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Dev Discussion #65 - Camera Perspective

VaknarVaknar Moderator, Member, Staff
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Glorious Ashes community - it's time for another Dev Discussion! Dev Discussion topics are kind of like a "reverse Q&A" - rather than you asking us questions about Ashes of Creation, we want to ask YOU what your thoughts are.

Our design team has compiled a list of burning questions we'd love to get your feedback on regarding gameplay, your past MMO experiences, and more. Join in on the Dev Discussion and share what makes gaming special to you!

Dev Discussion - Camera Perspective

Camera Perspective: What camera perspective do you prefer in terms of both angle and distance from your character? Do different situations call for different perspectives?
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    FlorianFlorian Member
    casual gameplay more zoomed in. high crowded pvp pve spots zoomed out.
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    DisobedientDisobedient Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    BDO has the best camera angle from games I've played. It's slightly off center. Any way you do it, people will get used to it though. As long as it's not super zoomed in.
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    hleVhleV Member
    I will always be zoomed out as far as possible for maximum awareness, however I would like a sane limit to how much you can zoom out, so you can still see and admire your character without compromising awareness.
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    GrappLrGrappLr Member, Alpha One
    I think this is a great topic, and here's my take:

    Anyone competitive will always zoom out as far as they can, to get as much information as possible (whithin limit, ofcourse, not to lose detail).

    Being that far zoomed out though, is a negative to overall enjoyment of the game.

    The devs limiting the max zoom out is a positive thing, because it allows people to play at the "most competitive" zoom, while simultaneously enjoying the view.

    This is similar to being allowed to turn down all graphics to a minimum, where you only see stick figures. If this was advantageous to PVP, every serious PVP player would do it. Should then devs allow people to do this? No. Turning down graphics should be designed for only low spec systems, and some aspects of what people enjoy watching.

    TL;DR:

    Allow zooming out far enough where people have a good competitive view of their surroundings, but don't allow infinite zooming out, as it leads to metagaming where people find less enjoyment for more advantages.
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    HeartbeatHeartbeat Member, Founder, Kickstarter
    I keep it simple, camera behind and above my character, locked in place to match the direction my character is moving/looking as well as having the ability to unlock the camera to rotate it freely if I wish. For zooming in or out it's purely what im doing or where im at.
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    AmelAmel Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    Depends on the environment, but usually its always as zoomed out as possible.
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    LashingLashing Member
    All I really care about is a reasonable cap to zoom out distance. There should never be a massive competitive advantage based on camera zoom. Massive zoom ins or outs should be in game item based like a telescope or a point of interest that zooms you out while standing on it.
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    PlasticLemonsPlasticLemons Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    Ultimately I will play the most optimal camera zoom amount which more often than not is zoomed as far out as I can.

    I heavily dislike the amount of zoom out that Archeage and EVE allow you to do - where you can zoom so far out that your character is barely a pixel on your screen anymore. I at least want to be able to make out details of my character when zoomed out to max.

    I also think that the game generally requires more skill with a lower max zoom camera. Content can become trivial if you can see the entirety of both groups fighting and becomes much more difficult if the most you can fit in your view is your party and the tank of the other group.
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    MindForkMindFork Member
    More zoomed in during a fight, max zoomed out during any coordination tasks.
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    BludbornBludborn Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    I prefer centered and not offset and also further out in a lot of circumstances, but more specifically in open world PVP. I think in almost every game that I play, I zoom out or increase the FOV as much as I can. It gives an advantage when you can see and process what is going on around you more quickly. I don’t know that I ever really zoom far in for gameplay.

    On the other hand I love being able to zoom all the way into first person for landscape screenshots and videos. I don’t always want to have my character and HUD up. You all are making a beautiful game and I would like to sometimes be able to see it without all the game elements on screen.
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    RobinhoodrsRobinhoodrs Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    I like to have my camera behind me, locked in place looking in the same direction as my character is.

    On a side note, while talking about cameras... as a PvP Shoutcaster on Albion Online, please think about having a freecam option, a #stalk function that allows you to follow a player, being able to join a guild to see one side vs the other more clearly.

    I know these features will be locked behind a GM account or something, but if there's an option for casters to come in and cast these massive Node Wars and paint a story while doing so, it'll be amazing!
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    xDracxDrac Member
    I prefer to be relatively zoomed in to feel more immersed in the world and surroundings, to take it all in.
    But whenever there's combat involved or especially PvP, I zoom out much more, to get a better overview of things and see more.
    Ideally perhaps you could offset the camera-perspective a bit, so it's not neccessarily always horizontally centered on the character, or have options to have it offset to the left or right a bit, depending on preferance. Not sure if this counts as camera control, but FoV is another big aspect I like to have that set as high as possible.
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    Gaul_Gaul_ Member
    I agree with the earlier assessments that having a very large zoom out is a negative for the game
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    Yokai TheaterYokai Theater Member, Phoenix Initiative, Royalty, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    edited July 2
    Different situations call for different perspectives but generally speaking in PvX / PvP MMOS zooming as far out as possible is the competitive thing to do. Zooming out just provides a lot of needed information and provides you with maximum awareness. However saying this I actually do prefer when MMOs and games in general have a fixed camera perspective.
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    LineagerLineager Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    Camera/vision distance should have a limited distance. So that players don’t zoom out or zoom in and see what’s behind the hill, mountain, river.
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    LunexLunex Member
    I've always played maximally zoomed out in **any** game.
    Be it a racing game, a third person shooter, an MMORPG, a top down ARPG, a MOBA, anything.

    That's because I'd always like to enjoy as much information as is available to me.
    There's obviously benefits of playing zoomed in, for example having an easier time to keep your focus, but for me personally that's never been an option due to mental/genetic issues. I've a really easy time taking in and processing a wide breath of information though, which is why (this is where the yt shorts ends and loops back to the beginning)
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    tautautautau Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    Above and behind me, with the options to:
    1. zoom in so the camera is just behind & over my head, and
    2. an option to see out my eyes, so as to have exactly the view that my character has, so a swivel is turning my head
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    PallywagzPallywagz Member
    I usually zoom pretty far out for raids if the environment allows it. I like my character to be centered on the screen if it's tab target, or slightly offset to the left if it's action combat.
    Balding but not old
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    ZekethephoenixZekethephoenix Member, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    I'm not a fan when cameras can see 40 feet above their character. I like when things are more immersive and you keep your character's actions very clear. Whenever I used to play wow with camera add-ons I could see almost 100feet above me. That is way too much for modern games.
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    lolagelolage Member
    edited July 2
    Echoing sentiments here of zoomed out, centered over character for pvp/large scale stuff but honestly I enjoy being able to do that while pveing/exploring in other MMOs too.

    The option of first-person can be nice for grabbing screenshots/photomode stuff too tbh.

    The crucial issue comes down to camera-collision with terrain or vegetation so allowing some sort of configurability there could be handy.
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    I prefer my camera to be at about a 135-150 degree angle above the back shoulders of my character when doing content that requires my full attention, like raid, pvp, etc. I zoom out far to be able to see the area around me.
    When I'm questing though I'll bring my camera down to about a 105 angle and zoom in to resemble more of a 3rd person story game.
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    SonicXplosionSonicXplosion Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    Being able to enjoy my characters appearance, and not be penalized for it is important to me. I dont like a far zoom.
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    VelkinVelkin Member
    I enjoy using the mouse wheel for zooming in/out. There are times when I need to be zoomed in and other times where I need to be zoomed out. I like both and having the ability to do it with the mouse wheel makes it super simple.
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    LinikerLiniker Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    zooming out as much as possible is a competitive pvp advantage, so there is no "preference" you have to zoom the max out especially during massive pvp, therefore there shouldnt be a ridiculous amount of zooming available I think Archeage was a bit too much tbh,

    as for camera position, have some up down left right customization, BDO did it great
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    GoalidGoalid Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    Letting the shot caller of a raid max zoom out to an almost satellite view like in ArcheAge is a terrible game design decision. It reduces the need for team communication and limits ambush gameplay. It also allows for "quarterbacking" where somehow in my fantasy game, my raid leader is telling the fighters exactly when to engage instead of them having to decide for themselves and off other front line callouts. This is where New World was far superior than ArcheAge for large scale PvP. If I want to have a birds eye view of a battlefield make me get a dragon mount and fly above the battlefield.

    I'm not saying the camera has to be as restrictive as New World's was, but nowhere near what ArcheAge allowed you to do.
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    GilgameshGilgamesh Member, Leader of Men, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    Simply replicate the camera perspective used in World of Warcraft.
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    mcstackersonmcstackerson Member, Phoenix Initiative, Royalty, Kickstarter, Alpha One
    I prefer my camera closer to my character, like in helldivers and darksouls, because i feel like it gives a better perspective on the environment and allows you to see the model of what you are interacting with.

    I usually play with my camera zoomed out as far as possible since a larger vision range gives you an advantage, even if it's a small one at times, and most MMOs have you focusing on the UI instead of the characters.

    I don't think perspective needs to be changed for a situation unless it's for cinematic reasons.
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    zaayrzaayr Member, Alpha One, Adventurer
    zoomed in down to first person makes the game feel more realistic in that you can't look around corners and can't see stuff beside or behind you. zoomed out makes it feel more like a moba/top-down view where you see everything around you for hundreds of feet and it is hard to be snuck up on or surprised. for those that want a more action combat where aiming down sights actually matter, they will want the closer view and further away is more of a tabletop game view. with all of that i know games like you zoomed out enough that you can view your whole character so you can see all of the design work done on the outfits but i wouldn't want to get zoomed out to far if you are wanting to keep your "action" combat where you can aim stuff.
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    Florian wrote: »
    casual gameplay more zoomed in. high crowded pvp pve spots zoomed out.

    Me too.
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    ClonageClonage Member
    I prefer having the option to customize the camera depending on the type of content i'm doing. Not just zoom in/out but also camera altitude and off-setting to the sides for action combat. Having these options would also help with taking fancy screenshots :)
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