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Check out Alpha Two Announcements here to see the latest news on Alpha Two.
Check out general Announcements here to see the latest news on Ashes of Creation & Intrepid Studios.
To get the quickest updates regarding Alpha Two, connect your Discord and Intrepid accounts here.
Comments
The griefer doesn't care about people who fight back. He'll simply die to them and not touch them again. He's looking for prey that won't fight back. And he'll spend as much of his time as possible harassing such prey. That's his goal.
Again, the easy part is the avoidance of becoming a PKer. I don't care about anything that took place before that or after.
And the alt is simply for rep preservation. If the griefer doesn't care about his rep - the alt doesn't even enter the equation.
I keep telling yall, but you keep bunching me up with other arguments. My only base argument has been "visible hp makes it easier to do this abuse". Azherae's change removes that ease. That's it. That's what I wanted
We didn't get to here after testing and experimentation, we are not even in Alpha 2 yet. Information hiding was the go to, it's the first thing we tried.
And this topic isn't just a hypothetical forum suggestion. The segmented HP bars show that.
Is this what we are going to go to every time the corruption system has a problem?
Yes. Like, that's how Intrepid develops things in general. It's been that way, from the start, and I don't say this as a bad thing or a thing they should be 'ashamed of'.
From the beginning they've had a somewhat 'let's try stuff and see what sticks, based on what I like and think can be made to work - Steven Paraphrased Sharif' approach.
You can't really argue with the initial results either, can you? Ashes of Creation has far more support and hype than it has direct criticism based on this approach (or used to, it's hard to tell if it changed and I'm biased now).
The only thing we can probably look to as a potential downside of this would be that Alpha-2 might be kinda long.
The issue isn't corruption its people pvping the game out of a reasonable market. Corruption is there to put rules and reduce it, not to remove pvp.
That is where you are getting your logic mixed up because "fix" for you means it can't happen anymore. Which again the point of corruption isn't to "fix" (ie remove all pvp) it is there to reduce it by a large margin.
Other features like seeing he HP bar and such further supports it again reducing the amount of pvp.
Ah yes, the old fall back for the L2 guys, invoke "The Steven". Do you think he's reading this thread? Do you think he's mad at me? Im frightened, someone hold me.
If we say we don't like a direction we are taking then it simply must be because we are not true believers.
Edit: deleted part of this, its hard to describe how infuriating responses like this are. Im not even going to enguage with it.
And again, if you were arguing in an honest manner (with yourself, I assume) where there is a potential situation you can see where a player should gain corruption but doesn't, the remedy you would be asking for is for them to be gaining corruption, not for a change to a totally unrelated system that you yourself agree wouldn't actually stop people from being able to avoid corruption in the manner you are talking about.
This is why you are looking crazy, and why I honestly can't take your argument as being anything other than that of from a position of nostelgia.
Once again, if a lack of corruption is your issue here, then the remedy you should be asking for is corruption in that situation.
By the nature of response filtering, that is in fact, how this works.
Steven makes a change, a subset of the potential playerbase say 'This sounds really bad I hope you don't do it', and Steven often goes 'we're gonna try it'. Then those who believe 'learn to accept it' until the next thing, and those who don't, Jahlon their way out (he has a new video btw!)
But, at the same time, Ashes is not for everyone.
Like I said, going to this first sets a bad precident.
It's not like I like it either, I just have to accept it because I can't change Intrepid. I'm super frustrated at the way decisions seem to be 'made' about all sorts of aspects of Ashes, but accepting that 'misery' is a literal prerequisite for continuing to be here. My friends can't even, so they just don't.
You said 'precedent set', but for me, who felt like this particular 'precedent' was set quite long ago, I just answered as if you were potentially someone who is actually not familiar 'how it works around here' in terms of Intrepid development.
I'm happy to add you to my list of 'disgruntled stoics', sorry about the answer type.
No worries.
If you don't like it either then you shouldn't just accept it. It your job to voice why its a problem.
That's the actual point of open development. Go after them when it's needed. They ask for it.
I feel like Intrepid knows that my opinion is that their entire Corruption system is entirely flawed and needs to be redone and reconsidered from the ground up.
I've posted to that effect many times in the related threads that constantly pop up, so it's probably just 'fatigue'.
And, like you, I know that the main response I can get in discussion a lot of the time is 'but it worked in L2'. Sometimes I can work through that with the poster (NiKr), and sometimes I can't. In general, I'd be happy to just have people that can articulate why precisely they want something instead of [that thing Mag7 does in conversations].
This didn't seem to be that thread type, so yeah, it's my endurance lapsing. No sarc.
Under the bridge man. We are on page 9 I think, I think I'm feeling it too 🫡
This is the logic I seem to get from your current approach.
Like I've been saying. I've experienced (and done a bit myself) this abuse in L2. Quite often people would get corrupted because they misjudged their victim's hp values in relation to their attacks. Seeing any kind of hp value would make this particular abuse easier. I believe that is a problem that can be resolved by not having visible hp.
To me, not seeing hp in pvp is a normal design, which is why I don't see my suggestion as smth huge and abnormal. Obviously others think otherwise, because they have different experiences.
To me, the corruption system works fine (again, this abuse included), and I'm fine with Steven's changes to it to make it work better (at least until we see the details of corruption balancing). And I believe that making this hp change would be a good addition to make the system work better.
The 2 points above combine into the reasoning behind my discussions in this thread. If you consider this "nostalgia talking" - ok, I'm fine with that. This entire damn game is "Steven's nostalgia talking", so it's not like this is something new.
And on that note, I'd touch a bit on what Diamaht said. We're here for the exact purpose of giving Intrepid feedback. This thread had that exact purpose. And any and all responses and arguments in this thread server that purpose. And it'll be on Intrepid to decide which side they'll stick with. As for "do you think Steven reads this?" - no, I'm sure he doesn't. But I'm also sure that mods will at least give him a few pointers on what this thread was about, and probably a few main arguments for each side of the discussion. Cause afaik that's the mods' job (or at least a part of it). I'm also pretty sure Steven himself has said in the past that the team has discussed topics that were brought up on the forums in the past, so no, these 8 pages have not been spammed in vein
You have to remember, for almost all of us combating other players utilizing hp as a reference is the norm. Perhaps I'm missing something but to me having that reference enables so many more possibilities in responce to aggression.
Yes, there are things it opens you up to, but you are a lot more free in your decision making with more info than less.
I'm confident something can be developed that lets us mitigate grief while not taking tools away from the player.
But yes, I can see the L2 perspective on it.
Better content, sure, but not EQ2 style content. Taking specific aspects from EQ2 on occasion as well - but not a direct copy of the game.
You keep calling it an abuse while it is not. It is an intended game mechanic.
Azherae's suggestion has also the weakness that players will be able to run with very low health around and anyone trying to engage in PvP with them will actually kill them in one shot and become corrupted.
Then what? Reduce the corruption penalties so if you kill a dozen players every day to have minimal impact?
Engaging with mobs must be a risky activity, and you must know with whom you play, if you can trust them or not.
You give a very good point there!
A good adoption would be to have it only display the hp %/segment when you are x meters away from the enemy. That way you cannot be scouted from miles back but the enemy would have to actually come close to "look" at you. The party fighting the mobs would javelin to be careful that they aren't getting scouted by a sneaky ranger or Rouge. This can be done in several ways.
You give a very good point there!
A good adoption would be to have it only display the hp %/segment when you are x meters away from the enemy. That way you cannot be scouted from miles back but the enemy would have to actually come close to "look" at you. The party fighting the mobs would javelin to be careful that they aren't getting scouted by a sneaky ranger or Rouge. This can be done in several ways.
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Not javelin but: "would have to be"
Mobile can be such a pain
I'm against pointless killing (or even attacks), so to me this is a counter against the people who would do that. This is also one of the reasons why I'm against players dropping loot on death, because now there's a higher chance that anyone might attack anyone at any time, which just makes people even more annoyed with the flagging system than they will already be.
So much wrong with this take.
The segmented HP bars is probably the best option if we're going to see any at all.
Someone running around with low health might know well how to survive and the attacker will not know know if he faces a full health farmer loaded with loot or a player willing to just put corruption on him.
As it is now, seeing that a player refuses to answer PvP even when when his health drops below 25% can be an indication that he has nothing of value.
No visible health bar eliminates the possibility of putting pressure onto the green player to defend and becomes a russian roulette for the attacker.
Pointless killing is when the killer gets nothing out of that kill, not even fun. But players must drop something to make both sides want to fight, the attacker to get whatever drops and the defender to keep his stuff.
The corruption is not meant to prevent killing but to prevent killing repeatedly many times:
Players will gank other players, but the intention is for Ashes of Creation to not be a "gank box".[52]
If that is balanced as described, then killing 1-2 players every day will be fine.
If killing other (green) players would be seen as a bad game mechanic, we would not have
"Corruption duration is reduced in military nodes.[74]"
You do not seem to resonate with the main goals of the game.
Do you think you will enjoy it?
You refer to yourself when you say "which just makes people even more annoyed with the flagging system than they will already be" ?
I mean players before joining to play the game should already be aware how the game works. It's not that hard to understand that it is not a PvE game. Maybe some soloers will join after seeing an add somewhere but even adds will highlight that
Around 80% of the content is open-world, where competition is- healthy competition is an instigator for soft player friction; for potential cooperation; for the ability to yield alliances; and the political theater that comes with it. So that's an intended part of the PvX design of Ashes. It's a core philosophical point. And just to be clear, that is not for everyone. We are not trying to make a product that appeals to every MMO gamer.