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Phase I of Alpha Two testing will occur on weekends. Each weekend is scheduled to start on Fridays at 10 AM PT and end on Sundays at 10 PM PT. Find out more here.
Check out Alpha Two Announcements here to see the latest Alpha Two news and update notes.
Our quickest Alpha Two updates are in Discord. Testers with Alpha Two access can chat in Alpha Two channels by connecting your Discord and Intrepid accounts here.
Comments
@Amaze If two guilds are at war, Intrepid has talked about making it so that members of the opposing guild cannot give you corruption. Both guilds will always be considered combatants when faced against each other. You can kill them as much as you want, but they can do likewise.
Being put in pvp situations you don't want to be in is part of the game. You may not like it but that doesn't mean it's a bad thing. This is a pvx game, pvp and pve are both parts of it. Remember, pvpers will have to pve just like there might be times where pve'ers will have to pvp.
As i said before, i strongly recommend you stick around and see how this system turns out. I don't think it will be nearly as bad as you think and doubt you will have to deal with pvp much if you try to avoid it. The flagging system is not the only thing that will be deterring pvp. There will also be political consequences for attacking people. In the city hall blog they mention that a leader can mark players as enemy of the state. If you are truly passionate for MMOs and community then please give it a chance, you will be surprised.
If you put a PVPer in a pve situation no big deal most mobs= Damage over time plus animation. Kite and kill or tank and kill. no big deal.
If you Put PVEer in a PVP situation then you might have a problem. I know players that could kill other players all day long they are just that skilled.
Just as an example a person could go out and pvp do seiges, do caravans, and so one and get their fill of pvp for the day. But now it is time to do a dungeoun or harvest or complete a questline and all the sudden they find themsleves in a PVP situation. This will be annoying (no risk or reward or any of that stuff) to even the most avid PVPer. I have been in situations were I have people waiting on me to complete a deal or a dungeoun, but wait cannot go yet cause someone is trying to kill me. So what if they get punished. I could not care less if they get punished or not, I still get delayed.
I geuss it is an open world so you could follow someone into a dungeoun with a group and camp the Boss and/or Mini Boss and Kill a group of people in the middle or at the end of doing a dungeoun. But they will get punished oooooh. So what there is no value no risk vs reward no nothing when someone just comes along kills you while you are trying to do a dungeoun. But they get punished!!!! It is so cool.
Great they get punished and you run of time and have to log off for the night with out completeing your dungeound or other PVE content.
But that is ok cause you go to bed knowing that they will be rightfully punished.
Think there are other ways to have bounty hunters in the game besides corruption.
As many have said this is a pvx game. This is not themepark where you go ride the pvp rides and then go do the pve rides. It's all supposed to be connected and part of one game instead of being separated out. Every time you go out there will be a threat of pvp and you might want to plan for that. Some players enjoy this added danger and the randomness of it. To me, it makes the world feel alive and creates an atmosphere that makes it feel like a real world.
The system isn't there to make you feel good. It's there to deter pvp and make it so it happens less. It's there to make attacking people not worth it. It gives player incentives to only attack when they have a good reason.
I'm sorry for sounding like a broken record. Maybe you wont like but i still recommend you give it a try before insisting they adopt the same systems we have today.
It doesn't entirely depend on if the victim cares about the punishment of PKers. But the PKers should care.
I dont think that ganking will be a big problem. And that's because of the punishment. It just doesn't pay off. The more victims, the more it doesn't pay off for the attacker.
@Zastro Thanks for the information. Sounds even better!
But just to list a few more example since every one can attack every one.
Well did not like what he said so I am killing him. (will get killed later but not by him)
What is anyone going to do against 20 or more corrupted players. Are there going to be 20 bounty hunters to kill them.
One of the things that can happen on pvp servers is people can group together and basically control a point of interest. If they get enough they could control an entire city killing all gaurds and vendors and toons and npcs.(actually happened for 3 days)
If you were to call Ashes of Creation servers PVP servers a lot of people would just pass on to the next game. But they have a PVP server plus a corruption system and call it a PVX. PVX implies toon can decide to put a P or an E were the X is but that is not the case. Having world PVP is great. Flagging everone for pvp not so great. I understand the fun and value of World PVP, but you do not have flag everyone for pvp to have that.
Just to be clear PVP Server = everyone can attack everyone situation as far as this post is concerned.
You can see the post I made with suggestions for change but then determined it wouldnt be necessary going through the original flow chart and the one I was suggesting really helped see it more clearly.
Check it out see what you think: ( You will noticed I amended the original title at the end )
https://forums.ashesofcreation.com/discussion/37057/proposal-for-slight-change-in-the-pvp-flagging-system-determined-unnecessary#latest
Not trying to change your mind just trying to provide another perspective
Bounty hunter system seems like the perfect answer for rampant griefing. PKing is an inevitable aspect of any great game that institutes pvp into its core mechanics and I couldn't think of a better way to combat it in a more immersive fashion. Cheers.
Really do not see the point of bounter hunters when I am red basically telling everyone withing earshot to kill me. Even best PVPErs cannot handle 1v3. I do not think red toons will live long enough for bounty hunters to kill them. And if they stat degraded well...
I think having some safe zones would be cool. Maybe a players free hold or just some place to be to do things like going through inventory and general toon maintenance could be implemented.
Even the some of the most hardcore pvp games have safe zones. even if they are small. The I am going through my inventory and I will get someone to guard me while I do it....does not sound to exciting.
Savezones would be good. Like you said: The own freehold for example. On the other hand... What if I have a freehold near a street, ambush people, get back to my house, ambush people, get back to my house... and so on... Because I'm an idiot somehow? ^^
EDIT: Of course I would get weaker all the time and enough people would be eager to kill me, when I want to leave my house xD
Well the only reason I can see to have the Everone can attack Everyone mechanic is to add a sense of danger to the game which makes it more immersive. So I geuss gankers are in fact making for better gameplay but they are going to get punished for it cause overganking makes for a bad pve experience (most game content will be pve)
but really we should be thanking the gankers for adding a sense of danger to the game.
If every one adhered to the rules (never attack a green ) This whole system would be redundant and useless. Cannot have curroption without ganking. So gankers are used to add a sense danger to the game and get punished for it.
Well maybe if every mob (over 90%) in game was not = to claw/bit/swing(Insert the one mob ability) damage over time. Undead, bear , cat, elemental all do same damage just different animation. Who ever heard of undead with no undead abilities. Or some magical creature with no magical abities, then maybe you would have a sense of danger.(get smarter more challenging AI)
You could easily give the ganking duty to an avian AI that kills toons at random. Or and Earth elemental that comes out of ground or Pheonix or Undead that comes out of the ground. So sense of danger could come from Player vs Environment.(world mini bosses)
Plus if I had the most legendary item in the game would people be trying to get me corrupted to get that item.
Am I mistaken? maybe I missed some other game mechanic.
Steven: Alright, so there needs to be some clarity on how the flagging system works. Alright, so to be clear, everyone in the world exists as a non-combatant by default. You’re all out in the world players and you are not flagged for combat. If you as a player go to another player who is either flagged for combat or a non-combatant and you attack them or heal the combatant, you will become a combatant, you will be flagged for PVP, your name color will change, probably purple, and you will remain flagged for a period of time after which you have struck another character or aided another flagged character.
So, combatants are people who either aid other combatants or attack other combatants or noncombatants, so those are combatants… those are flagged players, they’re purple.
Question: Do you get combatant status for attacking a player who is corrupted?
Steven: You do not, i was about to get into that. If you kill a person who is not flagged for combat, a noncombatant, you will gain a corruption value and that value is determined by a few factors. The disparity of level between you and the opponent. If they are higher level than you, you gain less corruption, if they are lower level than you, you’ll gain more corruption, if they are an equal level to you, you will gain a moderate amount of corruption. If you kill a person who is a non-combatant, you’ll gain a corruption value.
Now this corruption value stays with you until you die. If you die while corrupt, the death penalties that you will receive will be tripled from what it would have been had you died while a noncombatant. So those death penalties include a negative experience that you gain an experience debt. It doesn't necessarily de-level your character, but that experience debt, as it accrues, will cause skill penalties, will cause stat penalties, and if you just go on a PKing rage where you are just killing a bunch of noncombatants, that death penalty, that experience debt is just going to rack up and it’s going to adversely affect your ability to participate in combat. So this prevents PK alts from being made. So that’s corruption. If you die, you’ll lose a value of corruption equal to your level in game and how much experience loss you accrue from death.
Another added downside for being a corrupted player, is that while normal death causes the loss of a certain percentage of your gatherable materials and mats, if you die while corrupt, you have a chance now, based on what your corruption score is, to drop equipped gear or completed items. So, that is the flagging system in a nutshell.
Would like to see following tweaks
Limit the number of times a green can be killed by toons to like 10 per day preventing people from ganging up on one person. A green could get killed penty of times by different people Or ten times per hour or just some limit to prevent one toon getting farmed to much.
Have it so you can only attack someone let say five levels lower or higher than yourslef.
PVEers (most of player base) just want to PVE in peace for the most part and not really into the PVP aspects of game, so will be turning away a certain amount of people away. Even a lot of PVPers like to PVE in peace.
Hundreds of thousands of PvPers are waiting for some MMO that will be finally good for PvP.
IS can scrap those 10,000 PvEers, and still profit on multiple more PvPers that will come and play.
Why?
Because there is multiple PvE MMOs out there right now (and people will remain playing them), but there wasn't a good PvP MMO out there for a long time. Make a good PvP MMO and a huge amount of crowd will come.
Also this game doesn't force people to PVP.
I had my doubts at the beginning but after analyzing and re analyzing the system i think it will pan out. There is a pretty hefty penalty for killing people who are not flagged and don't fight back.
It's called a PVX game elements of both and I bet when people give it a try things will be ok .
It's impossible to please everyone you have to pick the purpose of your game and go with it.
I'm curious to see how it all pans out
Come for the PVP .....
..... Stay for the PVX
Personally the corruption system seems harsh to me at this point but i am obviously biased towards PVP and would like to see a more open pvp system that will rely more heavily on the bounty system like using currency from the bounty target or increased taxes while being marked as a bounty, limited npc interaction while a bounty etc etc. Not being able to defend your self from greens without going further red feels wrong coupled with the inability to remove corruption without dying.
Ultimately i hope a nice balance is achieved and there are proper incentives to remain a combatant to both sides of the argument.. that would leave the remaining players attacking large level disparities (AKA gankers) as corrupted and punished.
PVX game should in theory= PVP/PVE both types on one server and that is not the case.
Argent dawn (or anyone) just define what a pvp server is then what a pve server is then what PVX server (means PVP Plus PVE server)
Think IS is incorrectly labeling their servers PVX. When it is really PVP mainly cause you will always be flagged for PVP(no choice) Another way to look at it is :
This is a PVX server Te X will always = P Not and E so it is PVP servers.
You will never be in PVE mode in Ashes of creation. You could be deep in a huge dungeoun and have a pvp experience. (meet other palyers and attack them).
PVX does not = having PVP and PVE at the same time that is a PVP server.
You can throw terms around as much as you want and have a corruption system. Guess what? Always being flagged for pvp = PVP server. No way around it.
How would you define a PVX server?