Glorious Alpha Two Testers!
Alpha Two Realms are now unlocked for Phase II testing!
For our initial launch, testing will begin on Friday, December 20, 2024, at 10 AM Pacific and continue uninterrupted until Monday, January 6, 2025, at 10 AM Pacific. After January 6th, we’ll transition to a schedule of five-day-per-week access for the remainder of Phase II.
You can download the game launcher here and we encourage you to join us on our for the most up to date testing news.
Alpha Two Realms are now unlocked for Phase II testing!
For our initial launch, testing will begin on Friday, December 20, 2024, at 10 AM Pacific and continue uninterrupted until Monday, January 6, 2025, at 10 AM Pacific. After January 6th, we’ll transition to a schedule of five-day-per-week access for the remainder of Phase II.
You can download the game launcher here and we encourage you to join us on our for the most up to date testing news.
Comments
To see more and more games trying to charge a sub fee and a cash shop or a large flat cost and cash shops its ridiculous. What's worse is it's become such a norm that people just feel it's ok.
Too many games are too easy. Too many games where you can buy advantage. Too many games where you can pay to look better than other people. I was really hoping AOC would be different.
I still like the concept of the game the ideas are amazing. I love what Steve wants to bring into games, things he experienced when he was younger and the gaming industry was different. Which while was so excited first reading about thee game and his goals when the word MT and cash shop came up my heart sank and simplifying in my mind was WHY. It contradicts so many of the things he says he wants to do.
I want a game with meaningful experience that means earning something. I'm sorry but you can spi cash shops all you want but the simple truth is whether its for game play advantage or how one looks it cheapens the experience.
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You work really hard to earn a mount that looks great some has a pleab mount slaps a skin on it and it looks better than the mount you worked so hard for.
The dangers of working hard to get an Inn all the crafting materials, currency and such but you can get a much better looking in by spending $15.
"Hey that mount looks cool what quest line or mob did you get it from" reply "non you can get one to its selling for $20 at the cash shop if you want to make you mount look like this too."
How would any of these situations deepen our experience in the game? How does it not cheapen it.
Traditionally you look better the more work you put in cash shops just throws that out the window. You could tell who was just starting out you could see who put the extra effort in.
Then all these skins popping out left and right for pre funding at what point is it pre funding and at what extreme does it just become cash grabbing. Cash grabbing is something AOC is not supposed to be about.
You'll see me defend a lot about this game Cash Shops are most definitely not one of them.
Every AAA MMO that I am aware of has had at least two, often three -and sometimes even four - streams of revenue. Even going back to EQ in 1999, you had to buy the game as well as pay a subscription fee.
I mean, "some games" out now have cash shops, subscription fees, require a buy in to the game AND require expansion purchases. When compared to that, having no buy-in, no paid expansions, a standard subscription fee and a 100% optional cash shop is fairly reasonable.
All I see with the way Ashes is doing things is positives. It will be the cheapest online game I've ever played - purely due to a total lack of in game vanity on my part.
With EQ releasing an expansion a year, it cost a player roughly $230 a year to play - adjusted that is $306 - or $25.65 a month. With only one revenue stream, this is the MINIMUM that we would need to pay now.
Bottom line I want a game where what we get in game is earned and not purchased and yes even cosmetics. How one looks has a large impact not just in a game but also in real life.
I'm sorry but there is no way around this simple truth if you can purchase something to make you, you're mount or ship look better than what you can earn in game it cheapens the experience and creates a divide in the community the people willing to or that can afford to look better than everyone else in the game not because they earned it but because they spent money to get it.
Some one who went through the efforts in game should have the appearance that dictates what they went they did to get there not how much they spent.
If I am paying a sub why should I have to pay more to gain something in a game isnt the whole point to a game, beating various stages to progress. That as you progress items look better?
It also cheapens the experience of a crafter. Traditionally if you wanted to look good in a game you had to progress in levels overcome big challenges or work to earn the cash to pay a master crafter to craft an outfit for you. So it is a form of income that will be limited to crafters if people can purchase things that look much better than what they can craft either for themselves or sell to others.
Yes other games are doing it but also it is everything that is wrong with the gaming industry today.
It's difficult to find a RPG game these days where you just play a flat one time purchase, or a MMORPG that is purely sub based because many of the Developing companies have been bought out by companies like EA, Ubisoft as well as others where they systematically stripped all that were good of those companies and turned them into Cash Grab companies.
So just because it's the norm does not make it ok quite contrary it's still very wrong.
Which is why it saddened me to learn after hearing all the great things about AOC and what their mission goal was, that it would have Cash Shops.
My reaction was a silent saddened scream in my mind WHY.
Does this make me an AOC hater far from it, I still love the concepts behind AOC it sounds like it will be a wonderful game. I'm still hopeful that Steve will hold true and not go overboard with Cash Shops. I Hope that Cash Shops items will not be better than in game items just different.
But I keep coming back to the statement he said :
I understand your apprehension. The state and direction of other Mmorpg's is why I started Ashes. You don't have to agree with the pricing structure of the crowdsourcing add ons, but rest assured Ashes will never include monetization practices that require players to pay to win or stay competitive. And there will be an abundance of in game cosmetics that are achievable and rare, some on par with marketplace cosmetics
Some
This worries that just SOME items in game will be on PAR with marketplace cosmetics.
Now I think Steve is a Visionary, I think he is sincere with a lot of the things he says but he is also a very Successful business man this is a good thing but can be a bad thing as well. I hope his Inner child remains a stronger inner voice than his Inner Entrepreneur.
If the best looking gear are Items earned through game Epic Gear, Long Quest Lines, Master Crafted Items with rare matts. If items in cash shops to not superior to the way items look in game just different, it may be ok . But based on key things that have been said and past experiences it raises a red flag to this one and very important aspect to the game. I hope when the game comes out and it progresses these red flags disappear but that has to be earned and I hope he earns it.
I love every thing about what this game is proposed to be except the cash shop and for good reason.
Literally every MMO gamer that I consider a friend cares greatly about the above quoted statement, except for the last four words.
Literally every single one of them cares that there is no advantage to be had in the cash shop, but not one of them extends that to cosmetics.
It's been 10 years since cosmetics became something that MMO developers considered an optional extra, and I can't name a single major MMO right now that doesn't offer this as an option.
Thing is, as it is purely cosmetic, it is purely optional. That is what makes it acceptable to literally every MMO player I know.
The cost I posted earlier was what we would pay today if everything went up at the same rate as inflation. Experienced MMO developer salaries and electricity have both gone up much faster than inflation over the last 15 years, and when broken down, these are the two biggest costs of an MMO. That is without factoring in the extra labor required to produce the significantly more complex games we have now ocer what we had then,
The people that care about cosmetics and would pay upwards of $30 a month for a subscription (we are at $26 without adding in the increase in power and labor costs) are actually in a position to get a new cosmetic every month and so don't need to concern themselves with it.
A player that is able to afford to play Ashes, but is unable to afford to buy any cosmetics isn't likely to be upset by this fact. If they have $15 a month to spend and absolutely no more, they will simply be glad that Ashes actually allows them to play the full game - something *LITERALLY* no other MMORPG on the market right now does.
As far as how I view the importance of Cosmetics, I would go on a limb as well and say highly doubtful I am in the minority here whether people admit it or not. Companies would not be making tons of money off of cosmetics if I was in the Minority in how important Cosmetics are. People may say it's not important but earnings in Cosmetics in the gaming industry would speak other wise, profit margins don't deceive.
My predictions are that the Cash Shop profits for AOC at some point will far exceed what's earned via Subscriptions and this is some of the dangers I worry about as I posted previously in this thread. No one will actually know how cash shops will be handled during release until it happens or how it will be handled as the game progresses. Much of that profit could in fact be used to further develop game play or most of it could be held for profit or much of it could just be dumped into making even more skins to make even more profit. We have no way of knowing till the time comes. In most instances Cash Shops usually turns into cash grabs which AOC is marketed to not be. I really hope that AOC is the exception but trust and faith in this aspect of the game will have to be earned with results for me personally.
But the bottom line I stated was and this is a personal viewpoint as I can't speak for others. I would prefer to be in a game where things are earned over being bought. Earning things gives meaningfulness buying things removes game value and cheapens the experience. Where is pride of accomplishment in purchasing something in a cash shop vrs earning it through effort. This is the fundamental thing that has been lacking in most of the games that are out right now. Whether its PTW or Cosmetics or both so many games use Cash Shop with the the buy over effort mentality and in most situation almost always turns into a cash grab.
It's pretty obvious that the Cash Shop is in the game and will most likely stay though out. All I can hope for is that In game items will not be over shadowed by cash shop items that a good portion of the profit earned is in fact used for further development.
Only time will tell, till then I am thankful we have the freedom to post our feelings freely as long as we are respectful to each other, that definitely garnishes much respect and hope.
Intrepid is a privately held company, as opposed to a listed company. This means that Steven owns the company, and need answer to no one but himself. He has no board of directors watching over him, and no shareholders demanding a specific level of profit.
I guess how happy you are with this depends on your views on listed companies, and whether you think people owning a company (or portion thereof) that don't actually care about the product past the profit it makes is a good thing or a bad thing for the product in question.
In my mind, a company owned by someone that loves the genre that their product fits in to is far more likely as a company to put the quality of the product first.
I definitely love the forums and community here the true freedom of speech which is practically non existent in most game forums, no over moderation. There is a lot to love about the game and the community.
A nice respectful dialog TY
Cause the greed...
Humans are greedy, so even if they have 10$(?)/month/player guarantated income, they still want more...
but if you can get the "respect" you get from a legendary armor by simply buying a skin that looks alike ... that would be lame
I know a purchased cosmetic is only appealing as so far as it is unique in someway. However, if you can obtain a skin on par with it just by playing, who will buy the one in the shop?
Lazy people.
You will never lose betting on human laziness.
This is, in my opinion, why the shop exists in Ashes. They already stated good cosmetics will be obtained in game. But there are always people with more money than time/motivation.
Is it a slippery slope. Hell yes. But I'd they deliver in said promise of equal cosmetics in game, Im ok with said cash shop existing.
I mean players that purchase stuff now are taking a risk, they don’t even know how stuff is gonne look ingame.
It is partially supporting the game and having items not others can have that came later on to the game giving zero support.
The items that are purchased are nothing else then cosmetic that are obtainable in the game just looks different.
If you want ashes to deliver an near perfect game then instead of whining people should support them in many possible ways.
Then you'll start seeing other ridiculous reasoning(s) later if things get suspicious - so for the last f!cking time " @everyone " ... stop supporting cash shops ... its utter cringe. Regardless of how you look at it .... its still a MTX for Cosmetics
Whatever, just don't be surprised if Pantheon ( or any other MMORPG without a cash shop ) does better than this MMORPG solely because Pantheon doesn't plan on having a Cash Shop
But hey ... at this least this link keeps me neutral https://youtu.be/eCvcB4S-tZM?t=49m45s ... via it'll be " cash shop cosmetics will be on par with in-game cosmetics "
And you missed the whole point of it - thats how every cash shop starts ... at first its (usually) okay, but then it likely always turns into something ugly a few years later
Ashes will have a subscription fee and a cosmetic only cash shop.
World of Warcraft has a subscription fee, a cosmetic cash shop, AND requires expansion purchases.
ESO has a subscription fee, and a has a NON-cosmetics only cash shop.
https://youtu.be/Kg3bE0b0UR8?t=4m50s
@AutumnLeaf