Please be sure to be well unto one another. I know we're all very passionate about not only the game, but this topic. But remember - we're all here because we love MMORPGs and want to see the game succeed, and we all have that in common :heart:

    I am very concerned that these two specific topics have been merged together for multiple reasons. I do not wish for this to be undone, but I do wish to ask, if another topic was made even more explicitly regarding the reasoning for the change, if that would also be merged.

    They need to be merged now i dont need to look between two threads it was kind of annoying to keep up with the info. We don't need like 5 different threads running on the same topic.

    Mine was a bit broader than this one but it's whatever to me. We are generally talking about the same topics

    As long as you're fine with it. It's probably going to end up pivoting to 'discussion of reason' regardless, I admit I was thinking from the perspective of 'people who just want to make topics that are celebrating it', getting thrown into discussions they might not care about, which is probably not a concern.
    Sorry, my native language is Erlang.
    
  • AzheraeAzherae Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    Ignore azhrae...

    That's not how you do that, it's a button on my profile if you click through. It's a little hard to find, for some people, but just poke around at anything that looks like an arrow.
    Sorry, my native language is Erlang.
    
  • DolyemDolyem Member
    Azherae wrote: »
    Dolyem wrote: »
    Mag7spy wrote: »
    Azherae wrote: »
    Vaknar wrote: »
    Hiya everyone!

    I merged two threads on the same topic: (Auto-flagging in open sea) together!

    I also wanted to mention a comment that Steven made following the livestream, which can be found here

    Steven discussed this topic and brings forward a few notes to remember about different game features and elements to our design direction. I highly encourage everyone to read it! ^_^

    Carry on and keep up the awesome discussions!

    P.S. Please be sure to be well unto one another. I know we're all very passionate about not only the game, but this topic. But remember - we're all here because we love MMORPGs and want to see the game succeed, and we all have that in common :heart:

    I am very concerned that these two specific topics have been merged together for multiple reasons. I do not wish for this to be undone, but I do wish to ask, if another topic was made even more explicitly regarding the reasoning for the change, if that would also be merged.

    They need to be merged now i dont need to look between two threads it was kind of annoying to keep up with the info. We don't need like 5 different threads running on the same topic.

    Mine was a bit broader than this one but it's whatever to me. We are generally talking about the same topics

    As long as you're fine with it. It's probably going to end up pivoting to 'discussion of reason' regardless, I admit I was thinking from the perspective of 'people who just want to make topics that are celebrating it', getting thrown into discussions they might not care about, which is probably not a concern.

    It's a bummer that it won't be on my discussion record but I won't make a fuss. In the end it's about providing feedback for devs
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  • XiraelAcaronXiraelAcaron Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    edited August 29
    Dolyem wrote: »
    Dolyem wrote: »
    Dolyem wrote: »
    [ I ask you, if you assume that this will cause a loss of interest in some part of the population and that
    Dolyem wrote: »
    Dolyem wrote: »

    For technical problems technical solutions can be found. They should be discussed. If this was the reason for the change this solution sounds lazy to me.

    I'd assume that they implemented it, and once they tested perhaps made a judgement call saying that having to flag for this content was bad gameplay

    Then they should tell us that. And I already have a first idea of the top of my head of how you can make corruption work with ships. We can discuss it if you like, but it would turn this discussion in a totally different direction.

    Go for it, it's more info for devs

    OK, its simple. But please remember its a first shot. I did not think about every last aspect. The main ocean content is done by ships, yes? Then why not have ship owners have a ship corruption status that applies to every ship that is summoned by them and is independent from the players corruption state (or from the other occupants). So you summon a ship and the ship gets corruption (or however you want to call it. Lorewise it is of course total crap) and reduces corruption if it does normal naval gameplay or is sunk. Basically the same as on land, only for ships. You still have auto-flagging zones around caravans/merchant ships/world bosses etc. As a drawback fot going back, red ships cannot go to harbors to be repaired or improved until purple.
    Of course, if the reason was to increase the risk on the ocean that will not help. You have to think about something other there.

    Interesting take, how would that negatively affect the players on the ship then? And if it got too corrupted, wouldn't it be as simple as making another?

    It would not affect the players on the ship. I have no problem with that. If they leave the ship they go back to their normal corruption state. I have no problem with distinguishing the two states. What happend on the ocean stays on the ocean.
    The owners ship corruption status would apply to all ships that they summon. You could use another players ship next time, but summoning is only possible at harbors so that is very inconvenient. Also at some point you have a whole lot of red ships that you have to get to purple somehow. Also they would only be able to be sold in a purple state.

    At that point I'd have 1 player designated as a corrupt ship and have another player follow without engaging as the designated green ship. Problem arises? Abandon ship and hop on the green one, sail away without dying unless the other already damaged ship decides to engage. I try to think up exploits for everything so don't take it as me saying you're wrong, this is just how I would avoid it

    I am not sure what the scenario is. Do you want to avoid attacks and use the designated green ship as a get-away or do you want to use the red one to PK and the green one is for what? What is the goal in the latter secenario?

    In the first scenario, you can do that. You still loose the red ship you abondon. Its a high price to avoid a player death. I would think the ship death would be a higher priority to avoid.

    Use the red ship to kill other ships, once you're about to lose you disengage and go to the green ship as not to die and lose materials to the enemy.

    You loose the ship thats a hard punishment. Regarding the loot you supposedly collected with the green ship from all the previous kills, that is indeed a problem I have to think about. Maybe apply looting rights rules. Either the green ship at least fires one shot and is then purple, or it cannot loot. If only the red ship can loot, then all the mats go down with the ship since I assume you cannot transfer crago on the open sea.
  • mcstackersonmcstackerson Member, Phoenix Initiative, Royalty, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    edited August 29
    Azherae wrote: »
    Azherae wrote: »
    "Please explain if you are still of the opinion that the reason for the change is technical."

    Sorry, i don't think it's purely technical, just thought it might have played a role. I also think it was made because the kind of content that was planned for the sea and to support the pirate playstyle.

    Please clarify if you expect Coastal content to not include things like meaningful/complex PvE encounters, in contrast to the Open Sea where it might be necessary to change the flagging system due to such encounters.

    I'd expect coastal pve enounters to work the same as the ones on land and not involve ships but that is purely my guess. On the ocean, I expect ships to play a larger role in pve encounters like the kraken/leviathon from Archeage but i'm not going to go as far as say the change is necessary.

    I think the difference between the zones and reason for the change is more that the land has a large variety of content but the sea will probably be focused on high level content.
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  • AzheraeAzherae Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    Azherae wrote: »
    Azherae wrote: »
    "Please explain if you are still of the opinion that the reason for the change is technical."

    Sorry, i don't think it's purely technical, just thought it might have played a role. I also think it was made because the kind of content that was planned for the sea and to support the pirate playstyle.

    Please clarify if you expect Coastal content to not include things like meaningful/complex PvE encounters, in contrast to the Open Sea where it might be necessary to change the flagging system due to such encounters.

    I'd expect coastal pve enounters to work the same as the ones on land and not involve ships but that is purely my guess. On the ocean, I expect ships to play a larger role in pve encounters like the kraken/leviathon from Archeage but i'm not going to go as far as say the change is necessary.

    I think the difference between the zones and reason for the change is more that the land has a large variety of content but the sea will probably be focused on high level content.

    Please clarify if you perceive that this high level content will be rewarding enough to be a meaningful impact on the power balance on the server.
    Sorry, my native language is Erlang.
    
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