I feel they are far to Tolkienish. I understand at this point it's almost played out to claim that the classic western european fantasy is played out (I mean no one does it anymore besides ESO) , but I was under the impression the at the Toren empire was modeled after the Macedonian/Roman empires. Which I feel is a great idea as the age of antiquity is completely unrepresented. With that said, I feel as though it would be fitting for them to fill the role of the Mongolian hordes.
Considering both empires covered 100s-1000s of ethnicities. I don't suggest simply making all Asian peoples represented as orcs, Africans as Vaelune, Romans as Elves, Western Europeans as Kaelal. I feel it's insensitive (eurocentric). I would like for each race to have many ethnicities within themselves, but cultural and architectural design to be less varied and encompassing of all the Roman empire.
I'm being very respectful when I say they need a bigger butt. Those muscles also become bigger as someone becomes more muscular and now it looks weirdly small.
I'm being very respectful when I say they need a bigger butt. Those muscles also become bigger as someone becomes more muscular and now it looks weirdly small.
Dammit, I'll have that song stuck in my head for weeks, now...
Perhaps a body constitution scroller to control the muscle mass of the Ren Kai, so that you could have an orc who’s mediumly buff or slightly still buffer than other races
when I look at facial features of the 5 races you’ve created, most look incredibly realistic and I applaud the level detail you’ve created. However, the vek look like they aren’t even from the same game. Their features are super exaggerated and they look unrealistic in comparison, But I love it. I think that rather than tone the vek down, I think the rest of the races are too similar. The dwarves and humans are perfect, they should be super realistic. Humans are.. well, humans. Realism is their entire point. The excessive hair and short stature are what sets the dwarves apart, yet still retaining a sense of realism. In the Tolkien fantasy that we have all adapted and love, elves humans and dwarves are the realistic ones. If the vek are going to have such distinguished alien like features, I believe the ren kai should also have more exaggerated facial features so that the orc races are set apart from the rest, rather than just the vek being super cool freaks. As it is, the ren kai just look like massive half orcs. I love them being massive muscled brutes. But Here are my points of issue.
- the tusks are puny,
- There is almost no underbite which is a crucial historical orc feature.
- The brow should be deepened for a more Neanderthal influence
- the is important l, the nose is small, and scrunched up into his eyes which is part of the reason everyone thinks his eyes look so strange and create a large awkward gap between his nose and upper lip. Additionally, if you take influence from dungeons and dragons, the orcs are historically porcine creatures. So possibly a slightly upturned nose. Though In other versions they came from eleven ancestors which would account for the pointed ears.
- For a resting face, his eyes are strangely squinted.
- the head has a humorous conical shape. I think either dulling the pointed tip of the scalp down, enlarging the top of the forehead, or fixing his unfortunate hair line\thickness could fix this head shape.
- The ears are rotated back too far, giving them a bat-like appearance. I think the ears need to be larger and more distinguished. Heck, the vex ears are basically wings.
- this is I think the biggest one that has been pointed out a bunch already, it has lots of facial hair, but no body hair. I can see the reptilian influence with the scaled skin and snake eyes, I think these conflict. You already have a race to represent the cross between hairy mammals and scaled reptiles. What I would like to see out of the ren kai personally is somewhat of a Sasquatch. Massive hairy brutes. Not quite as thick or healthy of hair as the dwarves, but hairy nonetheless. Again. Possibly porcine in influence.
I think a lot of these might just be accounted for in character creation sliders, in which case, fantastic job. I know this is only an iteration but you asked for feedback. Keep up the good work
- the tusks are puny,
- There is almost no underbite which is a crucial historical orc feature.
That is my main issue with the model. The tusks are so small they look almost out of place. I'm not saying they have to be ginormous, but they should look sturdy. Those look a little frail and like they might break in combat. They are just seem out of place given how robust the model is.
I don't understand what the "scales" are. Are they actually scales or are they a tattoo? Tattoos or ceremonial body markings would be cool, but I'm not sure how I feel about scaly orcs.
Other than that, I think the model looks great. I think the team did a great job.
I would like to see lots of hair and facial hair options for the Ren'Kai. Other people have asked for body hair, and they make good points, but I am neutral in my opinion of it. I think that could best be handled with slider.
0
Options
AtamaMember, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
I don't understand what the "scales" are. Are they actually scales or are they a tattoo? Tattoos or ceremonial body markings would be cool, but I'm not sure how I feel about scaly orcs.
That confused me too. I couldn't tell if they were scales or some faint tattoo that was hard to make out. If they were scales, it would be weird that they were only in specific places, but if it's a tattoo I would hope it would be easier to see.
I also thought that it might have been an attempt to represent faint body hair, but if so, it didn't work.
Late to the party but... The only thing that stands out as bad is the Hands and forearms are Popeye level goofy. Once he's wearing gauntlets or has a single handed sword in his hand he will look way too cartoony
0
Options
T ElfMember, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
edited February 2022
Would have to see the females to give an opinion. Males look like a gorilla, meh. Was hoping they would look more like the guys in The Hu Band video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jM8dCGIm6yc
One of the things I'd like to see in character creation is facial customization with different types of horns like on the brow/nose or bigger tusks. Orca have always been my top pick for race and I'd like to be able to customize his husks or add in like horns to his brow stuff like that. My only other problem is his tiny ears 👀. To me they don't seem to match the rest of his physique.
Looks orc-ish, to me! Have to agree with the options for more body-hair. Some tribal tattoos would go nice with this large body type, as there's more room for decoration!
As far as the eyes? I'm okay with the vertical slits. I'd like to see the option to color the whites of the eyes, with this race, though; Something this large and (potentially) monstrous will have some large peepers to look into, and could fit well, with the race's overall visual appearance.
I wish their silhouettes weren't so Humanoid and generic. Their silhouettes just strike me as large/muscular humans- not like other takes on orcs. I'm not saying they have to be canonically like Warcraft Orcs, or Warhammer Orcs, but something that better personifies their racial differences from other human-like races. I think the Vek did a way better job distinguishing themselves.
What do you like about the current art direction of this race? Their physical presence, towering and very physically imposing over all the other races. Their muscled forms, the huge models, huge muscles, arms and hands, thick legs, one look and you know fighting them they are going to be physically a force to be reckoned with. Some nice touches on the face were the scars from battle, wrinkles from a face that has seen a lot of combat, I like the ears, small out of the way. I hope spells also scale in size relative to the caster size.
Is there anything you dislike about the art direction for this race, and why?
I really don't like the nose, I think having several options is the go as some people in here do like them, Voldemort like slits, I think that would be particularly badass. Or short stunted noses like Azog the white orc from The Hobbit. I'd like many skin colour options, eye options, more tusk options, beard styles almost as many as the Dunir. I feel the face and eyes could get some iterations, maybe the whole head bar the ears. But we've only seen a stiff expression, but I can easily see that face twisting into anger, to signs of respect. The Dunir I think have been nailed, they look intelligent, composed, waiting to act from the experience their face shows. I feel the Ren'Kai face close up, wasn't as bang on in comparison but its still only our first look at a model, seeing it action might be different.
What are your thoughts on what was shown during the livestream for the Ren’Kai race?
I was very happy, they were so much of what I wanted from them, especially for a first 3d model reveal. I was stoked. I wanted to see more of course haha, armour sets, them moving, in game stuff but all in time. Loved the livestream.
Are there any specific Character Creator customizations you would like to see for the Ren'Kai race?
Dragon influenced tattoos, beard & hair styles inspired from these creatures of immense physical power and presence, that are so heavily featured in their sigil. Honor, Power & Tranquility are their creed, something to showcase these. A jade tea set as an accessory, family tattoos or hair styles/colours to show their honor. Things that contrast their brute strength as well as symbols of it. I'd like to see stoic face expressions, aggressive face options, in the initial models we saw some had massive neck/shoulder muscles, I think options and sliders to customise their muscles would be great too, height as well within a set range so they are still tall Ren'Kai. EDIT - Underbite options as posted by others, I really like that idea. Body as a slider, not everyone will want that, some will love it.
For non character creator customisation options I hope they will feature in their armour as well, perhaps the horns of a different types of dragons attached to the sides of their helmets or one side of their shoulders, the elder dragon horns being the ultimate. Have a Shishi-odoshi (deer scarer) in their freehold gardens, then mounted on spikes along a section of the outside walls are trophies from their greatest enemies and hardest battles, a warning to all would be raiders and thieves.
0
Options
sektothMember, Leader of Men, Kickstarter, Alpha One
edited February 2022
I'm a big fan of orc and orc-inspired races in fantasy, and I think the art direction here is definitely going the right way. I appreciate the larger, bulkier profile and I hope that we can emphasize it even further with customization (body options for bulkier or leaner would be great!). I'm also a fan of the leathery/scaly hide and the exotic eyes, it helps make them more distinct from the other races.
That said, I think the face here is in a strange between-place where it doesn't want to look too human but doesn't really know how to look different. I think larger tusks and a heavier, stronger jaw would help balance out this face, and I definitely hope for different nose options as well. At present, the tusks look like they're just clipping out of the bottom lip. I think this would help bring them in line with how Steven presented them during the Livestream, emphasizing their imposing physical figure.
Other options I'd like to see would be accessories of course: jewelry, piercings, tattoos, I feel like the Ren'kai would really want to emphasize their forms and increase their physical presence. Options for more body hair and facial hair would be a very strong preference, and again, different nose/jaw options. A variety of hair styles from different inspirations- European, African, Asiatic- a diversity of options could give players the freedom to bring some wow-factor to their character design.
I'm very excited to see how the Ren'kai develop, thank you devs for listening to our feedback!
Not really a fan of their skin tone. The model is alright and may look much better once we apply different colors to it, but I preferred some of the earlier concept art.
For the most part I agree. In light of looking at the Vek who have a very strong purple coloration I would have expected the Ren'Kai to be similar...just with a deeper reddish tone. As a whole I like the concept but the skin tone is a bit too human like. Perhaps more color saturation will be something you can do in the character creation matrix. Also they look just a tad bit too friendly...a little more menacing or fierce would probably fit the race better. In that aspect the Vek knocked it out of the park.
I feel they are far to Tolkienish. I understand at this point it's almost played out to claim that the classic western european fantasy is played out (I mean no one does it anymore besides ESO) , but I was under the impression the at the Toren empire was modeled after the Macedonian/Roman empires. Which I feel is a great idea as the age of antiquity is completely unrepresented. With that said, I feel as though it would be fitting for them to fill the role of the Mongolian hordes.
Considering both empires covered 100s-1000s of ethnicities. I don't suggest simply making all Asian peoples represented as orcs, Africans as Vaelune, Romans as Elves, Western Europeans as Kaelal. I feel it's insensitive (eurocentric). I would like for each race to have many ethnicities within themselves, but cultural and architectural design to be less varied and encompassing of all the Roman empire.
Why do you bring real life identity politics to a fantasy game? You guys are nuts
What do you like about the current art direction of this race? I like the size of the overall body
Is there anything you dislike about the art direction for this race, and why? I feel the face is a little weird for my taste, the nose to mouth region. But if I have an overall customization of the aspect I would be good with it.
What are your thoughts on what was shown during the livestream for the Ren’Kai race? I think having a dragon background and theme to the race is really cool. Again even more customization.
Are there any specific Character Creator customization's you would like to see for the Ren'Kai race? Scaling features enhanced, webbed fingers, larger teeth, webbed toes, hair, skin color, the facial features from nose to mouth.
Nope... Not for Me... Sure they will be Popular though.... If it was Green it could pass as a Certain OTHER game's Orc, but then again... They All Look alike..... Seriously though.. You guys do Great work... (Just need to get rid of that poor guy's Eczema....)
The Truth has 3 sides, Your Point of View, Their point of View, and The Actual Truth, so, Be careful How you wield the Sword of Truth, It Cuts 3 ways!
I know this thread is closed at this point but, hopefully it gets considered anyways. My two cents on the matter is:
1) know your planing to have a robust character creator. I hope we can adjust the face. ie the jaw size etc
2) I know Steven talked about them as these large hulking bruts. But, with as many classes as your gonna have in AoC. I hope we are not locked to the large hulking idea. While I like that and it would be great for warrior types it always seems odd to me to have big hulking types when it comes to the rogue or more nimble classes. While they could still be strong I hope we get the option to trim them down for those types of classes.
Over all I like the race and I think it's a great direction. I just hope they are not locked in so they are all hulking types.
0
Options
Anduin KayvaanMember, Phoenix Initiative, Royalty, Alpha One
Do keep in mind that the Ren'kai skin tone will range from current example to reds to greens and everything in between. They will not just be human tannish. I do love their design and hope they stay as they are.
We updated the images for this thread. We consolidated the full body front and back images into a single image and also removed the beard so you can see the full Ren'kai male's face.
Just a heads up! ^_^
2
Options
AtamaMember, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
edited March 2022
It looks a little better without the beard.
Given some time to look this over, though, I'm a bit uncomfortable with the silly cross-eyed look of the face. I think it's mostly the nose. It's just too high and small. The noses on the older concept art looked better.
You still had the long distance from the mouth to the nose, but it wasn't the cute little button nose we have in the newer photo. I also think the jaw is too wide, the narrower jaw in the older concept was better.
I like the new ears better, and I like the red eyes and slitted pupils. Otherwise, overall, as far as the face goes, the previous concept art was more appealing to me.
EDIT: Another thing that occurred to me that is also contributing to the "doofusness" of the face; the exaggerated chin. The chin looks large and swollen. Combine that with the wide jaw sticking out the sides with huge mandibles, and the whole lower part of the head looks bloated. Again, I prefer the older concept art.
Now, if we had sliders that could shrink those features to be closer to the original concept art, I'd be very happy. I wouldn't mind the option to look like a meathead, as long as it wasn't mandatory.
Comments
Considering both empires covered 100s-1000s of ethnicities. I don't suggest simply making all Asian peoples represented as orcs, Africans as Vaelune, Romans as Elves, Western Europeans as Kaelal. I feel it's insensitive (eurocentric). I would like for each race to have many ethnicities within themselves, but cultural and architectural design to be less varied and encompassing of all the Roman empire.
Dammit, I'll have that song stuck in my head for weeks, now...
- the tusks are puny,
- There is almost no underbite which is a crucial historical orc feature.
- The brow should be deepened for a more Neanderthal influence
- the is important l, the nose is small, and scrunched up into his eyes which is part of the reason everyone thinks his eyes look so strange and create a large awkward gap between his nose and upper lip. Additionally, if you take influence from dungeons and dragons, the orcs are historically porcine creatures. So possibly a slightly upturned nose. Though In other versions they came from eleven ancestors which would account for the pointed ears.
- For a resting face, his eyes are strangely squinted.
- the head has a humorous conical shape. I think either dulling the pointed tip of the scalp down, enlarging the top of the forehead, or fixing his unfortunate hair line\thickness could fix this head shape.
- The ears are rotated back too far, giving them a bat-like appearance. I think the ears need to be larger and more distinguished. Heck, the vex ears are basically wings.
- this is I think the biggest one that has been pointed out a bunch already, it has lots of facial hair, but no body hair. I can see the reptilian influence with the scaled skin and snake eyes, I think these conflict. You already have a race to represent the cross between hairy mammals and scaled reptiles. What I would like to see out of the ren kai personally is somewhat of a Sasquatch. Massive hairy brutes. Not quite as thick or healthy of hair as the dwarves, but hairy nonetheless. Again. Possibly porcine in influence.
I think a lot of these might just be accounted for in character creation sliders, in which case, fantastic job. I know this is only an iteration but you asked for feedback. Keep up the good work
That is my main issue with the model. The tusks are so small they look almost out of place. I'm not saying they have to be ginormous, but they should look sturdy. Those look a little frail and like they might break in combat. They are just seem out of place given how robust the model is.
I don't understand what the "scales" are. Are they actually scales or are they a tattoo? Tattoos or ceremonial body markings would be cool, but I'm not sure how I feel about scaly orcs.
Other than that, I think the model looks great. I think the team did a great job.
I would like to see lots of hair and facial hair options for the Ren'Kai. Other people have asked for body hair, and they make good points, but I am neutral in my opinion of it. I think that could best be handled with slider.
That confused me too. I couldn't tell if they were scales or some faint tattoo that was hard to make out. If they were scales, it would be weird that they were only in specific places, but if it's a tattoo I would hope it would be easier to see.
I also thought that it might have been an attempt to represent faint body hair, but if so, it didn't work.
Pug noses are generally considered 'cute', and that word should have nothing to do with these guys.
Formerly T-Elf
As far as the eyes? I'm okay with the vertical slits. I'd like to see the option to color the whites of the eyes, with this race, though; Something this large and (potentially) monstrous will have some large peepers to look into, and could fit well, with the race's overall visual appearance.
Is there anything you dislike about the art direction for this race, and why?
I really don't like the nose, I think having several options is the go as some people in here do like them, Voldemort like slits, I think that would be particularly badass. Or short stunted noses like Azog the white orc from The Hobbit. I'd like many skin colour options, eye options, more tusk options, beard styles almost as many as the Dunir. I feel the face and eyes could get some iterations, maybe the whole head bar the ears. But we've only seen a stiff expression, but I can easily see that face twisting into anger, to signs of respect. The Dunir I think have been nailed, they look intelligent, composed, waiting to act from the experience their face shows. I feel the Ren'Kai face close up, wasn't as bang on in comparison but its still only our first look at a model, seeing it action might be different.
What are your thoughts on what was shown during the livestream for the Ren’Kai race?
I was very happy, they were so much of what I wanted from them, especially for a first 3d model reveal. I was stoked. I wanted to see more of course haha, armour sets, them moving, in game stuff but all in time. Loved the livestream.
Are there any specific Character Creator customizations you would like to see for the Ren'Kai race?
Dragon influenced tattoos, beard & hair styles inspired from these creatures of immense physical power and presence, that are so heavily featured in their sigil. Honor, Power & Tranquility are their creed, something to showcase these. A jade tea set as an accessory, family tattoos or hair styles/colours to show their honor. Things that contrast their brute strength as well as symbols of it. I'd like to see stoic face expressions, aggressive face options, in the initial models we saw some had massive neck/shoulder muscles, I think options and sliders to customise their muscles would be great too, height as well within a set range so they are still tall Ren'Kai. EDIT - Underbite options as posted by others, I really like that idea. Body as a slider, not everyone will want that, some will love it.
For non character creator customisation options I hope they will feature in their armour as well, perhaps the horns of a different types of dragons attached to the sides of their helmets or one side of their shoulders, the elder dragon horns being the ultimate. Have a Shishi-odoshi (deer scarer) in their freehold gardens, then mounted on spikes along a section of the outside walls are trophies from their greatest enemies and hardest battles, a warning to all would be raiders and thieves.
That said, I think the face here is in a strange between-place where it doesn't want to look too human but doesn't really know how to look different. I think larger tusks and a heavier, stronger jaw would help balance out this face, and I definitely hope for different nose options as well. At present, the tusks look like they're just clipping out of the bottom lip. I think this would help bring them in line with how Steven presented them during the Livestream, emphasizing their imposing physical figure.
Other options I'd like to see would be accessories of course: jewelry, piercings, tattoos, I feel like the Ren'kai would really want to emphasize their forms and increase their physical presence. Options for more body hair and facial hair would be a very strong preference, and again, different nose/jaw options. A variety of hair styles from different inspirations- European, African, Asiatic- a diversity of options could give players the freedom to bring some wow-factor to their character design.
I'm very excited to see how the Ren'kai develop, thank you devs for listening to our feedback!
the model pictures look abit friendly ?
Why do you bring real life identity politics to a fantasy game? You guys are nuts
Is there anything you dislike about the art direction for this race, and why? I feel the face is a little weird for my taste, the nose to mouth region. But if I have an overall customization of the aspect I would be good with it.
What are your thoughts on what was shown during the livestream for the Ren’Kai race? I think having a dragon background and theme to the race is really cool. Again even more customization.
Are there any specific Character Creator customization's you would like to see for the Ren'Kai race? Scaling features enhanced, webbed fingers, larger teeth, webbed toes, hair, skin color, the facial features from nose to mouth.
1) know your planing to have a robust character creator. I hope we can adjust the face. ie the jaw size etc
2) I know Steven talked about them as these large hulking bruts. But, with as many classes as your gonna have in AoC. I hope we are not locked to the large hulking idea. While I like that and it would be great for warrior types it always seems odd to me to have big hulking types when it comes to the rogue or more nimble classes. While they could still be strong I hope we get the option to trim them down for those types of classes.
Over all I like the race and I think it's a great direction. I just hope they are not locked in so they are all hulking types.
We updated the images for this thread. We consolidated the full body front and back images into a single image and also removed the beard so you can see the full Ren'kai male's face.
Just a heads up! ^_^
Given some time to look this over, though, I'm a bit uncomfortable with the silly cross-eyed look of the face. I think it's mostly the nose. It's just too high and small. The noses on the older concept art looked better.
You still had the long distance from the mouth to the nose, but it wasn't the cute little button nose we have in the newer photo. I also think the jaw is too wide, the narrower jaw in the older concept was better.
I like the new ears better, and I like the red eyes and slitted pupils. Otherwise, overall, as far as the face goes, the previous concept art was more appealing to me.
EDIT: Another thing that occurred to me that is also contributing to the "doofusness" of the face; the exaggerated chin. The chin looks large and swollen. Combine that with the wide jaw sticking out the sides with huge mandibles, and the whole lower part of the head looks bloated. Again, I prefer the older concept art.
Now, if we had sliders that could shrink those features to be closer to the original concept art, I'd be very happy. I wouldn't mind the option to look like a meathead, as long as it wasn't mandatory.