Unfortunately, I already know some females who are putting a 'HARD-PASS' on playing AOC, because they feel they won't be able to represent themselves as truly FEMININE. Of course, this was an opinion generated by visuals seen in ALPHA-1 (where all the FEMALE CHARACTERS looked more manly then my own Dad).
However, If a male character can run around wearing just a loincloth (Conan the Barbarian), then personally I feel a female character should be allowed to wear the Iron-Bikini model (if they so choose to do so).
It would be cool however if ARMOR actually reflected real-use stats to some degree. Example: Wearing a loincloth or iron-bikini would give the character a SPEED BOOST in combat (as their movement is not hindered in anyway) -- But they have close to no ACTUAL ARMOR PROTECTION in choosing that type of outfit.
WEREAS: someone in FULL BODY ARMOR would have the best in protection, but their abilities as far as movement and speed are hindered a bit due to their choice.
Key Word here is "CHOICE".
I believe in Freedom of Choice. For all things - not just this topic.
Taking someone's ability away to choose - and not be the PERSON/PLAYER that they truly want to be is going to alienate certain groups of people. Taking away someone's freedom of choice - forcing them to be something that they are not - or don't relate with -- is again, going to alienate certain groups of PEOPLE/PLAYERS.
Honestly, my feelings on this subject, is to give all kinds of options to all types of people (in regards to armor). However, give legitimate PROS and CONS when using these types of Armors. If going to war, and sieging a castle, would a loincloth or bikini-armor be the best choice? Probably not. But if I CHOOSE to wear that into battle, and die 2 minutes into the fight - well then, I just learned a valuable lesson about dressing appropriately for the occasion.
However, If i'm just questing, grinding, or harvesting, then a loincloth or bikini-armor would probably be just fine considering what my plans are.
At least I had the "CHOICE" and the "OPTION" to play and look the way "I WANTED TO".
Practical vs Un-Practical takes a back-seat to FREEDOM OF CHOICE.
Yeah just look at the current shop gear skin that you can buy now its horrible as a style for the female, if you didnt have the male standing next to the female for comparison you wouldnt know if the character was a female.
Lol exactly, its like they made the male one and then just shrunk it down a bit and made slight bulges on the chest. I feel like they do that a lot.
Yeah just look at the current shop gear skin that you can buy now its horrible as a style for the female, if you didnt have the male standing next to the female for comparison you wouldnt know if the character was a female.
Lol exactly, its like they made the male one and then just shrunk it down a bit and made slight bulges on the chest. I feel like they do that a lot.
For some of them maybe, but a lot of the ones you linked in a previous post had clear style divisions. It was just the fact that the costumes tended to be 'uniforms' of some type, so they were bound to follow some similar guidelines. A lot of them still look distinctly 'female cut' to me. I can agree with some of the pieces doing what you are implying, but not all. Some of the ones you posted look quite feminine to me in fact and it is the guy that get's the 'shorter end' of the design stick. But that one was also a uniform I think. I'd have to double check.
For some of them maybe, but a lot of the ones you linked in a previous post had clear style divisions. It was just the fact that the costumes tended to be 'uniforms' of some type, so they were bound to follow some similar guidelines. A lot of them still look distinctly 'female cut' to me. I can agree with some of the pieces doing what you are implying, but not all. Some of the ones you posted look quite feminine to me in fact and it is the guy that get's the 'shorter end' of the design stick. But that one was also a uniform I think. I'd have to double check.
I know homie i was just saying a lot of them look very similar. In my previous post i posted all monthly cosmetics (45 in total) and only 7 out of 45 of them in my opinion had very different male and female versions. I understand in the statement you quoted of me i had said it looked identical to the male but just smaller and with boob bumps, but i was mainly talking about the newest one but did also say a lot of others were like that too. I think some of them you can tell its a female for sure, but you can make any masculine armor into feminine by adding boobs lol. I was just hoping they add more variation in the future. Wouldn't you agree it feels more like they design the male armor and then go "ok now how do we make this fit the female too?" NOT ALWAYS, but a lot of times, like around half.
For some of them maybe, but a lot of the ones you linked in a previous post had clear style divisions. It was just the fact that the costumes tended to be 'uniforms' of some type, so they were bound to follow some similar guidelines. A lot of them still look distinctly 'female cut' to me. I can agree with some of the pieces doing what you are implying, but not all. Some of the ones you posted look quite feminine to me in fact and it is the guy that get's the 'shorter end' of the design stick. But that one was also a uniform I think. I'd have to double check.
I know homie i was just saying a lot of them look very similar. In my previous post i posted all monthly cosmetics (45 in total) and only 7 out of 45 of them in my opinion had very different male and female versions. I understand in the statement you quoted of me i had said it looked identical to the male but just smaller and with boob bumps, but i was mainly talking about the newest one but did also say a lot of others were like that too. I think some of them you can tell its a female for sure, but you can make any masculine armor into feminine by adding boobs lol. I was just hoping they add more variation in the future. Wouldn't you agree it feels more like they design the male armor and then go "ok now how do we make this fit the female too?" NOT ALWAYS, but a lot of times, like around half.
Oh no worries. I think what I really wanted to point out was that uniform type costumes tend to feel more unisex than they really are. I get the rest of your points for sure. I think around half feels like a fair guestimate. I personally think that's fairly acceptable as a ratio but we don't have a good range within that ratio yet which is probably what is causing so many others more sensitive to the topic to be so vocal.
Also I'm not really sure how many women there are in IS right now. Every time Steven prattles off a name of an employee it feels like it is taken out of 'generic male name bank.' I think I've heard two other than Margaret and Toast themselves in the past six months and that is out of dozens of employees Steven likes to praise during stream. This isn't to say they have none, but it's hard to imagine there are a lot of them based on that sample.
I think Margaret is a pretty strong voice when it comes to design direction from a female perspective, but it takes more than a few people to effect the dozens of designs they have to make at any given time. Everything Margaret has made personally that she has said so on Stream has been super tasteful and walking a pretty good line in terms of range of sexiness vs 'serious/reserved/whatever you wanna call it' in her designs. I hope there is a healthy proportion of women in those new hires that can be helping with some of these design decisions. Perhaps that would improve things if it's not currently present.
It is difficult. The whole store smacks of amateurs or fraudsters. I mean why do we buy cosmetics we have never seen on all races prior to purchase?
Why do we still have no structure details?
Why have we spent years of money on the game only to be forced to change, not use or replace half our purchases after racial concepts are changed.
Sometimes I feel so used, abused and confused that I have to leave these forums for days or weeks just to escape the suppression.
Get that shit out of this topic. It has nothing to do with people wanting feminine designs. Dont derail it.
Fuck you you can't. I have only a female toon. Bye bye beautiful.
Hahhah ahahhah what?
Yeah, George. I must apologise. At the time I was in a bad mood and naturally I responded in kind (swearing for swearing etc). I'm pleased you took it in jest mate. Once again my apologies. (I won't edit the post so people understand what I have apologised for.)
Yeah I know. No worries bro. I still love IS and hope for a good livestream to come. I used to post armour here but since the pyrai reveal I feel I can't really wear what I want atm.
Anyways, I like to rhyme hence the words used lol.
It would be great to have more variety of armor looks. If you want armor that covers up, you should be able to find that. If you want less cover, you should be able to find that too. More options, not less.
It kind of disappointing seeing things gender locked. It would be nice to have a choice to wear the suit or dress regardless of the gender of the character.
1
Options
DygzMember, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
That's a flawed argument, imo. If we're to start a new life in this world, then we need options to live a fulfilling life. If the devs truly believe that, then there's no need for a robust housing system either. Why waste time decorating when you should be out adventuring. No need for a marriage or family system either. The reality is, once you establish your basic needs (food, water, shelter) in this dangerous new world, it's only logical that you will begin building a home and family and expressing your creativity. That's how life flourishes.
Maybe we're ready for marriage, but not ready for sex, yet. No children, so, we're definitely not ready for procreation.
Family system does not include children.
Maybe everyone venturing through the Portals a prudish pilgrims.
Steven says they are all heroes - which is why they wear heroic gear, rather than having any commoner gear.
We'll just have to see what Steven's threshold of "sexy" is.
Actually, I think he said that before Margaret was onboard, so - could be that he now has enough women on the team that they are able to expand his vision of armor for women.
That's a flawed argument, imo. If we're to start a new life in this world, then we need options to live a fulfilling life. If the devs truly believe that, then there's no need for a robust housing system either. Why waste time decorating when you should be out adventuring. No need for a marriage or family system either. The reality is, once you establish your basic needs (food, water, shelter) in this dangerous new world, it's only logical that you will begin building a home and family and expressing your creativity. That's how life flourishes.
Maybe we're ready for marriage, but not ready for sex, yet. No children, so, we're definitely not ready for procreation.
Family system does not include children.
Maybe everyone venturing through the Portals a prudish pilgrims.
Steven says they are all heroes - which is why they wear heroic gear, rather than having any commoner gear.
We'll just have to see what Steven's threshold of "sexy" is.
Actually, I think he said that before Margaret was onboard, so - could be that he now has enough women on the team that they are able to expand his vision of armor for women.
I sure hope this is the case as far as having female Armor types. The female models are very close to the male. This is disheartening because I will be RPing my Vaelune bard as a Feminine Street performer. I am not advocating for bikini armor but having a more effeminate look and bikini armor are two drastically different things
Okay, here is my new approach (Nymph Demon Blood Mage (Shaman Healer). Ignore the skin tones because I'd have a withered py'rai. Sometimes I dislike the disjointed problem but I guess it's only temporary.
It would be great to have more variety of armor looks. If you want armor that covers up, you should be able to find that. If you want less cover, you should be able to find that too. More options, not less.
It kind of disappointing seeing things gender locked. It would be nice to have a choice to wear the suit or dress regardless of the gender of the character.
See this is what I'm trying to get at. Some people might want to give their character (male or female) a more feminine or masculine look. I personally think that if you just give a lot of options people will be satisfied. The beauty of the MMO genre is the freedom. If I can't have more Effeminate armor on my character that isn't freedom. Thats restricting what we as players can do with our character. If I want to dress Effeminately that doesn't really involve any one else. If they are given options.
3
Options
DygzMember, Braver of Worlds, Kickstarter, Alpha One
Games have rules and restrictions.
Sometimes those can feel arbitrary.
Hm... I'd focus this back to our women players. This is a fantasy game, so I would hope that the devs/design/artists prioritize her fantasy about her own character/journey/experience over his fantasy about her character/journey/experience.
Hm... I'd focus this back to our women players. This is a fantasy game, so I would hope that the devs/design/artists prioritize her fantasy about her own character/journey/experience over his fantasy about her character/journey/experience.
I couldn't agree more, you are right on the money! I would love to hear more female opinions too. Although i too only make female characters in every game I've played for 10+ years, but when i say i want to make a sexy female character I'm looked at like a weirdo lol. But if a girl says she wants to make a sexy female everyone is like, yea you go girl! I really do hope IS hires more girls though and hope we get a lot of female players putting in th3eir input on the forums and stuff!
Yes, I thought this was the female armour thread when I read a post saying cover up if u want (which I can't due to horns). Hence my armour post Anyway, I've spent years in mmos and most female toons were men back then. I still can't tell the difference between a female, a catfish and a male on the Internet though.
However. If u think its appropriate for females to dictate what my toon wears what is your problem with mutual input from a female toon player who's male? Double standards no?
As a female player. AoC' biggest flaw for me was how the armor looks on female toons.
U dont have to make the armor skimpy to be appealing. All u need to do is make the armor form fitting to the female model.
Dont be afraid to make the character model "sexy" as there are a lot of girls out there that have measurements like 36-24-36. As long as the armor is form fitting it will look appealing to most of us. We just dont want to look like a man or fat in a bulky armor set
Cloth armor thou should feel like a dress. There' really no point to make all of us wearing long ass robes as there' little to no physical defense property to them. Make us look pretty and stylish and that'll make us happy (please also add laces... Love laces)
Leather armor should be focused on movement so "pantsuits" would work well (ie. Witcher3 ciri)
Heavy armor should be plated and slender. We have smaller bone structure & muscle mass comparing to our male counterparts therefore it makes sense to make us look smaller & more slender. (Just dont make us look fat lol)
To be frank ... There' like 1 MAYBE 2 outfits out of everything thats shown i would actually enjoy wearing on my toon.
Seems like I am a little late to the party, but as usual, I do love when this topic comes up for discussion!
I am a female gamer and I very much enjoy my character to represent a "fantasy" version of myself in the games I play.
What I mean specifically by a fantasy version of myself is the way I want to dress/style my character. In the real, everyday world I am not able to go out wearing a form-fitting dress that makes me look and feel like a fierse, badass, sexy magician (apart from on Halloween perhaps). However, in a high fantasy world like Ashes of Creation, I think that this type of look should definitely be possible and an option for players to achieve.
I do not for a moment believe that the only way female characters can be viewed as "strong" and "powerful" is by having them dressed/designed in armour that is large, bulky, flat shoed and all-covering. I have definitely seen this viewpoint being shared before, and I really do disagree. Many females (myself included) actually feel empowered by having a choice to dress/style our characters in form-fitting, more revealing and even high heel styled armours. It allows us to represent ourselves in the way we want to be seen.
The most important point is CHOICE. I would just like to copy-paste what I said in a similar topic before:
I firmly believe that diversity and variation in armour/cosmetic styles in games is a good thing, and allows people to create characters that they like the look of to represent them. As long as there are options for both fully covering, non form-fitting (loose?), flat shoe/boots and then also more form-fitting, revealing, high-heel
shoe/boots etc. that people can choose between - then why should this ever be seen as a problem? Although some people personally may not like one or the other style, why should others not be able to use them?
I agree, players who chose a female character should be able to dress their character up in a fashion that makes them look really good and has some sex appeal.
I agree, players who chose a female character should be able to dress their character up in a fashion that makes them look really good and has some sex appeal.
Please not again. stay true to the line AOC team
May i ask why you think having sex appeal is a bad thing for female characters? Does it hurt your gameplay experience if someone else does this? Not trying to argue, I'm legit curious on why so many people hate sexy female characters in games.
I spend thousands on computers to see the best graphical fidetlities on my female toons. Requested ue5, was told devs also planned it, got ue5 then got py-rai update.
These days I'm actually quite stoked though. I do appreciate the opportunities to express myself freely. I'm quite a reclusive writer
I agree, players who chose a female character should be able to dress their character up in a fashion that makes them look really good and has some sex appeal.
Please not again. stay true to the line AOC team
May i ask why you think having sex appeal is a bad thing for female characters? Does it hurt your gameplay experience if someone else does this? Not trying to argue, I'm legit curious on why so many people hate sexy female characters in games.
I don't think it's simply about hate against sexy female characters.
It's more about the sexual objectifying of female game characters and females in general.
I agree, players who chose a female character should be able to dress their character up in a fashion that makes them look really good and has some sex appeal.
Please not again. stay true to the line AOC team
May i ask why you think having sex appeal is a bad thing for female characters? Does it hurt your gameplay experience if someone else does this? Not trying to argue, I'm legit curious on why so many people hate sexy female characters in games.
I don't think it's simply about hate against sexy female characters.
It's more about the sexual objectifying of female game characters and females in general.
I don't think it's simply about hate against sexy female characters.
It's more about the sexual objectifying of female game characters and females in general.
So far every girl that has commented has been in favor of making sexy characters though. So who is getting upset about sexualizing's women? Most of this topic isn't about putting women in mini bikinis or anything, just more feminine armor that is form fitting and sexy looking. Wouldn't you agree that most women would like the option to make their character sexy from time to time and feel sexy as they play? If you look back at page one the post by @Leiloni was a good example of sexy but still practical. I'm in agreement that bikini armor is a bit immersion breaking because how does it protect anything lol but I think a lot of this thread is just asking for armor that is more sexy than what we are getting currently. NOT full stripper mode lol
Comments
However, If a male character can run around wearing just a loincloth (Conan the Barbarian), then personally I feel a female character should be allowed to wear the Iron-Bikini model (if they so choose to do so).
It would be cool however if ARMOR actually reflected real-use stats to some degree.
Example: Wearing a loincloth or iron-bikini would give the character a SPEED BOOST in combat (as their movement is not hindered in anyway) -- But they have close to no ACTUAL ARMOR PROTECTION in choosing that type of outfit.
WEREAS: someone in FULL BODY ARMOR would have the best in protection, but their abilities as far as movement and speed are hindered a bit due to their choice.
Key Word here is "CHOICE".
I believe in Freedom of Choice. For all things - not just this topic.
Taking someone's ability away to choose - and not be the PERSON/PLAYER that they truly want to be is going to alienate certain groups of people. Taking away someone's freedom of choice - forcing them to be something that they are not - or don't relate with -- is again, going to alienate certain groups of PEOPLE/PLAYERS.
Honestly, my feelings on this subject, is to give all kinds of options to all types of people (in regards to armor). However, give legitimate PROS and CONS when using these types of Armors. If going to war, and sieging a castle, would a loincloth or bikini-armor be the best choice? Probably not. But if I CHOOSE to wear that into battle, and die 2 minutes into the fight - well then, I just learned a valuable lesson about dressing appropriately for the occasion.
However, If i'm just questing, grinding, or harvesting, then a loincloth or bikini-armor would probably be just fine considering what my plans are.
At least I had the "CHOICE" and the "OPTION" to play and look the way "I WANTED TO".
Practical vs Un-Practical takes a back-seat to FREEDOM OF CHOICE.
WATCH & SUBSCRIBE TO ME ON: Twitch --- YouTube --- PLAY: Ashes Of Creation
Why do we still have no structure details?
Why have we spent years of money on the game only to be forced to change, not use or replace half our purchases after racial concepts are changed.
Sometimes I feel so used, abused and confused that I have to leave these forums for days or weeks just to escape the suppression.
Get that shit out of this topic. It has nothing to do with people wanting feminine designs. Dont derail it.
For some of them maybe, but a lot of the ones you linked in a previous post had clear style divisions. It was just the fact that the costumes tended to be 'uniforms' of some type, so they were bound to follow some similar guidelines. A lot of them still look distinctly 'female cut' to me. I can agree with some of the pieces doing what you are implying, but not all. Some of the ones you posted look quite feminine to me in fact and it is the guy that get's the 'shorter end' of the design stick. But that one was also a uniform I think. I'd have to double check.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=Yhr9WpjaDzw
Fuck you you can't. I have only a female toon. Bye bye beautiful.
Hahhah ahahhah what?
Oh no worries. I think what I really wanted to point out was that uniform type costumes tend to feel more unisex than they really are. I get the rest of your points for sure. I think around half feels like a fair guestimate. I personally think that's fairly acceptable as a ratio but we don't have a good range within that ratio yet which is probably what is causing so many others more sensitive to the topic to be so vocal.
Also I'm not really sure how many women there are in IS right now. Every time Steven prattles off a name of an employee it feels like it is taken out of 'generic male name bank.' I think I've heard two other than Margaret and Toast themselves in the past six months and that is out of dozens of employees Steven likes to praise during stream. This isn't to say they have none, but it's hard to imagine there are a lot of them based on that sample.
I think Margaret is a pretty strong voice when it comes to design direction from a female perspective, but it takes more than a few people to effect the dozens of designs they have to make at any given time. Everything Margaret has made personally that she has said so on Stream has been super tasteful and walking a pretty good line in terms of range of sexiness vs 'serious/reserved/whatever you wanna call it' in her designs. I hope there is a healthy proportion of women in those new hires that can be helping with some of these design decisions. Perhaps that would improve things if it's not currently present.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=Yhr9WpjaDzw
Yeah, George. I must apologise. At the time I was in a bad mood and naturally I responded in kind (swearing for swearing etc). I'm pleased you took it in jest mate. Once again my apologies. (I won't edit the post so people understand what I have apologised for.)
Cheers,
Neu
Frustration and anger came forth like a mighty river.
But seriously... no need for accusations regarding the monthly stuff. It's been discussed.
Anyways, I like to rhyme hence the words used lol.
It kind of disappointing seeing things gender locked. It would be nice to have a choice to wear the suit or dress regardless of the gender of the character.
Family system does not include children.
Maybe everyone venturing through the Portals a prudish pilgrims.
Steven says they are all heroes - which is why they wear heroic gear, rather than having any commoner gear.
We'll just have to see what Steven's threshold of "sexy" is.
Actually, I think he said that before Margaret was onboard, so - could be that he now has enough women on the team that they are able to expand his vision of armor for women.
I sure hope this is the case as far as having female Armor types. The female models are very close to the male. This is disheartening because I will be RPing my Vaelune bard as a Feminine Street performer. I am not advocating for bikini armor but having a more effeminate look and bikini armor are two drastically different things
See this is what I'm trying to get at. Some people might want to give their character (male or female) a more feminine or masculine look. I personally think that if you just give a lot of options people will be satisfied. The beauty of the MMO genre is the freedom. If I can't have more Effeminate armor on my character that isn't freedom. Thats restricting what we as players can do with our character. If I want to dress Effeminately that doesn't really involve any one else. If they are given options.
Sometimes those can feel arbitrary.
However. If u think its appropriate for females to dictate what my toon wears what is your problem with mutual input from a female toon player who's male? Double standards no?
U dont have to make the armor skimpy to be appealing. All u need to do is make the armor form fitting to the female model.
Dont be afraid to make the character model "sexy" as there are a lot of girls out there that have measurements like 36-24-36. As long as the armor is form fitting it will look appealing to most of us. We just dont want to look like a man or fat in a bulky armor set
Cloth armor thou should feel like a dress. There' really no point to make all of us wearing long ass robes as there' little to no physical defense property to them. Make us look pretty and stylish and that'll make us happy (please also add laces... Love laces)
Leather armor should be focused on movement so "pantsuits" would work well (ie. Witcher3 ciri)
Heavy armor should be plated and slender. We have smaller bone structure & muscle mass comparing to our male counterparts therefore it makes sense to make us look smaller & more slender. (Just dont make us look fat lol)
To be frank ... There' like 1 MAYBE 2 outfits out of everything thats shown i would actually enjoy wearing on my toon.
I am a female gamer and I very much enjoy my character to represent a "fantasy" version of myself in the games I play.
What I mean specifically by a fantasy version of myself is the way I want to dress/style my character. In the real, everyday world I am not able to go out wearing a form-fitting dress that makes me look and feel like a fierse, badass, sexy magician (apart from on Halloween perhaps). However, in a high fantasy world like Ashes of Creation, I think that this type of look should definitely be possible and an option for players to achieve.
I do not for a moment believe that the only way female characters can be viewed as "strong" and "powerful" is by having them dressed/designed in armour that is large, bulky, flat shoed and all-covering. I have definitely seen this viewpoint being shared before, and I really do disagree. Many females (myself included) actually feel empowered by having a choice to dress/style our characters in form-fitting, more revealing and even high heel styled armours. It allows us to represent ourselves in the way we want to be seen.
The most important point is CHOICE. I would just like to copy-paste what I said in a similar topic before:
I firmly believe that diversity and variation in armour/cosmetic styles in games is a good thing, and allows people to create characters that they like the look of to represent them. As long as there are options for both fully covering, non form-fitting (loose?), flat shoe/boots and then also more form-fitting, revealing, high-heel
shoe/boots etc. that people can choose between - then why should this ever be seen as a problem? Although some people personally may not like one or the other style, why should others not be able to use them?
Please not again. stay true to the line AOC team
These days I'm actually quite stoked though. I do appreciate the opportunities to express myself freely. I'm quite a reclusive writer
I don't think it's simply about hate against sexy female characters.
It's more about the sexual objectifying of female game characters and females in general.
Says you.