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Toxicity in forums. What is it and how we can prevent it?

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    ArchivedUserArchivedUser Guest
    edited June 2017
    The trouble is, that there now have been multiple times that I have commented within a thread that he has then 'apparently' taken issue with.
    I'd like to not feel as I do now, that I can't answer anywhere because of anxiety that he's going to be making prodding comment at me again. 
    So yeah, I'd like to resolve it, however it's in his hands not mine. 

    I honestly have no idea what he's trying to convey when he posted that last 
    Dygz said:
    1) can I misunderstand it? If yes, then I try not to do it

    "I hope you guys will sort this out."
    comment.... are you wanting to sort it out? Are you wanting to discuss things or just ignore each other? I don't understand can you please explain?

    As to the roleplay community not being directly affected by dividing up groups, no I agree, they personally won't likely be harmed they'll continue on as normal, only it does increase misunderstanding of roleplay to those outside of the community, making ganking and interrupting rp much more acceptable.... 'mahahahah, you were theatre rping' etc

    The damage is done externally looking in on this kind of pidgeonholing, and that I'm afraid is a highly emotive issue for me that I can't let lie, as it often is the first step in the chain towards bullying. 

    Meh, It's important to me, I believe that there should be acceptance of all, however who knows where this will end. 

    Guess running away and ignoring him are the way to go. 

    *Calms down and goes to find a cup of tea*
    You never know, there may be a cordial solution
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    ArchivedUserArchivedUser Guest
    edited June 2017
    AutumnWillow said:
    I had a long discussion with Dygz about in game religion in the game during my first few days being active on the forums. My goal was to see if I could get him to understand my perspective on the issue and I was also very curious. In the end I think we ended the discussion on relatively good terms. I felt I explained my views clearly, and I understood where he was coming from. 

    We probably still don't disagree on that particular topic, but there are many others I agree with him on.
    (I think we agree on the concepts of that topic - we may still disagree on the labels)
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    ArchivedUserArchivedUser Guest
    edited June 2017
    LOOK SIDE OF OBJECT MORE. 

    OBJECTIVI-SOMETHING HELP UNDERSTAND HAPPENING.

    SPRINKLE OPINION ON TOP.

    GOOD NON TOXIC DISH YES.
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    Dygz said:
    AutumnWillow said:
    I had a long discussion with Dygz about in game religion in the game during my first few days being active on the forums. My goal was to see if I could get him to understand my perspective on the issue and I was also very curious. In the end I think we ended the discussion on relatively good terms. I felt I explained my views clearly, and I understood where he was coming from. 

    We probably still don't disagree on that particular topic, but there are many others I agree with him on.
    (I think we agree on the concepts of that topic - we may still disagree on the labels)
    Yep. That's pretty accurate. 
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    Your mother is a hamster! And your father smells like elderberries!

    Seriously, though, relative anonimity + internet echo chamber + hurt feelings + polarization being totally acceptable nowadays (look at the problems the US has with 'compromise' as a simple example), will always lead to people just spewing garbage about 'others'.

    Whether the others are people they disagree with, people with an unpopular opinion, or people that are critical for good reason but run into fanbois, it's the new way of doing things it appears.

    A look at Steam and Youtube is all you need to see how bad it has gotten.
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    +1 for Monty python quote. :smiley:
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    There are different levels of player ability, I wouldn' t want to see ANY name calling at all.I don t want to see a talented player taunting a less talented player.
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    Dygz said:

    In 9th grade, my best friend and I entered a 3-legged race. I thought we were a shoe-in to win because we were both fast runners - award winning runners.
    But, it was a disaster.
    Afterwards, my friend explained that it was a disaster because he's a cross country runner and I'm a sprinter. We don't run the same way. And that the whole point of a 3-legged race is finding the balance between us.


    Man that is deep. I had to stop and think about that. You could apply that to a lot in life. I'm going to use this example at some point to my little nephews. Those are some powerful words, so thank you.

    I'd like to offer a different perspective that some may not have felt. I am a developer in real life. I do not work in the game industry, but there is an ongoing joke/truth that I feel that most developer feel often. Users are never happy, and think these "easy fixes" can be done in a blink of an eye.

    There are a lot of decision made to push out a piece of software. When a "bad update" is released it could have been any number of reasons. The developer could have been overruled by a business decision, maybe the best way was not cost efficient, or maybe they simply thought this was the best option and got it wrong. 

    We are constantly told not to read to much into negative feedback. Take it with a grain of salt and try to improve the product, but I can tell you it can be hard coding when you feel like the customer has little faith in your work.

    So I'd like to say this to everyone here. Invest in the developers, artists, community managers, and even their muffin man. Because it is them that will create the world we want to dive into. 
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    ArchivedUserArchivedUser Guest
    edited June 2017

    I have attempted everything,  I have spent hours trying to resolve my toxicity issue. 

    That might not sound like much, but it's the reason I haven't been as active here.
    Sending a simple a4 length missive takes me about three hours now a days, and that is basically all of my usable time for that day.
    So actually I have been working seriously hard to negotiate any form of understanding or compromise.

    I changed my communication style, offered up my own self critisism, and made serious efforts to offer olive branches and work towards any form of agreement, the following is a segment of a message I sent out in my efforts:
    Forgetting everything that has gone before, for the good of the roleplay community in ashes...

    Is it possible for both of us to put aside all assumptions of styles of roleplay other than our own? And accept that views may be flawed (on both sides)
    To both acknowledge that whilst we don't enjoy playing in other sites than our own, we both intend to get on with opposite styles in game, even if getting on is ignoring or pretending each other is loopy?

    And if we can do that, is there not any way that we can just get on trying to work out the best way to unite all different rp styles and ways that might result in all styles getting the best possible experiences out of this game?
    There can never be a resolution if one person doesn't actually want one. 

    Everyone here is correct, ignoring and pretending that a troll doesn't exist is the only way forward from here. 



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    I just want to point out , that just because someone disagrees with your point of view and may feel strongly about their point, does not make them a troll.  you just disagree. several may agree with you, several may agree with him.  just keep that in mind. 
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    I totally agree with this. :)
     
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    Umji said:
    LOOK SIDE OF OBJECT MORE. 

    OBJECTIVI-SOMETHING HELP UNDERSTAND HAPPENING.

    SPRINKLE OPINION ON TOP.

    GOOD NON TOXIC DISH YES.
    MultiFacet Gem? Multiple points of view? and can the non-toxic dish be a good seafood dish? The last one is obviously the most important but please clarify the other 2. =<

    Now for my real reply to this rather than my normal rambling:
    I didn't read the entirety of this because scrolling through 5 pages of what I can only assume dropped partially into what it's talking about in the first place. @Mykkala One for the last note here as well (Mainly cause your right there as I type and I can't ignore your words XD) it's not about the disagreement when it comes to toxicity it's about how things are said/worded.

    You can ask a lot of people on this forums I typically have a disagreement with something about nearly every serious thread. However I rarely end up in some argument that garners aggression and disrespectful tones. At least I don't think I do please correct me if I'm wrong.

    Other than that, well toxic+trolls will happen stopping it entirely is impractical. Containing it however is a viable option if there are a significant number of other people who determine "That ones a troll" Then why not ignore their posts? I know that's hard for some people and others might not see that person as a troll but unless your a mod then isn't much you can do about it in the first place besides chill and carry on.
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    Megs said:
    There can never be a resolution if one person doesn't actually want one. 

    Everyone here is correct, ignoring and pretending that a troll doesn't exist is the only way forward from here. 
    If @Yaviey is watching, I'd like to kindly request an "Ignore" function on the Ashes forums. In my experience, I believe that this is the single best tool for combatting trolling and toxicity in an online community. <3
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    ^AGREEE

    And what was the other one... inspired? <3
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    Bannith said:
     it's not about the disagreement when it comes to toxicity it's about how things are said/worded.

    i agree, if they resort to personal attacks, it then becomes toxic / trolly,  But  just disagreeing even if a tad agressive, just may be their personality and no actual bad intentions or trolly intentions are behind it.
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    Actually, I have said many times to Megs that it is OK for us to disagree.
    And she's just mad that I refuse to agree with her perspective.
    She finds my desire to label the different styles of RP to be inherently negative; while I view that as neutral.

    We disagree. And that is OK.
    She gets to feel however she wishes to feel about that.
    I wish her joy and happiness regardless.
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    lexmax said:
    Megs said:
    There can never be a resolution if one person doesn't actually want one. 

    Everyone here is correct, ignoring and pretending that a troll doesn't exist is the only way forward from here. 
    If @Yaviey is watching, I'd like to kindly request an "Ignore" function on the Ashes forums. In my experience, I believe that this is the single best tool for combatting trolling and toxicity in an online community. <3
    You heard it folks. Wrap this one up :)
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    ArchivedUserArchivedUser Guest
    edited June 2017
    Dygz said:
    it is OK for us to disagree.
    An ignore button allows you to wipe away anything that upsets you whether it be true toxicity or just something that conflicts with a strongly held belief. What's even better is nobody else in chat is any the wiser. The admin/mod people can also use the ignore stats to zero in on potential problem spots. There really are no downsides :)
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    lexmax said:
    Dygz said:
    it is OK for us to disagree.
    Sorry I disagree, even today I remember that I had 3 disagrees against my name and I deserved 0. I remember who gave them to me and they're going to be my first 3 PKs. /Ignore would've been so much more classy. :p
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    Kratz said:
    lexmax said:
    Dygz said:
    it is OK for us to disagree.
    Sorry I disagree, even today I remember that I had 3 disagrees against my name and I deserved 0. I remember who gave them to me and they're going to be my first 3 PKs. /Ignore would've been so much more classy. :p
    Maybe I'd have Ignored you instead of hit Disagree if that was an option back then ;)

    PS It's pretty easy for an Elf to ignore a dwarf. Just don't look down :o
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    lexmax said:
    Kratz said:
    lexmax said:
    Dygz said:
    it is OK for us to disagree.
    Sorry I disagree, even today I remember that I had 3 disagrees against my name and I deserved 0. I remember who gave them to me and they're going to be my first 3 PKs. /Ignore would've been so much more classy. :p
    Maybe I'd have Ignored you instead of hit Disagree if that was an option back then ;)

    PS It's pretty easy for an Elf to ignore a dwarf. Just don't look down :o
    Don't forget to brush your pigtails to the sides first. :open_mouth:
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    Um. By disagree, I was not referring to buttons.
    I'm just saying that people disagreeing with each other is OK.

    Ignore button is great.

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    ArchivedUserArchivedUser Guest
    edited June 2017
    I don't think there's anyway to totally keep out trolls and aholes.

    I do like making posting in the forums available only to subscribers after launch.

    Tight moderation with 'time-outs' and eventually permanent bans are in order BUT that takes a lot of time, effort, and manpower.

    Tight moderation can lead to OVER moderation which is no fun either.

    Sometime a good, old fashioned IGNORE button is the best solution.

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    There are three kinds of people on these forums.

    1 Those who can count
    2.Those who can't
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    Dygz said:
    Actually, I have said many times to Megs that it is OK for us to disagree.
    And she's just mad that I refuse to agree with her perspective.
    She finds my desire to label the different styles of RP to be inherently negative; while I view that as neutral.

    We disagree. And that is OK.
    She gets to feel however she wishes to feel about that.
    I wish her joy and happiness regardless.
    I have asked you before to not speak for me, it's rude and disrespectful, and most of all, you fail again to understand my point of view.

    I wish you all the best, but would you kindly stop now?

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    ArchivedUserArchivedUser Guest
    edited June 2017
    You brought the subject up here not I.
    I'm sure the thread will get locked at some point.
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    Grrrr I cannot ignore this. It's provocational and ridiculous.

    I am NOT mad because you disagree with me. 
    I am mad because I invested serious time and effort in an attempt to resolve our differences, yet met  with no attempts to compromise, no attempts to recognise any major issues, no attempts to move forward.
    You came across as just wanting to argue for arguments sake. If you really wanted to resolve it, we would have.

    Now I warned you before, before I made an effort to resolve this that if you were to drag me into a thread or speak for me I would flag it.
    I personally feel that it's a shame.

    P.s. if you look back at all my posts on this thread, I was very careful in not mentioning (in the first instance s) who it was that I had a beef with.
    I felt that talking in the vague way would be less toxic for the community as a whole.
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    And, again, we disagree on what transpired.
    And, on which one of us has been rude and toxic.
    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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    Dygz said:
    Actually, I have said many times to Megs that it is OK for us to disagree.
    And she's just mad that I refuse to agree with her perspective.
    She finds my desire to label the different styles of RP to be inherently negative; while I view that as neutral.
    https://forums.ashesofcreation.com/discussion/33716/roleplayers-unite#latest
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    Dygz said:
    Dygz said:
    Actually, I have said many times to Megs that it is OK for us to disagree.
    And she's just mad that I refuse to agree with her perspective.
    She finds my desire to label the different styles of RP to be inherently negative; while I view that as neutral.
    https://forums.ashesofcreation.com/discussion/33716/roleplayers-unite#latest
    Brah drop it... We got it the first time man. It happens I understand but dragging it out isn't helping anyone.
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